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Re: [sdcc-devel] FW: Fwd: RE: gpasm - MPASM include files license
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From: <Joe...@mi...> - 2010-10-18 16:19:34
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Borut, gentlepeople,
If you are interested in the XML repository, I can make that happen.
Let me get it worked out with the right people.
Best Regards,
Joe Drzewiecki
Microchip Technology, Inc.
2355 W. Chandler Blvd.
Chandler, AZ
(480) 792-7012
Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com <mailto:Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com>
P please consider the environment before printing this email
THIS E-MAIL TRANSMISSION, AND ANY DOCUMENTS, FILES OR PREVIOUS E-MAILS
ATTACHED TO IT, IS CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF
THE NAMED RECIPIENT(S). ANY DISSEMINATION, DISTRIBUTION OR DUPLICATION
OF THIS TRANSMISSION IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED.
If you believe you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the
Sender and delete the e-mail from your system.
DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY:
This transmittal and any accompanying information is for suggestion only
and is provided "AS IS". It shall not be deemed to modify Microchip's
standard warranty for its products. It is your responsibility to ensure
that this information meets your requirements.
MICROCHIP DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED STATUTORY OR
OTHERWISE, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR
PURPOSE, NON-INFRINGEMENT, QUALITY, OR CONDITION. MICROCHIP PROVIDES
THIS INFORMATION CONDITIONALLY UPON YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THESE TERMS.
To the fullest extent allowed by law, Microchip's liability shall not
exceed the amount of fee, if any, that you have paid directly to
Microchip for development of this information and associated services.
________________________________
From: Borut Razem [mailto:bor...@si...]
Sent: Sunday, October 17, 2010 9:21 AM
To: Development chatter about sdcc
Cc: Joe Drzewiecki - C11694
Subject: Re: [sdcc-devel] FW: Fwd: RE: gpasm - MPASM include files
license
Hi Joe,
your requirement: "The header files should state that they are only to
be used with authentic Microchip devices" is not GPL compatible: in
clause 6 of GPLv2 (GPLv3 is a bit more verbose, see clause 7 and 10) is
written: "You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients'
exercise of the rights granted herein".
So we decided to put all pic device description header and library
files, derived from Microchip include files into a separate non-free
directory ("free" as in "free speech," not as in "free beer"). This also
makes the life of Debian package mangers easier, since non-free files
can be easily packaged in as separate packages, in order to be in
conformity with Debian Free Software guidelines (DFSG).
We also added the --non-free sdcc command line option, which enables
sdcc to search for include and lib files under the non-free directory
(non-free/include, non-free/lib). This means that user can not use the
Microchip derived lib & include files by mistake with non-Microchip
devices. The restriction is also documented in the sdcc manual
(sddcman.lyx, sdccman.pdf and sdccman html documents).
I hope that we choose the optimal way to protect your (Microchip)
interests, interests of FOSS developers, and the interests of closed
source developers.
We are still very much interested to change our device description lib &
header files generation system to use the XML repository after the sdcc
3.0.0 release, but I still don't know how to access / get the
repository...
Best regards,
Borut
On 09/21/2010 07:02 PM, Joe...@mi... wrote:
Borut and gang,
Here's the email thread, released, to share and discuss. :-)
Thanks for being so persnickety!
Now you are all named.
Let me know what you decide.
Best Regards,
Joe Drzewiecki
Microchip Technology, Inc.
2355 W. Chandler Blvd.
Chandler, AZ
(480) 792-7012
Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com <mailto:Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com>
P please consider the environment before printing this email
THIS E-MAIL TRANSMISSION, AND ANY DOCUMENTS, FILES OR PREVIOUS E-MAILS
ATTACHED TO IT, IS CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF
THE NAMED RECIPIENT(S). ANY DISSEMINATION, DISTRIBUTION OR DUPLICATION
OF THIS TRANSMISSION IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED.
If you believe you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the
Sender and delete the e-mail from your system.
DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY:
This transmittal and any accompanying information is for suggestion only
and is provided "AS IS". It shall not be deemed to modify Microchip's
standard warranty for its products. It is your responsibility to ensure
that this information meets your requirements.
