I have been using EQ APO as a cinema processor and it works great.
The software allows me to process my 7.1 channels in the same way that Dolby does with
their processors, 1/3 octave 31 band eq. All measured with RTA.
I use Kodi to output 48khz 24bit PCM (bluray drive installed, DTS HD master source) and then EQ APO to
process everything.
I am still looking to get the most out of my system, and since there is no Asio support due to the nature of APO
I have instead been trying to get Voicemeeter to work, virtual cable input and output piped into Eq Apo.
But no luck, voicemeeter output as capture device does'nt work.
Anyone had luck using voicemeeter? Tried Aux, Vaio and hifi cable but nothing works....
Love the software though, keep up the good work.
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The just released version 1.2 has integrated Voicemeeter support. Just install it and select the Voicemeeter device in the Configurator. Then you can just use Voicemeeter normally as E-APO does the processing inside Voicemeeter.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
No, there should be no audible difference. The advantage of Voicemeeter is that it does support all APIs, so also WASAPI exclusive mode and ASIO, while Equalizer APO as a normal APO does not work when these APIs are used. However, if you are not using one of these low-latency APIs, the latency using Voicemeeter is usually higher than when doing direct output to the sound device (it also depends on buffer sizes and your sound card driver). Another advantage of Voicemeeter is that it can simultaneously output to multiple devices.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Isn't bypassing the Windows OS Mixer with its dithering and resampling considered a SQ best practice in the industry? (e.g. Exclusive Mode in Roon, JRiver, etc).
My thinking - VoiceMeeter might benefit sound quality while keep using EqualizerAPO since it implemented using the VoiceMeeter Client and not using the Windows APO, therefore bypassing the OS Mixer if using "WDM Input Exclusive Mode" in VoiceMeeter and "Exclusive Mode" in the player. What do you think?
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I have a 2.1 setup (left, right and a subwoofer)
At the moment it works like this:
My audiointerfaces sends a stereomix to my subwoofer which has a build in lowcut, which is sended to my satellites afterwards.
My wish would be that I can configure my subwoofer separat from my left or right satellite to get a better acoustic in my music room. I think voicemeeter can handle this somehow.
My setup: Win10, Focusrite 8i6 with Mixcontrol, Apo Equalizer, REW and Voicemeeter installed.
I installed Voicemeeter and made it the standard audio device. I setup for 5.1 in Windows and in the Apo Editor. With that i can configure 4 different channels L, R, SL and SR
SL and SR will be the two physical outputs for my subwoofer.
Filter Settings file
Copy: SL=L SR=R
Channel: L
Filter: ON HP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: R
Filter: ON HP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: SL
Filter: ON LP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: SR
Filter: ON LP Fc 120 Hz
How do I handle route VoiceMeeter and MixControl on my Focusrite?
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Voicemeeter does not give reliable information about the currently selected device and its channel configuration. Therefore, Equalizer APO always uses all 8 channels in a 7.1 configuration. You might need to change SL and SR to RL and RR so that you address the channels 5 and 6 instead of 7 and 8 (which are lost because you are using a 5.1 device).
You should not need to do any additional configuration in Voicemeeter if you already have working audio output. I don't know anything about MixControl, so I can't give you any advice for that.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
If you see all the channels you need in your setup being active in Voicemeeter "Virtual Inputs" section (meters) ... there shouldn't be more than just selecting the "Normal Mode" option in "Master Section" to do (BTW, I'm using Banana version).
Probably you could do channel mixing (that Copy: SL=L, SR=R thing) throuh that MixControl applet (maybe Router) ....
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
I am getting closer to it. I switched my setup to 7.1.
Before I will work with ApoEQ i want the audio routing correct. For that I just use my MusicPlayer to hear which channel is playing. At the moment I dont hear anyhting of all 4 channels. So I guess I did not setup my drivers correctly.
Windows: VoiceMeeter Output and Input (without Aux) is standard
3 Soundcard sources: Focusrite output, Voicemeeter AUX Input, Voicemeeter Input
I choose DirectSound and Virtual Input (without AUX), with that my Player is playing (I see timeline) and in Voicemeeter my virtual Input is moving accordingly to the signal of the player. The problem is that I can`t hear anything. Any advice?
There is no signal in MixControl, which shows all outputs or inputs.
