Is this received backspace chars or the backspace key on the PC keyboard?
Is the problem in the terminal or in other UI elements (eg edit boxes)?
In what way does it not work? (not displaying char, not moving cursor etc etc)
Which DisplayAs emulator are you using?
Is the problem on one emulator or multiple ones?
Last edit: Simon Bridger 2015-10-18
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Backspace works with all of the dialogue boxes but whenever you are trying
to send backspace with an Ansi-VT100 serial or IP connection (we use raw)
it doesn't work.
This happens on the two PCs we have the program loaded on. It worked fine
with all the same settings on version 2.0.0.70.
Thanks
Keith
On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 5:12 AM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
Is this received backspace chars or the backspace key on the PC keyboard?
Is the problem in the terminal or in other UI elements (eg edit boxes)?
Status: open Fixed_in_Version: Not Fixed Version: V3.0.0.27 Created: Mon Jul 27, 2015 08:35 PM UTC by keith Last Updated: Mon Jul 27, 2015 08:35 PM UTC Owner: nobody
Backspace doesn't work in version 3.0.0.28 using the serial port or an IP
address. Backspace works fine with identical settings in 2.0.0.70.
Well amazing what I didn't know. This is the rubout/delete character and so is obviously deliberate, rather than a bug. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delete_characterhttp://www.vt100.net/docs/vt100-ug/table3-4.html
The logical difference is that delete is a command to the remote system, with no cursor movement and no function specified. Backspace implies move cursor back and overwrite space.
Which leave the question: Should it be backspace or delete char?
If yes, then the "delete" key should be probably be mapped to 0x7f, instead of being unmapped as at present
Last edit: Simon Bridger 2016-01-09
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Hello, I have been asked for some feedback on the issue. Here are the results of my tests.
Here are key codes read from realterm when entered in TerraTerm (hex):
BACKSPACE: 0x08
DELETE: 0x7F
SHIFT + BACKSPACE: 0x08
Same here but sending from putty:
BACKSPACE: 0x7F
DELETE: 0x1B 0x5B 0x33 0x7E
SHIFT + BACKSPACE: 0x08
Seems like they send different data.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Key-code changes in terminal to make more logical and regular in all emulators
Change BACKSPACE and DELETE key behaviour to send BS and DEL (fix bug#64)
^BS sends DELETE
add NULL key ^@ or ^space
ENTER->CR, shift+ENTER->CRLF, ^ENTER->LF Ansi/VT100 now same.
(note ^C is trapped for copy before it gets to emulator, so you still have to use button on send tab)
Load Keymaps. Separate Keymaps for VT100/Ansi (KEYMAPVT) and (future) the other terminals (KEYMAP)
This allows remapping of keyboards, adding custom multi-char keys ie macros
New commandline params KEYMAPVT=<fname> loads a keymap file for VT100</fname>
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
However, in Ascii mode it behaves a bit strange compared to what I expected
(I am definitely not an expert in this area). When I type something while
connected to a device, I see "Bs Bs" but it doesn't actually move the
cursor backward. But if I type something in after hitting backspace the
proper number of times, it takes the new command.
So it works functionally, but it doesn't actually move the cursor to the
left. I attached a screen shot. You can see our module properly
responding to the HELP command.
I tried Ascii mode on a computer wtih 2.0.0.70 and backspace doesn't do
anything.
Keith
On Sat, Jan 30, 2016 at 5:29 AM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
OK fixed now, please test this version and report back, please test VT100
and ASCII display modes:
Key-code changes in terminal to make more logical and regular in all
emulators
Change BACKSPACE and DELETE key behaviour to send BS and DEL (fix
bug#64)
^BS sends DELETE
add NULL key ^@ or ^space
ENTER->CR, shift+ENTER->CRLF, ^ENTER->LF Ansi/VT100 now same.
