rails-devel — List for discussion of Rails development

Re: [Rails-devel] 1835 token lay cost

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

NoMap Mode token costs in 1835:
I agree that this is the best implementation. I just added code that only 
those token costs are suggested, that can be paid with the available cash. 
(That is checked now for all NoMap OperatingCost actions).

And I removed the zero cost for laying (again) at the home city.
Stefan

On Saturday 20 February 2010 13:41:24 Erik Vos wrote:
> I have implemented token lay cost calcuation in 1835.
>
> To Stefan Frey:
> I have also added NoMap mode to 1835.
> All possible token lay costs from the current company home hex are now
> displayed in the "Operating Cost" list as separate entries.
> I don't know if this is the way you would like it to be, but at least this
> was easy to do.
>
> Erik.
>
>
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Re: [Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

No other types have been implemented yet, but "linear" obviously will be
another one (and "hexagonal" for 1837).
Erik.

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...] 
Sent: Monday 22 February 2010 14:55
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

type = rectangular

Is the only option I see listed amongst games we have supported.  Is
there yet any support for different types of stock market?  I'm
playing around with getting files added to support 1825 and this has a
linear stock market (not to mention double and triple price jumps) I'm
aware this will need additional work to support, I'm just using this
as a way to get to know the structure and contribute better :)

Phil

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Re: [Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

On 22 Feb 2010, at 17:40, brett lentz <bre...@gm...> wrote:

> On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 5:54 AM, Phil Davies <de...@gm...>  
> wrote:
>> type = rectangular
>>
>> Is the only option I see listed amongst games we have supported.  Is
>> there yet any support for different types of stock market?  I'm
>> playing around with getting files added to support 1825 and this  
>> has a
>> linear stock market (not to mention double and triple price jumps)  
>> I'm
>> aware this will need additional work to support, I'm just using this
>> as a way to get to know the structure and contribute better :)
>>
>> Phil
>
> Linear is rectangular with only a single row. :-)
>
Okay, this is true but you are going to need a fairly wide monitor to  
fit the linear market on one row.

Valid point from John on the hex markets, I had forgotten about those  
existing

> I don't think we yet support any other types of stock layouts, but I
> seem to recall that we put it there just in case someone decided to
> come up with a non-rectangular stock layout (i.e. circular, 3-d,
> etc.).
>
> ---Brett.
>
> --- 
> --- 
> --- 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
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Re: [Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

[John A. T. <ja...@ja...>]

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 12:40 PM, brett lentz <bre...@gm...> wrote:

> Linear is rectangular with only a single row. :-)
>
> I don't think we yet support any other types of stock layouts, but I
> seem to recall that we put it there just in case someone decided to
> come up with a non-rectangular stock layout (i.e. circular, 3-d,
> etc.).


1854 and 18Kit have hexagonal stock markets.

-- 
John A. Tamplin

Re: [Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

[brett l. <bre...@gm...>]

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 5:54 AM, Phil Davies <de...@gm...> wrote:
> type = rectangular
>
> Is the only option I see listed amongst games we have supported.  Is
> there yet any support for different types of stock market?  I'm
> playing around with getting files added to support 1825 and this has a
> linear stock market (not to mention double and triple price jumps) I'm
> aware this will need additional work to support, I'm just using this
> as a way to get to know the structure and contribute better :)
>
> Phil

Linear is rectangular with only a single row. :-)

I don't think we yet support any other types of stock layouts, but I
seem to recall that we put it there just in case someone decided to
come up with a non-rectangular stock layout (i.e. circular, 3-d,
etc.).

---Brett.

Re: [Rails-devel] Info

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

Patch for 18AL longnames for companies

The 'powers' for the M&C and NDY aren't in particularly clear English
but I'm unsure exactly how the info menu is populated here.  I'm
assuming it's somewhere in LocalisedText.properties but couldn't
totally work out where the existing companies are picking up their
info from.

Any pointers on where to put this information and I'll add it.

