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Audacity
A free multi-track audio editor and recorder
audacity-quality — Quality Assurance: priorities for overall usability, interface choices, & bugs
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-10-01 03:01:59
|
Well, I’m stumped. Did another Git Pull and rebuilt wxWidgets again. The first patch gives 3 success messages. The 2nd 3 “Patching” messages. The 3rd - 5th give 5, 6 and 3 “Patching” messages respectively. The build gives the usual blurb at the end that it has built it. Audacity build went normally as far as I can tell and built the two files. The resulting build does not show the latest fix with VO on. Gale - do you do anything to get rid of the old wxWidgets build or just rely on the new build overwriting the old one? That is the only thing I can think of that could be happening. I know it is using a modified wxWidgets since it has pinch gestures but how to tell it is using the latest build? Also a strange thing is that in the Audacity build info window there is no commit level and date/time as there is on yours. Do you put that in or should it be automatic? Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:56 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > I have no problem with Selection Toolbar after disabling VoiceOver. > > Also SHIFT + M to open the Audio Track dropdown menu works whether > VoiceOver is on or off. > > Did you get the expected success messages when you patched widgets? > > Does the build I posted open the context menus with or without > VoiceOver enabled? > > > Gale > > > On 1 October 2016 at 01:45, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >> I did a git pull this morning at 6:19 and rebuilt wxWidgets and recompiled >> audacity this afternoon. As far as I could tell it had the change to the >> wxMac-3.0.2-wxaccessable.patch file. Checking the commits on Git that commit >> was made 2 days ago. I patched a fresh copy of wxWidgets and rebuilt it then >> compiled Audacity after a “Clean". What else could I do? >> >> Cliff >> >> >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:07 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>> >>> Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with >>> VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown >>> menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t >>> cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however >>> turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as >>> well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting >>> Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits >>> in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format >>> change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I >>> assume they mean the spin boxes. >>> >>> Anything else to test in this area? >> >> >> You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must >> do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the >> updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new >> version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and >> rebuild Audacity. >> >> PRL >> >>> >>> >>> Cliff >>> >>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>> wrote: >>> >>> The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as >>> without. >>> >>> Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve >>> control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click >>> a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And >>> others. >>> >>> This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good >>> enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good >>> enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility >>> in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. >>> >>> PRL >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >>>> >>>> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >>>> now seems to work properly. >>>> >>>> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >>>> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? >>>> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, >>>> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad >>>> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >>>> Track Control Panel. >>>> >>>> Cliff >>>> >>>>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >>>>> >>>>> Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >>>>> now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >>>>> I really think someone else should test given my machine was >>>>> behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >>>>> disabled. >>>>> >>>>> To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >>>>> try my build: >>>>> http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >>>>> >>>>> Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >>>>> patch. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Gale >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews >>>>>>> <gale@...> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>>>>>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>>>>>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older >>>>>>>> versions >>>>>>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>>>>>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>>>>>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>>>>>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow >>>>>>>> Leopard". >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >>>>>>> dialog >>>>>>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >>>>>>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >>>>>>> while >>>>>>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>>>>>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>>>>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >>>>>>> rebuilds >>>>>>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >>>>>> >>>>>> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >>>>>> I have done so. >>>>>> >>>>>> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >>>>>> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >>>>>> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >>>>>> wxWidgets. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Gale >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >>>>>>>>>> can >>>>>>>>>> still >>>>>>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>>>>>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>> the actual inconvenience. >>>>>>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>>>>>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >>>>>>>>> term >>>>>>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >>>>>>>>> system >>>>>>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >>>>>>>>> changed >>>>>>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> --James. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >>> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
|
From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-10-01 01:45:13
|
Ok. Downloaded yours and it works great with VO on or off. No problems with switching back and forth. Something must have gone south with the wxWidgets build I did. I’ll redo it and see if I can see what the issue is. At least the fix seems to work now. Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:56 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > I have no problem with Selection Toolbar after disabling VoiceOver. > > Also SHIFT + M to open the Audio Track dropdown menu works whether > VoiceOver is on or off. > > Did you get the expected success messages when you patched widgets? > > Does the build I posted open the context menus with or without > VoiceOver enabled? > > > Gale > > > On 1 October 2016 at 01:45, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >> I did a git pull this morning at 6:19 and rebuilt wxWidgets and recompiled >> audacity this afternoon. As far as I could tell it had the change to the >> wxMac-3.0.2-wxaccessable.patch file. Checking the commits on Git that commit >> was made 2 days ago. I patched a fresh copy of wxWidgets and rebuilt it then >> compiled Audacity after a “Clean". What else could I do? >> >> Cliff >> >> >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:07 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>> >>> Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with >>> VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown >>> menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t >>> cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however >>> turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as >>> well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting >>> Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits >>> in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format >>> change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I >>> assume they mean the spin boxes. >>> >>> Anything else to test in this area? >> >> >> You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must >> do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the >> updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new >> version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and >> rebuild Audacity. >> >> PRL >> >>> >>> >>> Cliff >>> >>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>> wrote: >>> >>> The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as >>> without. >>> >>> Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve >>> control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click >>> a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And >>> others. >>> >>> This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good >>> enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good >>> enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility >>> in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. >>> >>> PRL >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >>>> >>>> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >>>> now seems to work properly. >>>> >>>> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >>>> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? >>>> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, >>>> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad >>>> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >>>> Track Control Panel. >>>> >>>> Cliff >>>> >>>>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >>>>> >>>>> Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >>>>> now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >>>>> I really think someone else should test given my machine was >>>>> behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >>>>> disabled. >>>>> >>>>> To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >>>>> try my build: >>>>> http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >>>>> >>>>> Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >>>>> patch. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Gale >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews >>>>>>> <gale@...> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>>>>>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>>>>>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older >>>>>>>> versions >>>>>>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>>>>>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>>>>>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>>>>>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow >>>>>>>> Leopard". >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >>>>>>> dialog >>>>>>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >>>>>>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >>>>>>> while >>>>>>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>>>>>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>>>>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >>>>>>> rebuilds >>>>>>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >>>>>> >>>>>> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >>>>>> I have done so. >>>>>> >>>>>> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >>>>>> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >>>>>> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >>>>>> wxWidgets. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Gale >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >>>>>>>>>> can >>>>>>>>>> still >>>>>>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>>>>>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>> the actual inconvenience. >>>>>>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>>>>>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >>>>>>>>> term >>>>>>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >>>>>>>>> system >>>>>>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >>>>>>>>> changed >>>>>>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> --James. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >>> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
|
From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-10-01 01:41:51
|