Last edit: stoneson2 2017-08-14
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Play with the Voicemeeter I/O buffer sizes. ASIO, WASAPI and WDM/WDMKS should work well below 2048 samples buffer but MME may need ir set bigger. Try to find suitable size. Also, I've noticed that sometimes you need to close EqualizerAPO and Voicemeeter to get that distortion to end.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Can you tell me where the EQ is placed? circle is pre-mixer, square is post-mixer right? (pic attched)
It is really difficult because each program has different names for different channels/mix :D
There are two possbilities in my eyes now why it does not work: copy channel does not work ( only channel R and L are EQ able and i tested it with a lot of mixes and channels in MixControl it does not have any affect at SUB, C, RL, SL, SR, RR) could somebody check and tell I am wrong please :D ?
What I noticed that 5.1 sorrund and 7.1 sourrund have both 8 channels? (I am not an expert, but would like to know what is a reason for that) There is also a normal 5.1 and sorrund option with 6 channels.
My audiointerfaces has 6 mixes maximum, which is hint that is 5.1 capable, but which option in Apo-EQ should i select?
It would very good for me to know, if the channels in ApoEQ (R,L,SL,SR......) are DAW 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 or Mixes (1-6) or both depends on prestage or poststage.
I am sorry, for so many questions, but tried the hole afternoon to get it right, I have no clue where I can get some informations about this topic, links are welcome!
It seems to me that Voicemeeter Banana is NOT able to realize a crossover for active systems. Has a lot of filter types for all the channels (6 pro channel seems to be tight but enough), BUT: there is no option to copy or mix the channels! This is a reason why it can not be working!
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
There is an option (stereo repeat) to copy channels 1&2 to 3&4, 5&6 amd 7&8 ... see Voicemeeter Banana User Manual page 17.
If needed you can also enable buses A2 and A3 for to get more EQ bands ... (virtual inputs -section).
Last edit: Juha 2017-08-19
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Thanks, this was very detailed! :)
So, it is really possibe to do something. But I still can not see the adding, leveling and delaying channels options...
Last edit: csigabiga 2017-08-21
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Hmm... well, you're here discussions!, so, why not use EqualizerAPO for those features not found in Voicemeeter Banana?
To allow cooperation, all you need to do is to set Voicemeeter to use right type device API for playback...
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
I do so, I am using the EQ-APO since 3-4 years with pleasure.... And it works in cooperation with Voicemeeter too (I do not have real experience in terms of possibly quality improvement). But it is another software to install, run, manage... Should be good if one program could handle all this things.
Voicemeeter Banana has in the manual that the program can be use as a crossover. Yes, but with strong restrictions! So, perhaps in the incoming versions will be this missing functions available...:)
Last edit: csigabiga 2017-08-22
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Here's an example of 24dB/oct crossover using Voicemeeter Banana
Settings:
Filters:
Channels 1&2 has equal (LP) filters, 3&4 has equal (Bandpass made using HP and LP) filters and channels 5&6 (HP) as well. You be able to save the settings through Banana Menu.
I don't know how the Q is defined in Banana so, instedad of using the suggested value 3.0, I just picked something. Actual Q value could be 2.871.
@Juha Your Voicemeeter Banana crossover settings are not displayed on my computer using Edge nor Chrome on tablet. Are the images broken?
I'd appreciate more info on these settings. Is the crossover outcome going to be the same generated with Voicemeeter Banana compared to EAPO generated crossover processed within Voicemeeter Banana?
And why is the suggested Q value 3.0 and not something closer to .49 or .707 as per http://www.bcae1.com/xoorder.htm
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
postimage.org seems to delete unregistered user's uploads after certain time period (though, they promise something else ...).
What comes to Q value definition on Voicemeeter Banana, I have never checked if it's following 'the standard' (= you might not get what you expect by setting the Q by some scale used on another software) ... but, they use range between 1 and 100 for Q ... which means you can't use decimal values below 1 as you suggest ... . This leads to :
Q=3.0 is ~0.478699 as bw/oct (i.e. Q=~2.871 = ~0.5 as bw/oct) ... to get Q match with 0.7071 (bw/oct) just use calculator linked in my earlier post.
NOTE: IIRC, LP and HP Voicemeeter implements are maybe fixed Q filters so you are not able to change Q for them (are those fixed for Q=3.0 or Q=2.871 ... ?).
Last edit: Juha 2018-10-28
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
I have been using EQ APO as a cinema processor and it works great.
The software allows me to process my 7.1 channels in the same way that Dolby does with
their processors, 1/3 octave 31 band eq. All measured with RTA.
I use Kodi to output 48khz 24bit PCM (bluray drive installed, DTS HD master source) and then EQ APO to
process everything.
I am still looking to get the most out of my system, and since there is no Asio support due to the nature of APO
I have instead been trying to get Voicemeeter to work, virtual cable input and output piped into Eq Apo.
