tuxpaint-i18n — Discussion on internationalization and translation of Tux Paint

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Plural in tuxpaint-config

[Jacques C. <jac...@or...>]

Bill Kendrick a écrit :
...................
> 
> #: ../tuxpaint-config2.cxx:1815
> msgid "seconds"
> msgstr "sekund (-y)"
> 
> 
> Can someone lend a hand?  I'm not familiar with dealing with plurals in
> gettext quite yet.
...............

Something like that is not sufficient ?

msgid "second(s)"
msgstr "seconde(s)"  #in french


Regards

Jacques

[Tuxpaint-i18n] Plural in tuxpaint-config

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

Jaroslav noted:

----- Forwarded message from Jaroslav Rynik <jr...@ya...> -----

There's 1 string that needs another plural. I marked it with the
comment starting with "XXX". Do you think something could be done
about it?

----- End forwarded message -----

the line in question is:

#: ../tuxpaint-config2.cxx:1815
msgid "seconds"
msgstr "sekund (-y)"


Can someone lend a hand?  I'm not familiar with dealing with plurals in
gettext quite yet.

Thx!

-- 
-bill!
"Tux Paint" - free children's drawing software for Windows / Mac OS X / Linux!
Download it today!  http://www.tuxpaint.org/

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Slovak translation updated

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Thu, Jan 08, 2009 at 02:19:13PM +0000, Jaroslav Rynik wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I have updated Slovak translation.

Thank you!

-- 
-bill!
"Tux Paint" - free children's drawing software for Windows / Mac OS X / Linux!
Download it today!  http://www.tuxpaint.org/

[Tuxpaint-i18n] Slovak translation updated

[Jaroslav R. <jr...@ya...>]

Hello,

I have updated Slovak translation.

Best wishes,
Jaro


      

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Wrong language code for Zapotec language

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 12:02:20AM +0100, Karl Ove Hufthammer wrote:
> In Tux Paint there is a language with code zw_MX. However, there *is* no ISO 
> 639 language code zw. Also, the English name would be Zapotec, not Zapoteco.
> 
> What the correct code (and name) is, depends on which Zapotec language it 
> actually is. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Zapotec_languages and
> http://www.ethnologue.com/show_country.asp?name=MX
> 
> So, which language is this meant to be?

The email I got with the original PO file read:

   We have finished translating tuxpaint to zapoteco, is possible to have
   ours lenguan in this program? I sent translation to zapoteco (zw.po;
   poedit).

My apologies for not doing research into this.  I'll pass your questions
along to them, to see what they can tell me.

Thanks for noticing this!

-bill!

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] tuxpaint-config

[Jacques C. <jac...@or...>]

Frederico Goncalves Guimaraes a écrit :

............
> 
> As Bill said on the other message there isn't. I had the same problem
> with Brazilian Portuguese translation. In fact, I did a "non-literal"
> translation of the interface and the result was good. I don't know if
> it may help you, but take a look at the pt_BR translation (it's on CVS).
> 
Hello Frederico,

yes, you are right, this is the best solution.
I will rework my job, it is not a big document.

Best regards

Jacques

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] tuxpaint-config

[Frederico G. G. <fgg...@te...>]

Hi Jacques and everybody else,

Consta no registro %JC04400 do Livro da Grande Teia que,
em 04/01/09, Jacques escreveu o seguinte:

> On first happy new year for everybody !

For you too, my friend...  :-)

> I have a small problem with the translation of tuxpaint-config.
> The size of the window when running the progrma is designed for
> english language.
> Generally, the words and the sentences in french (and i think it is
> the same for other languages) are longer than english ones.
> So in some cases, the sentences are going out of the window.
> I tried to shorten the french sentences, but it is sometimes
> difficult because we must remain understandable ..
> Is there a simple solution ?

As Bill said on the other message there isn't. I had the same problem
with Brazilian Portuguese translation. In fact, I did a "non-literal"
translation of the interface and the result was good. I don't know if
it may help you, but take a look at the pt_BR translation (it's on CVS).

