Re: [Audacity-manual] {manual} Your First recording tutorial

[Peter S. <pet...@ya...>]

As this thread is getting way too long - and email is a poor way to develop 
these discussion anyway (I thought we agreed in the past that such email threads 
were hard to follow and keep track of)- I have started a summary entry on my 
user page - see: http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/User:PeterSampson

Comments welcomed there - in particular comments re the sub-tutorial titling 
(James' proposal versus Gale's proposal).  Personally I'm fairly agnostic about 
the nomenclature - I can see arguments for both sides.

Peter.

 



________________________________
From: Gale Andrews <ga...@au...>
To: For discussion of Audacity Manual <aud...@li...>
Sent: Sat, June 18, 2011 4:26:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Audacity-manual] {manual} Your First recording tutorial


| From Bill Wharrie <bi...@go...> 
| Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:46:03 -0400
| Subject: [Audacity-manual] {manual} Your First recording tutorial
> 
> On 17-Jun-11, at 2:55 PM, Gale Andrews wrote:
> 
> >
> > To my mind, "Audacity Setup and Configuration" as it is being
> > envisaged in:
> > 
>http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/User:Billw58/Audacity_Setup_and_Configuration
> >
> > isn't part of "Understanding Audacity" except for the first brief  
> > sections
> > "Temporary Files", "Project Sample Rate" and "Setting up for  
> > playback".
> > And those don't really say much that it isn't already in the  
> > Reference.
> 
> ...If YFR is going to do the hand-holding and step-by-step, then the  
> current Audacity Setup and Configuration page can be trimmed  
> significantly. If may even become redundant. But let's not forget our  
> motivation for the expanded setup pages - to integrate information  
> from the wiki into the manual (where it will hopefully be easier to  
> find), with all information and images relevant to 1.3.14/2.0 (no  
> reference to 1.2), and addressing the many support questions we get  
> about recording with an external microphone or instrument.
> 
> If Peter's expanded YFR tutorial will do this, that's fine with me.

I agree, but doesn't your User Page content largely address this now?  
I think your pages are the new starting point. 

The "beginner" questions that turn up on feedback@ may be more 
clueless than the ones you get on the Forum. They suggest people 
should be warned off inbuilt mics and encouraged to spend a little 
money. Others have enough knowledge to be dangerous but need 
a bit of help with condenser/dynamic, polar patterns and where to
find out about mic technique.  Wiki links may better here (maybe
even Wikipedia) - our Wiki information isn't that good yet:
http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Recording_Tips 


> > So I feel that the original motivation in integrating "Setup and
> > Configuration" into YFR was probably correct. If needed at all, an  
> > item
> > in "Understanding Audacity" would provide an overview (probably an
> > image of the Audacity project window with arrows) pointing to the
> > relevant parts of the Audacity interface and describing what they do
> > - Mixer, Meter and Device Toolbars, Transport Menu, Devices and
> > Recording Preferences, Project Rate, Temporary Folder. It will only
> > be useful for those who don't need hand-holding.
> 
> An interesting idea. Kind of like the current Quick Guide 
>http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Quick_Guide 
>
> , but targeted to setup?

Yes that's what I had in mind. 


> > My feeling is that we need a separate, strongly targeted tutorial
> > (with an OS-based structure) about "Recording Computer Playback",
> > even if some of its content duplicates YFR. People who need help
> > recording playback don't want complications thrown with huge
> > images of computer ports or to see descriptions of largely irrelevant
> > options in Device Toolbar. Such a tutorial would complement the
> > existing ones for recording pre-recorded media and for creating new
> > material (whether by mic, keyboard, guitar or whatever).
> 
> Yes, they'd need to duplicate at least the Device Toolbar settings.

I don't see that as a big issue because the Device Toolbar content 
could be focused on a relevant choice. The tutorial for LPs and 
cassettes already has such a duplication. 


> > The subsections should have a "Tutorial" name.
> 
> I'm not sure about that. The subsections of
>http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Tutorial_-_Copying_tapes,_LPs_or_minidiscs_to_CD
>D
> don't start with the word "Tutorial"

That's why I suggested using the slash to suggest the subsections are 
part of the parent tutorial.  