On 30 September 2016 at 20:34, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> wrote: > Well, the bug appears as soon as an export title is proposed which is > naturally the case after saving a project or importing a file into a > new window. > > Back to your question. > Yes, I would like to tackle the missing sample format options. > However, it is a bit tricky to place the combo box without actually seeing it... I imagine the combo box will go underneath the command and so displace the "Show output" checkbox to a third row. Or perhaps the combo box should be a set of radio buttons if there are no more than four choices? > Another point is that I want to extent the flexibility of the external > exporter by having the encoder (-path) as a separate Combo box. > This has the following advantages: > - external programs do not longer disappear once the list goes over 13 entries. > - Each encoder can have it's own last xx switches. In that case I think the "Path" box would probably go above the current "Command" box > We should also offer (or do it silently) a w64 header if the > selection exceeds 4 GB. If FFmpeg supports it, I am not sure the old FFmpeg we use for Windows and Mac does so. But WAV files over 4 GB is a much more important issue for standard export (no CLI). We ought to do better than blindly export a standard WAV file over 4 GB. > Last but not least, this export option should be available to chains > with the four parameters: > - *.wav or extended (w64/ref64) > (- or a list of external files) > - bit depth > - encoder program > - switches Well, we should improve Chains support for GUI export first. Even FFmpeg-compatible files and Other uncompressed files would be a good start. :=) > I think this export feature is highly under-estimated. > There's so much one can do with it, not only export but also analyse > files or combine clips with videos. It is underestimated, but it would be beyond the capability of many users. Not least in finding out the exact syntax you need. Gale > Robert > > 2016-09-30 19:09 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >> Thanks, Robert. I think you missed a step, in that you must import a file >> or save a project to see the bug. >> >> Your discovery means that >> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1315 >> >> is cross-platform, but on Windows and Mac, it only occurs if you export >> as "Other uncompressed files", whereas on Linux it occurs with any >> export format. I updated the bug description. >> >> >> >> Gale >> >> >> On 27 September 2016 at 06:40, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >> wrote: >>> Hi Gale >>> A bit off topic: >>> If I choose "Other uncompressed files", I can export as e.g. "Test" >>> and choose my profile such as wave. >>> On reopening the dialog, 'aiff' is attached to the file name. >>> >>> This seems related to bug 1217. >>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1217 >>> >>> Although the extension will later be correctly replaced (through Paul >>> L's fix) does it remain a confusing behaviour. >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> 2016-09-27 3:33 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >>>> On 26 September 2016 at 18:04, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Hi Gale >>>>> Thanks for taking the time to reply. >>>>> >>>>> 2016-09-26 2:26 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >>>>>> On 25 September 2016 at 10:39, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> Hi all >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I've recently tried to export to WavPack in order to get a 32-bit >>>>>>> float backup of my tracks. >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Robert, >>>>>> >>>>>>> It does not work with the custom FFmpeg export (I believe float is >>>>>>> anyways not yet supported). >>>>>> >>>>>> As often happens with that feature, you have to choose the >>>>>> "Format" first (wv in this case ). If you choose codec first >>>>>> (wavpack) then it does not let you choose .wv format. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I had no problem in choosing the codec. Although, one has to know the >>>>> extension. This should go in both directions, shouldn't it? >>>> >>>> Yes you should get appropriate choices for the other field >>>> when selecting the first field, whichever you choose first. >>>> >>>> >>>>>> I agree you only get a 16-bit WavPack file and there is no way >>>>>> to choose otherwise. >>>>>> >>>>> I have not looked at the source, do you mean that we should also offer >>>>> a combo box for this export option in order to have a > 16-bit input >>>>> sample format? >>>> >>>> I don't think so, because my understanding is that the options that are >>>> exposed should be governed by what our supported version of FFmpeg >>>> supports. This assumes we stay with FFmpeg and don't move to >>>> GStreamer's FFmpeg support. >>>> >>>> I see a lot of hard coding in ExportFFmpegDialogs.cpp for the list of >>>> formats and codecs but I think that was written for what FFmpeg >>>> 0.6.2 supports and has not been updated since. >>>> >>>> The interface itself is 24/32/32-bit float capable, because you can use >>>> it to choose such PCM options. >>>> >>>> >>>>>> Hence, I've tried the "External Program" feature for export. >>>>>>> Unfortunately, the STDIN provides only 16-bit integer as pipe stream, >>>>>>> that's rather poor, isn't it. >>>>>> >>>>>> S:\wavpack-4.80.0\wavpack.exe --raw-pcm=44100,32f,2 - %f >>>>>> >>>>>> produced a nominally 32-bit float WavPack file but there was >>>>>> a warning about "raw pcm infile length does not divide evenly, >>>>>> 4 bytes will be discarded" and the file is a little smaller than >>>>>> that produced by WavPack. Anyway it is only incidental if >>>>>> STDIN is constrained to 16-bit integer. >>>>> >>>>> I've tried that command too. However, it is wrong since stdin isn't RAW >>>>> audio. >>>>> On the contrary, a RIFF header is given with the mentioned 16-bit >>>>> resolution as a fixed parameter. >>>>> If one wants to go higher, an additional 'Fact' chunk is needed. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Another aside - the CLI seems to accept the 64-bit WavPack >>>>>> executable on Windows x64, same as it accepts 64-bit >>>>>> executables on modern Macs. The 64-bit WavPack >>>>>> executable is no faster in Audacity on Windows, on my testing. >>>>> >>>>> Same here, the difference is marginal if not random. >>>>> >>>>> The resulting times for different material and switches: >>>>> >>>>> 10 min Chirp, 52 mb >>>>> -x6hh 131 sec 16.5 mb >>>>> -f 4.4 s 22 mb >>>>> -xhh 9 s 17.1 mb >>>>> 10 min noise will be compressed by only 1 % (to be expected) >>>>> However, it is also faster (44 s instead of 131 s for the highest mode) >>>>> The x64 version took 128 s, essentially no difference there. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I think that this should be mentioned in the manual. >>>>>> >>>>>> Done. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, Probably the same for custom FFmpeg export. >>>> >>>> I don't think so, see above. >>>> >>>> >>>>>>> I've looked briefly into ExportCL.cpp where the 16 bits are hard-coded >>>>>>> and I think that it is possible to provide also 24 bit integer and 32 >>>>>>> bit float. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The question is if we need a combo box for this or if the format >>>>>>> should automatically be taken from the preference setting. >>>>>> >>>>>> The Audacity default quality is 32-bit float, but most people might >>>>>> want 16-bit export for uncompressed formats, even if the encoder >>>>>> supports greater depth. >>>>> >>>>> We are talking about compressed files, are we not. >>>> >>>> Yes largely, but take FLAC or ALAC as examples of compressed >>>> lossless. Users might not be happy if we tried to be clever and give >>>> them the highest encoder bit depth available (24-bit) on the grounds >>>> that their Quality Preference was 32-bit float. >>>> >>>> >>>>>> I suppose a combo box defaulting to 16-bit would be better than >>>>>> making a decision based on the Quality Preference (or based on >>>>>> the format of the data in the track regardless of the Quality >>>>>> Preference). I assume that a user choosing 24-bit integer or 32-bit >>>>>> float might encounter errors with some encoders. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> This had to be tested. It must only work for the encoder commands we >>>>> are providing--lame and ffmpeg. >>>>> For lossy encoding, the file size will be the same, regardless of the >>>>> input sample format. >>>>> It is of more interest for the lossless case. I presume that making a >>>>> 24-bit FLAC file will still work with 32-bit float input but not as >>>>> fast. >>>> >>>> Well, the reference FLAC encoder does not accept > 24-bit >>>> input, though that is not a limitation in FLAC: >>>> https://xiph.org/flac/documentation_tools_flac.html#usage . >>>> >>>> Are you planning to work on this, Robert? >>>> >>>> >>>> Gale >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-10-01 01:27:26
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All seemed normal when patching. No errors, only success messages. I found it strange that the Selection Toolbar format menus didn’t work anymore after opening and closing VoiceOver. It was like there was some holdover left connected. Shift-M only works with VoiceOver off and as with the mouse/trackpad operations on those spin-boxes which don’t work with VO on and Audacity has to be restarted to regain normal functionality. I’ve not tried your build. I’ll download it and give a go. Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:56 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > I have no problem with Selection Toolbar after disabling VoiceOver. > > Also SHIFT + M to open the Audio Track dropdown menu works whether > VoiceOver is on or off. > > Did you get the expected success messages when you patched widgets? > > Does the build I posted open the context menus with or without > VoiceOver enabled? > > > Gale > > > On 1 October 2016 at 01:45, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >> I did a git pull this morning at 6:19 and rebuilt wxWidgets and recompiled >> audacity this afternoon. As far as I could tell it had the change to the >> wxMac-3.0.2-wxaccessable.patch file. Checking the commits on Git that commit >> was made 2 days ago. I patched a fresh copy of wxWidgets and rebuilt it then >> compiled Audacity after a “Clean". What else could I do? >> >> Cliff >> >> >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:07 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>> >>> Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with >>> VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown >>> menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t >>> cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however >>> turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as >>> well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting >>> Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits >>> in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format >>> change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I >>> assume they mean the spin boxes. >>> >>> Anything else to test in this area? >> >> >> You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must >> do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the >> updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new >> version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and >> rebuild Audacity. >> >> PRL >> >>> >>> >>> Cliff >>> >>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>> wrote: >>> >>> The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as >>> without. >>> >>> Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve >>> control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click >>> a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And >>> others. >>> >>> This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good >>> enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good >>> enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility >>> in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. >>> >>> PRL >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >>>> >>>> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >>>> now seems to work properly. >>>> >>>> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >>>> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? >>>> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, >>>> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad >>>> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >>>> Track Control Panel. >>>> >>>> Cliff >>>> >>>>> On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >>>>> >>>>> Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >>>>> now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >>>>> I really think someone else should test given my machine was >>>>> behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >>>>> disabled. >>>>> >>>>> To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >>>>> try my build: >>>>> http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >>>>> >>>>> Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >>>>> patch. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Gale >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews >>>>>>> <gale@...> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>>>>>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>>>>>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older >>>>>>>> versions >>>>>>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>>>>>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>>>>>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>>>>>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow >>>>>>>> Leopard". >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >>>>>>> dialog >>>>>>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >>>>>>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >>>>>>> while >>>>>>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>>>>>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>>>>>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >>>>>>> rebuilds >>>>>>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >>>>>> >>>>>> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >>>>>> I have done so. >>>>>> >>>>>> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >>>>>> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >>>>>> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >>>>>> wxWidgets. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Gale >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >>>>>>>>>> can >>>>>>>>>> still >>>>>>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>>>>>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>> the actual inconvenience. >>>>>>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>>>>>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >>>>>>>>> term >>>>>>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >>>>>>>>> system >>>>>>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >>>>>>>>> changed >>>>>>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> --James. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >>> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-10-01 00:56:52
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I have no problem with Selection Toolbar after disabling VoiceOver. Also SHIFT + M to open the Audio Track dropdown menu works whether VoiceOver is on or off. Did you get the expected success messages when you patched widgets? Does the build I posted open the context menus with or without VoiceOver enabled? Gale On 1 October 2016 at 01:45, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: > I did a git pull this morning at 6:19 and rebuilt wxWidgets and recompiled > audacity this afternoon. As far as I could tell it had the change to the > wxMac-3.0.2-wxaccessable.patch file. Checking the commits on Git that commit > was made 2 days ago. I patched a fresh copy of wxWidgets and rebuilt it then > compiled Audacity after a “Clean". What else could I do? > > Cliff > > > On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:07 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: > > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >> >> Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with >> VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown >> menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t >> cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however >> turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as >> well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting >> Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits >> in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format >> change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I >> assume they mean the spin boxes. >> >> Anything else to test in this area? > > > You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must > do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the > updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new > version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and > rebuild Audacity. > > PRL > >> >> >> Cliff >> >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >> wrote: >> >> The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as >> without. >> >> Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve >> control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click >> a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And >> others. >> >> This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good >> enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good >> enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility >> in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. >> >> PRL >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: >>> >>> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >>> >>> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >>> now seems to work properly. >>> >>> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >>> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? >>> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, >>> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad >>> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >>> Track Control Panel. >>> >>> Cliff >>> >>> > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>> > wrote: >>> > >>> > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >>> > >>> > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >>> > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >>> > I really think someone else should test given my machine was >>> > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >>> > disabled. >>> > >>> > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >>> > try my build: >>> > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >>> > >>> > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >>> > patch. >>> > >>> > >>> > Gale >>> > >>> > >>> > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>> > wrote: >>> >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews >>> >>> <gale@...> >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>> >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>> >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>> >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older >>> >>>> versions >>> >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>> >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>> >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>> >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow >>> >>>> Leopard". >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >>> >>> dialog >>> >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >>> >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >>> >>> while >>> >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >>> >> >>> >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>> >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>> >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >>> >>> rebuilds >>> >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >>> >> >>> >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >>> >> I have done so. >>> >> >>> >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >>> >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >>> >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >>> >> wxWidgets. >>> >> >>> >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >>> >> >>> >> Thanks, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Gale >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>> >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>> >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >>> >>>>>> can >>> >>>>>> still >>> >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>> >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >>> >>>>> from >>> >>>>> the actual inconvenience. >>> >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>> >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >>> >>>>> to >>> >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >>> >>>>> term >>> >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >>> >>>>> system >>> >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >>> >>>>> changed >>> >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> --James. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Audacity-quality mailing list >>> > Audacity-quality@... >>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! > http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > |
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-10-01 00:45:41
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I did a git pull this morning at 6:19 and rebuilt wxWidgets and recompiled audacity this afternoon. As far as I could tell it had the change to the wxMac-3.0.2-wxaccessable.patch file. Checking the commits on Git that commit was made 2 days ago. I patched a fresh copy of wxWidgets and rebuilt it then compiled Audacity after a “Clean". What else could I do? Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 7:07 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: > > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@... <mailto:flyer185@...>> wrote: > Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I assume they mean the spin boxes. > > Anything else to test in this area? > > You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and rebuild Audacity. > > PRL > > > Cliff > >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@... <mailto:paul.licameli@...>> wrote: >> >> The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as without. >> >> Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And others. >> >> This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. >> >> PRL >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@... <mailto:flyer185@...>> wrote: >> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >> >> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 now seems to work properly. >> >> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the Track Control Panel. >> >> Cliff >> >> > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> wrote: >> > >> > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 <http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470>; . >> > >> > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >> > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >> > I really think someone else should test given my machine was >> > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >> > disabled. >> > >> > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >> > try my build: >> > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ <http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/>; . >> > >> > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >> > patch. >> > >> > >> > Gale >> > >> > >> > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> wrote: >> >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@... <mailto:paul.licameli@...>> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> >> >>> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >> >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >> >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions >> >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >> >>>> >> >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >> >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >> >>>> >> >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >> >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >> >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one dialog >> >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >> >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one while >> >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >> >> >> >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >> >> >> >> >> >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >> >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >> >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 <http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470>; ? >> >>>> >> >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete rebuilds >> >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >> >> >> >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >> >> I have done so. >> >> >> >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >> >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >> >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >> >> wxWidgets. >> >> >> >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> >> >> Gale >> >> >> >> >> >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@... <mailto:crookj@...>> wrote: >> >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >> >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can >> >>>>>> still >> >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >> >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect from >> >>>>> the actual inconvenience. >> >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >> >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need to >> >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long term >> >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the system >> >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just changed >> >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> --James. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; >> >>> >> > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org/>;! http://sdm.link/slashdot <http://sdm.link/slashdot>; >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Audacity-quality mailing list >> > Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org/>;! http://sdm.link/slashdot <http://sdm.link/slashdot>; >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org/>;! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ <http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________>; >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot <http://sdm.link/slashdot>; > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@gm...> - 2016-10-01 00:07:15