Phil

On 15 February 2010 22:40, brett lentz <bre...@gm...> wrote:
> Applied.
>
> ---Brett.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 4:46 AM, Phil Davies <de...@gm...> wrote:
>> Patch for 1870 longnames as well as adding/correcting some of the
>> longnames in 18EU to match those given in the rulebook
>>
>> A lot of the private company bonus features from 1870 aren't
>> implemented yet so I haven't bothered adding help text until we know
>> how the implementation is going to work.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>> On 5 February 2010 01:18, Phil Davies <de...@gm...> wrote:
>>> I can do data for 1870, will be off the grid for about a week or so
>>> from tomorrow but I'll update before I go offline and will no doubt
>>> have time to plug stuff in whilst I'm away
>>>
>>> On 4 February 2010 21:29, Erik Vos <eri...@xs...> wrote:
>>>> I have generalized Info/Privates to Info/Companies, now covering all types.
>>>> The info displayed has also been extended.
>>>> 1830 and 1835 are mostly done, other games remain to be done (volunteers?)
>>>>
>>>> Erik.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> The Planet: dedicated and managed hosting, cloud storage, colocation
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>>>>
>>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Predictive Self Healing and Award Winning ZFS. Get Solaris 10 NOW
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>

[Rails-devel] Stockmarket type

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

type = rectangular

Is the only option I see listed amongst games we have supported.  Is
there yet any support for different types of stock market?  I'm
playing around with getting files added to support 1825 and this has a
linear stock market (not to mention double and triple price jumps) I'm
aware this will need additional work to support, I'm just using this
as a way to get to know the structure and contribute better :)

Phil

[Rails-devel] 1835 token lay cost

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

I have implemented token lay cost calcuation in 1835.

To Stefan Frey:
I have also added NoMap mode to 1835. 
All possible token lay costs from the current company home hex are now
displayed in the "Operating Cost" list as separate entries.
I don't know if this is the way you would like it to be, but at least this
was easy to do.

Erik.

Re: [Rails-devel] Ending without playing all ORs

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

The value should have been "CurrentOR" (the other option being "SetOfORs").
I'll fix it. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...] 
Sent: Friday 19 February 2010 15:11
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] Ending without playing all ORs

The rules for 1851 state that you only play to the end of the current
OR, not all of the set.  I can see the BankBreaks tag in the game.xml
has a finish="OR" attribute but rails still wants to run to
conclusion.  Is there an option in existence to fix this already or do
we need a separate finish attribute (currentOR or allOR perhaps??)

Phil

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[Rails-devel] Ending without playing all ORs

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

The rules for 1851 state that you only play to the end of the current
OR, not all of the set.  I can see the BankBreaks tag in the game.xml
has a finish="OR" attribute but rails still wants to run to
conclusion.  Is there an option in existence to fix this already or do
we need a separate finish attribute (currentOR or allOR perhaps??)

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] 1851 stock market error

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Fixed 

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...] 
Sent: Thursday 18 February 2010 13:08
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] 1851 stock market error

Spot K3 on the 1851 stock market shows 280 when it should be 180.
Correction attached

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

> A special [edit] mode isn't completely necessary, in my opinion. 
> A separate menu entry that is clearly marked as "administrative"
> options, is definitely required.

Such menu even exists, in the Game Status window: Operator (with forced
undo and redo for use in the stock round).

[EV] Moderator, actually.

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

How did you export the order stack to a text file?  

[EV] There is a class rails.util.ListAndFixSavedFiles in the jar, that runs
as a stand-alone program.
It can be used to display a saved file, and also to truncate it at some
point.

[Rails-devel] 1851 stock market error

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

Spot K3 on the 1851 stock market shows 280 when it should be 180.
Correction attached

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Freek D. <sf_...@ma...>]

brett lentz wrote:

> A special [edit] mode isn't completely necessary, in my opinion. 
> A separate menu entry that is clearly marked as "administrative"
> options, is definitely required.

Such menu even exists, in the Game Status window: Operator (with forced
undo and redo for use in the stock round).

Regards,
Freek

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

I don't especially remember if it was given that option or not...

It 'might' be that going past that point, then undoing to the treasury
trading stage might have made that step occur?  Since it won't be
checked and skipped when going in reverse??  I'm totally guessing
here...I'll try and recreate the scenario again and see what happens!

