springframework-developer

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Thomas R. <tri...@tr...>]

I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.  

It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with the 0.8
release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to the
new demo app that we are developing.  

It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and a more
advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the web-tier,
infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app should
be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or maybe
MySQL.  

For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB and
maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and a more
robust database with transaction support.

Thomas Risberg

> Hello,
> Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring list. In
> this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> demo/tutorial.
> 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are making
> all the sense of the framework
> 
> Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on the
> first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to provide
> both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts and a more
> advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily start with
> the framework and users interested by the more interesting topics will
> normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
>  
> I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I recognize
> that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat. Nevertheless Rod's
> book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> 
> 
> In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have another
> question: having two applications working with the initial i21 from the
> book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> framework? What is the best way today to found what have changed? Have
> we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess from here?
> It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved in the
> development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> 
> Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> 
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : spr...@li...
> [mailto:spr...@li...] De la
> part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003 13:29 À :
> spr...@li...
> Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> 
> How about this for a slogan :
> 
> J2EE made easy
> 
> Isabelle
> 
> -- 
> Isabelle Muszynski
> Software Engineer
> Zandweellaan 4
> 2660 Antwerpen
> Belgium
> Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> Email: isa...@me...
> Website: www.meta-logix.com
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 

-- 
Thomas Risberg
tri...@tr...

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Thomas R. <tri...@tr...>]

Rod,

Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives on though in
the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.

This is from their web site

*----------------------------------------------------------------
 What is HSQLDB?

    * It is an Open Source Java Database
    * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
    * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
    * It is compact
    * It is very fast
    * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
    * It can be used also in Applets

More Features:

    * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
    * Transactions are supported
    * Joins between tables are possible
    * Referential Integrity
    * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
    * Database can create SQL scripts
    * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
    * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2

HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in applets, for
testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes. 
*----------------------------------------------------------------

I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
version of HSQLDB it in their install.

The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, Postgres and
Oracle as well.

Thomas


> What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's potentially
> zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
Transactionality is a
> must.
> 
> Rod
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Isabelle Muszynski" <isa...@me...>
> To: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> Cc: <spr...@li...>
> Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 5:40 PM
> Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> 
> 
> > Hi Thomas,
> >
> > MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type that
> supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree, but
who'd
> want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot of
> resources.
> >
> > Isabelle
> >
> > On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> > > I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.
> > >
> > > It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with
the 0.8
> > > release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to the
> > > new demo app that we are developing.
> > >
> > > It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and
a more
> > > advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the web-tier,
> > > infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app
should
> > > be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or maybe
> > > MySQL.
> > >
> > > For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB and
> > > maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and
a more
> > > robust database with transaction support.
> > >
> > > Thomas Risberg
> > >
> > > > Hello,
> > > > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring
list. In
> > > > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > > > demo/tutorial.
> > > > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > > > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are
making
> > > > all the sense of the framework
> > > >
> > > > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on the
> > > > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to
provide
> > > > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts and a
> more
> > > > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily
start with
> > > > the framework and users interested by the more interesting
topics will
> > > > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> > > >
> > > > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I recognize
> > > > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat. Nevertheless
> Rod's
> > > > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have another
> > > > question: having two applications working with the initial i21 from
> the
> > > > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> > > > framework? What is the best way today to found what have
changed? Have
> > > > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess from
> here?
> > > > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved in
> the
> > > > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > > >
> > > > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > > >
> > > > -----Message d'origine-----
> > > > De : spr...@li...
> > > > [mailto:spr...@li...] De la
> > > > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003 13:29 � :
> > > > spr...@li...
> > > > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > > >
> > > > How about this for a slogan :
> > > >
> > > > J2EE made easy
> > > >
> > > > Isabelle
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > Software Engineer
> > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > Belgium
> > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > Spr...@li...
> > > >
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > Spr...@li...
> > > >
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Thomas Risberg
> > > tri...@tr...
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Isabelle Muszynski
> > Software Engineer
> > Zandweellaan 4
> > 2660 Antwerpen
> > Belgium
> > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > Email: isa...@me...
> > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 

-- 
Thomas Risberg
tri...@tr...

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Rod J. <rod...@in...>]

+1 for HSQL. I've been evaluating Kodo JDO at work, and their demo works
very well with HSQL. No need to set it up: it just works. Very important for
a demo.

