From: Tim A. <tna...@sh...> - 2008-05-28 02:53:58
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> I agree with Chad that it would be better to go with the term "annotation" for what we are trying to accomplish with this module. People are use to the concept of annotating images, especially if they work with any type of image/document storage and retrieval on an professional basis.<br> <br> With the context of Gallery "tagging" has a whole different context. i.e. tag clouds, tags on an image, etc. So for the purpose of Paul's project, I would suggest that we tag images and annotate portions of an image. There is no reason that under the covers, the concept of tags is consistent and annotation text could appear in tag clouds and other tag related searches.<br> <br> The other question we need to consider is does this module depend on the tag module or can it function independently. At this point we don't have a good plug-in dependency checking, so this module needs to be able to leverage the tag module if it is enabled, but should be able to function if the tag module is not installed or enabled.<br> <br> Just my opinion<br> Tim<br> <br> Donald Webster wrote: <blockquote cite="mid:3b5...@ma..." type="cite"> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">I've been referring to this type of feature as "image area annotation." I think "note" or "annotation" is appropriate and referring to this feature as "tags" or "tagging" should be avoided. - Chad (aka thumb) </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""><!----> This is actually the only thing I really disagree with. I feel pretty strongly that this should be part of the tags module, because it is very logically the same. At least, it is in my imagined use case. What I imagine is this: Right now, I am tagging people and animals in my gallery. You can hit a tag in the cloud and see obviously all the pictures with person X in them, but unless you know what they look like or are smart enough to see the common trend in the pictures (or there is a photo with just one person), you don't know exactly which one it is. So I would like to see "tags" bound with these "notes" on the photo. For example, if I "tag" an image with someone in it, that tag should also be associated with the box I draw around them. But then... I see the other side. What if you are using this in another manner. Perhaps you draw a box around a child's birthday cake and write something about the cake. Something 2 or 4 sentences long. You wouldn't want *that* to show up as a "tag" in the tag cloud. So is it possible to perhaps have this module allow two types of "note"? One would be a "tag" and be integrated with the tag module (if it is installed) and perhaps be used with the idea of showing specific people, places or things. The other would be a "note" which is meant to be used in a more general sense, anywhere and for anything and doesn't interact with tag module at all? </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">On May 27, 2008, at 1:53 PM, Paul Hinze wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">--------------- 1. Introduction --------------- So Day 1 of GSoC programming was yesterday (even though it was Memorial Day in the states...odd), and talmdal suggested what I should do first: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">[2:27pm] gallery-bot: (7934) From talmdal (Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00:00) -- thanks for completing that task. Now what you might want to do is create a more detailed "design doc" for your SoC task :-) basically, what you want to accomplish and what needs to be changed, and screen layouts and such [2:27pm] gallery-bot: (7935) From talmdal (Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00:00) -- (cont) as bharat suggested, it would be good to include some HTML mockups of what the interface would look like. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">As I've only really had one day to work, I don't have all that much yet, but seeing as there is a meeting in a few minutes I wanted to share at least my first thoughts with the group. Let's start with a study of the two elephants in the room: Facebook and Flickr, and examine their respective tagging UIs. ------------------------ 2. Facebook's Tagging UI ------------------------ </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://phinze.com/share/facebook_photo.jpg">http://phinze.com/share/facebook_photo.jpg</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">Facebook presents a very clean interface when viewing photos, the tagging feature is marked with a red ellipse. </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://phinze.com/share/facebook_photo_tagging.jpg">http://phinze.com/share/facebook_photo_tagging.jpg</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">When tagging a photo, it's helpful to note several things: - The tagging area is fixed size. - By default Facebook provides you with your list of friends, making the tagging system catered towards the tagging of people. - After tagging something, the tag does not show up anywhere on the image unless moused over, rather it is listed below the photo. - If you have tagged a friend, you can easily view photos with that friend in them (i.e. view all photos with a given tag). With regards to terminology, Facebook calls its feature simply "Tags". ---------------------- 3. Flickr's Tagging UI ---------------------- </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://phinze.com/share/flickr_photo.jpg">http://phinze.com/share/flickr_photo.jpg</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">What I am calling "Region-based Image Tagging", Flickr calls "Notes", which a user adds by clicking the small "Add Notes" button indicated here. </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://phinze.com/share/flickr_photo_tagging.jpg">http://phinze.com/share/flickr_photo_tagging.jpg</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">Flickr's note interface has the following important details: - Variable size tagging area. - Longer, free-form textarea for note content. - Notes are searchable in full text form. - Created notes are visible as boxes over an image unless they are hidden by the user. Flickr's terminology maintains a completely separate concept of "Tags" that is independent from "Notes". Tags in Flickr function very similarly to the current Gallery2 Tags module, but they do not interact with the Notes feature. Also it is worth mentioning that Flickr's Notes feature encourages users other than the creator to leave notes on a photo. ------------------------------ 4. Fotonotes Mockup in Gallery ------------------------------ </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://phinze.com/sandbox/fotonotes.html">http://phinze.com/sandbox/fotonotes.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">This is a very very basic example of incorporating the Fotonotes library into gallery. Flickr's Notes feature is "based on" Fotonotes, so the similarities will be clear. I basically extracted static HTML from a gallery photo page and edited it to include the Fotonotes javascript--in other words, this is really nothing at all. Fotonotes will store tags you insert by default in the associated JPEG file's header data using its own XML-based standard. I've changed the permissions on the file in the mock-up so tags should work properly. PLEASE NOTE: This in no way represents my vision for the final UI of gallery's tagging system. I am merely submitting it as a conversation starter. In this next week I hope to be able to more accurately plan and design a Gallery2-specific UI that combines the best of these three options. ------------- 5. Conclusion ------------- Facebook has some interesting things going for it, and so does Flickr. Fotonotes provides one example UI for image tagging. I am also evaluating a YUI component for selecting a region of an image that may serve us better. Like I say, not much to show yet, but it's a start! Regards, Paul ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008. <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/">http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/</a> __[ g a l l e r y - d e v e l ]_________________________ [ list info/archive --> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gallery.sf.net/lists.php">http://gallery.sf.net/lists.php</a> ] [ gallery info/FAQ/download --> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gallery.sf.net">http://gallery.sf.net</a> ] </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008. <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/">http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/</a> __[ g a l l e r y - d e v e l ]_________________________ [ list info/archive --> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gallery.sf.net/lists.php">http://gallery.sf.net/lists.php</a> ] [ gallery info/FAQ/download --> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gallery.sf.net">http://gallery.sf.net</a> ] </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""><!----> </pre> <pre wrap=""> <hr size="4" width="90%"> No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 8.0.100 / Virus Database: 269.24.1/1469 - Release Date: 5/27/2008 1:25 PM </pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> |