MICROCHIP DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED STATUTORY OR
OTHERWISE, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR
PURPOSE, NON-INFRINGEMENT, QUALITY, OR CONDITION. MICROCHIP PROVIDES
THIS INFORMATION CONDITIONALLY UPON YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THESE TERMS.
To the fullest extent allowed by law, Microchip's liability shall not
exceed the amount of fee, if any, that you have paid directly to
Microchip for development of this information and associated services.
________________________________
From: Borut Razem [mailto:bor...@si...]
Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 11:25 PM
To: Joe Drzewiecki - C11694
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: gpasm - MPASM include files license
Hi Joe,
thanks for the response.
See my comments below.
I'm also asking you for the permission to share your mails with other
sdcc developers, specially to discuss the request about exclusive use
with authentic Microchip devices.
The attached statement at the end of your mail (... "IS CONFIDENTIAL
INFORMATION INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF THE NAMED RECIPIENT(S)")
explicitly prevents it.
You can also CC your mails directly to the sdcc development mailinig
list sdc...@li... or join the mailing list at
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sdcc-devel.
Best regards,
Borut
On 09/21/2010 01:21 AM, Joe...@mi... wrote:
Borut,
I would like to provide you with our XML repository, which contains all
of the information you need to construct the header/linker files.
Using the header files (an intermediate representation) to generate your
files is too prone for error for my liking.
We will update the XML repository regularly so that you will always have
the best data that we have.
If you start from the XML repository, as Microchip desires, I would be
glad to provide it.
Yes, I'm definitely interested on XML repository. Is it available from
the web? If not, please provide it to me. But this is out of scope for
the sdcc 3.0.0 release...
For the files you generate, I have one request:
The header files should state that they are only to be used with
authentic Microchip devices
This is the hard one: I don't know if the requies is in spirit and
compatible with GPL. I'm affraid it is not, but I have to check...
If you want to issue them under the GPL+LE license, I have no objection.
I your request is compatible with GPL, we can add an additional
exception, stating that "the file can be used only with authentic
Microchip devices".
I would like you to offer the latest XML repository for use without the
restrictions of the GPL+LE license - basically free for any use that
involves authentic Microchip devices.
Best Regards,
Joe Drzewiecki
Microchip Technology, Inc.
2355 W. Chandler Blvd.
Chandler, AZ
(480) 792-7012
Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com <mailto:Joe.Drzewiecki@Microchip.com>
P please consider the environment before printing this email
THIS E-MAIL TRANSMISSION, AND ANY DOCUMENTS, FILES OR PREVIOUS E-MAILS
ATTACHED TO IT, IS CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF
THE NAMED RECIPIENT(S). ANY DISSEMINATION, DISTRIBUTION OR DUPLICATION
OF THIS TRANSMISSION IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED.
If you believe you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the
Sender and delete the e-mail from your system.
DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY:
This transmittal and any accompanying information is for suggestion only
and is provided "AS IS". It shall not be deemed to modify Microchip's
standard warranty for its products. It is your responsibility to ensure
that this information meets your requirements.
MICROCHIP DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED STATUTORY OR
OTHERWISE, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR
PURPOSE, NON-INFRINGEMENT, QUALITY, OR CONDITION. MICROCHIP PROVIDES
THIS INFORMATION CONDITIONALLY UPON YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THESE TERMS.
To the fullest extent allowed by law, Microchip's liability shall not
exceed the amount of fee, if any, that you have paid directly to
Microchip for development of this information and associated services.
________________________________
From: Borut Razem [mailto:bor...@si...]
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 12:33 AM
To: Joe Drzewiecki - C11694
Cc: John O Battle
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: gpasm - MPASM include files license
Hello Joe,
thanks for your willingness to collaborate.
SDCC uses MPLAB include files indirectly: we have inc2h.pl,
inc2h-pic16.pl and pic18fam-h-gen.pl perl scripts (see
http://sdcc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/sdcc/trunk/sdcc/support/scripts/)
which generate C source and header files, distributed as a part of SDCC
library.