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On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: > Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with > VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown > menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t > cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however > turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as > well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting > Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits > in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format > change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that > I assume they mean the spin boxes. > > Anything else to test in this area? > You exactly described the symptoms I meant to fix, and to fix them, you must do the unusual step of completely rebuilding wxWidgets after applying the updated patch files. Then you must be sure Audacity links with the new version of wxWidgets. To do that, it may be simplest just to clean and rebuild Audacity. PRL > > Cliff > > On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> > wrote: > > The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as > without. > > Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve > control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to > click a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested > hierarchy. And others. > > This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good > enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good > enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility > in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. > > PRL > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: > >> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >> >> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >> now seems to work properly. >> >> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? >> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, >> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad >> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >> Track Control Panel. >> >> Cliff >> >> > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> wrote: >> > >> > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >> > >> > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >> > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >> > I really think someone else should test given my machine was >> > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >> > disabled. >> > >> > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >> > try my build: >> > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >> > >> > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >> > patch. >> > >> > >> > Gale >> > >> > >> > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> wrote: >> >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@... >> > >> >>> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >> >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >> >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions >> >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >> >>>> >> >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >> >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >> >>>> >> >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >> >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >> >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >> dialog >> >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >> >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >> while >> >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >> >> >> >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >> >> >> >> >> >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >> >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >> >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >> >>>> >> >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >> rebuilds >> >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >> >> >> >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >> >> I have done so. >> >> >> >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >> >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >> >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >> >> wxWidgets. >> >> >> >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> >> >> Gale >> >> >> >> >> >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >> >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >> >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >> can >> >>>>>> still >> >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >> >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >> from >> >>>>> the actual inconvenience. >> >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >> >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >> to >> >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >> term >> >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >> system >> >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >> changed >> >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> --James. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>> >> > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org>;! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Audacity-quality mailing list >> > Audacity-quality@... >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org>;! >> http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org <http://slashdot.org>;! > http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > |
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-09-30 23:57:31
|
Ok. So you expect that the mouse/trackpad should act as normal with VoiceOver on? If that is the case it does nothing to activate the dropdown menus in the Selection Panel and not in the Track Control Panel. It doesn’t cause any problems or exceptions that I can see, just does nothing, however turning VoiceOver off leaves the selection tool bar spin boxes useless as well as the Track Control Panel dropdown menu. Closing and restarting Audacity results in normal operation again. I can change individual digits in the Selection Tool Bar fields with VoiceOver on or off, but no format change. VoiceOver says to use the “Context Menu” to change format. By that I assume they mean the spin boxes. Anything else to test in this area? Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 6:09 PM, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: > > The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as without. > > Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And others. > > This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. > > PRL > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@... <mailto:flyer185@...>> wrote: > Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. > > All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 now seems to work properly. > > Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the Track Control Panel. > > Cliff > > > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> wrote: > > > > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 <http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470>; . > > > > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus > > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but > > I really think someone else should test given my machine was > > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver > > disabled. > > > > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can > > try my build: > > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ <http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/>; . > > > > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets > > patch. > > > > > > Gale > > > > > > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> wrote: > >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@... <mailto:paul.licameli@...>> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@... <mailto:gale@...>> > >>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about > >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't > >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions > >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. > >>>> > >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is > >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. > >>>> > >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately > >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and > >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". > >>> > >>> > >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one dialog > >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key > >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one while > >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. > >> > >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. > >> > >> > >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track > >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: > >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 <http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470>; ? > >>>> > >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? > >>> > >>> > >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete rebuilds > >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? > >> > >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt > >> I have done so. > >> > >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time > >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings > >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt > >> wxWidgets. > >> > >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? > >> > >> Thanks, > >> > >> > >> Gale > >> > >> > >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@... <mailto:crookj@...>> wrote: > >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: > >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can > >>>>>> still > >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. > >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. > >>>>> > >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect from > >>>>> the actual inconvenience. > >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for > >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need to > >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long term > >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. > >>>>> > >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the system > >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just changed > >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. > >>>>> > >>>>> --James. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>>>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>> Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > >>> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot <http://sdm.link/slashdot>; > > _______________________________________________ > > Audacity-quality mailing list > > Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot <http://sdm.link/slashdot>; > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... <mailto:Audacity-quality@...> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality>; > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@gm...> - 2016-09-30 23:31:14
|