I managed to load up the saved file in the Eclipse debugger and got
the order stack displayed then worked through it manually from SR5.
How did you export the order stack to a text file?  This looks like it
would be useful for fixing these things in future, it took me longer
than necessary to work through it with the debugger but this is mainly
due to my unfamiliarity with Eclipse :p

Phil

On 17 February 2010 20:35, Erik Vos <eri...@xs...> wrote:
> Looking at the log, what seems to have happened at the end of OR 4.1 is the
> following:
>
> Dixie (pres. Simon) has just completed its first OR. So it wasn't allowed to
> do any share trading yet.
> However, the saved file contains 2 consecutive Done actions at the end of
> that turn.
> The first Done came after Dixie buying a train, and the second one (still by
> Simon) can only be explained if Dixie has incorrectly got the opportunity to
> trade shares. Can you remember if such a thing has happened?
>
> I cannot exclude your suggestion that using Undo/Redo might have disturbed
> things. Most likely Undo/Redo isn't perfect yet, although I'm not aware of
> any particular failure points. I just remember vaguely occasionally having
> seen misfits, sadly ignoring to investigate these...
>
> Anyway, after reloading this saved file you are left at the start of SR5.
> Can you reconstruct the game from there?
> I have attached a dump of the saved file, listing all its actions (#128 is
> the bad one). Perhaps that helps.
>
> Erik.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...]
> Sent: Wednesday 17 February 2010 11:19
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: [Rails-devel] Saved game error
>
> See attached saved game file
>
> We were through to OR 6.2 when I saved this (rails 1.1.3) and on
> reload it only plays through to SR5 before receiving an error.  I
> assume this is as a result of too much faffing with the undo button
> during play and the order stack not being saved correctly.
>
> I stupidly didn't save the game report separately for this game so I
> think we'll have to pick up again from here...a 'manual edit' mode for
> rails would be great to fix this situations, just allowing you to
> tweak things to the state they should be in (since I have screenshots
> of the current gamestate etc.) would be helpful when running into bugs
> likely this (I am fully aware this is by no means a small request ;))
>
> Phil
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> SOLARIS 10 is the OS for Data Centers - provides features such as DTrace,
> Predictive Self Healing and Award Winning ZFS. Get Solaris 10 NOW
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/solaris-dev2dev
> _______________________________________________
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> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>
>

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

BTW I have fixed an error in the message displayed: the expected player name
(in this case the Priority holder) was missing (and represented as '{1}').

-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Vos [mailto:eri...@xs...] 
Sent: Wednesday 17 February 2010 21:36
To: 'Development list for Rails: an 18xx game'
Subject: RE: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

Looking at the log, what seems to have happened at the end of OR 4.1 is the
following:

Dixie (pres. Simon) has just completed its first OR. So it wasn't allowed to
do any share trading yet.
However, the saved file contains 2 consecutive Done actions at the end of
that turn.
The first Done came after Dixie buying a train, and the second one (still by
Simon) can only be explained if Dixie has incorrectly got the opportunity to
trade shares. Can you remember if such a thing has happened?

I cannot exclude your suggestion that using Undo/Redo might have disturbed
things. Most likely Undo/Redo isn't perfect yet, although I'm not aware of
any particular failure points. I just remember vaguely occasionally having
seen misfits, sadly ignoring to investigate these...

Anyway, after reloading this saved file you are left at the start of SR5.
Can you reconstruct the game from there?
I have attached a dump of the saved file, listing all its actions (#128 is
the bad one). Perhaps that helps.

Erik.
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...] 
Sent: Wednesday 17 February 2010 11:19
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

See attached saved game file

We were through to OR 6.2 when I saved this (rails 1.1.3) and on
reload it only plays through to SR5 before receiving an error.  I
assume this is as a result of too much faffing with the undo button
during play and the order stack not being saved correctly.