(note ^C is trapped for copy before it gets to emulator, so you still
have to use button on send tab)
Load Keymaps. Separate Keymaps for VT100/Ansi (KEYMAPVT) and
(future) the other terminals (KEYMAP)
This allows remapping of keyboards, adding custom multi-char keys ie
macros
New commandline params KEYMAPVT=<fname> loads a keymap file for VT100</fname>
Status: accepted Fixed_in_Version: Not Fixed Version: V3.0.0.29 Created: Mon Jul 27, 2015 08:35 PM UTC by keith Last Updated: Sat Jan 09, 2016 01:37 PM UTC Owner: nobody
Backspace doesn't work in version 3.0.0.28 using the serial port or an IP
address. Backspace works fine with identical settings in 2.0.0.70.
OK you are confusing what Realterm does:
In ASCII mode (display=0) Realterm displays every character (well if you use our hex font which has every char in it). This is called the "ShowAll" emulator.
BS is displayed, not actioned (as this would make both the BS, and the preceeding char disappear.
CR, and LF can be both displayed and actioned. The purpose of this mode is seeing what is *everything actually being sent^
The lower ASCII mode (display=9) only shows printable chars, and obeys BS. Actually this seems a bit inconsistent to me, and could probably do with being more logical
ANSI/VT100 is the mode for using with formatted text, cursor control and so on. If your device is trying to get the screen looking a certain way with tabs, cursor commands, or BS to allow re-writes you want to use ANSI emulation.
.--------------------------------
Perhaps I should add a checkbox to Action BS?
Does this really make sense when ANSI emulation exists to meet this need?
Is this an actual issue for you ie do you have a reason to want to use the ASCII showall emulator instead of the ANSI one, AND have BS actioned?
Should we have chat on skype/viber and talk through your use-case?
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Thanks for the explanation on ASCII. Honestly I have never purposely used
ASCII mode nor had I realized there were two ASCII selections in the
Display tab.
We have always used ANSI-VT100 and it fits what we need it to do perfectly.
I personally wouldn't feel comfortable recommending a change to the way you
have implemented ASCII as our use would be limited at most.
Keith
On Tue, Feb 2, 2016 at 11:43 PM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
OK you are confusing what Realterm does:
In ASCII mode (display=0) Realterm displays every character (well if
you use our hex font which has every char in it). This is called the
"ShowAll" emulator.
BS is displayed, not actioned (as this would make both the BS, and the
preceeding char disappear.
CR, and LF can be both displayed and actioned. The purpose of this mode is
seeing what is *everything actually being sent^
The lower ASCII mode (display=9) only shows printable chars, and obeys BS.
Actually this seems a bit inconsistent to me, and could probably do with
being more logical
ANSI/VT100 is the mode for using with formatted text, cursor control and
so on. If your device is trying to get the screen looking a certain way
with tabs, cursor commands, or BS to allow re-writes you want to use ANSI
emulation.
.--------------------------------
Perhaps I should add a checkbox to Action BS?
Does this really make sense when ANSI emulation exists to meet this need?
Is this an actual issue for you ie do you have a reason to want to use the
ASCII showall emulator instead of the ANSI one, AND have BS actioned?
Should we have chat on skype/viber and talk through your use-case?
Status: awaiting-testing Fixed_in_Version: V3.0.0.30 Version: V3.0.0.29 Created: Mon Jul 27, 2015 08:35 PM UTC by keith Last Updated: Sat Jan 30, 2016 10:29 AM UTC Owner: nobody
Backspace doesn't work in version 3.0.0.28 using the serial port or an IP
address. Backspace works fine with identical settings in 2.0.0.70.
Is this received backspace chars or the backspace key on the PC keyboard?
Is the problem in the terminal or in other UI elements (eg edit boxes)?
In what way does it not work? (not displaying char, not moving cursor etc etc)
Which DisplayAs emulator are you using?
Is the problem on one emulator or multiple ones?
Last edit: Simon Bridger 2015-10-18
Hi Simon,
Sorry about the late reply.
Backspace works with all of the dialogue boxes but whenever you are trying
to send backspace with an Ansi-VT100 serial or IP connection (we use raw)
it doesn't work.
This happens on the two PCs we have the program loaded on. It worked fine
with all the same settings on version 2.0.0.70.
Thanks
Keith
On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 5:12 AM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
Related
Bugs: #64
Indeed you seem to be right, $7F gets sent both from the BS key and by ^H, and in all terminal modes.