Paul, what do you mean with track control panel menu? The Track drop down menu (with name, display etc) can be opened with the Windows application/context key or Shift-m. Does the latter work on Mac? What's not accessible is the context menu for a specific position, e.g. on a single label. Thus, we can't for instance open the label editor for that label--the feature that you've added recently to the context menu. Robert 2016-10-01 1:09 GMT+02:00, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...>: > The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as > without. > > Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve > control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to > click a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested > hierarchy. And others. > > This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good > enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good > enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility > in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. > > PRL > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: > >> Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. >> >> All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 >> now seems to work properly. >> >> Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you >> operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from >> VoiceOver? >> I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right >> thing, >> but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the >> mouse/trackpad >> does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the >> Track Control Panel. >> >> Cliff >> >> > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> > wrote: >> > >> > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >> > >> > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >> > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >> > I really think someone else should test given my machine was >> > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >> > disabled. >> > >> > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >> > try my build: >> > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >> > >> > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >> > patch. >> > >> > >> > Gale >> > >> > >> > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> wrote: >> >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews >> >>> <gale@...> >> >>> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >> >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >> >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older >> >>>> versions >> >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >> >>>> >> >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >> >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >> >>>> >> >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >> >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >> >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow >> >>>> Leopard". >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >> dialog >> >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >> >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >> while >> >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >> >> >> >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >> >> >> >> >> >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >> >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >> >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >> >>>> >> >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >> rebuilds >> >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >> >> >> >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >> >> I have done so. >> >> >> >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >> >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >> >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >> >> wxWidgets. >> >> >> >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> >> >> Gale >> >> >> >> >> >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >> >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >> >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >> >>>>>> can >> >>>>>> still >> >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >> >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >> from >> >>>>> the actual inconvenience. >> >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >> >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >> to >> >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >> term >> >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >> system >> >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >> changed >> >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> --James. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>> >> > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Audacity-quality mailing list >> > Audacity-quality@... >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > |
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From: Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@gm...> - 2016-09-30 23:09:17
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The issue is just whether use of the mouse pointer acts with voiceover as without. Other VoiceOver navigation involves key combinations that involve control+alt. H for a help menu. Arrow keys for navigation. Space to click a button. Sfhit + up arrow or down arrow to navigate nested hierarchy. And others. This did not interact with 2.1.2 at all usefully. In 2.1.3, it is good enough to visit all the pushbuttons in the toolbars. It is not yet good enough to visit the Track Control Panel menu, but I think our accessibility in Windows (which is best) does not do that yet either. PRL On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Cliff Scott <flyer185@...> wrote: > Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. > > All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 > now seems to work properly. > > Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you > operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? > I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, > but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad > does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the > Track Control Panel. > > Cliff > > > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > > > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . > > > > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus > > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but > > I really think someone else should test given my machine was > > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver > > disabled. > > > > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can > > try my build: > > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . > > > > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets > > patch. > > > > > > Gale > > > > > > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> > wrote: > >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> > wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> > >>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about > >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't > >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions > >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. > >>>> > >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is > >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. > >>>> > >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately > >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and > >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". > >>> > >>> > >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one > dialog > >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key > >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one > while > >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. > >> > >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. > >> > >> > >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track > >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: > >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? > >>>> > >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? > >>> > >>> > >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete > rebuilds > >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? > >> > >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt > >> I have done so. > >> > >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time > >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings > >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt > >> wxWidgets. > >> > >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? > >> > >> Thanks, > >> > >> > >> Gale > >> > >> > >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: > >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: > >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can > >>>>>> still > >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. > >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. > >>>>> > >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect > from > >>>>> the actual inconvenience. > >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for > >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need > to > >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long > term > >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. > >>>>> > >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the > system > >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just > changed > >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. > >>>>> > >>>>> --James. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>>>> Audacity-quality@... > >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>>> Audacity-quality@... > >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>> Audacity-quality@... > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >>> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > > _______________________________________________ > > Audacity-quality mailing list > > Audacity-quality@... > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > |
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-09-30 21:59:38
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Just rebuilt wxWidgets and Audacity. All dropdown menus seem to work fine with VoiceOver off as well as Cmd-F6 now seems to work properly. Turning VoiceOver on, I’ve never used it before, is fine, but how do you operate the dropdown (context menus it seems you call them) from VoiceOver? I’ve looked at the help etc. and guess I’m not looking for the right thing, but I find nothing to get the menus to drop down. Using the mouse/trackpad does nothing when clicking on the spin boxes or the dropdown menu in the Track Control Panel. Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . > > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but > I really think someone else should test given my machine was > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver > disabled. > > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can > try my build: > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . > > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets > patch. > > > Gale > > > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >> On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions >>>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>>> >>>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>>> >>>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". >>> >>> >>> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one dialog >>> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >>> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one while >>> still keeping the improvements for the others. >> >> Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >> >> >>>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>>> >>>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >>> >>> >>> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete rebuilds >>> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >> >> If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >> I have done so. >> >> And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >> I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >> and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >> wxWidgets. >> >> Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> Gale >> >> >>>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>>>> On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>>>>> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can >>>>>> still >>>>>> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>>>>> >>>>>> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>>>> Thanks for fixing it. >>>>> >>>>> Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect from >>>>> the actual inconvenience. >>>>> One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>>>> people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need to >>>>> support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long term >>>>> for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>>>> >>>>> Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the system >>>>> for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just changed >>>>> ratings they did not agree with. >>>>> >>>>> --James. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@gm...> - 2016-09-30 19:45:23
