scribia-developers — Discussion of Scribia development.

Re: [Scribia-developers] Using the mailing list

[Rob T. <ro...@ts...>]

on 7/12/00 10:07 AM, Lark at la...@fe... wrote:

> Just a reminder: Please use (or CC) the mailing list for all our
> communication. First, it's archived, so we can go back later and see what
> the hell we talked about back then. Second, it keeps others informed about
> what's going on, and information is key in all development.

Can Lark change mailing list option to default to replying to the list
rather than the individual?

Also, the [Scribia-developers] in the subject is quite annoying. Does anyone
mind if Lark turns it off, or at least make it something much shorter. Can
you, Lark?

Rob

[Scribia-developers] Using the mailing list

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

Just a reminder: Please use (or CC) the mailing list for all our
communication. First, it's archived, so we can go back later and see what
the hell we talked about back then. Second, it keeps others informed about
what's going on, and information is key in all development.

If you think the list is getting high-traffic - subscribe to the daily
digest instead (I do).
-- 
Lark <la...@fe...>

[Scribia-developers] Application Signatures:

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

FYI: I have registered these with Apple. SCRI seemed to be taken, but I got
it anyway, and is what I'm using now.

Application Signatures:
    Scri  (Hex) 53637269
    SCRI  (Hex) 53435249
-- 
Lark <la...@fe...>

[Scribia-developers] FW: Scribia

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

FYI: Bigfat <bi...@ha...> has volunteered to do graphics for
Scribia, and help with the web page when we'll need one (around initial
release time).

----------
From: Bigfat <bi...@ha...>
Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2000 08:49:34 -0500
To: Lark <la...@fe...>
Subject: Re: Scribia

I don't know a bit of programming, but I will volunteer for the scroll. :)
And any graphic help you need.

> From: Lark <la...@fe...>
> Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000 21:29:30 -0700
> To: Bigfat <bi...@ha...>
> Subject: Re: Scribia
> 
>> I was wondering, would you like a web page for this project?
> 
> Right now, the sourceforge page is fine, but once we'll have a binary (user)
> release, we should probably do something with the scribia.sourceforge.net
> site.
> 
> Are you volunteering? :-)
> 
> Lark
> 

[Scribia-developers] Re: Cygnus' mail

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

> Lark, please don't sign me up for write access yet.  I've never used
> CVS before, so I'd rather wait until I learn how it works and what
> I'm doing with it.  I'd really hate to be playing around with it and
> accidently do something that nukes all the code.  =)

If you never "commit" anything, you can't break anything. :-) It's your
choice, but I'd set you up with it just so it's ready when you need it.

> From the readme:
> However, what you are not permitted to do is to redistribute the
> source as "DSC Sample Code" after having made changes. If you're
> going to redistribute the source, we require that you make it clear
> in the source that the code was descended from Apple Sample Code, but
> that you've made changes.
> 
> It sounds to me that it would be ok to redistribute it since it
> hasn't been modified.  All of the files in the package do have the
> Apple Source Code info at the top.  If that's left in, it should be
> ok.

That sounds reasonable. I'll try to contact the author, just to make sure.

> I have no objections as long as it'll make it easier for the overall
> project.  Importing the XML isn't difficult.  I just wouldn't want to
> do it if its going to cause problems for someone or somewhere.

The biggest difference is that since it's text, you can have CW or BBEdit
compare versions and highlight differences, so it's easy to see what has
changed, if you need to. Also, with binary files, CVS always replaces the
whole file with a new version since it cannot create binary diffs; using XML
allows it to do that. (Too bad there isn't a text form for the .rsrc and
.ppob files as well.)
 
> P.S.   Lark, is it possible to set the mail server so that the reply
> address is to the list and not the person who sent it?  I've already
> sent out a couple messages to just the sender on accident.

I think I've changed it. Let me know if it does/doesn't work.

Lark

Re: [Scribia-developers] Re: Scribus compiling

[Lumpy <mi...@ma...>]

Hi all,

Cygnus wrote:
> 
> 
> That leaves me still not able to compile scribia though.  But at
> least there's light at the end of the tunnel now.  It looks like all
> of my compile errors are due to using morefiles 1.5 since it needs UI
> 3.3.  I'm trying to find an the older version of morefiles now.
> 

I have been able to compile and run Scribia using MoreFiles 1.5.  I
needed to make a number of modifications, specifically including some
new constants from the latest Files.h, altering how some of the 64 bit
math was handled and defining a couple of inlines for creating and
disposing of a timer proc.