Best regards,


Frederico
-- 
Linux User #228171
Debian-BR User #434
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"Liberdade, essa palavra que o sonho humano alimenta, que não há
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Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] tuxpaint-config

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Sun, Jan 04, 2009 at 10:40:13AM +0100, Jacques Chion wrote:
> I have a small problem with the translation of tuxpaint-config.
> The size of the window when running the progrma is designed for english 
> language.
> Generally, the words and the sentences in french (and i think it is the 
> same for other languages) are longer than english ones.
> So in some cases, the sentences are going out of the window.
> I tried to shorten the french sentences, but it is sometimes difficult 
> because we must remain understandable ..
> Is there a simple solution ?

Sadly, no, not a simple one.  One of my goals some time soon is to learn
wxWidgets (or perhaps both Python and wxPython) and rewrite Tux Paint Config.
The current FLTK-based code is a big pain to maintain.

-- 
-bill!
"Tux Paint" - free children's drawing software for Windows / Mac OS X / Linux!
Download it today!  http://www.tuxpaint.org/

[Tuxpaint-i18n] tuxpaint-config

[Jacques C. <jac...@or...>]

On first happy new year for everybody !

I have a small problem with the translation of tuxpaint-config.
The size of the window when running the progrma is designed for english 
language.
Generally, the words and the sentences in french (and i think it is the 
same for other languages) are longer than english ones.
So in some cases, the sentences are going out of the window.
I tried to shorten the french sentences, but it is sometimes difficult 
because we must remain understandable ..
Is there a simple solution ?
I tried to modify the preogram itself, but i am not a programmer, and i 
am afraid to make some mistakes.

Regards

Jacques

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Pere P. i C. <pe...@fo...>]

El dv 02 de 01 de 2009 a les 16:07 -0800, en/na Bill Kendrick va
escriure:
> On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 12:40:34AM +0100, Pere Pujal i Carabantes wrote:
> > For now, I've commited something less intrussive, it works, but it adds
> > an extra line in the page :(
> 
> I don't like that the <title> loses the specific details.
> (I don't want _every_ page of the gallery to have an identical, ambiguous
> title.)
> 
A new attempt, I've made a start_gettext() function by copy/pasting code
from page_start() and page_start2().
<title> has recovered the details and translations work fine, but there
are some duplicate code now...

Pere

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 12:40:34AM +0100, Pere Pujal i Carabantes wrote:
> For now, I've commited something less intrussive, it works, but it adds
> an extra line in the page :(

I don't like that the <title> loses the specific details.
(I don't want _every_ page of the gallery to have an identical, ambiguous
title.)

Gotta run,

-bill!

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Pere P. i C. <pe...@fo...>]

Hi Bill!
El dv 02 de 01 de 2009 a les 01:17 -0800, en/na Bill Kendrick va
escriure:
> On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 12:32:33AM +0100, Pere Pujal i Carabantes wrote:
> > I think I figured out why those doesn't appear translated:
> > some titles in gallery are composed by two of those strings, so when
> > trying to gettext a composed title in layout/std.php3, there is not a
> > translation that matches the composed title.

There is another problem in plus of what I said about composed strings,
$specifics contains yet the substituted values, so if it is on the
title, it is currently untranslatable.
> > 
> > Does this make sense?
> 
> I think so, but I'm too slow and tired right now to look into it.
> Feel free to change things in CVS and commit, and I'll pull it down on the
> webserver. :)

I think that the real solution will be to get gettext working before
calling page_start, say a start_gettext() function in layout/std.php3
that one can call as needed, but this is out of my knowledge.