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Gale, I've passed your link to the Audacity4Blind mailing list. Perhaps we'll get some additional feedback. Robert 2016-09-30 21:30 GMT+02:00, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...>: > And in case you don't know, Command+F5 is what turns VoiceOver on and off. > > PRL > > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 3:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> > wrote: > >> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . >> >> Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus >> now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but >> I really think someone else should test given my machine was >> behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver >> disabled. >> >> To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can >> try my build: >> http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . >> >> Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets >> patch. >> >> >> Gale >> >> >> On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> wrote: >> > On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >> >>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >> >>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions >> >>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >> >>> >> >>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >> >>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >> >>> >> >>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >> >>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >> >>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". >> >> >> >> >> >> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one >> dialog >> >> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >> >> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one >> >> while >> >> still keeping the improvements for the others. >> > >> > Thank you Paul, I will test it out. >> > >> > >> >>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >> >>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >> >>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >> >>> >> >>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >> >> >> >> >> >> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete >> rebuilds >> >> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? >> > >> > If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt >> > I have done so. >> > >> > And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time >> > I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings >> > and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt >> > wxWidgets. >> > >> > Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > >> > Gale >> > >> > >> >>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >> >>> > On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >> >>> >> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you >> >>> >> can >> >>> >> still >> >>> >> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >> >>> >> >> >>> >> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >> >>> > Thanks for fixing it. >> >>> > >> >>> > Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect >> from >> >>> > the actual inconvenience. >> >>> > One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >> >>> > people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need >> to >> >>> > support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long >> term >> >>> > for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >> >>> > >> >>> > Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the >> system >> >>> > for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just >> changed >> >>> > ratings they did not agree with. >> >>> > >> >>> > --James. >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>> > _______________________________________________ >> >>> > Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>> > Audacity-quality@... >> >>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >>> Audacity-quality@... >> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> >> Audacity-quality@... >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------------ >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most >> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 19:38:35
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I could commit an updated Xcode project file, removing clicktrack.ny, adding rhythmtrack.ny and adding vocalrediso.ny (which was never added), but Leland's build script copies the current plugins from the source tree anyway, so that part of the Xcode file is not used. Do users building in other ways need the Xcode project to be correct for plugins? Gale |
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From: Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@gm...> - 2016-09-30 19:34:55
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Well, the bug appears as soon as an export title is proposed which is naturally the case after saving a project or importing a file into a new window. Back to your question. Yes, I would like to tackle the missing sample format options. However, it is a bit tricky to place the combo box without actually seeing it... Another point is that I want to extent the flexibility of the external exporter by having the encoder (-path) as a separate Combo box. This has the following advantages: - external programs do not longer disappear once the list goes over 13 entries. - Each encoder can have it's own last xx switches. We should also offer (or do it silently) a w64 header if the selection exceeds 4 GB. Last but not least, this export option should be available to chains with the four parameters: - *.wav or extended (w64/ref64) (- or a list of external files) - bit depth - encoder program - switches I think this export feature is highly under-estimated. There's so much one can do with it, not only export but also analyse files or combine clips with videos. Robert 2016-09-30 19:09 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: > Thanks, Robert. I think you missed a step, in that you must import a file > or save a project to see the bug. > > Your discovery means that > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1315 > > is cross-platform, but on Windows and Mac, it only occurs if you export > as "Other uncompressed files", whereas on Linux it occurs with any > export format. I updated the bug description. > > > > Gale > > > On 27 September 2016 at 06:40, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> > wrote: >> Hi Gale >> A bit off topic: >> If I choose "Other uncompressed files", I can export as e.g. "Test" >> and choose my profile such as wave. >> On reopening the dialog, 'aiff' is attached to the file name. >> >> This seems related to bug 1217. >> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1217 >> >> Although the extension will later be correctly replaced (through Paul >> L's fix) does it remain a confusing behaviour. >> >> Robert >> >> 2016-09-27 3:33 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >>> On 26 September 2016 at 18:04, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >>> wrote: >>>> Hi Gale >>>> Thanks for taking the time to reply. >>>> >>>> 2016-09-26 2:26 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >>>>> On 25 September 2016 at 10:39, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> Hi all >>>>>> >>>>>> I've recently tried to export to WavPack in order to get a 32-bit >>>>>> float backup of my tracks. >>>>> >>>>> Hi Robert, >>>>> >>>>>> It does not work with the custom FFmpeg export (I believe float is >>>>>> anyways not yet supported). >>>>> >>>>> As often happens with that feature, you have to choose the >>>>> "Format" first (wv in this case ). If you choose codec first >>>>> (wavpack) then it does not let you choose .wv format. >>>>> >>>> >>>> I had no problem in choosing the codec. Although, one has to know the >>>> extension. This should go in both directions, shouldn't it? >>> >>> Yes you should get appropriate choices for the other field >>> when selecting the first field, whichever you choose first. >>> >>> >>>>> I agree you only get a 16-bit WavPack file and there is no way >>>>> to choose otherwise. >>>>> >>>> I have not looked at the source, do you mean that we should also offer >>>> a combo box for this export option in order to have a > 16-bit input >>>> sample format? >>> >>> I don't think so, because my understanding is that the options that are >>> exposed should be governed by what our supported version of FFmpeg >>> supports. This assumes we stay with FFmpeg and don't move to >>> GStreamer's FFmpeg support. >>> >>> I see a lot of hard coding in ExportFFmpegDialogs.cpp for the list of >>> formats and codecs but I think that was written for what FFmpeg >>> 0.6.2 supports and has not been updated since. >>> >>> The interface itself is 24/32/32-bit float capable, because you can use >>> it to choose such PCM options. >>> >>> >>>>> Hence, I've tried the "External Program" feature for export. >>>>>> Unfortunately, the STDIN provides only 16-bit integer as pipe stream, >>>>>> that's rather poor, isn't it. >>>>> >>>>> S:\wavpack-4.80.0\wavpack.exe --raw-pcm=44100,32f,2 - %f >>>>> >>>>> produced a nominally 32-bit float WavPack file but there was >>>>> a warning about "raw pcm infile length does not divide evenly, >>>>> 4 bytes will be discarded" and the file is a little smaller than >>>>> that produced by WavPack. Anyway it is only incidental if >>>>> STDIN is constrained to 16-bit integer. >>>> >>>> I've tried that command too. However, it is wrong since stdin isn't RAW >>>> audio. >>>> On the contrary, a RIFF header is given with the mentioned 16-bit >>>> resolution as a fixed parameter. >>>> If one wants to go higher, an additional 'Fact' chunk is needed. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Another aside - the CLI seems to accept the 64-bit WavPack >>>>> executable on Windows x64, same as it accepts 64-bit >>>>> executables on modern Macs. The 64-bit WavPack >>>>> executable is no faster in Audacity on Windows, on my testing. >>>> >>>> Same here, the difference is marginal if not random. >>>> >>>> The resulting times for different material and switches: >>>> >>>> 10 min Chirp, 52 mb >>>> -x6hh 131 sec 16.5 mb >>>> -f 4.4 s 22 mb >>>> -xhh 9 s 17.1 mb >>>> 10 min noise will be compressed by only 1 % (to be expected) >>>> However, it is also faster (44 s instead of 131 s for the highest mode) >>>> The x64 version took 128 s, essentially no difference there. >>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I think that this should be mentioned in the manual. >>>>> >>>>> Done. >>>> >>>> Thanks, Probably the same for custom FFmpeg export. >>> >>> I don't think so, see above. >>> >>> >>>>>> I've looked briefly into ExportCL.cpp where the 16 bits are hard-coded >>>>>> and I think that it is possible to provide also 24 bit integer and 32 >>>>>> bit float. >>>>>> >>>>>> The question is if we need a combo box for this or if the format >>>>>> should automatically be taken from the preference setting. >>>>> >>>>> The Audacity default quality is 32-bit float, but most people might >>>>> want 16-bit export for uncompressed formats, even if the encoder >>>>> supports greater depth. >>>> >>>> We are talking about compressed files, are we not. >>> >>> Yes largely, but take FLAC or ALAC as examples of compressed >>> lossless. Users might not be happy if we tried to be clever and give >>> them the highest encoder bit depth available (24-bit) on the grounds >>> that their Quality Preference was 32-bit float. >>> >>> >>>>> I suppose a combo box defaulting to 16-bit would be better than >>>>> making a decision based on the Quality Preference (or based on >>>>> the format of the data in the track regardless of the Quality >>>>> Preference). I assume that a user choosing 24-bit integer or 32-bit >>>>> float might encounter errors with some encoders. >>>>> >>>> >>>> This had to be tested. It must only work for the encoder commands we >>>> are providing--lame and ffmpeg. >>>> For lossy encoding, the file size will be the same, regardless of the >>>> input sample format. >>>> It is of more interest for the lossless case. I presume that making a >>>> 24-bit FLAC file will still work with 32-bit float input but not as >>>> fast. >>> >>> Well, the reference FLAC encoder does not accept > 24-bit >>> input, though that is not a limitation in FLAC: >>> https://xiph.org/flac/documentation_tools_flac.html#usage . >>> >>> Are you planning to work on this, Robert? >>> >>> >>> Gale >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > |
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From: Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@gm...> - 2016-09-30 19:30:44