(see
http://sdcc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/sdcc/trunk/sdcc/device/include/pi
c/
http://sdcc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/sdcc/trunk/sdcc/device/lib/pic/li
bdev/
http://sdcc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/sdcc/trunk/sdcc/device/include/pi
c16/
http://sdcc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/sdcc/trunk/sdcc/device/lib/pic16/
libdev/)
We decided to release the SDCC library under an open source license,
which allows to use it in proprietary (non open source) projects in the
next SDCC release. Currently the library files are released mainly under
GPL or LGPL. We chose the GPL+LE license (see
https://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/sdcc/wiki/Library%20License%20Selectio
n).
You can see the current sdcc library license change status at
https://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/sdcc/wiki/Files%20and%20Licenses
We would like to release the pic device library files under the GPL+LE
license too, but we think we can't do it without your permission, since
they are generated from MPLAB include files (which doesn't contain any
info about licensing conditions). The license will be applied only on
the generated sdcc library files. The original MPLAB include files
licensing will not be affected.
So I'm kindly asking you for permission to release pic device files,
generated from MPLAB include files and included in sdcc library, under
the GLP+LE license by adding the GPL+LE comment to them (see
https://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/sdcc/wiki/SDCC%20library%20source%20fi
le%20license%20header).
If you don't agree with the GPL+LE license or you have additional
questions / propositions / requirements / concerns / anything, please
don't hesitate to contact me or the sdcc developers mailing list at
sdc...@li....
Sincerely Yours,
Borut
On 07/29/2010 07:29 PM, John O Battle wrote:
- -------- Original Message --------
Subject: RE: gpasm - MPASM include files license
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2010 09:12:52 -0700
From: <Joe...@mi...>
<mailto:Joe...@mi...>
To: <job...@ca...> <mailto:job...@ca...> ,
<Don...@mi...> <mailto:Don...@mi...> ,
<Vincent.Sheard@Microchip.com> <mailto:Vincent.Sheard@Microchip.com>
John,
We're going one better.
We're setting up a web site where the entire device database is
presented in XML (among other things).
We can post the header and include files as well at the time of release
of every compiler or MPASM. It will take a little doing, but hell, you
can't use them with any other device - why should we care about letting
GPASM and SDCC use them?
The only thing is going to be a question of synchronization. The release
schedule is pretty haphazard right now. The SDCC and GPASM guys are
going to have to keep an eagle eye out and when we update them on the
open-source web site, they'll have to snarf them. Is that fair enough?
Joe
P.S., BTW, I am the guy Borut wants to talk to. Feel free to give him my
name and email address. We'd like to forge (:) a closer alliance with
those guys.
- -----Original Message-----
From: John O Battle [mailto:job...@ca...]
Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 8:14 AM
To: Donna Mason - C08830; Joe Drzewiecki - C11694; Vincent Sheard -
C10252
Subject: Fwd: gpasm - MPASM include files license
Donna
Any way we (Microchip) can help/cooperate with this effort? I think
working with these guys would be good PR for microchip and would make
some friends in the process.
John
- -------- Original Message --------
Subject: gpasm - MPASM include files license
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 21:33:56 +0200
From: Borut Razem <bor...@si...> <mailto:bor...@si...>
Reply-To: <gn...@li...> <mailto:gn...@li...>
To: gnupic <gn...@li...> <mailto:gn...@li...>
CC: Sdcc-Devel <sdc...@li...>
<mailto:sdc...@li...>
Hi,
I wold like to know what is the status of using / distributing Microchip
MPASM include files with gpasm:
- - is there any "official" statement from Microchip that the include
files can be used with gpasm?
- - has anybody contact the Microchip to clarify this issue?
- - does anybody know a contact person or address at Microchip where I
can
send an e-mail to get answers about the matter?
I'm asking this because there is no copyright notice (Microchip is
mentioned, but not explicitly as a copyright holder) nor any licensing
terms in include files.
Sdcc project is using MPASM include files to produce device specific
headers and c source files which are part of sdcc run-time libraries.
One of goals for the upcoming sdcc 3.0 release is to release the sdcc
library under the GPL+LE (see
http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/sdcc/wiki/Library%20License%20Selection
),
so that it can be used with closed source (proprietary) software. Part
of this task is also clarification of licensing status of MPASM include
files.
Best regards,
Borut
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