But no luck, voicemeeter output as capture device does'nt work.
Anyone had luck using voicemeeter? Tried Aux, Vaio and hifi cable but nothing works....
Love the software though, keep up the good work.
The just released version 1.2 has integrated Voicemeeter support. Just install it and select the Voicemeeter device in the Configurator. Then you can just use Voicemeeter normally as E-APO does the processing inside Voicemeeter.
Hi,
I have tryed and it works perfect. My question is that does this solution have a sonic benefit at all?
No, there should be no audible difference. The advantage of Voicemeeter is that it does support all APIs, so also WASAPI exclusive mode and ASIO, while Equalizer APO as a normal APO does not work when these APIs are used. However, if you are not using one of these low-latency APIs, the latency using Voicemeeter is usually higher than when doing direct output to the sound device (it also depends on buffer sizes and your sound card driver). Another advantage of Voicemeeter is that it can simultaneously output to multiple devices.
Isn't bypassing the Windows OS Mixer with its dithering and resampling considered a SQ best practice in the industry? (e.g. Exclusive Mode in Roon, JRiver, etc).
My thinking - VoiceMeeter might benefit sound quality while keep using EqualizerAPO since it implemented using the VoiceMeeter Client and not using the Windows APO, therefore bypassing the OS Mixer if using "WDM Input Exclusive Mode" in VoiceMeeter and "Exclusive Mode" in the player. What do you think?
hi,
I have a 2.1 setup (left, right and a subwoofer)
At the moment it works like this:
My audiointerfaces sends a stereomix to my subwoofer which has a build in lowcut, which is sended to my satellites afterwards.
My wish would be that I can configure my subwoofer separat from my left or right satellite to get a better acoustic in my music room. I think voicemeeter can handle this somehow.
My setup: Win10, Focusrite 8i6 with Mixcontrol, Apo Equalizer, REW and Voicemeeter installed.
I installed Voicemeeter and made it the standard audio device. I setup for 5.1 in Windows and in the Apo Editor. With that i can configure 4 different channels L, R, SL and SR
SL and SR will be the two physical outputs for my subwoofer.
Filter Settings file
Copy: SL=L SR=R
Channel: L
Filter: ON HP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: R
Filter: ON HP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: SL
Filter: ON LP Fc 120 Hz
Channel: SR
Filter: ON LP Fc 120 Hz
How do I handle route VoiceMeeter and MixControl on my Focusrite?
Voicemeeter does not give reliable information about the currently selected device and its channel configuration. Therefore, Equalizer APO always uses all 8 channels in a 7.1 configuration. You might need to change SL and SR to RL and RR so that you address the channels 5 and 6 instead of 7 and 8 (which are lost because you are using a 5.1 device).
You should not need to do any additional configuration in Voicemeeter if you already have working audio output. I don't know anything about MixControl, so I can't give you any advice for that.
If you see all the channels you need in your setup being active in Voicemeeter "Virtual Inputs" section (meters) ... there shouldn't be more than just selecting the "Normal Mode" option in "Master Section" to do (BTW, I'm using Banana version).
Probably you could do channel mixing (that Copy: SL=L, SR=R thing) throuh that MixControl applet (maybe Router) ....
Thanks for your replies! :D
I am getting closer to it. I switched my setup to 7.1.
Before I will work with ApoEQ i want the audio routing correct. For that I just use my MusicPlayer to hear which channel is playing. At the moment I dont hear anyhting of all 4 channels. So I guess I did not setup my drivers correctly.
Windows: VoiceMeeter Output and Input (without Aux) is standard
VoiceMeeter: A1 output: WDM Focusrite 8i6 output is selected, (correct?) alternatives ASIO (not supported by APO-EQ), KS, MME
Input: WDM Input Scarlett 8i6, alternatives KS, MME
MusicPlayer: 3 driver options: DirectSound, ASIO, WASAPI,
3 Soundcard sources: Focusrite output, Voicemeeter AUX Input, Voicemeeter Input
I choose DirectSound and Virtual Input (without AUX), with that my Player is playing (I see timeline) and in Voicemeeter my virtual Input is moving accordingly to the signal of the player. The problem is that I can`t hear anything. Any advice?
There is no signal in MixControl, which shows all outputs or inputs.
Last edit: stoneson2 2017-08-14
Ahh I to turn on the virtual input Button A! no I get a signal to the output. I see it on MixControl and can hear it, but it is very distorted signal.