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And in case you don't know, Command+F5 is what turns VoiceOver on and off. PRL On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 3:17 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . > > Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus > now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but > I really think someone else should test given my machine was > behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver > disabled. > > To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can > try my build: > http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . > > Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets > patch. > > > Gale > > > On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > > On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> > wrote: > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about > >>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't > >>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions > >>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. > >>> > >>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is > >>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. > >>> > >>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately > >>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and > >>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". > >> > >> > >> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one > dialog > >> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key > >> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one while > >> still keeping the improvements for the others. > > > > Thank you Paul, I will test it out. > > > > > >>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track > >>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: > >>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? > >>> > >>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? > >> > >> > >> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete > rebuilds > >> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? > > > > If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt > > I have done so. > > > > And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time > > I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings > > and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt > > wxWidgets. > > > > Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Gale > > > > > >>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: > >>> > On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: > >>> >> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can > >>> >> still > >>> >> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. > >>> >> > >>> >> But not matter, I have fixed it now. > >>> > Thanks for fixing it. > >>> > > >>> > Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect > from > >>> > the actual inconvenience. > >>> > One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for > >>> > people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need > to > >>> > support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long > term > >>> > for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. > >>> > > >>> > Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the > system > >>> > for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just > changed > >>> > ratings they did not agree with. > >>> > > >>> > --James. > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >>> > _______________________________________________ > >>> > Audacity-quality mailing list > >>> > Audacity-quality@... > >>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >>> > >>> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Audacity-quality mailing list > >>> Audacity-quality@... > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Audacity-quality mailing list > >> Audacity-quality@... > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 19:30:26
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I could commit an updated Xcode project file, removing clicktrack.ny and adding rhythmtrack.ny and vocalrediso.ny (which is missing), but it seems Leland's build script just copies the plugins from the source tree so that part of the Xcode project file is redundant anyway. Would people building or packaging in other ways still need the project file to be correct? Gale |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 19:18:06
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http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 . Could someone on Mac other than Paul try opening context menus now, with VoiceOver enabled and disabled? I'm happy with it but I really think someone else should test given my machine was behaving differently in showing the bug even with VoiceOver disabled. To save someone possibly having to rebuild Widgets, you can try my build: http://gaclrecords.org.uk/test-builds/ . Leland has not updated the nightly builds yet for the widgets patch. Gale On 27 September 2016 at 19:57, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > On 27 September 2016 at 18:20, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> >> >> On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> >> wrote: >>> >>> As you may have noticed, Mac users are particularly touchy about >>> "regressions". Muscle memory gets ingrained, so if the user can't >>> use TAB like they did before, they will just revert to older versions >>> of Audacity until the "problem" is fixed. >>> >>> Besides, not being able to TAB in Metadata Editor on Mac is >>> platform-inconsistent and so would create a documentation issue. >>> >>> We have given Mac users far too many reasons to revert lately >>> (mostly due to wx3 of course). That is also in my reasoning, and >>> so (at the time) was making 2.1.3 a "final version for Snow Leopard". >> >> >> And I was trying to address those regressions this summer. This one dialog >> may have changed behavior, but in the same commit that fixed TAB key >> navigation in many, many other dialogs. Now I have fixed this one while >> still keeping the improvements for the others. > > Thank you Paul, I will test it out. > > >>> Could we address not being able to open the Audio Track >>> Dropdown Menu and other context menus on Mac: >>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1470 ? >>> >>> Surely no-one can argue that is not P1? >> >> >> As I have said, I can't reproduce this, when I make my own complete rebuilds >> of wxWidgets and of Audacity. Have you tried the same? > > If a complete rebuild of wxWidgets is as described in mac/Build.txt > I have done so. > > And as I said, Leland's Nightly Builds had the same issue, last time > I checked. His and my builds have the benefits from the focusrings > and eventloops patches, which makes me think they do have rebuilt > wxWidgets. > > Cliff, can you open the Track Dropdown Menu in your builds? > > Thanks, > > > Gale > > >>> On 27 September 2016 at 16:35, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >>> > On 9/27/2016 3:58 PM, Paul Licameli wrote: >>> >> I don't understand the high priority given this bug, because you can >>> >> still >>> >> navigate the grid cells with the arrow keys instead of tab. >>> >> >>> >> But not matter, I have fixed it now. >>> > Thanks for fixing it. >>> > >>> > Regressions generally get higher bug ratings than one might expect from >>> > the actual inconvenience. >>> > One principle we try to follow is to avoid having valid reasons for >>> > people to stay using an older version. If they do, and if we need to >>> > support them on the older version, it's a lot more work in the long term >>> > for us. The tab regression could be such a reason not to upgrade. >>> > >>> > Kvetching a bit about bug ratings is OK / expected. We have the system >>> > for a reason, and we would be much worse off if developers just changed >>> > ratings they did not agree with. >>> > >>> > --James. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Audacity-quality mailing list >>> > Audacity-quality@... >>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 17:19:04
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A lot of effort originally went into placing Scrub Toolbar to left of Device Toolbar and testing that. I prefer Scrub Toolbar to left, but that is not as important as it was, now that Scrub Toolbar is off by default, If Scrub Toolbar is still likely to be removed for 2.1.4, then it's probably not worth bothering to reposition it. Gale On 30 September 2016 at 17:25, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: > It's a consequence of hiding the scrub toolbar at the start. > I think it's OK there. If we wanted to we could make it on the left, > but it would take more code. > > On 9/30/2016 5:14 PM, Steve the Fiddle wrote: >> On 30 September 2016 at 16:26, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>> On 30 September 2016 at 09:09, Steve the Fiddle >>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>> On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>>>> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. >>>> So not intentional ? >>>> >>>>> PRL >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>>>>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>>>>> by >>>>>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>>>>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. >>>> Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me >>>> (and more conventional / expected). >>>> >>>>>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>>>>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>>>>> Toolbar. >>>> When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random >>>> screen position. >>>> >>>> Steps to reproduce: >>>> 1) Delete audacity.cfg >>>> 2) Launch Audacity >>>> 3) Exit Audacity (required) >>>> 4) Launch Audacity >>>> 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar >>> That seems to be fixed now. Scrub Toolbar is still not placed left of Device >>> Toolbar where originally intended but I know you (Steve) prefer it to right. >> I have no left/right preference for its position. >> >> Steve >> >>> >>> Gale >>> >>> >>>>>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>>>>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>>>>> After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>>>>> is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Steve >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 17:10:32
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Thanks, Robert. I think you missed a step, in that you must import a file or save a project to see the bug. Your discovery means that http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1315 is cross-platform, but on Windows and Mac, it only occurs if you export as "Other uncompressed files", whereas on Linux it occurs with any export format. I updated the bug description. Gale On 27 September 2016 at 06:40, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> wrote: > Hi Gale > A bit off topic: > If I choose "Other uncompressed files", I can export as e.g. "Test" > and choose my profile such as wave. > On reopening the dialog, 'aiff' is attached to the file name. > > This seems related to bug 1217. > http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1217 > > Although the extension will later be correctly replaced (through Paul > L's fix) does it remain a confusing behaviour. > > Robert > > 2016-09-27 3:33 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >> On 26 September 2016 at 18:04, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >> wrote: >>> Hi Gale >>> Thanks for taking the time to reply. >>> >>> 2016-09-26 2:26 GMT+02:00, Gale Andrews <gale@...>: >>>> On 25 September 2016 at 10:39, Robert Hänggi <aarjay.robert@...> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Hi all >>>>> >>>>> I've recently tried to export to WavPack in order to get a 32-bit >>>>> float backup of my tracks. >>>> >>>> Hi Robert, >>>> >>>>> It does not work with the custom FFmpeg export (I believe float is >>>>> anyways not yet supported). >>>> >>>> As often happens with that feature, you have to choose the >>>> "Format" first (wv in this case ). If you choose codec first >>>> (wavpack) then it does not let you choose .wv format. >>>> >>> >>> I had no problem in choosing the codec. Although, one has to know the >>> extension. This should go in both directions, shouldn't it? >> >> Yes you should get appropriate choices for the other field >> when selecting the first field, whichever you choose first. >> >> >>>> I agree you only get a 16-bit WavPack file and there is no way >>>> to choose otherwise. >>>> >>> I have not looked at the source, do you mean that we should also offer >>> a combo box for this export option in order to have a > 16-bit input >>> sample format? >> >> I don't think so, because my understanding is that the options that are >> exposed should be governed by what our supported version of FFmpeg >> supports. This assumes we stay with FFmpeg and don't move to >> GStreamer's FFmpeg support. >> >> I see a lot of hard coding in ExportFFmpegDialogs.cpp for the list of >> formats and codecs but I think that was written for what FFmpeg >> 0.6.2 supports and has not been updated since. >> >> The interface itself is 24/32/32-bit float capable, because you can use >> it to choose such PCM options. >> >> >>>> Hence, I've tried the "External Program" feature for export. >>>>> Unfortunately, the STDIN provides only 16-bit integer as pipe stream, >>>>> that's rather poor, isn't it. >>>> >>>> S:\wavpack-4.80.0\wavpack.exe --raw-pcm=44100,32f,2 - %f >>>> >>>> produced a nominally 32-bit float WavPack file but there was >>>> a warning about "raw pcm infile length does not divide evenly, >>>> 4 bytes will be discarded" and the file is a little smaller than >>>> that produced by WavPack. Anyway it is only incidental if >>>> STDIN is constrained to 16-bit integer. >>> >>> I've tried that command too. However, it is wrong since stdin isn't RAW >>> audio. >>> On the contrary, a RIFF header is given with the mentioned 16-bit >>> resolution as a fixed parameter. >>> If one wants to go higher, an additional 'Fact' chunk is needed. >>> >>>> >>>> Another aside - the CLI seems to accept the 64-bit WavPack >>>> executable on Windows x64, same as it accepts 64-bit >>>> executables on modern Macs. The 64-bit WavPack >>>> executable is no faster in Audacity on Windows, on my testing. >>> >>> Same here, the difference is marginal if not random. >>> >>> The resulting times for different