I stupidly didn't save the game report separately for this game so I
think we'll have to pick up again from here...a 'manual edit' mode for
rails would be great to fix this situations, just allowing you to
tweak things to the state they should be in (since I have screenshots
of the current gamestate etc.) would be helpful when running into bugs
likely this (I am fully aware this is by no means a small request ;))

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Looking at the log, what seems to have happened at the end of OR 4.1 is the
following:

Dixie (pres. Simon) has just completed its first OR. So it wasn't allowed to
do any share trading yet.
However, the saved file contains 2 consecutive Done actions at the end of
that turn.
The first Done came after Dixie buying a train, and the second one (still by
Simon) can only be explained if Dixie has incorrectly got the opportunity to
trade shares. Can you remember if such a thing has happened?

I cannot exclude your suggestion that using Undo/Redo might have disturbed
things. Most likely Undo/Redo isn't perfect yet, although I'm not aware of
any particular failure points. I just remember vaguely occasionally having
seen misfits, sadly ignoring to investigate these...

Anyway, after reloading this saved file you are left at the start of SR5.
Can you reconstruct the game from there?
I have attached a dump of the saved file, listing all its actions (#128 is
the bad one). Perhaps that helps.

Erik.
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Davies [mailto:de...@gm...] 
Sent: Wednesday 17 February 2010 11:19
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

See attached saved game file

We were through to OR 6.2 when I saved this (rails 1.1.3) and on
reload it only plays through to SR5 before receiving an error.  I
assume this is as a result of too much faffing with the undo button
during play and the order stack not being saved correctly.

I stupidly didn't save the game report separately for this game so I
think we'll have to pick up again from here...a 'manual edit' mode for
rails would be great to fix this situations, just allowing you to
tweak things to the state they should be in (since I have screenshots
of the current gamestate etc.) would be helpful when running into bugs
likely this (I am fully aware this is by no means a small request ;))

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[brett l. <bre...@gm...>]

On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 11:46 AM, Stefan Frey <ste...@we...> wrote:
> I think the objectives of such changes are:
> - Accessible only during a special mode
> (maybe highlighting by background color?)

A special mode isn't completely necessary, in my opinion.  A separate
menu entry that is clearly marked as "administrative" options, is
definitely required.

> - Shows in the audit trail (=> game report)

Agreed.  The other players should be made aware that the game has been
tampered with in a way that ignores the rules enforcement.

I don't want it to be too invasive, but maybe a single pop up on the
player's turn that follows the use of these features?

> - Integrated with the undo/redo framework
>
> A potential downside could be that players do not bother
> anymore to file a bug report.

Completely agreed.

There's a few different ways to approach this.  I definitely don't
want us to harass users for a bug report.

Perhaps what we could also do is build in a Report Bug function as a
menu option?  Have it save out the current game state, pop up a window
for the user to include additional details, and e-mail the message and
saved game to the rails-devel list?

>
> Stefan

---Brett.

Re: [Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

I have no solution to offer for the bug reported below.

But some general remarks:
as "sibling" to the noMapMode Erik recommended to add
some correction possibilities. I am currently working on that:

For a first step it will be possible to adjust cash positions of player and 
companies (a new menu will be available after activation of the correction 
mode, which will be highlighted in the game report) and this change hopefully 
will make into the next release.

Somewhat more involved are other adjustments to the game state like:
A. Adjusting portfolios of players (certificates and private companies)
B. Adjusting the board (add and remove tiles)
C. Adjusting the company portfolios (tokens, trains, private companies)

I think the objectives of such changes are:
- Accessible only during a special mode
(maybe highlighting by background color?)
- Shows in the audit trail (=> game report)
- Integrated with the undo/redo framework

A potential downside could be that players do not bother 
anymore to file a bug report.

Stefan


On Wednesday 17 February 2010 11:19:12 Phil Davies wrote:
> See attached saved game file
>
> We were through to OR 6.2 when I saved this (rails 1.1.3) and on
> reload it only plays through to SR5 before receiving an error.  I
> assume this is as a result of too much faffing with the undo button
> during play and the order stack not being saved correctly.
>
> I stupidly didn't save the game report separately for this game so I
> think we'll have to pick up again from here...a 'manual edit' mode for
> rails would be great to fix this situations, just allowing you to
> tweak things to the state they should be in (since I have screenshots
> of the current gamestate etc.) would be helpful when running into bugs
> likely this (I am fully aware this is by no means a small request ;))
>
> Phil

[Rails-devel] Saved game error

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

See attached saved game file

We were through to OR 6.2 when I saved this (rails 1.1.3) and on
reload it only plays through to SR5 before receiving an error.  I
assume this is as a result of too much faffing with the undo button
during play and the order stack not being saved correctly.