All of these changes are made in the MoreFiles sources, and will be
obsolete once the latest headers are available for CodeWarrior.

In the meantime, what is the plan? Are we planning to use the older
MoreFiles, a modified set of the 1.5 sources, or some other solution?

--Mike

Re: [Scribia-developers] Lark answers all questions :-)

[Rob T. <ro...@ts...>]

on 7/11/00 9:28 PM, Lark at la...@fe... wrote:

> Rob: If you'd like, I'll set this up for you as well, of course.

Please do. I'm rtsuk on SourceForge.

Rob

[Scribia-developers] Lark answers all questions :-)

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

Since I get a daily digest of the messages, I'll simple answer everything in
one messgage.



From: Rob Tsuk <ro...@ts...>
> I have the PowerPlant UI skills needed to implement the Scribia UI. Before I
> get started I was wondering what UI is desired? Should I just clone Scribus?

I think the Scribus interface would be an excellent starting point. In
general, I'd like to get Scribia to be feature-identical to Scribus before
adding (large) new parts. Then again, people will work on whatever they
think most interesting, as it should be :-).



From: Pugwash <pu...@ac...>
> Hi Scribia developers! So what's the next step? I've subscribed to the mailing
> list so now what? Do I register as a new user on the sourceforge site?

Depends. If you just want to grab the source and compile it, you can get it
via anonymous CVS, without the need to register with sourceforge.

If you'd like to actively develop Scribia (i.e. make larger code changes
you'd like to contribute back to me/us) I will add you as a developer. For
that, you will need to do these steps:

1. sign up with sourceforge

2. tell me your sourceforge user name, so I can add you as a developer

3. open a customer service item with sourceforge, and ask them to set up CVS
   "pserver" access to the scribia CVS repository (SSH does not work on the
   Mac)

After that, you have read/write access to the CVS repository. Cyguns and
Rob: If you'd like, I'll set this up for you as well, of course.

Since I don't know if people have used CVS before, here are some short
things you should know:

€ commit log entries are your friend, please take the time to describe
  changes made to the code

€ never check in code that has known bugs, or worse, does not compile
  (people will get angry if they'll have to fix your bugs after they have
  CVS updated your changes)

€ try to use the indentation style of the rest of the sources for new
  things/changes (I've tried to stick to the "Mac way" of indentation and
  naming things as much as I could figure it out; it's not perfect)

€ include the HEADER file (Documentation folder) at the top of each new
  source file, it has some magic CVS tags in it that auto-insert the commit
  log, current version, etc. (it also has the disclaimer)

The copyright will change ("soon") from "Lark" to something like "The
Scribia Developers".

Other good news: Cygnus just let me know he can compile now :-) For other
people looking for MoreFiles 1.4.9 that is needed for Scribia: It is part of
one of the CW PowerPlant examples (I think a debugging example?) I'm unclear
on the copyright, maybe we can even redistribute it with Scribia and simply
make it part of the CVS tree?

Talking about the CVS tree: I've replaced the binary project file
(Scribia.mcp) with an XML text export of the project file (Scribia.mcp.xml).
I hope this will make it easier to maintain it under CVS - is anybody
opposed to this? (It's a little more work, since you'll have to remember to
import/export this file if it changes.)



From: Rob Tsuk <ro...@ts...>
> Attached is a copy of CScribiaDoc.cp that fixes the crash bug. I would check
> it in myself but I don't have write access to CVS.

Great! I'll check it in right away.
See above for the steps to get CVS write access.

Lark

[Scribia-developers] Fix fo Scribia crashing bug

[Rob T. <ro...@ts...>]

Attached is a copy of CScribiaDoc.cp that fixes the crash bug. I would check
it in myself but I don't have write access to CVS.

Rob

[Scribia-developers] Scribia: Next step?

[Pugwash <pu...@ac...>]

Hi Scribia developers!

So what's the next step?
I've subscribed to the mailing list so now what?

Do I register as a new user on the sourceforge site?



A new log program is a great idea!
I hope it goes well!


