Re: [Audacity-translation] Lisp formats are not C formats

[Paul L. <pau...@gm...>]

On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 4:40 PM, Paul Licameli <pau...@gm...>
wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 3:50 PM, Yuri Chornoivan <yu...@uk...> wrote:
>
>> четвер, 8 березня 2018 р. 22:30:46 EET Paul Licameli написано:
>> > On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 3:09 PM, Thomas De Rocker <
>> tho...@ou...
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Hi Paul
>> > >
>> > > First of all: the Dutch translations are completed on Transifex! 😊
>> > >
>> > > Second: my username on Transifex is RockyTDR, and I made the comment.
>> > >
>> > > What I meant is the following. Transifex "recognizes" html and some
>> other
>> > > tags. It allows translators to copy e.g. "*<a href...*" as some kind
>> of
>> > > "balloon".
>> > >
>> > > The problem is that Transifex treats some characters, or the order of
>> some
>> > > characters (*1%F* for example) as a "balloon". Translators are
>> obliged to
>> > > use that same "balloon" in their translations. If not, it returns an
>> > > error.
>> > >
>> > > This is what I mean (Transifex screenshot):
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > In this case the "F" of "Frequency" is recognized as a tag. This can
>> be
>> > > solved by putting a space between characters, like this: "1% F".
>> > >
>> > > I hope this clears things. If you have any questions, i'd be happy to
>> > > answer them.
>> > >
>> > > Regards
>> >
>> > Thanks, Thomas,
>> >
>> > I think Transifex is being "stupid" then about #, lisp-format and its
>> > software needs an update.  Who should we complain to?
>>
>> Transifex online editor has very basic support even for C-formatted
>> strings.
>> It is not its main market.
>>
>> >
>> > Were you compelled to put the spaces in before your upload was accepted?
>> > Yuri C., you too, for Ukrainian?
>>
>> I do not use Transifex online editor. And I did not add spaces myself. The
>> catalog was translated offline with Lokalize then uploaded back with no
>> reported problems.
>>
>
> So then, there is a Transifex editor that is not smart about lisp-format,
> but your upload of work done in another editor is not obstructed.  That is
> good.
>
>
>>
>> > If so, then maybe we should not rely on Transifex and you should send me
>> > your updates either by email or by pull request at GitHub.
>>
>
> So ignore that suggestion.
>
>
>>
>> BTW, can somebody look at this PR?
>>
>> https://github.com/audacity/audacity/pull/261
>>
>> Thanks in advance for your review.
>>
>
> I see you fixed doubled spaces in a few places.
>
> I will take that, but then make minor updates to audacity.pot to reflect
> that.  This will make your uk.po slightly out of date, as those two entries
> will become fuzzy when you merge again, and you should fix that easily of
> course.
>
> I recall about 13 strings still needed translations in uk.po besides, so I
> will not simply fix uk.po myself.
>
> PRL
>

I updated audacity.pot for those changes in those two Lisp strings, but
also took many updates for C++ strings.

So, nl.po and uk.po are no longer 100% up-to-date with that.  Shall I wait
for your updates?

Again, at this point we are interested mostly just in testing the
translations of Nyquist effects, and having one or a few locales that are
complete for Lisp strings.  This is far from the final audacity.pot for
this version.

PRL



>
>
>
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Yuri
>>
>> > Or I can edit the few strings myself to remove the unnecessary spaces.
>> >
>> > By the way, Thomas, I also saw your question about the meaning of
>> > "frequency bounds."  That string is part of an effect that cooperates
>> with
>> > the spectral selection feature, detailed at the link below.  The user
>> sees
>> > a rectangle in the spectrogram, which was upper and lower bounds.
>> >
>> > https://manual.audacityteam.org/man/spectral_selection.html
>> >
>> > PRL
>> >
>> > > Thomas De Rocker
>> > >
>> > > ------------------------------
>> > > *Van:* Paul Licameli <pau...@gm...>
>> > > *Verzonden:* donderdag 8 maart 2018 20:20
>> > > *Aan:* audacity-translation; Thomas De Rocker
>> > > *Onderwerp:* Re: Lisp formats are not C formats
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 1:55 PM, Paul Licameli <
>> pau...@gm...>
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > I got this notification from Transifex, forwarding a query from one of
>> > > you, and not sure how to respond at that site, so I write to this
>> mailing
>> > > list:
>> > >
>> > > "
>> > > Error:~%~%Frequency (~a Hz) is too high for track sample rate.~%~%~
>> Track
>> > > sample rate is ~a Hz~%~ Frequency must be less than ~a Hz.
>> > >
>> > > 1%F is recognized as placeholder - no problem for Dutch translation
>> > > because "frequentie" (nl) starts with f like "frequency", but maybe
>> other
>> > > languages will have problems.
>> > > "
>> > >
>> > > Either I misunderstand the report, or the translator does not
>> understand
>> > > that this is a Lisp-format string, not C-format.  So % does not have
>> the
>> > > usual meaning.
>> > >
>> > > The Lisp function called format changes ~% to a newline, so
>> ~%Frequency
>> > > becomes just a newline and then the word -- no relation to the C
>> format %f
>> > > sequence.
>> > >
>> > > Also ~~ becomes ~, and ~ followed by newline is just a break in the
>> string
>> > > to make the format easier to read, and is simply deleted, with
>> following
>> > > whitespace characters, by format.
>> > >
>> > > The ~a sequence is the only placeholder.  Unlike with C, there is no
>> need
>> > > in Lisp to distinguish placeholders for strings and for numbers with
>> > > different sequences.
>> > >
>> > > Or is it the .po file editor that is misunderstanding the input and
>> making
>> > > some incorrect warnings about this string?  Perhaps then there is a
>> better
>> > > editing program to use instead!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > You should also know:  there are special generated comments in the
>> .pot
>> > > file, that are supposed to identify format strings:
>> > >
>> > > #, c-format
>> > > #, lisp-format
>> > >
>> > > These comments are used in the build to check that the number of
>> > > placeholders in the msgid equals that in the msgstr.
>> > >
>> > > Perhaps a good .po file editor is sensitive to these lines?
>> > >
>> > > I checked this example, and one other that the translator mentioned,
>> and
>> > > indeed the audacity.pot has a #, lisp-format comment, not #,
>> c-format, so
>> > > I
>> > > hope your editor is good enough not to misinterpret the message as
>> > > c-format
>> > > when it is clearly marked otherwise.
>> > >
>> > > PRL
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > PRL
>>
>>
>>
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>
>