For now, I've commited something less intrussive, it works, but it adds
an extra line in the page :(

the call to page_start() has now a fixed string as title and has gone up
to top as it starts gettext needed to have $specifics translated.
A new line is added with the contents of $specifics (before it was on
the title) 

Hope this helps
Happy new year!
Pere

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Tux Paint translations not working

[Karl O. H. <ka...@hu...>]

Fredag 02 januar 2009 skreiv Bill Kendrick:
>Hrm, every odd.  Have you changed how you build Tux Paint?
>(I normally do "make && make install", which by default drops things in
>/usr/local/, but when people package Tux Paint, they override one or more
>of the PREFIX variables in Makefile to point it to /usr/)

I did change the Makefile (I miss a proper ./configure, BTW ...).
Running make clean before make and make install seems to have
solved it, though.

-- 
Karl Ove Hufthammer

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] FriBidi added to Tux Paint (was: Tux Paint Hebrew text entry)

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 12:37:08AM +0100, Karl Ove Hufthammer wrote:
> It uses an old method of finding the correct environment variables. See
> http://www.nabble.com/Re%3A-fribidi-config-p17441756.html
> 
> I had to do the following changes to make the program compile:

Thanks.  Applying to CVS.

-bill!

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 12:32:33AM +0100, Pere Pujal i Carabantes wrote:
> I think I figured out why those doesn't appear translated:
> some titles in gallery are composed by two of those strings, so when
> trying to gettext a composed title in layout/std.php3, there is not a
> translation that matches the composed title.
> 
> Does this make sense?

I think so, but I'm too slow and tired right now to look into it.
Feel free to change things in CVS and commit, and I'll pull it down on the
webserver. :)

Thanks, and happy new year!

-- 
-bill!
"Tux Paint" - free children's drawing software for Windows / Mac OS X / Linux!
Download it today!  http://www.tuxpaint.org/

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Tux Paint translations not working

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 01:05:02AM +0100, Karl Ove Hufthammer wrote:
> Torsdag 01 januar 2009 skreiv Karl Ove Hufthammer:
> >I finally compiled the latest version of Tux Paint, and discovered that
> >interface was shown in English, instead of in Norwegian (my locale
> >language). I have the the .mo file installed, so what???s going on?
> 
> Installing Tux Paint in /usr/local instead of /usr solved this, but that???s 
> obviously not a good solution. Tux Paint should be able to handle being 
> installed in /usr, especially since most distros do so.

Hrm, every odd.  Have you changed how you build Tux Paint?
(I normally do "make && make install", which by default drops things in
/usr/local/, but when people package Tux Paint, they override one or more
of the PREFIX variables in Makefile to point it to /usr/)

-bill!

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Tux Paint translations not working

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 12:41:09AM +0100, Karl Ove Hufthammer wrote:
> I finally compiled the latest version of Tux Paint, and discovered that 
> interface was shown in English, instead of in Norwegian (my locale 
> language). I have the the .mo file installed, so what???s going on?

I tried it with:

  $ LANGUAGE=nn_NO.UTF-8 tuxpaint

and it seemed to work...?  I admit I normally show Tux Paint in other locales
using the "--lang ..." option, so perhaps "LANGUAGE" isn't precisely the
env. var. we need to be caring about.

Checking CHANGES.txt, I didn't notice any difference.
src/i18n.c has been changed recently, though (October 26).  I'll check the CVS
history...

-- 
-bill!
"Tux Paint" - free children's drawing software for Windows / Mac OS X / Linux!
Download it today!  http://www.tuxpaint.org/

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Tux Paint translations not working

[Karl O. H. <ka...@hu...>]

Torsdag 01 januar 2009 skreiv Karl Ove Hufthammer:
>I finally compiled the latest version of Tux Paint, and discovered that
>interface was shown in English, instead of in Norwegian (my locale
>language). I have the the .mo file installed, so what’s going on?

Installing Tux Paint in /usr/local instead of /usr solved this, but that’s 
obviously not a good solution. Tux Paint should be able to handle being 
installed in /usr, especially since most distros do so.

