Re: [Audacity-nyquist] Ubuntu's switch to pulseaudio broke accessibility for the blind.

[Steve <ste...@gm...>]

On Sat, 2009-10-10 at 02:08 +0200, Igor Chernenko wrote:
> Hi Edgar!
> 
> I believe you know exactly why and for whom, I posted this message to
> Nyquist forum.
> And, what is more, Audacity is actually unusable with PulseAudio.
> It is true for old boxes, and for dual cores. I tested this. The same
> overtones of 50Hz in recordings.
> 
> Could you imagine how a blind person deals with trojans on his Windows
> box today?
> You know, trojans tend to become a real disaster.
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/24/botnet_economics/
> 
> Could you imagine a blind person who should change from Ubuntu to
> Windows because of the evil PulseAudio?
> This is what the so-called "Ubuntu humanism" means in reality.
> 
> Linux Haters are now laughing at us:
> Pulse my audio
> http://linuxhaters.blogspot.com/2008/10/pulse-my-audio.html
> 
> It is perfectly possible and even necessary to remove PulseAudio from Ubuntu.
> I did remove PulseAudio from my boxes and installed OSS4.
> All audio applications work perfectly with OSS4.
> 
> You stated: "many other ubuntu audio packages NEED pulseaudio."
> I am really amused.
> I have a friend who knows about Linux not less than you, or even more,
> or, at least, he knows enough to comprehend that PulseAudio is evil in
> pure form.
> He ask me: "Why do you recommend to use skype-static-oss with OSS4?
> This package depends on pulseaudio, you can check this with apt-get".
> 
> That package, skype-static-oss, works perfectly with OSS4 on my boxes
> (PulseAudio is removed and purged away).
> Fantastic sound quality with ancient soundcards. Unbelievable!
> 
> Ubuntu developers are not going to take care about the blind, they are
> very busy now.
> "They are seriously building a kind of Berlin Wall to prevent a
> massive escape from PulseAudio."
> http://www.ubuntumini.com/2009/09/fix-most-audio-problems-remove.html
> 
> They have a reason to worry. The Russian hackers have already invented
> an effective method to purge PulseAudio from Ubuntu 9.10.
> 
> PulseAudio was created by Germans, and "Berlin Walls" is a normal
> German way to deal with problems.
> This is true for Germans and for Russians too, as far as I know, and
> perhaps, it is in the very nature of human beings in general.
> If they have a problem, they build a wall, or "Iron Curtain", or else.
> Think why borders exist.
> 
> QUOTE: "Nearly half a year ago I had sent detailed instructions how to compile
> espeak in a pulseaudio-compatible way to make the orca screen reader
> work with pulseaudio to the ubuntu launchpad".
> 
> Are you kidding, or you are serious?
> It does not really matter whether espeak is compatible with PulseAudio or not.
> PulseAudio is the "master bug", it is fundamentally wrong by design,
> and, therefore, it invariably fails to work.
> http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=32637
> 
> Ubuntu forums are flooded with "no sound problems" and PulseAudio
> related problems,
> and nobody is going to help the unlucky users, because the only way to
> help them is to explain how to remove PulseAudio.
> 
> In fact, the only way to make Skype working with Ubuntu is to remove PulseAudio.
> You may try it, if you want. We made already agreement with one Audacity dev
> to test how his Skype works with PulseAudio. I am still waiting for
> the test call.
> He is not ready, perhaps.

I'm not an Audacity dev, but we did have an agreement to try Skype, and
I have attempted to do so a few times but you are still shown in my
contacts as "awaiting authorisation". I have sent a Skype request for
authorisation but it still shows the same.

I am not usually a Skype user, but I have tested it with the test call
and that works fine. When I connect a decent microphone and headphones
the sound quality is pretty good, though I don't know how good one
should expect from an internet call.

Yes, I use PulseAudio and it works very well for me.

I think that the main reason that so many Ubuntu users have problems
with PulseAudio is because Ubuntu does not include the PulseAudio Device
Chooser (padevchooser) or the PulseAudio Volume Control by default.

The PulseAudio website states:
"Distributors: if you ship PulseAudio, please make sure to follow these
instruction as much as possible, to provide optimal PulseAudio
experience to your users! Thank you!"

It then goes on to list both of these packages as 2 of the tools to give
users a good experience with Pulse. I've no idea why Ubuntu disregarded
this advice, but to my mind it was a big mistake.

> Some explanations - Skype for Linux
> http://share.skype.com/sites/linux/2009/09/some_explanations.html

Again the recommendation to use padevchooser.

> Bug #362203 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu): “Skype high CPU use on 9.04 ...
> Yes, using pulseaudio with skype in 9.04 gives a leak of memory, but
> fortunately it is possible to avoid using pulseaudio with skype. ...
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/362203
> 
> Bug #362203:
> Skype high CPU use on 9.04 using pulse (and audio recording/sending delay >5sec)

It appears that bug is now closed.

I am currently building a new Linux box to see if I can get OSS4 to run
alongside Jackd. As a musician, Jackd is essential for my work and
unless I can get Jackd and OSS4 to play nicely together, OSS4 is a
non-starter.

I'm particularly interested to see if there is any truth in the claims
that OSS4 gives better sound quality than ALSA. I have seen a great deal
of anecdotal evidence for this, but I'm rather surprised to not be able
to find any test measurements to support this.

Steve D