Play with the Voicemeeter I/O buffer sizes. ASIO, WASAPI and WDM/WDMKS should work well below 2048 samples buffer but MME may need ir set bigger. Try to find suitable size. Also, I've noticed that sometimes you need to close EqualizerAPO and Voicemeeter to get that distortion to end.
hi,
Can you tell me where the EQ is placed? circle is pre-mixer, square is post-mixer right? (pic attched)
It is really difficult because each program has different names for different channels/mix :D
There are two possbilities in my eyes now why it does not work: copy channel does not work ( only channel R and L are EQ able and i tested it with a lot of mixes and channels in MixControl it does not have any affect at SUB, C, RL, SL, SR, RR) could somebody check and tell I am wrong please :D ?
What I noticed that 5.1 sorrund and 7.1 sourrund have both 8 channels? (I am not an expert, but would like to know what is a reason for that) There is also a normal 5.1 and sorrund option with 6 channels.
My audiointerfaces has 6 mixes maximum, which is hint that is 5.1 capable, but which option in Apo-EQ should i select?
It would very good for me to know, if the channels in ApoEQ (R,L,SL,SR......) are DAW 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 or Mixes (1-6) or both depends on prestage or poststage.
I am sorry, for so many questions, but tried the hole afternoon to get it right, I have no clue where I can get some informations about this topic, links are welcome!
Last edit: stoneson2 2017-08-14
It seems to me that Voicemeeter Banana is NOT able to realize a crossover for active systems. Has a lot of filter types for all the channels (6 pro channel seems to be tight but enough), BUT: there is no option to copy or mix the channels! This is a reason why it can not be working!
Do you mean copy stereo to 8 channels or downmix surround to stereo (or 2.1. for your speakers)?
Last edit: Juha 2017-08-18
Yes, copy stereo to 8 channels and possibly add or multiply signals...
(downmix is made by the player software)
Last edit: csigabiga 2017-08-18
There is an option (stereo repeat) to copy channels 1&2 to 3&4, 5&6 amd 7&8 ... see Voicemeeter Banana User Manual page 17.
If needed you can also enable buses A2 and A3 for to get more EQ bands ... (virtual inputs -section).
Last edit: Juha 2017-08-19
Thanks, this was very detailed! :)
So, it is really possibe to do something. But I still can not see the adding, leveling and delaying channels options...
Last edit: csigabiga 2017-08-21
Hmm... well, you're here discussions!, so, why not use EqualizerAPO for those features not found in Voicemeeter Banana?
To allow cooperation, all you need to do is to set Voicemeeter to use right type device API for playback...
I do so, I am using the EQ-APO since 3-4 years with pleasure.... And it works in cooperation with Voicemeeter too (I do not have real experience in terms of possibly quality improvement). But it is another software to install, run, manage... Should be good if one program could handle all this things.
Voicemeeter Banana has in the manual that the program can be use as a crossover. Yes, but with strong restrictions! So, perhaps in the incoming versions will be this missing functions available...:)
Last edit: csigabiga 2017-08-22
Here's an example of 24dB/oct crossover using Voicemeeter Banana
Settings:
Filters:
Channels 1&2 has equal (LP) filters, 3&4 has equal (Bandpass made using HP and LP) filters and channels 5&6 (HP) as well. You be able to save the settings through Banana Menu.
I don't know how the Q is defined in Banana so, instedad of using the suggested value 3.0, I just picked something. Actual Q value could be 2.871.
If needed, BW <-> Q conversion can be done here: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-bandwidth.htm.
BTW, I did not test this crossover.
@Juha Your Voicemeeter Banana crossover settings are not displayed on my computer using Edge nor Chrome on tablet. Are the images broken?
I'd appreciate more info on these settings. Is the crossover outcome going to be the same generated with Voicemeeter Banana compared to EAPO generated crossover processed within Voicemeeter Banana?
And why is the suggested Q value 3.0 and not something closer to .49 or .707 as per http://www.bcae1.com/xoorder.htm
postimage.org seems to delete unregistered user's uploads after certain time period (though, they promise something else ...).
What comes to Q value definition on Voicemeeter Banana, I have never checked if it's following 'the standard' (= you might not get what you expect by setting the Q by some scale used on another software) ... but, they use range between 1 and 100 for Q ... which means you can't use decimal values below 1 as you suggest ... . This leads to :
Q=3.0 is ~0.478699 as bw/oct (i.e. Q=~2.871 = ~0.5 as bw/oct) ... to get Q match with 0.7071 (bw/oct) just use calculator linked in my earlier post.
NOTE: IIRC, LP and HP Voicemeeter implements are maybe fixed Q filters so you are not able to change Q for them (are those fixed for Q=3.0 or Q=2.871 ... ?).
Last edit: Juha 2018-10-28