-- 
Karl Ove Hufthammer

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Pere P. i C. <pe...@fo...>]

El ds 20 de 12 de 2008 a les 14:19 +0100, en/na Pere Pujal i Carabantes
va escriure:


> gettext(ed) in gallery/index.php3, appearing in the po files but not
> displaying translated in the web site:
> 
> #: ../gallery/index.php3:49 ../gallery/index.php3:53
> #, php-format
> msgid "Main Gallery (page %1$s/%2$s)"
> 
> #: ../gallery/index.php3:58
> #, php-format
> msgid "Artist Gallery — %s"

> #. Show artist's info:
> #: ../gallery/index.php3:67
> #, php-format
> msgid "Artwork by %s"

This latest should be
#: ../gallery/index.php3:36
#, php-format
msgid "All Artwork by %s"
Sorry

I think I figured out why those doesn't appear translated:
some titles in gallery are composed by two of those strings, so when
trying to gettext a composed title in layout/std.php3, there is not a
translation that matches the composed title.

Does this make sense?

Pere

[Tuxpaint-i18n] Tux Paint translations not working

[Karl O. H. <ka...@hu...>]

I finally compiled the latest version of Tux Paint, and discovered that 
interface was shown in English, instead of in Norwegian (my locale 
language). I have the the .mo file installed, so what’s going on?

-- 
Karl Ove Hufthammer

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] FriBidi added to Tux Paint (was: Tux Paint Hebrew text entry)

[Karl O. H. <ka...@hu...>]

Torsdag 04 desember 2008 skreiv Bill Kendrick:
>I've dropped in some basic FriBidi support into Tux Paint.
>Can people please test to see if it's working properly (esp. folks using
>other locales)?

It uses an old method of finding the correct environment variables. See
http://www.nabble.com/Re%3A-fribidi-config-p17441756.html

I had to do the following changes to make the program compile:

Index: Makefile                                                       
===================================================================   
RCS file: /cvsroot/tuxpaint/tuxpaint/Makefile,v                       
retrieving revision 1.226                                             
diff -u -r1.226 Makefile                                              
--- Makefile    4 Dec 2008 21:43:47 -0000       1.226                 
+++ Makefile    31 Dec 2008 23:34:48 -0000                            
@@ -74,8 +74,8 @@                                                     
 PNG:=$(call linktest,-lpng,)                                         
 PNG:=$(if $(PNG),$(PNG),$(call linktest,-lpng12,))                   
                                                                      
-FRIBIDI_LIB:=$(shell fribidi-config --libs)                          
-FRIBIDI_CFLAGS:=$(shell fribidi-config --cflags)                     
+FRIBIDI_LIB:=$(shell pkg-config --libs fribidi)                      
+FRIBIDI_CFLAGS:=$(shell pkg-config --cflags fribidi)                 
                                                                      
 windows_ARCH_LINKS:=-lintl $(PNG) -lwinspool -lshlwapi $(FRIBIDI_LIB)
 osx_ARCH_LINKS:=$(PAPER_LIB) $(FRIBIDI_LIB)                          
Index: src/tuxpaint.c                                                 
===================================================================   
RCS file: /cvsroot/tuxpaint/tuxpaint/src/tuxpaint.c,v                 
retrieving revision 1.665                                             
diff -u -r1.665 tuxpaint.c                                            
--- src/tuxpaint.c      7 Dec 2008 09:03:40 -0000       1.665         
+++ src/tuxpaint.c      31 Dec 2008 23:34:51 -0000
@@ -965,7 +965,7 @@

 #if 1 /* FIXME: ifdef for platforms that lack fribidi? */
 #include <fribidi/fribidi.h>
-#if !defined(FRIBIDI_H)
+#if !defined(_FRIBIDI_H)
 #error "---------------------------------------------------"
 #error "If you installed libfribidi from a package, be sure"
 #error "to get the development package, as well!"
@@ -15498,7 +15498,7 @@

   if (texttool_len > 0)
   {
-    #ifdef FRIBIDI_H
+    #ifdef _FRIBIDI_H
       FriBidiCharType baseDir = FRIBIDI_TYPE_LTR;
       FriBidiChar *unicodeIn, *unicodeOut;
       unsigned int i;

-- 
Karl Ove Hufthammer

[Tuxpaint-i18n] Wrong language code for Zapotec language

[Karl O. H. <ka...@hu...>]

In Tux Paint there is a language with code zw_MX. However, there *is* no ISO 
639 language code zw. Also, the English name would be Zapotec, not Zapoteco.