Rod

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
To: <spr...@li...>
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 6:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos


> Rod,
>
> Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives on though in
> the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.
>
> This is from their web site
>
> *----------------------------------------------------------------
>  What is HSQLDB?
>
>     * It is an Open Source Java Database
>     * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
>     * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
>     * It is compact
>     * It is very fast
>     * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
>     * It can be used also in Applets
>
> More Features:
>
>     * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
>     * Transactions are supported
>     * Joins between tables are possible
>     * Referential Integrity
>     * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
>     * Database can create SQL scripts
>     * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
>     * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2
>
> HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
> very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in applets, for
> testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes.
> *----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
> that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
> version of HSQLDB it in their install.
>
> The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
> target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, Postgres and
> Oracle as well.
>
> Thomas
>
>
> > What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's
potentially
> > zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
> Transactionality is a
> > must.
> >
> > Rod
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Isabelle Muszynski" <isa...@me...>
> > To: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> > Cc: <spr...@li...>
> > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 5:40 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> >
> >
> > > Hi Thomas,
> > >
> > > MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type
that
> > supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree, but
> who'd
> > want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot of
> > resources.
> > >
> > > Isabelle
> > >
> > > On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> > > > I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.
> > > >
> > > > It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with
> the 0.8
> > > > release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to
the
> > > > new demo app that we are developing.
> > > >
> > > > It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and
> a more
> > > > advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the
web-tier,
> > > > infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app
> should
> > > > be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or
maybe
> > > > MySQL.
> > > >
> > > > For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB
and
> > > > maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and
> a more
> > > > robust database with transaction support.
> > > >
> > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > >
> > > > > Hello,
> > > > > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring
> list. In
> > > > > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > > > > demo/tutorial.
> > > > > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > > > > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are
> making
> > > > > all the sense of the framework
> > > > >
> > > > > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on
the
> > > > > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to
> provide
> > > > > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts and a
> > more
> > > > > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily
> start with
> > > > > the framework and users interested by the more interesting
> topics will
> > > > > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I
recognize
> > > > > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat. Nevertheless
> > Rod's
> > > > > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have another
> > > > > question: having two applications working with the initial i21
from
> > the
> > > > > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> > > > > framework? What is the best way today to found what have
> changed? Have
> > > > > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess from
> > here?
> > > > > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved
in
> > the
> > > > > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > > > >
> > > > > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Message d'origine-----
> > > > > De : spr...@li...
> > > > > [mailto:spr...@li...] De
la
> > > > > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003 13:29 �
:
> > > > > spr...@li...
> > > > > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > > > >
> > > > > How about this for a slogan :
> > > > >
> > > > > J2EE made easy
> > > > >
> > > > > Isabelle
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > > Software Engineer
> > > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > > Belgium
> > > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > > tri...@tr...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > Spr...@li...
> > > >
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > Software Engineer
> > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > Belgium
> > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> >
> >
>
> --
> Thomas Risberg
> tri...@tr...
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[William G. T. Jr. <wg...@rc...>]

+1 for HSQL.  I've used with Japple open source project for demo 
applications.  The uPortal project also uses it for their "quick-start" 
download.  It just works.

later.
Bill


Rod Johnson wrote:
> +1 for HSQL. I've been evaluating Kodo JDO at work, and their demo works
> very well with HSQL. No need to set it up: it just works. Very important for
> a demo.
> 
> Rod
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> To: <spr...@li...>
> Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 6:46 PM
> Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> 
> 
> 
>>Rod,
>>
>>Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives on though in
>>the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.
>>
>>This is from their web site
>>
>>*----------------------------------------------------------------
>> What is HSQLDB?
>>
>>    * It is an Open Source Java Database
>>    * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
>>    * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
>>    * It is compact
>>    * It is very fast
>>    * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
>>    * It can be used also in Applets
>>
>>More Features:
>>
>>    * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
>>    * Transactions are supported
>>    * Joins between tables are possible
>>    * Referential Integrity
>>    * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
>>    * Database can create SQL scripts
>>    * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
>>    * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2
>>
>>HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
>>very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in applets, for
>>testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes.
>>*----------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
>>that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
>>version of HSQLDB it in their install.
>>
>>The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
>>target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, Postgres and
>>Oracle as well.
>>
>>Thomas
>>
>>
>>
>>>What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's
> 
> potentially
> 
>>>zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
>>
>>Transactionality is a
>>
>>>must.
>>>
>>>Rod

RE: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Martin J. W. <ma...@do...>]

Hi Guys,

Sorry to jump in here. But as a potential user of Spring I would say I'd
like to see demos for Tomcat and MySQL. Just about everybody has this
installed (especially MySQL). We also use Resin; but I'm not too worried
about a demo for this, if Tomcat is supplied I'll write up a tutorial
for Resin for the project (we don't actually run Tomcat, but since we've
seen so many demos we can read and translate Tomcat examples for just
about any server). Jboss is my second choice as it's our preferred
app-server platform.

