Re: [LinuxSTEP-General] Re: [Simplygnustep-discuss] What GNUstep Re: [LinuxSTEP-General] Re: [Simplygnustep-discuss] What GNUstep

[Nicolas R. <ni...@ro...>]

On 2003-05-12 20:56:18 +0000 ceh...@ma... wrote:

Hello,

> I think that a combination of InterfaceWM and a separate Dock.app is  ideal.  I have to say that prefer the OS X style of Dock over the  OpenStep one.  For instance, I think that the user should be able to  put documents in the dock.   I also think that the openstep style of  having two separate places for App icons is confusing to the typical  user, they wonder why the can grab an App ion and put *it* into the  dock, but cannot put a miniwindow icon there as well.  Stuff like that.
> 
> So, what this means is that if I do write a Dock.app (and it's looking  like I will), it will be in the basic style os OS X.  Now, the question  remains, what to do with the miniwindows?  Do we put those in the Dock  as well (like OS X), or de we put them in the lower part of the screen?

Imho, the "Dock" should be some separate program, perhaps communicating
with the window manager (IWM ?) to handle iconfied windows ...
So that you could have a program with a NeXT-like dock, or an Aqua-dock, or
even a panel or whatever.

The "Dock" program (whatever its representation) only needs to receive startup notification of programs (already the case for gnustep apps), iconification and close notifications too. Perhaps others notifications are needed.

> Having a dock to handle these types of things will make the creation of  InterfaceWM much easier since it will be able to defer these window  handling issues to a dock.  There just needs to be a method of  interaction between InterfaceWM and Dock.app, the natural choice would  be via Distributed Objects, of course.

Distributed Notifications would be fine.

>> - Dock: I think GWorkspace.app includes Backgrounder.app that can take
>> care of the root window and a Fiend where you cand attach applications
>> and switch workspaces. There's also a beta Panel for GNUstep
>> (screenshots here: http://wiki.gnustep.org/index.php/Panel) but IMHO a
>> gnome/kde-like panel is not a good idea for GNUstep.
> 
> Fiend is ok, but is it not everything a real dock can be.  I also think  that these two things should be separate processes.  I've heard of the  Panel and seen the screenshots, but have never seen any code?!?  I also   don't think that a GNOME/windows/KDE style panel is good, that is  garbage, "Start" menus are garbage.

Well the code was never officially released, because it lacks some features
to be really user friendly ...
Anyway the code is downloadable on http://www.roard.com/download/Panel.tgz
(caution : crappy and unsupported code for the moment)

> Hmmm, Who owns the root window?  Good question!  In the traditional  OpenStep, the root window was blank, just a color or whatever.  Os X  allows the placement of icons and such on the desktop, which I find  very, very, convenient and like.  I think that if we allow files to be  put on the desktop, then GWorkspace should own it.

In my opinion, putting files on the desktop is *not good*. Well, at first it sounds like a good idea, but you'll end with your desktop filled with files quickly. And
the reason why NeXT choose to not let people put their file on the desktop
is quickly remained : because generally you have *something* over them
(programs' windows...) --> your desktop isn't really easily reachable .. thus
some dirty UI hacks on some environments such as a "show only the desktop"
icon to remove temporally all the windows on top of it... brrr...

Anyway. I'm currently working a bit on a Dock app, but this time, not a separate application, but one which also handles the background. The reason
was that some things weren't easy to do at all ("highlighting" the place where
the user *will* put a stone for example) with a separate window for the Dock,
and all in all, having a unique application for handling the background stuff
and the dock/panel stuff seems good.
 From my early tests it seems to be quite useable (speed) and there is a plus, you could do fancy graphical stuffs as you draw on the background directly (transparency,
etc.) very easily (thanks to back-art). see http://www.roard.com/screenshots/screenshot_background.png

To end with the background thing : for me it mustn't offers the possibility to put your
icons files on it, for the reason stated earlier, but you should have the possibility of customizing the background.
That is, put an image (classic), but also put things like meteo, last news, etc.
(in the same spirit as konfabulator on mac os x or karamba on kde).

-- 
Nicolas Roard