refdb-users — List for RefDB users

Re: [Refdb-users] ANN: refdb-0.9.7-pre7 released

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Sat, 10 Jun 2006, Markus Hoenicka wrote:

> I've just uploaded refdb-0.9.7-pre7, which you can download using this
> link:

> echo "  refdb-init.sh shell script as root, or peruse the handbook if you"

Markus,

   After killing off the running process, I ran refdb-init.sh as root. It
failed:

Checking for the status of the application server control script.
You need to have the permissions to run this script in order to set up
RefDB with all the bells and whistles. If this test fails, you are most
likely not running as root.

refdbctl is not executable

refdbd-init.sh failed.
refdb-init.sh is finished.

   However, /usr/local/bin/refdbctl has perms 0755 and is owned by root.

Checkmate,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |    The Environmental Permitting
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.(TM)    |            Accelerator
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

[Refdb-users] ANN: refdb-0.9.7-pre7 released

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi,

I've just uploaded refdb-0.9.7-pre7, which you can download using this
link:

http://refdb.sourceforge.net/pre/refdb-latest.tar.gz

The binaries are essentially the same as in pre6. The reason for this
prerelease is an experimental first version of an interactive setup
script. We've had discussions lately about the poblems of users who
somehow miss the fact that there is something else to do after running
"make install". I've changed the trailing output of ./configure which
now displays a list of things to do:

echo "What you should do next"
echo "- run \"make\" to build RefDB."
echo "- run \"make install\" as root to install everything."
echo "- create the main database and the configuration files. Either run the"
echo "  refdb-init.sh shell script as root, or peruse the handbook if you"
echo "  prefer a manual installation."

Said script is the main new code in pre7. To cite from the docs:

    * Creates the main database refdb for the selected database engine. If a copy of the main database already exists, it asks for permission to delete this database before proceeding.
    * Creates a configuration file for refdbd(1), the RefDB application server. If the file already exists, it will keep a copy of this version.
    * Creates a configuration file for refdba(1), the RefDB administrative client, in the current login account. If the file already exists, it will keep a copy of this version.
    * Starts refdbd, the RefDB application server
    * Loads the bibliography and citation styles shipped with RefDB
    * Creates a reference database
    * Creates a database user with permissions to work with the reference database

Some of the steps can be skipped. The script currently does not handle
loss-free system upgrades, i.e. you're still responsible to backup and
restore any data that you'd like to keep if upgrading involves
creating new databases. The main purpose is to get the first-time
admin up and running.

I'd ask everyone with a bit spare time to test-drive the setup
script. The easiest way is to use the script to set up refdb for a
database engine which you do not currently use for RefDB. E.g. if you
use MySQL as a backend, you could use the script to set up RefDB for
sqlite (this is a very small download if you don't run it anyway). The
setup script keeps backups of the config files it touches (refdbdrc
and refdbarc) so it should be easy to revert the system to the
previous state.

I'm aware that you can kill an existing installation if the script
fails for some reason. Although I'd like to encourage as many users as
possible to run this test, please don't if you're not sure you can
revert to the previous state by hand. In any case, the script won't
delete reference data under any circumstances.

As a consequence of the new script, a few minor adjustments were
necessary:

- the refdbdrc.example template is gone. It was replaced by four
  templates called refdbdrc.<engine>.example which are preconfigured
  for the supported database engines. This should make it easier for
  package builders as well as for end-users as you can just copy or
  symlink one of the files based on the package user's engine choice.

- the --with-db-engine configure switch is therefore obsolete and was
  removed


regards,
Markus

-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] Call Numbers

[Dan O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

Sure. I think what I'll do is look at what refWorks does when outputting
RIS. It uses an RIS-y markup and has an explicit field for call numbers
in its own language; I'll pump some out in RIS and see where it puts
them.