Pugwash
-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Pugwash on Clan Lord
Neko No Kessha Clan: http://www.grosbill.org/NnK/
Clan Lord: http://www.deltatao.com/clanlord.html
ICQ: 11524889
Hotline: 24.72.12.31
mailto:pu...@ac...
MUGORS: http://tdi.uregina.ca/~mugors
                       t h i n k   d i f f e r e n t

Re: [Scribia-developers] Re: Scribus compiling

[Rob T. <ro...@ts...>]

on 7/10/00 9:29 PM, Cygnus at cy...@po... wrote:

> I'm trying to find an the older version of morefiles now.

I have an older copy that works with Scribia as it is checked in. I can pack
it up and upload it somewhere if you can't find it.

Rob

[Scribia-developers] Re: What UI is desired?

[Cygnus <cy...@po...>]

>Hi folks,
>
>I have the PowerPlant UI skills needed to implement the Scribia UI. Before I
>get started I was wondering what UI is desired? Should I just clone Scribus?
>That would be the easiest course. I don't have a strong opinion one way or
>the other.
>
>Rob/Rifkin

I was thinking that keeping the UI close to Scribus would the easiest 
and would also make it easy on the end user. At least to start out, 
can always modify it as need arises.  One slight modification that I 
was thinking of is to change the control to switch sections to tabs 
down the edge instead of a pop-up menu.  Its just an idea to throw 
out.

-- 
Cygnus
Cy...@po...

_________________________________________________________________
Oh the words that he spoke
Seemed the wisest of philosophies
There's nothing ever gained
By a wet thing called a tear
When the world is too dark
And I need the light inside of me
I'll walk into a bar
And drink fifteen pints of beer

[Scribia-developers] Re: Scribus compiling

[Cygnus <cy...@po...>]

Note to anyone on the list:  This is the continuation of a 
disscussion I've been having with lark on trying to get scribia to 
compile.


>  > I hadn't updated to CW 5.3 yet and morefiles required Universal
>>  Interfaces 3.3.  I'm still not compiling though.  It looks like its
>>  something in my set up.  I think that I just don't have the correct
>>  headers set up somewhere.  All of the errors are in compiling the
>>  powerplant source and they deal with no finding system defined
>>  constants.  Hopefully I'll be able to figure out the problem tomorrow.
>
>>  One other thing for you. I don't think its causing a problem, more of
>>  a FYI.  It appears that you are using morefiles 1.4.9.  1.5 is out
>>  and is the version available on Apple's web site.
>
>Ah. The README is wrong. I tried using 1.5.0, but could not get it to
>compile with CW5.3 - I think it may be because CW5.3 seems to use Universal
>Headers 3.2? There were some undefined constants. So I went back to 1.4.9.
>
>Can you compile an empty project (PowerPlant stationary)?

I can now.  It looks like I missed something when upgrading.  I 
reinstalled CW 5.3 tonight and its working now with empty projects. 
It also looks like some of my problems were due to installing 
Universal Interfaces 3.3.2.  I think powerplant needs to be updated 
or at least some of the precompiled headers recompiled for it.  So I 
went back to UI 3.2.

That leaves me still not able to compile scribia though.  But at 
least there's light at the end of the tunnel now.  It looks like all 
of my compile errors are due to using morefiles 1.5 since it needs UI 
3.3.  I'm trying to find an the older version of morefiles now.



-- 
Cygnus
Cy...@po...

_________________________________________________________________
Oh the words that he spoke
Seemed the wisest of philosophies
There's nothing ever gained
By a wet thing called a tear
When the world is too dark
And I need the light inside of me
I'll walk into a bar
And drink fifteen pints of beer

[Scribia-developers] What UI is desired?

[Rob T. <ro...@ts...>]

Hi folks,

I have the PowerPlant UI skills needed to implement the Scribia UI. Before I
get started I was wondering what UI is desired? Should I just clone Scribus?
That would be the easiest course. I don't have a strong opinion one way or
the other.

Rob/Rifkin

[Scribia-developers] Developers Wanted: Scribia

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

H'loi!

I'm looking for exiles willing to help with the development of Scribia.

Scribia is an open-source Scribus replacement. It is based on Metrowerks
Codewarrior 5.3 and PowerPlant/STL. The log file scanner is based on GNU
Flex. Scribia is available under the terms of the Artistic License, and
development is managed via SourceForge.net.

