Re: [Audacity-quality] Sync-lock track indicators in Track Control Panels

[Bill W. <bi...@go...>]

Good catch, Steve. I hadn't tried a track arrangement like that.

I agree that this is in the category of "conceptual/design" problems.  
With the track arrangement you discuss, it is impossible to  
simultaneously indicate that there are two groups. Gale says it  
another way - "we need a steady-state indication that tracks are in a  
group, selected or not".

There's an even simpler demonstration. Create two audio tracks. Turn  
sync-lock on. Click with the selection tool in one track, then press  
the enter key to deselect the track - the sync-lock indicators in the  
track control panels go away. Now select the Time Shift tool and drag  
- the tracks move together and the sync-lock indicators remain off.

This doesn't need to be a "back to the drawing board" situation. Sync- 
lock exists even if there is no indication - the time shift drag in  
the non-selected track shows that. It's just that the indication is  
tied to selection. Unfortunately we'd probably be talking for months  
about what that steady-state indicator should look like. "Bracketing"  
was discussed and rejected. Differently coloured dots in the track  
panel was rejected as "too distracting" as I recall, but remains my  
preferred solution. I think the possible distraction of the sync-lock  
indicators being  on all the time outweighs the potential user  
confusion when the sync-lock indicators flash on and off as the  
selection changes, and sync-locked tracks not being indicated as such  
when they are operated on.

-- Bill


On 18-Feb-11, at 6:58 AM, Steve the Fiddle wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 9:58 AM, Gale Andrews  
> <ga...@au...> wrote:
>>
>> | From Steve the Fiddle <ste...@gm...>
>> | Wed, 16 Feb 2011 17:34:21 +0000
>> | Subject: Sync-lock track indicators in Track Control Panels
>>> Not sure where I should raise this issue, perhaps someone could  
>>> advise:
>>>
>>> One would probably think that the "sync-lock background shading"
>>> indicated sync-locked selections, and the "sync-lock icon" in the
>>> Track Control Panel indicated that the tracks are sync-locked.
>>>
>>> If sync-lock is enabled but there are no tracks selected, there is  
>>> no
>>> sync-lock indicator in any track. However, tracks ARE sync-locked  
>>> even
>>> if they have no selection, so the track sync-lock indicator should  
>>> be
>>> on for all sync-locked tracks.
>>
>> We had all this over on -devel ages ago - I raised the identical  
>> point.
>> I too think users will assume that the icon indicates a track  
>> belonging
>> to a sync-locked group, but it does not indicate that.
>>
>> In Al's scheme the icon is an indicator that the track is in a sync- 
>> locked
>> group where at least one of the tracks in the group is selected,   
>> so that
>> any synchronicity change in the selected track(s) will be reflected  
>> in
>> the other tracks in the group.
>>
>> If you have:
>>
>> Audio Track
>> Audio Track
>> Label Track
>> Audio Track
>> Audio Track
>>
>> select in the bottom track then toggle selectedness in the other  
>> tracks,
>> you can probably see this more clearly. For example, if you had a
>> selection in just the bottom track, the icons will not show in the  
>> upper
>> two audio tracks and the label track, indicating those tracks will  
>> not
>> be affected by any synchronicity changes in the lower two audio  
>> tracks.
>> If icons were to denote tracks in a group (selected or not), then we
>> would probably need different icons for the upper two tracks and  
>> label
>> track. I always thought some solution like that, or "bracketing" of  
>> tracks
>> in each group to make clear which track belongs to which group, would
>> aid user understanding.
>>
>> I think the slight weakness of the scheme is that it was built too  
>> much
>> around selections. So 1) we have bug 222:
>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=222
>>
>> which James thinks is not a bug but I do, albeit one we can't fix  
>> at the
>> moment. That is, we are inconsistent in showing sync-selected regions
>> but not sync-selected cursors, so creating ambiguity about whether
>> an action at a cursor point in a selected track will affect sync- 
>> selected
>> tracks or not.
>>
>> The other problem 2) is time-shifting. With sync-lock on, you can  
>> drag
>> all tracks in a group by dragging one track, even if the tracks in  
>> that
>> group are deselected and thus showing no icon. To me that's a strong
>> indication that we need a steady-state indication that tracks are  
>> in a
>> group, selected or not.
>>
>
> It's the time shift issue (2) that looks particularly wrong and was
> reported on the forum as a "wtf". I then tried it and had the same
> reaction.
>
> I think that the idea of the Track Control Panel Sync-lock icon only
> indicating sync-locked selections is flawed.
> Here's two specific examples.
>
> With Sync-lock enabled and using the same arrangement of tracks that
> you described;
> Audio track 1
> Audio track 2
> Label track
> Audio track 3
> Audio track 4
>
> * Click (don't drag) with the selection tool on Audio track 3. A
> cursor appears on track 3 and the Sync-lock icons display in Audio
> tracks 3 and 4.
> * Change to the Time Shift tool.
> * Click on Audio track 4. The cursor is now shown in track 3 and 4 and
> the Sync-lock icon is still displayed in tracks 3 and 4.
> So far it looks completely as expected. Audio tracks 3 and 4 are
> clearly sync-locked.
>
> There is no indication that Audio tracks 1 and 2 are sync-locked.
> * Drag Audio track 1. Now is the first "wtf" moment as Audio tracks 1
> and 2 and the label track all move.
>
> * With a facial expression of incredulity (optional), press Ctrl+U to
> undo. The cursor still shows in Audio track 3, Sync-lock icons display
> in Audio tracks 3 and 4 and the Time-Shift tool is still selected.
> * Click (don't drag) on Audio track 1.
>
> There is now a cursor in Audio track 1 and Audio track 3. The
> sync-lock icons show in Audio tracks 3 and 4.
> What is the user suppose to think that means? What 'does' that mean?
> New user guess (1) - If I drag Audio track 1, Audio track 3 will also
> move (because there is a cursor in it) - wrong.
> New user guess (2) - If I drag Audio track 1, Audio tracks 3 and 4
> will also move (because they are indicated as Sync-locked) - wrong.
> New user guess (3) - If I drag Audio track 1, only Audio track 1 will
> move (because it is not in the Sync-locked group) - wrong.
>
> I very much doubt that a new user would guess the correct answer until
> they tried it. I didn't, did you?
>
> Wikipedia describes beta software as "The focus of beta testing is
> reducing impacts to users, often incorporating usability testing".
> This says to me that beta testing should not only reveal technical
> flaws (bugs) but also conceptual/design problems. I think this issue
> with the Track Control Panel Sync-lock icon falls into the latter
> category.
>
> I've Cc:'d this reply to the QA list, hope you don't mind me quoting
> your reply Gale. Feel free to quote my comments in part or in full as
> you feel appropriate.
>
> Steve
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Gale
>>
>>
>>
>
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