What the correct code (and name) is, depends on which Zapotec language it 
actually is. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Zapotec_languages and
http://www.ethnologue.com/show_country.asp?name=MX

So, which language is this meant to be?

-- 
Karl Ove Hufthammer

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Pere P. i C. <pe...@fo...>]

El dl 22 de 12 de 2008 a les 14:07 -0800, en/na Bill Kendrick va
escriure:
> On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 10:08:57PM +0200, F Wolff wrote:
> > You are correct - it does add complexity. We'll have to decide if it is
> > worth it. Your example creates other problems though. The variables
> > can't be repositioned easily. Concatenated strings are often very hard
> > to translate.
> 
> Ok, you guys come up with something that's simple enough.  I'm fine with
> changing the original text to something that's easier to deal with, like:
> 
> 
> > The gallery contains X pictures. Y children contributed pictures to the
> > gallery.
> 
> Is that good?

It's good for me. There will be two ngettext calls, one for each
sentence, I don't see any problems here.


> 
> -bill!
> 

Merry Xmass to all!
Pere

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[Bill K. <nb...@so...>]

On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 10:08:57PM +0200, F Wolff wrote:
> You are correct - it does add complexity. We'll have to decide if it is
> worth it. Your example creates other problems though. The variables
> can't be repositioned easily. Concatenated strings are often very hard
> to translate.

Ok, you guys come up with something that's simple enough.  I'm fine with
changing the original text to something that's easier to deal with, like:


> The gallery contains X pictures. Y children contributed pictures to the
> gallery.

Is that good?

-bill!

Re: [Tuxpaint-i18n] Some strings not translating (website)

[F W. <fr...@tr...>]

On Ma, 2008-12-22 at 20:03 +0100, Pere Pujal i Carabantes wrote:
> 
> Aproximately something like this?:
> 
>     /*This string and the following will be concatenated*/
>     $pict_text=sprintf(ngettext('The following is a gallery of %1$d
> picture ','The following is a gallery of %1$d pictures ',$num_picts),
> $num_picts);
> 
>       /*This string and the preceding will be concatenated*/
>     $child_text=sprintf(ngettext('drawn by %1$d child around the world
> using Tux Paint:','drawn by %1$d children (and adults) around the
> world using Tux Paint:',$num_artists),$num_artists);
> 
>       /*Here you can swap the two preceding strings*/
>     echo sprintf(gettext('%1$s%2$s'), $pict_text, $child_text);
> 
> This adds a lot of complexity...

You are correct - it does add complexity. We'll have to decide if it is
worth it. Your example creates other problems though. The variables
can't be repositioned easily. Concatenated strings are often very hard
to translate.

If we want to support both variables properly, something like this might
work:


    /*This string will be substituted into the following one*/
    $pict_text=sprintf(ngettext('%1$d picture','%1$d pictures', num_picts), $num_picts);

    /*The first variable is text like '5 pictures' from the previous string*/
    echo sprintf(ngettext('The following is a gallery of %1$s drawn by %2$d child around the world
using Tux Paint:','The following is a gallery of %1$s drawn by %2$d children around the world
using Tux Paint:',$num_artists), $pict_text, $num_artists);


I'm guess this still doesn't solve it for all languages. I foresee that
the translation of "drawn" might be dependent on the number of pictures.
The easy way out is to not construct a sentence, but do something more
similar to "headings", or to use two separate sentences:

Gallery statistics:
x pictures
y children

or

The gallery contains X pictures. Y children contributed pictures to the
gallery.

If we really want to support all languages, it is a bit harder :-)

Keep well
Friedel


--
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