Development page: http://sourceforge.net/projects/scribia/

To participate in the development, you'll need to grab the Scribia sources
from CVS. To compile them, you need Metrowerks Codewarrior 5.3. You will
also need the following (free) 3rd party packages:

  € Apple Computer's MoreFiles 1.4.9
    http://developer.apple.com/samplecode/Sample_Code/Files/MoreFiles.htm
            
  € Codewarrior GNU Flex Plugin b2
    http://www.ambrosiasw.com/~fprefect/plugins.html

Scribia is in very early phases of its lifecycle. The GUI is practically
nonexistent, and I'd be more than happy if someone with PowerPlant
experience would take over responsibility for that part. The log file
scanner is pretty complete and much faster than Scribus (factor of 10x -
100x). THERE IS NO BINARY AVAILABLE YET.

If you decide to help developing Scribia, please subscribe to
scribia-developers on the web site. That mailing list will be the main
discussion forum for people working on Scribia. Other mailing lists
(scribia-announce, scribia-users) will be created soon.

Please do not hesitate to contact scr...@li...
if you have questions I haven't addressed here.

Lark

PS: I have sent this message directly to the representatives of several
clans in the hopes they will make it available on their clans' message
boards/mailing lists. I will not contact you personally again.

[Scribia-developers] Re: Scribus

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

Hi,

> I hadn't updated to CW 5.3 yet and morefiles required Universal
> Interfaces 3.3.  I'm still not compiling though.  It looks like its
> something in my set up.  I think that I just don't have the correct
> headers set up somewhere.  All of the errors are in compiling the
> powerplant source and they deal with no finding system defined
> constants.  Hopefully I'll be able to figure out the problem tomorrow.
 
> One other thing for you. I don't think its causing a problem, more of
> a FYI.  It appears that you are using morefiles 1.4.9.  1.5 is out
> and is the version available on Apple's web site.

Ah. The README is wrong. I tried using 1.5.0, but could not get it to
compile with CW5.3 - I think it may be because CW5.3 seems to use Universal
Headers 3.2? There were some undefined constants. So I went back to 1.4.9.

Can you compile an empty project (PowerPlant stationary)?

Lark

PS: Please start to use scr...@li... for our
discussions :-)

[Scribia-developers] Re: Scribus

[Lark <la...@fe...>]

> It appears that everything worked fine.  I was able to connect and
> get the module with no problems (other then figuring out CVS).  I
> haven't used CVS before, so I had to find a client and figure out the
> basic operation of it.  At least now I have something to read up on
> tomorrow =)

Glad it worked well. CVS on the Mac is a little weird to use.

I was going to put some more work into the GUI, but RL things kept me from
it. Plus, I figured there must be someone out there who knows PowerPlant and
can do it much better, nicer and faster than I could. :-) I'll gladly
offload all the GUI design to someone else.
 
> The only problem that I did have was that I could not connect to the
> project's web page.  Netscape keeps giving me a connection error when
> trying to access it.  I was able to access the project by doing a
> search on sourceforge for scribia and it gave me sourceforge pages on
> it.

Strange. http://scribia.sourceforge.net/ is simply a redirect to
http://sourceforge.net/projects/scribia/ - and it works for me.
 
> I'll take a look at it tomorrow when if I get a chance (slight chance
> I may be out of town for the night).  Sounds like its at about the
> stage I expected from talking to you.  Looks like I need to hit the
> power plant tutorials a little harder now. =)

Once you've successfully compiled it, I'll send an email to a few CL lists
calling for developers. (If you have the time, try to document problems you
have compiling Scribia, I'll put them in the README.)
 
> In the read me, you said that the scanner will pick up everything
> that scribus recorded and that you need the messages of things it
> didn't to add.  Do you have a list or know what trainers are needed?

All the language trainers. Marsh hermit. New mystic/general trainers that
may have appeared. I'm pretty sure it scans all the fighter/healer trainers
correctly.

> If you ever need to discuss something, feel free to get ahold of me
> in cl or I have a Carracho server running for PM (address is
> pogueline.poguemahone.org).  Its usually up nights and weekend
> afternoons pacific time.

I've also set up the scribia-developers mailing list on sourceforge. We
should probably start using it for all our exchanges, since it's archived.

Two other little things: One, the copyright in all the files right now says
"Lark". I will change this to "The Scribia Development Group" or something
like it soon, or simply use all the names of the project admins. Two, I will
give you and other interested people who'll put some time into Scribia
read/write CVS access and project admin permissions as needed.

Lark