material and switches: >>> >>> 10 min Chirp, 52 mb >>> -x6hh 131 sec 16.5 mb >>> -f 4.4 s 22 mb >>> -xhh 9 s 17.1 mb >>> 10 min noise will be compressed by only 1 % (to be expected) >>> However, it is also faster (44 s instead of 131 s for the highest mode) >>> The x64 version took 128 s, essentially no difference there. >>> >>>> >>>>> I think that this should be mentioned in the manual. >>>> >>>> Done. >>> >>> Thanks, Probably the same for custom FFmpeg export. >> >> I don't think so, see above. >> >> >>>>> I've looked briefly into ExportCL.cpp where the 16 bits are hard-coded >>>>> and I think that it is possible to provide also 24 bit integer and 32 >>>>> bit float. >>>>> >>>>> The question is if we need a combo box for this or if the format >>>>> should automatically be taken from the preference setting. >>>> >>>> The Audacity default quality is 32-bit float, but most people might >>>> want 16-bit export for uncompressed formats, even if the encoder >>>> supports greater depth. >>> >>> We are talking about compressed files, are we not. >> >> Yes largely, but take FLAC or ALAC as examples of compressed >> lossless. Users might not be happy if we tried to be clever and give >> them the highest encoder bit depth available (24-bit) on the grounds >> that their Quality Preference was 32-bit float. >> >> >>>> I suppose a combo box defaulting to 16-bit would be better than >>>> making a decision based on the Quality Preference (or based on >>>> the format of the data in the track regardless of the Quality >>>> Preference). I assume that a user choosing 24-bit integer or 32-bit >>>> float might encounter errors with some encoders. >>>> >>> >>> This had to be tested. It must only work for the encoder commands we >>> are providing--lame and ffmpeg. >>> For lossy encoding, the file size will be the same, regardless of the >>> input sample format. >>> It is of more interest for the lossless case. I presume that making a >>> 24-bit FLAC file will still work with 32-bit float input but not as >>> fast. >> >> Well, the reference FLAC encoder does not accept > 24-bit >> input, though that is not a limitation in FLAC: >> https://xiph.org/flac/documentation_tools_flac.html#usage . >> >> Are you planning to work on this, Robert? >> >> >> Gale >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: James Crook <crookj@in...> - 2016-09-30 16:25:14
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It's a consequence of hiding the scrub toolbar at the start. I think it's OK there. If we wanted to we could make it on the left, but it would take more code. On 9/30/2016 5:14 PM, Steve the Fiddle wrote: > On 30 September 2016 at 16:26, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >> On 30 September 2016 at 09:09, Steve the Fiddle >> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>> On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>>> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. >>> So not intentional ? >>> >>>> PRL >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>>>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>>>> by >>>>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>>>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. >>> Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me >>> (and more conventional / expected). >>> >>>>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>>>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>>>> Toolbar. >>> When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random >>> screen position. >>> >>> Steps to reproduce: >>> 1) Delete audacity.cfg >>> 2) Launch Audacity >>> 3) Exit Audacity (required) >>> 4) Launch Audacity >>> 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar >> That seems to be fixed now. Scrub Toolbar is still not placed left of Device >> Toolbar where originally intended but I know you (Steve) prefer it to right. > I have no left/right preference for its position. > > Steve > >> >> Gale >> >> >>>>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>>>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>>>> After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>>>> is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>>>> >>>>>> Steve >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > |
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From: Steve the Fiddle <stevethefiddle@gm...> - 2016-09-30 16:14:52
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On 30 September 2016 at 16:26, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: > On 30 September 2016 at 09:09, Steve the Fiddle > <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >> On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. >> >> So not intentional ? >> >>> >>> PRL >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>>> by >>>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. >> >> Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me >> (and more conventional / expected). >> >>>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>>> Toolbar. >> >> When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random >> screen position. >> >> Steps to reproduce: >> 1) Delete audacity.cfg >> 2) Launch Audacity >> 3) Exit Audacity (required) >> 4) Launch Audacity >> 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar > > That seems to be fixed now. Scrub Toolbar is still not placed left of Device > Toolbar where originally intended but I know you (Steve) prefer it to right. I have no left/right preference for its position. Steve > > > Gale > > >>>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>> > After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>> > is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>> > >>>> > Steve >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> > Audacity-quality@... >>>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: Gale Andrews <gale@au...> - 2016-09-30 15:27:31
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On 30 September 2016 at 09:09, Steve the Fiddle <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: > On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. > > So not intentional ? > >> >> PRL >> >> >> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>> >>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>> by >>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. > > Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me > (and more conventional / expected). > >>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>> Toolbar. > > When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random > screen position. > > Steps to reproduce: > 1) Delete audacity.cfg > 2) Launch Audacity > 3) Exit Audacity (required) > 4) Launch Audacity > 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar That seems to be fixed now. Scrub Toolbar is still not placed left of Device Toolbar where originally intended but I know you (Steve) prefer it to right. Gale >>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>> > After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>> > is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>> > >>> > Steve >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Audacity-quality mailing list >>> > Audacity-quality@... >>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: James Crook <crookj@in...> - 2016-09-30 11:58:13
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Transcription toolbar remains on by default for 2.1.3. At some future date we may make the play button a multibutton with looped-play, play-at-speed, play-excluding, and then abolish the transcription toolbar. That is quite some way off, and we would also have to agree what to do about the speed slider in that case. --James. On 9/30/2016 12:34 PM, Cliff Scott wrote: > Now is back to “normal”. I noticed that the Transcription Toolbar is still on by default. I thought I had read that it was going to be off, but maybe I recall incorrectly. > > Cliff > >> On Sep 30, 2016, at 3:42 AM, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: >> >> Wasn't intended. >> I'd misunderstood the new 'broom' in layout. >> Fixed with: >> https://github.com/audacity/audacity/commit/74887abb7021aa173bc84446be1a15835d3f55ae >> >> --James. >> >> >> >> On 9/30/2016 9:09 AM, Steve the Fiddle wrote: >>> On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>>> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. >>> So not intentional ? >>> >>>> PRL >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>>>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>>>> by >>>>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>>>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. >>> Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me >>> (and more conventional / expected). >>> >>>>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>>>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>>>> Toolbar. >>> When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random >>> screen position. >>> >>> Steps to reproduce: >>> 1) Delete audacity.cfg >>> 2) Launch Audacity >>> 3) Exit Audacity (required) >>> 4) Launch Audacity >>> 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar >>> >>> Steve >>> >>>>> Gale >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>>>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>>>> After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>>>> is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>>>> >>>>>> Steve >>>>>> >>>>>> |
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From: Cliff Scott <flyer185@gm...> - 2016-09-30 11:34:23
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Now is back to “normal”. I noticed that the Transcription Toolbar is still on by default. I thought I had read that it was going to be off, but maybe I recall incorrectly. Cliff > On Sep 30, 2016, at 3:42 AM, James Crook <crookj@...> wrote: > > Wasn't intended. > I'd misunderstood the new 'broom' in layout. > Fixed with: > https://github.com/audacity/audacity/commit/74887abb7021aa173bc84446be1a15835d3f55ae > > --James. > > > > On 9/30/2016 9:09 AM, Steve the Fiddle wrote: >> On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >>> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. >> So not intentional ? >> >>> PRL >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>>> by >>>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. >> Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me >> (and more conventional / expected). >> >>>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>>> Toolbar. >> When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random >> screen position. >> >> Steps to reproduce: >> 1) Delete audacity.cfg >> 2) Launch Audacity >> 3) Exit Audacity (required) >> 4) Launch Audacity >> 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar >> >> Steve >> >>>> >>>> Gale >>>> >>>> >>>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>>> After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>>> is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>>> >>>>> Steve >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality |
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From: James Crook <crookj@in...> - 2016-09-30 08:42:17
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Wasn't intended. I'd misunderstood the new 'broom' in layout. Fixed with: https://github.com/audacity/audacity/commit/74887abb7021aa173bc84446be1a15835d3f55ae --James. On 9/30/2016 9:09 AM, Steve the Fiddle wrote: > On 30 September 2016 at 04:31, Paul Licameli <paul.licameli@...> wrote: >> This is the consequence of commit 22726dc41daa by James. > So not intentional ? > >> PRL >> >> >> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Gale Andrews <gale@...> wrote: >>> It's been like this for at least 10 days, IIRC. I guessed it was intended >>> by >>> whoever changed it. Considering how many users don't know where >>> to select devices I thought it a passable change, so did not question it. > Having the Transport Toolbar at the top seems more ergonomic to me > (and more conventional / expected). > >>> If we care about Scrub Toolbar, it is not such a good change, because >>> if Scrub Toolbar is turned on it is now at the same height as Device >>> Toolbar. > When I enable the Scrub Toolbar it is floating at an apparently random > screen position. > > Steps to reproduce: > 1) Delete audacity.cfg > 2) Launch Audacity > 3) Exit Audacity (required) > 4) Launch Audacity > 5) Enable Scrub Toolbar > > Steve > >>> >>> Gale >>> >>> >>> On 29 September 2016 at 18:58, Steve the Fiddle >>> <stevethefiddle@...> wrote: >>>> After deleting audacity.cfg or resetting toolbars. the device toolbar >>>> is positioned in a row on its own above the other toolbars. >>>> >>>> Steve >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>>> Audacity-quality@... >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Audacity-quality mailing list >>> Audacity-quality@... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Audacity-quality mailing list >> Audacity-quality@... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Audacity-quality mailing list > Audacity-quality@... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-quality > > |