Btw: we have another project entering prototyping in the next week. Do
you think Spring is ready to be deployed in an early form? We would only
be using it as a frontend technology to interface to an existing model.

Regards,
Marty


> -----Original Message-----
> From: spr...@li... 
> [mailto:spr...@li...]
>  On Behalf Of William G. Thompson, Jr.
> Sent: Sunday, 27 April 2003 6:24 AM
> To: Rod Johnson
> Cc: Thomas Risberg; spr...@li...
> Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> 
> 
> +1 for HSQL.  I've used with Japple open source project for demo 
> applications.  The uPortal project also uses it for their 
> "quick-start" 
> download.  It just works.
> 
> later.
> Bill
> 
> 
> Rod Johnson wrote:
> > +1 for HSQL. I've been evaluating Kodo JDO at work, and 
> their demo works
> > very well with HSQL. No need to set it up: it just works. 
> Very important for
> > a demo.
> > 
> > Rod
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> > To: <spr...@li...>
> > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 6:46 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >>Rod,
> >>
> >>Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives 
> on though in
> >>the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.
> >>
> >>This is from their web site
> >>
> >>*----------------------------------------------------------------
> >> What is HSQLDB?
> >>
> >>    * It is an Open Source Java Database
> >>    * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
> >>    * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
> >>    * It is compact
> >>    * It is very fast
> >>    * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
> >>    * It can be used also in Applets
> >>
> >>More Features:
> >>
> >>    * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
> >>    * Transactions are supported
> >>    * Joins between tables are possible
> >>    * Referential Integrity
> >>    * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
> >>    * Database can create SQL scripts
> >>    * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
> >>    * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2
> >>
> >>HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
> >>very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in 
> applets, for
> >>testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes.
> >>*----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
> >>that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
> >>version of HSQLDB it in their install.
> >>
> >>The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
> >>target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, 
> Postgres and
> >>Oracle as well.
> >>
> >>Thomas
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's
> > 
> > potentially
> > 
> >>>zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
> >>
> >>Transactionality is a
> >>
> >>>must.
> >>>
> >>>Rod
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Thomas R. <tri...@tr...>]

What do you think of Kodo?  I have been meaning to try it out as well,
but so far I have not had time to play with it.