Gale 



> > YFR should I think
> > have subsections much as envisaged by Peter like "Connecting Up"
> > and "Selecting Your Input" (except that possibly "Selecting Your
> > Input"needs subsections too).
> 
> Agreed.
> 
> -- Bill
> 
> >
> > As regards "Total Recorder", my feeling is that it is a good option
> > especially as it solves Skype recording too, but from the feedback I
> > get, it's far too complex for the technically challenged.
> >
> > Freecorder 3 (browser based) is a much simpler option for those
> > whose main interest is only in recording something playing in the
> > web browser. Of course you get a toolbar as well, but a small price
> > to pay. I think Freecorder 3 should be recommended as a "free"
> > alternative to TotalRecorder, unless someone knows something of
> > comparable functionality that's free.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Gale
> >
> >
> >
> > | From Peter Sampson <pet...@ya...>
> > | Fri, 17 Jun 2011 08:13:30 -0700 (PDT)
> > | Subject: [Audacity-manual] {manual} Your First recording tutorial
> >> Hi Bill,
> >>
> >> <<This assumes that the new Setup pages get the green light. They  
> >> need
> >> attention from Windows and Linux users for content of those  
> >> sections,  and a
> >> decision from James, Gale and others on overall appropriateness.  I  
> >> don't think
> >> the Setup pages are a tutorial.>>
> >>
> >> The problem is that the existing Setup page is not up-to date -for  
> >> a start the
> >> image of the mixer toolbar is now stale.
> >>
> >> Yes I agree that the Setup pages are not a tutorial - and indeed  
> >> belong
> >> correctly where they are now on the front page in understanding  
> >> Audacity.
> >>
> >> And yes I agree that if your new Setup pages are greenlighted to go  
> >> - then we
> >> can shorten the YFR tutorial by providing links to the Setup  
> >> pages.  And since
> >> it would then only contain steps 3-7 it would probably then be  
> >> short enough
> >> without breaking it up.  So I will hold fire for now on YFR until  
> >> your new pages
> >> get greenlighted/redlighted.
> >>
> >> <<the new Setup pages ... need  attention from Windows ... users  
> >> for content
> >> ...>>
> >>
> >> My main comment is that for Windows users who cannot record  
> >> streaming audio  we
> >> normally recommend the TotalRecorderpackage - see: 
>http://www.highcriteria.com/
> >> It costs a liitle at $17.95, but it works well - my wife uses it on  
> >> her new W7
> >> laptop.
> >> I added an editornote to your page.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Peter
> >>
> >> ________________________________
> >> From: Bill Wharrie <bi...@go...>
> >> To: For discussion of Audacity Manual <aud...@li... 
>
> >> >
> >> Sent: Fri, June 17, 2011 3:10:58 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [Audacity-manual] {manual} Your First recording tutorial
> >>
> >> 
>http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/User:Billw58/Audacity_Setup_and_Configuration
> >>
> >> grew out of the discussion on this wiki page
> >>
> >> 
>http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/User:BillWharrie/Device_and_Input_selection_on_Mac
>
> >>
> >> (scroll down past the discussion of the Device/Mixer toolbar to the
> >> discussion of how and where to advise users how to deal with "sound
> >> card" issues).
> >>
> >> In short, we were leaning at that time to pulling the essential
> >> information from the wiki about setting up your computer's sound card
> >> (now confusingly placed on the "Mixer Toolbar Issues" page) and  
> >> adding
> >> it to the manual.
> >>
> >> I would start the YFR tutorial with "If you have successfully
> >> connected the device you want to record from, to your computer and  
> >> are
> >> getting sound into Audacity, you are ready to begin. If you are  
> >> having
> >> problems getting sound into Audacity, please read the Audacity Setup
> >> and Configuration pages." The end of the new AS&C pages link to YFR
> >> and Editing an Existing File tutorials. This way people who find that
> >> Audacity works "out of the box" can proceed with the test recording,
> >> etc., while those that need help can divert to the setup pages.
> >>
> >> This assumes that the new Setup pages get the green light. They need
> >> attention from Windows and Linux users for content of those sections,
> >> and a decision from James, Gale and others on overall  
> >> appropriateness.
> >> I don't think the Setup pages are a tutorial.
> >>
> >> On 17-Jun-11, at 9:47 AM, Peter Sampson wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi Bill,
> >>>
> >>> to be honest, yes I had forgotten that you had been working on that
> >>> page.  That
> >>> work was back in early May I see and I thought that momentum had
> >>> been lost and
> >>> your work on that had been kicked, by you, into the long grass.
> >>>
> >>> I was responding to the ToDo-2 note that you placed on the Your
> >>> First Recording
> >>> Tutorial (deeply conscious that a ToDo-2 blocks a stable release -
> >>> and thus
> >>> trying to prepare the path for 2.0 - and even for the 1.3.14 release
> >>> it is
> >>> currently a very unwieldy read, leading to TLDR).
> >>>
> >>> I still think it is worth breaking apart the existing tutorial and
> >>> then
> >>> reviewing it in the light of your new proposed Setup and
> >>> Configuration pages.
> >>> It is possible that your new stuff could replace items 1 & 2 in my
> >>> proposed list
> >>> of contents, linked to from the master tutorial page - but
> >>> personally I prefer
> >>> the flow h/w setup followed by Audacity s/w setup - it flows better
> >>> that way for
> >>> me.
> >>
> >> I have no problem with breaking up the tutorial. But note that the  
> >> new
> >> Setup pages have the hardware -> software flow as well.
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Or maybe we should ditch the whole "Your First Recording" Tutorial
> >>> in favour of
> >>> your new pages (which would need the "Tutorial - ..." labelling as
> >>> Martyn
> >>> pointed out).  The downside to doing this is that an awful lot of
> >>> pages link to
> >>> the "Your First Recording" tutorial - so a lot of links to fix too
> >>> (many of the
> >>> other tutorials link back to YFR).
> >>
> >> Not a good idea IMO. YFR is a tutorial, Setup is help.
> >>
> >>>
> >>> There is possibly room for both sets of tutorials - but there is
> >>> such a big
> >>> overlap that it would lead to parallel maintenance and so best
> >>> avoided.
> >>
> >> Overlap is the issue, which is why I'd link to the Setup pages from
> >> the YFR tutorial.
> >> -- Bill



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