However in Ansi-VT100, shift+BS sends $08 correctly, so that might help you until fixed.
Well amazing what I didn't know. This is the rubout/delete character and so is obviously deliberate, rather than a bug. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delete_character http://www.vt100.net/docs/vt100-ug/table3-4.html
The logical difference is that delete is a command to the remote system, with no cursor movement and no function specified. Backspace implies move cursor back and overwrite space.
Which leave the question: Should it be backspace or delete char?
If yes, then the "delete" key should be probably be mapped to 0x7f, instead of being unmapped as at present
Last edit: Simon Bridger 2016-01-09
Hello, I have been asked for some feedback on the issue. Here are the results of my tests.
Here are key codes read from realterm when entered in TerraTerm (hex):
BACKSPACE: 0x08
DELETE: 0x7F
SHIFT + BACKSPACE: 0x08
Same here but sending from putty:
BACKSPACE: 0x7F
DELETE: 0x1B 0x5B 0x33 0x7E
SHIFT + BACKSPACE: 0x08
Seems like they send different data.
Thanks L.
For now I think RT will change to:
BACKSPACE 0x08 ( also ^H)
DELETE 0x7F ( also shift/ctrl+BACKSPACE and ctrl+?)
^@ and ^space 0x00
I think this makes more sense for the RT mission (ie not being a console terminal)
OK fixed now, please test this version and report back, please test VT100 and ASCII display modes:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uwci0lcucobdncr/realterm.exe?dl=0
Change BACKSPACE and DELETE key behaviour to send BS and DEL (fix bug#64)
^BS sends DELETE
add NULL key ^@ or ^space
ENTER->CR, shift+ENTER->CRLF, ^ENTER->LF Ansi/VT100 now same.
(note ^C is trapped for copy before it gets to emulator, so you still have to use button on send tab)
This allows remapping of keyboards, adding custom multi-char keys ie macros
New commandline params KEYMAPVT=<fname> loads a keymap file for VT100</fname>
Hi Simon,
Backspace works like a charm in Ansi-VT100!
However, in Ascii mode it behaves a bit strange compared to what I expected
(I am definitely not an expert in this area). When I type something while
connected to a device, I see "Bs Bs" but it doesn't actually move the
cursor backward. But if I type something in after hitting backspace the
proper number of times, it takes the new command.
So it works functionally, but it doesn't actually move the cursor to the
left. I attached a screen shot. You can see our module properly
responding to the HELP command.
I tried Ascii mode on a computer wtih 2.0.0.70 and backspace doesn't do
anything.
Keith
On Sat, Jan 30, 2016 at 5:29 AM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
Related
Bugs: #64
OK you are confusing what Realterm does:
In ASCII mode (display=0) Realterm displays every character (well if you use our hex font which has every char in it). This is called the "ShowAll" emulator.
BS is displayed, not actioned (as this would make both the BS, and the preceeding char disappear.
CR, and LF can be both displayed and actioned. The purpose of this mode is seeing what is *everything actually being sent^
The lower ASCII mode (display=9) only shows printable chars, and obeys BS. Actually this seems a bit inconsistent to me, and could probably do with being more logical
ANSI/VT100 is the mode for using with formatted text, cursor control and so on. If your device is trying to get the screen looking a certain way with tabs, cursor commands, or BS to allow re-writes you want to use ANSI emulation.
.--------------------------------
Perhaps I should add a checkbox to Action BS?
Does this really make sense when ANSI emulation exists to meet this need?
Is this an actual issue for you ie do you have a reason to want to use the ASCII showall emulator instead of the ANSI one, AND have BS actioned?
Should we have chat on skype/viber and talk through your use-case?
Hi Simon,
Thanks for the explanation on ASCII. Honestly I have never purposely used
ASCII mode nor had I realized there were two ASCII selections in the
Display tab.
We have always used ANSI-VT100 and it fits what we need it to do perfectly.
I personally wouldn't feel comfortable recommending a change to the way you
have implemented ASCII as our use would be limited at most.
Keith
On Tue, Feb 2, 2016 at 11:43 PM, Simon Bridger crun@users.sf.net wrote:
Related
Bugs: #64