Thomas

> +1 for HSQL. I've been evaluating Kodo JDO at work, and their demo works
> very well with HSQL. No need to set it up: it just works. Very
important for
> a demo.
> 
> Rod
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> To: <spr...@li...>
> Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 6:46 PM
> Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> 
> 
> > Rod,
> >
> > Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives on though in
> > the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.
> >
> > This is from their web site
> >
> > *----------------------------------------------------------------
> >  What is HSQLDB?
> >
> >     * It is an Open Source Java Database
> >     * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
> >     * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
> >     * It is compact
> >     * It is very fast
> >     * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
> >     * It can be used also in Applets
> >
> > More Features:
> >
> >     * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
> >     * Transactions are supported
> >     * Joins between tables are possible
> >     * Referential Integrity
> >     * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
> >     * Database can create SQL scripts
> >     * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
> >     * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2
> >
> > HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
> > very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in applets, for
> > testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes.
> > *----------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
> > that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
> > version of HSQLDB it in their install.
> >
> > The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
> > target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, Postgres and
> > Oracle as well.
> >
> > Thomas
> >
> >
> > > What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's
> potentially
> > > zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
> > Transactionality is a
> > > must.
> > >
> > > Rod
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Isabelle Muszynski" <isa...@me...>
> > > To: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> > > Cc: <spr...@li...>
> > > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 5:40 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi Thomas,
> > > >
> > > > MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type
> that
> > > supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree, but
> > who'd
> > > want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot of
> > > resources.
> > > >
> > > > Isabelle
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> > > > > I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.
> > > > >
> > > > > It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with
> > the 0.8
> > > > > release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to
> the
> > > > > new demo app that we are developing.
> > > > >
> > > > > It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and
> > a more
> > > > > advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the
> web-tier,
> > > > > infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app
> > should
> > > > > be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or
> maybe
> > > > > MySQL.
> > > > >
> > > > > For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB
> and
> > > > > maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and
> > a more
> > > > > robust database with transaction support.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hello,
> > > > > > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring
> > list. In
> > > > > > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > > > > > demo/tutorial.
> > > > > > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > > > > > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are
> > making
> > > > > > all the sense of the framework
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on
> the
> > > > > > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to
> > provide
> > > > > > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts
and a
> > > more
> > > > > > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily
> > start with
> > > > > > the framework and users interested by the more interesting
> > topics will
> > > > > > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I
> recognize
> > > > > > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat.
Nevertheless
> > > Rod's
> > > > > > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have
another
> > > > > > question: having two applications working with the initial i21
> from
> > > the
> > > > > > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> > > > > > framework? What is the best way today to found what have
> > changed? Have
> > > > > > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess
from
> > > here?
> > > > > > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved
> in
> > > the
> > > > > > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Message d'origine-----
> > > > > > De : spr...@li...
> > > > > >
[mailto:spr...@li...] De
> la
> > > > > > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003
13:29 Ã?
> :
> > > > > > spr...@li...
> > > > > > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > > > > >
> > > > > > How about this for a slogan :
> > > > > >
> > > > > > J2EE made easy
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Isabelle
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > > > Software Engineer
> > > > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > > > Belgium
> > > > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > > >
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > > >
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > > > tri...@tr...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > Software Engineer
> > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > Belgium
> > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > Spr...@li...
> > > >
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Thomas Risberg
> > tri...@tr...
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Thomas Risberg
tri...@tr...

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Rod J. <rod...@in...>]

I'm impressed with Kodo. I actually made some changes to JdbcTemplate (new
ResultSetExtracter interface) to allow it to work with custom SQL queries in
Kodo. These will be useful elsewhere, though.

Rod

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
To: "Rod Johnson" <rod...@in...>; "Thomas Risberg"
<tri...@tr...>; <spr...@li...>
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos


> What do you think of Kodo?  I have been meaning to try it out as well,
> but so far I have not had time to play with it.
>
> Thomas
>
> > +1 for HSQL. I've been evaluating Kodo JDO at work, and their demo works
> > very well with HSQL. No need to set it up: it just works. Very
> important for
> > a demo.
> >
> > Rod
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> > To: <spr...@li...>
> > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 6:46 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> >
> >
> > > Rod,
> > >
> > > Hypersonic is no longer in development - the source lives on though in
> > > the HSQL Database Engine (HSQLDB) Project.
> > >
> > > This is from their web site
> > >
> > > *----------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  What is HSQLDB?
> > >
> > >     * It is an Open Source Java Database
> > >     * It has standard SQL syntax and a JDBC interface
> > >     * HSQLDB is FREE to use and re-distribute
> > >     * It is compact
> > >     * It is very fast
> > >     * In-Memory, Standalone and Client/Server modes
> > >     * It can be used also in Applets
> > >
> > > More Features:
> > >
> > >     * Indexes can be built and are used automatically
> > >     * Transactions are supported
> > >     * Joins between tables are possible
> > >     * Referential Integrity
> > >     * Java Stored Procedures and Functions are supported
> > >     * Database can create SQL scripts
> > >     * Security mechanism using users, passwords, access rights
> > >     * Can be compiled for Java 1.1 and Java 2
> > >
> > > HSQLDB, based on HypersonicSQL, is a general purpose database. It is
> > > very small and easy to install and use. It can be used in applets, for
> > > testing, as a distributed application, and for production purposes.
> > > *----------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > I have used it a little bit, and I think it has most of the features
> > > that we would require.  I think JBoss is still including some older
> > > version of HSQLDB it in their install.
> > >
> > > The more I think about it, I think that this should be the default
> > > target db.  Hopefully we can provide sample code for MySQL, Postgres
and
> > > Oracle as well.
> > >
> > > Thomas
> > >
> > >
> > > > What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's
> > potentially
> > > > zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities.
> > > Transactionality is a
> > > > must.
> > > >
> > > > Rod
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Isabelle Muszynski" <isa...@me...>
> > > > To: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
> > > > Cc: <spr...@li...>
> > > > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 5:40 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Hi Thomas,
> > > > >
> > > > > MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type
> > that
> > > > supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree,
but
> > > who'd
> > > > want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot
of
> > > > resources.
> > > > >
> > > > > Isabelle
> > > > >
> > > > > On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> > > > > > I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with
> > > the 0.8
> > > > > > release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition
to
> > the
> > > > > > new demo app that we are developing.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app
and
> > > a more
> > > > > > advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the
> > web-tier,
> > > > > > infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app
> > > should
> > > > > > be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or
> > maybe
> > > > > > MySQL.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions,
EJB
> > and
> > > > > > maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss
and
> > > a more
> > > > > > robust database with transaction support.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hello,
> > > > > > > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring
> > > list. In
> > > > > > > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > > > > > > demo/tutorial.
> > > > > > > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > > > > > > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that
are
> > > making
> > > > > > > all the sense of the framework
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated
on
> > the
> > > > > > > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to
> > > provide
> > > > > > > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts
> and a
> > > > more
> > > > > > > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily
> > > start with
> > > > > > > the framework and users interested by the more interesting
> > > topics will
> > > > > > > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I
> > recognize
> > > > > > > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat.
> Nevertheless
> > > > Rod's
> > > > > > > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have
> another
> > > > > > > question: having two applications working with the initial i21
> > from
> > > > the
> > > > > > > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the
Spring
> > > > > > > framework? What is the best way today to found what have
> > > changed? Have
> > > > > > > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess
> from
> > > > here?
> > > > > > > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply
involved
> > in
> > > > the
> > > > > > > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -----Message d'origine-----
> > > > > > > De : spr...@li...
> > > > > > >
> [mailto:spr...@li...] De
> > la
> > > > > > > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003
> 13:29 Ã?
> > :
> > > > > > > spr...@li...
> > > > > > > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > How about this for a slogan :
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > J2EE made easy
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Isabelle
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > > > > Software Engineer
> > > > > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > > > > Belgium
> > > > > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > > > >
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > > > >
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Thomas Risberg
> > > > > > tri...@tr...
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > > >
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > > > Software Engineer
> > > > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > > > Belgium
> > > > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > > Spr...@li...
> > > > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > > Spr...@li...
> > > >
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Thomas Risberg
> > > tri...@tr...
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Thomas Risberg
> tri...@tr...
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[<jue...@we...>]

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[Springframework-developer] Demo/tutorial content

[Ken K. <kk...@kk...>]

To Juergen,

Thanks for your offer of input to the demo apps. I especially look forward to your code reviews. Feel free to slash away unmercifully as I hope to learn a lot while doing this. I will save my ego-tripping temper tantrums for when I am on the golf course  :-) .



To all,

There certainly was a lot of activity this weekend regarding the server/database platform selection. I had also hoped to get some input on the content and form of the demo/tutorials but people seem to be more interested in the platform selection at least for now. Hopefully we can settle on the platforms soon and move on.

I anticipate that eventually we will settle on at least 2 major flavors of the Petclinic demo/tutorial each consisting of several discrete stages and possibly side trails. The first will probably be a simple webapp without transactions or EJB's that does not require a full J2EE application server. The first stage of this will probably have very limited functionality and probably have approx. 5-8 display pages, a few of which are forms.

I am very interested in getting input from developers as to what features and advantages of using Spring they think need to be emphasized and in what flavors/stages they should be included.

I will very soon be posting some content suggestions for the first stage of the first flavor of the Petclinic. Please feel free to make your own comments and/or suggestions on this.


Regards,
Ken 

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demo/tutorial content

[Isabelle M. <isa...@me...>]

Hi Ken,

It seems to me that 2 major groups of developeres will be using Spring. One of these would use only the persistence framework, together with an external MVC framework such as Struts. The other would use the Spring MVC framework as well (i.e. the whole enchilada).
So for the 1st stage I see some very simple pages which allow the user to enter base data (register a pet with the clinic, manage the vets, ...). This stage uses a simple servlet and / or JSP.
Then the second stage incorporates the Web framework, and has for ex. sick pets visiting the vet.

I am currently working on charting Spring in UML. Ideally there should be a parallel between your work and mine. You show the code, I show the framework innards.