I stupidly didn't save the game report separately for this game so I
think we'll have to pick up again from here...a 'manual edit' mode for
rails would be great to fix this situations, just allowing you to
tweak things to the state they should be in (since I have screenshots
of the current gamestate etc.) would be helpful when running into bugs
likely this (I am fully aware this is by no means a small request ;))

Phil

Re: [Rails-devel] 1835 playability

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

That's a bug, and it's already fixed. It will be in the next release.
 
Erik.


  _____  

From: James Romano [mailto:rom...@gm...] 
Sent: Tuesday 16 February 2010 15:52
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] 1835 playability


I can't seem to get out of the first stock round and into OR1 if the start
packet isn't completely sold.  Is that a bug, or is it intentional?

[Rails-devel] 1835 playability

[James R. <rom...@gm...>]

I can't seem to get out of the first stock round and into OR1 if the start
packet isn't completely sold.  Is that a bug, or is it intentional?

Re: [Rails-devel] 18AL Stock Market Bug

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Thanks for reporting, I have fixed it.
Erik. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Justin Rebelo [mailto:jus...@gm...] 
Sent: Monday 15 February 2010 23:28
To: rai...@li...
Subject: [Rails-devel] 18AL Stock Market Bug

I just started a 3p game of 18AL today with some guys I am playing a
separate game with. One of them pointed out something wrong with the
stock market.

If you look at row 4, there are two $105 cells side by side. The cell
on the right should be $120. We only just started the game, so I can't
confirm the effects, but Josh (who reported it to me) suggested that
he played through some turns on his own and the game does seem to
assign a $105 value to that stock space.

Hopefully it doesn't impact the game, but if any company moves on to
that cell, it could have a significant impact if it were to remain
there going in to a stock round where it matters (also for company
operating order perhaps). Again, I haven't gotten to that point, just
reporting it as soon as I saw it.

Justin

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Re: [Rails-devel] NoMapMode

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

both 1889 and NoMapMode only in development in cvs on sourceforge.

On Tuesday 16 February 2010 00:14:50 Justin Rebelo wrote:
> Sorry for the off-topic reply (though the NoMapMode seems like a very
> good option to me also), but I haven't seen anything regarding 1889
> support in Rails, though you mention it in your post. I am running the
> latest release. Is 1889 support in development and hidden without a
> flag or something? Or is it only in cvs/svn right now?
>
> On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 2:57 PM, Stefan Frey <ste...@we...> wrote:
> > Some weeks ago I suggested a easier support for face-to-face play: Rails
> > should not require the players to track tile and token lay on the
> > computer.
> >
> > For that reason I have implemented (with support and suggestions by Erik)
> > the NoMapMode, now available for testing.
> >
> > - Mode is activated as GameOption (starting with 1830 and 1889).
> >
> > - The tile and token lay actions are replaced by OperatingCosts actions.
> > They are only required to account for the necessary payments and updates
> > of the remaining tokens.
> >
> > - As of now this mode is not strict: Several tile and token lays in one
> > OR and free entry of costs is available. This allows to account for all
> > other types of costs which are not supported by Rails yet. This will
> > change as soon as a correction mode is implemented.
> >
> > - It is not possible to change between NoMapMode and MapMode after a new
> > game is started.
> >
> > - And currently the map is still shown, but this will change soon.
> >
> > Any questions and/or suggestions are more than welcome.
> >
> > Stefan
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >----- SOLARIS 10 is the OS for Data Centers - provides features such as
> > DTrace, Predictive Self Healing and Award Winning ZFS. Get Solaris 10 NOW
> > http://p.sf.net/sfu/solaris-dev2dev
> > _______________________________________________
> > Rails-devel mailing list
> > Rai...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>--- SOLARIS 10 is the OS for Data Centers - provides features such as
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