Re: [Audacity-quality] Text Envelope (feedback required)

[Gale A. <ga...@au...>]

Short:
The last time we discussed this a year ago on the Forum, you said you 
intended to complete a version that uses a dot as the decimal separator
(your option 1). I'm voting for (1) now.

Longer:

I preferred (2) at the time, but if the majority of Nyquist plug-in users
are English they "may" find inability to use comma as separator between
values irksome - especially as there are two possible separators (those
demarcating individual values and those demarcating a pair). 

We do have another option (6) of giving user instructions to edit a line 
in the .ny file to turn on comma for decimal separator. I prefer that to 
adding a control (option 3) as I think it would be better to have a control 
that represented a practical plug-in feature.

If all other Nyquist plug-ins do not support comma as decimal separator 
I think that's an argument for not making an exception here either. It's
confusing given built-in effects accept comma as decimal separator, but 
Nyquist plug-ins currently have no translations so it is perhaps not 
totally unexpected. If we feel the need to publicise the decimal 
separator restriction on the web pages where Nyquist Plug-ins can be 
downloaded, that is easily done. 

I think we should be as liberal as possible though with the allowed 
value separators. David had a concern about spaces in selected 
text boxes not being read by screen readers, and you had suggested
these as value separators in addition to space: 

   ( ) [] {} ; : ,

FWIW I note NVDA by default doesn't read space, comma, semicolon,
parens, brackets or braces in selected text boxes, but does read colon 
and dash. 





Gale 


| From Steve the Fiddle <ste...@gm...> 
| Tue, 21 Jun 2011 21:46:36 +0100
| Subject: Text Envelope (feedback required)
> I'd like to complete the "text envelope" plug-in that I began some
> time ago, but there is a usability issue that brought development of
> this plug-in to a standstill that is still unresolved.
> 
> A quick recap on what this is all about:
> 
> Audacity provides an Envelope tool for controlling a track's volume
> changes smoothly over time. Unfortunately this tool is unusable for
> visually impaired users, or other users that are unable to use a
> pointing device. The purpose of the Text Envelope plug-in is to
> provide an alternative way to change an audio tracks volume over time
> that does not require use of a mouse or other pointing device.
> 
> The unresolved usability issue is due to the current GUI limitations
> for Nyquist plug-ins. The only input method that can accept more than
> one value is the text input control (like the Frequency range control
> in the vocal remover effect). By using a text input control it will be
> possible for the user to type an arbitrary number of pairs of values
> for "time" and "amplification" (a text equivalent of the Envelope tool
> "control points"). The values would be numerical, and must be
> separated by either a space, or a non-numerical character. The problem
> comes if a user decides to use a comma as a separator, either between
> values, or between pairs of values. This is a problem because some
> European countries use a comma as a decimal separator.
> 
> Nyquist, as with virtually all programming languages, ONLY uses a dot
> as a decimal separator. To allow a comma to be used as a decimal
> separator, then the Nyquist code must convert the commas to dots.
> 
> On the other hand, comma separated variables is a very common (and
> easy to read) format in many countries.
> 
> So the problem is, that if commas are allowed as decimal separators,
> then Nyquist has no way of knowing if, for example, 2,3 means one
> value "2 point 3" or if it is two values "2 and 3".
> 
> Possible solutions:
> 
> 1) Use only a dot as the decimal separator regardless of locale.
> 2) Allow a dot or comma as the decimal separator, but have a note in
> the GUI that commas must not be used between values.
> 3) Have a decimal separator selection control (Decimal separator: "." or ",")
> 4) Allow only specific characters to be used as separators (for
> example, space or colon)
> 5) Use a lot of slider controls rather than text input.
> 
> Note that:
> * Nyquist is not aware of the system language settings
> * Commas are allowed as decimal separators in most (but not all?)
> built-in effects in Audacity (subject to the system language settings)
> * Other Nyquist plug-ins do not support a comma as a decimal separator (bug 173)
> 
> I'm aware that this may appear to be a trivial matter, but this is the
> main issue that has prevented an accessible envelope control from
> being released.
> 
> The question is which is the least bad out of options 1 to 5 (or
> another option that I've not thought of).
> 
> 
> Thank you for your consideration.
> Steve