Isabelle

On Wed, Apr 30, 2003 at 06:20:27PM -0500, Ken Krebs wrote:
> To Juergen,
> 
> Thanks for your offer of input to the demo apps. I especially look forward 
> to your code reviews. Feel free to slash away unmercifully as I hope to 
> learn a lot while doing this. I will save my ego-tripping temper tantrums 
> for when I am on the golf course  :-) .
> 
> 
> 
> To all,
> 
> There certainly was a lot of activity this weekend regarding the 
> server/database platform selection. I had also hoped to get some input on 
> the content and form of the demo/tutorials but people seem to be more 
> interested in the platform selection at least for now. Hopefully we can 
> settle on the platforms soon and move on.
> 
> I anticipate that eventually we will settle on at least 2 major flavors of 
> the Petclinic demo/tutorial each consisting of several discrete stages and 
> possibly side trails. The first will probably be a simple webapp without 
> transactions or EJB's that does not require a full J2EE application server. 
> The first stage of this will probably have very limited functionality and 
> probably have approx. 5-8 display pages, a few of which are forms.
> 
> I am very interested in getting input from developers as to what features 
> and advantages of using Spring they think need to be emphasized and in what 
> flavors/stages they should be included.
> 
> I will very soon be posting some content suggestions for the first stage of 
> the first flavor of the Petclinic. Please feel free to make your own 
> comments and/or suggestions on this.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Ken 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 

-- 
Isabelle Muszynski
Software Engineer
Zandweellaan 4
2660 Antwerpen
Belgium
Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
Email: isa...@me...
Website: www.meta-logix.com

[Springframework-developer] Demo/tutorial content

[Ken K. <kk...@kk...>]

Isabelle Muszynski wrote:

>Hi Ken,
>
>It seems to me that 2 major groups of developeres will be using Spring. One of these would use only the persistence framework, together with an external MVC framework such as Struts. The other would use the Spring MVC framework as well (i.e. the whole enchilada).
>So for the 1st stage I see some very simple pages which allow the user to enter base data (register a pet with the clinic, manage the vets, ...). This stage uses a simple servlet and / or JSP.
>Then the second stage incorporates the Web framework, and has for ex. sick pets visiting the vet.
>
>I am currently working on charting Spring in UML. Ideally there should be a parallel between your work and mine. You show the code, I show the framework innards.
>
>Isabelle
>
>  
>


Isabelle,

Although I agree with your statement regarding the 2 likely sets of 
developers that may use Spring, I respectfully disagree strategically 
with the approach you suggest of using a simple servlet for the first 
iteration of the demo/tutorial.

It seems to me that the primary emphasis of the demo/tutorial should be 
to showcase what the Spring frameworks have to offer to the developer. I 
think that the very heart of Spring is the web application framework. 
Although most of the other frameworks are useful without it, they exist 
primarily as conveniences to simply make the developers web application 
work easier. Spring's integration capability with other technologies, be 
they presentation or persistence oriented should be part of the side 
show/trails, IMO.

I also think that the group using the "whole enchildada" should be the 
primary target audience at least for the first iteration of the 
demo/tutorial.

Side trails that show how to use the Spring frameworks with Struts, 
servlets, fat clients, object-relational mappers, etc. are some of the 
future possibilities. Another side trail that compares the Spring web 
framework to Struts for instance is another possibility. That particular 
trail, however, would need to be a very carefully planned undertaking if 
it is to be effective in convincing developers to choose Spring over Struts.

It is also important to keep in mind that the demo/tutorial Petclinic 
metaphor itself is also part of the side show. The emphasis, 
particularly in the first iteration, needs to be on the most important 
Spring features/classes. The tutorial text should first discuss the 
framework's most important pieces and what common problems they can be 
used to address. It should then show how to use them as the  demo itself 
evolves.

The Petclinic metaphor should evolve as necessary to suit the needs of 
the demo/tutorial. Obviously, this is not the way real applications are 
developed but it is useful to meet the goals of this effort. The 
tutorial exposition itself however should evolve to show how to solve 
the Petclinic business problems in the more usual way from the 
developers point of view. Perhaps the best way to do this is to use an 
approach similar to that of the Sun Java Developer Certification Exam 
wherein there already exists a database full of data that needs to be 
accessed in a new way. We can pretend that some of the functionality 
will be provided by existing software at least temporarily. Parts of the 
database that don't add anything new to the tutorial probably should be 
pruned away, for instance, the Vets table may not be needed. At some 
point we will need to add session and transaction related stuff so maybe 
we add the invoicing of services/medications or provide the ability to 
purchase special pet food online. Just thinking out loud here.

The following are some examples of the important classes/interfaces that 
I think need to be explained/demonstrated in the less advanced 
version(s) of the demo/tutorial:

- from com.interface21.beans.factory : InitializingBean
- from com.interface21.validation : Errors, Validator

- from com.interface21.jdbc.object : ManualExtractionSqlQuery,SqlUpdate
- from com.interface21.jdbc.core : SmartDataSource and/or DataSourceUtils

- from com.interface21.web.servlet : ControllerServlet
- from com.interface21.web.servlet.mvc : FormController and later 
SessionFormController and WizardFormController
- from com.interface21.web.servlet.mvc.multiaction : 
MultiActionController, PropertiesMethodNameResolver
- from com.interface21.web.servlet.handler : SimpleUrlHandlerMapping
- from com.interface21.web.servlet.view : ResourceBundleViewResolver, 
InternalResourceView or JstlView
- from com.interface21.web.context : ContextLoaderServlet
- from com.interface21.web.context.support : XmlWebApplicationContext
- from com.interface21.web.tags : BindTag

I would suggest that the opening section of the tutorial text should be 
the same as what would be on the front page of the website. I would also 
suggest that this should be some sort of statement that Spring is a 
collection of loosely coupled, flexible frameworks which can be used as 
needed without having to buy into the whole collection. It would then 
provide a brief introduction to each of the Spring frameworks with a 
synopsis of what they provide for the potential developer. Much of this 
could probably be derived directly from information presented in the book.

I am also going to assume the following for the initial version:
- The view technology will be JSP and JSTL.
- The pages will be very simple forms/views without style sheets, 
headers/footers/menus, or internationalization.
- No authentication/authorization.
- No session.


As I am beginning to feel a compelling need to produce something 
substantive, I am going to proceed on this basis. It will probably 
include all the stuff related to the Pets and their Owners. If we decide 
to use a servlet instead, we can just chop out the web framework stuff 
for use later as needed and put in the servlet. I will put something 
together, post it, and then we can hack away at it. We can then discuss 
how to stage it within the tutorial.


What do you think ?


If anybody else has anything to add to this discussion, please do so.


Ken

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Isabelle M. <isa...@me...>]

Hi Thomas,

MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type that supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree, but who'd want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot of resources.

Isabelle

On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.  
> 
> It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with the 0.8
> release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to the
> new demo app that we are developing.  
> 
> It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and a more
> advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the web-tier,
> infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app should
> be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or maybe
> MySQL.  
> 
> For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB and
> maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and a more
> robust database with transaction support.
> 
> Thomas Risberg
> 
> > Hello,
> > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring list. In
> > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > demo/tutorial.
> > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are making
> > all the sense of the framework
> > 
> > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on the
> > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to provide
> > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts and a more
> > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily start with
> > the framework and users interested by the more interesting topics will
> > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> >  
> > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I recognize
> > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat. Nevertheless Rod's
> > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > 
> > 
> > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have another
> > question: having two applications working with the initial i21 from the
> > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> > framework? What is the best way today to found what have changed? Have
> > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess from here?
> > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved in the
> > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > 
> > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > 
> > -----Message d'origine-----
> > De : spr...@li...
> > [mailto:spr...@li...] De la
> > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003 13:29 À :
> > spr...@li...
> > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > 
> > How about this for a slogan :
> > 
> > J2EE made easy
> > 
> > Isabelle
> > 
> > -- 
> > Isabelle Muszynski
> > Software Engineer
> > Zandweellaan 4
> > 2660 Antwerpen
> > Belgium
> > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > Email: isa...@me...
> > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > 
> > 
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Thomas Risberg
> tri...@tr...
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> 
> 

-- 
Isabelle Muszynski
Software Engineer
Zandweellaan 4
2660 Antwerpen
Belgium
Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
Email: isa...@me...
Website: www.meta-logix.com

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Rod J. <rod...@in...>]

What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's potentially
zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities. Transactionality is a
must.

Rod

----- Original Message -----
From: "Isabelle Muszynski" <isa...@me...>
To: "Thomas Risberg" <tri...@tr...>
Cc: <spr...@li...>
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 5:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos


> Hi Thomas,
>
> MySQL provides transactions, you just have to specify a table type that
supports them (eg InnoDB). Oracle is much more powerful, I agree, but who'd
want to set up Oracle just to run a demo app? Plus it eats up a lot of
resources.
>
> Isabelle
>
> On Sat, Apr 26, 2003 at 12:20:22PM -0400, Thomas Risberg wrote:
> > I think Jean-Pierre raises some valid points here.
> >
> > It would be nice to have the sample apps from the book work with the 0.8
> > release of the framework.  This should be avaialble in addition to the
> > new demo app that we are developing.
> >
> > It would also be nice to have a very simple "entry level" app and a more
> > advanced one.  I think we should limit the first one to the web-tier,
> > infrastructure and data access parts of the framework.  This app should
> > be able to run on Tomcat and a lightweight database like HSQL or maybe
> > MySQL.
> >
> > For the more advanced one we should include AOP, Transactions, EJB and
> > maybe some more advanced JDBC stuff.  Here we could use JBoss and a more
> > robust database with transaction support.
> >
> > Thomas Risberg
> >
> > > Hello,
> > > Not writing a lot these times, I follow constantly the Spring list. In
> > > this discussion, I see clearly that we have two goals with the
> > > demo/tutorial.
> > > 1) For the beginners: telling about the main Spring approach
> > > 2) For advanced users: telling about advanced features that are making
> > > all the sense of the framework
> > >
> > > Both have to be founding a real aid. Isabelle is concentrated on the
> > > first, but the seconds don't to be ignored. Perhaps we have to provide
> > > both separately: A very simple demo on Tomcat for the firsts and a
more
> > > advanced on Jboss for the others. So everybody could easily start with
> > > the framework and users interested by the more interesting topics will
> > > normally not be afraid by installing Jboss.
> > >
> > > I don't agree when you say Jboss is too complicated, but I recognize
> > > that it's not the same level of difficulty as Tomcat. Nevertheless
Rod's
> > > book is very helping for starting with Jboss.
> > >
> > >
> > > In this topic, so long as no documentation is done, I have another
> > > question: having two applications working with the initial i21 from
the
> > > book, is it too early to thinking on passing them on the Spring
> > > framework? What is the best way today to found what have changed? Have
> > > we only the sources and the list discussion, having to guess from
here?
> > > It's certainly clear in the mind of a few people deeply involved in
the
> > > development, but personally, I'm a quite loosed.
> > >
> > > Jean-Pierre PAWLAK
> > >
> > > -----Message d'origine-----
> > > De : spr...@li...
> > > [mailto:spr...@li...] De la
> > > part de Isabelle Muszynski Envoyé : samedi 26 avril 2003 13:29 � :
> > > spr...@li...
> > > Objet : [Springframework-developer] slogan
> > >
> > > How about this for a slogan :
> > >
> > > J2EE made easy
> > >
> > > Isabelle
> > >
> > > --
> > > Isabelle Muszynski
> > > Software Engineer
> > > Zandweellaan 4
> > > 2660 Antwerpen
> > > Belgium
> > > Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> > > Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> > > Email: isa...@me...
> > > Website: www.meta-logix.com
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > > Spr...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Thomas Risberg
> > tri...@tr...
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> > Welcome to geek heaven.
> > http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> > _______________________________________________
> > Springframework-developer mailing list
> > Spr...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer
> >
> >
>
> --
> Isabelle Muszynski
> Software Engineer
> Zandweellaan 4
> 2660 Antwerpen
> Belgium
> Tel. 32-(0)3-830 18 54
> Mobile: 32-(0)485 49 50 89
> Email: isa...@me...
> Website: www.meta-logix.com
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
> Welcome to geek heaven.
> http://thinkgeek.com/sf
> _______________________________________________
> Springframework-developer mailing list
> Spr...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/springframework-developer

Re: [Springframework-developer] Demos

[Luke T. <ne...@fr...>]

Rod Johnson wrote:
> What about Hypersonic? It seems well suited for demos as it's potentially
> zero configuration. But I don't know its capabilities. Transactionality is a
> must.
> 

Hypersonic supports transactions and is very convenient to use. It also 
comes embedded with JBoss so there's no additional requirement to set up 
a DB if you deploy on JBoss.

Luke.


-- 
  Luke Taylor.                      Monkey Machine Ltd.
  PGP Key ID: 0x57E9523C            http://www.monkeymachine.ltd.uk