-d

On Tue, 2006-06-06 at 09:26 +0200, Markus Hoenicka wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> it might very well be that RIS has no field designed for this purpose. You might
> have to use one of the U1-U5 fields instead. I'll be happy to extend marc2ris to
> handle callnumber fields if you tell me which MARC field(s) I have to take care
> of. A few examples for testing, along with the expected output, would be nice
> too.
> 
> regards,
> Markus
> 
> Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:
> 
> > As far as I can tell, the marc2ris ignores callnumber fields. Anybody
> > have any suggestions for where they should go in RIS?I keep track of
> > them.
> 
> 
> 
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell, PhD
Acting Chair and Associate Professor of English
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
Canada

Vox: +1 (403) 329-2378/-2377
Fax: +1 (403) 382-7191

Re: [Refdb-users] Call Numbers

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi,

it might very well be that RIS has no field designed for this purpose. You might
have to use one of the U1-U5 fields instead. I'll be happy to extend marc2ris to
handle callnumber fields if you tell me which MARC field(s) I have to take care
of. A few examples for testing, along with the expected output, would be nice
too.

regards,
Markus

Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:

> As far as I can tell, the marc2ris ignores callnumber fields. Anybody
> have any suggestions for where they should go in RIS?I keep track of
> them.



-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

[Refdb-users] Call Numbers

[Daniel O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

As far as I can tell, the marc2ris ignores callnumber fields. Anybody
have any suggestions for where they should go in RIS?I keep track of
them.

-d
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell, PhD
Associate Professor and Chair
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
Department of English
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4

Tel. +1 (403) 329-2378
Fax. +1 (403) 382-7191

:@wiglaf (dapper ubuntu)

Re: [Refdb-users] What does one serve out to browsers

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Z F <mai...@ya...> was heard to say:


> As to www interface, I do not remember it it came with the package, but
> I have it in
>
> /usr/share/refdb/www/
>

I wasn't sure, but this shows conclusively that the latest Debian package still
contains the CGI web interface. The PHP web interface is available only from
sources.

regards,
Markus

-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] What does one serve out to browsers

[Z F <mai...@ya...>]

Hello Daniel,

I installed refdb from the debian package. Remember that this is very
old package and some very useful things were added afterwards.

As to www interface, I do not remember it it came with the package, but
I have it in

/usr/share/refdb/www/

In any case, it is better to get www interface from the new source
since some bugs were fixed recently.

With best wishes,
Lazar

--- Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> wrote:

> Unless it ends up somewhere odd, it looks like phpweb is not
> installed
> with the debian binary (I'm assuming it would end up with the rest of
> the directories in /usr/share/refdb?). I'll pull it out of the source
> and try it out.
> 
> -d
> 
> On Wed, 2006-31-05 at 09:24 +0200, Markus Hoenicka wrote:
> > Hi Daniel,
> > 
> > the web interface is one of these dusty corners that would require
> someone who
> > really takes care of. Once there was a really simple CGI-based web
> interface
> > including a manual section. I dropped that because it was too
> clumsy. Somebody
> > was nice enough to donate a reimplementation in PHP, but all you
> get in terms
> > of a manual is a INSTALL in the phpweb subdirectory. There was an
> inquiry just
> > the other day to improve the interface, but I haven't heard
> anything since. I'd
> > be more than happy if we had an improved interface and a manual
> section
> > describing it.
> > 
> > If you followed the terse instructions in the phpweb/INSTALL file,
> you should be
> > able to either open:
> > 
> > http://localhost/refdb/
> > 
> > (including the trailing slash) or
> > 
> > http://localhost/refdb/index.html
> > 
> > or from a remote box
> > 
> > http://hostname/refdb/index.html
> > 
> > regards,
> > Markus
> > 
> > 
> > Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:
> > 
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > Now that I figured out the config problem, I'm running great guns
> and
> > > everything seems to be working. I'd like to enable web browser
> access.
> > > I've read the manual and tutorial pretty carefully over the last
> two
> > > days, but am not quite sure what I need to serve out to browsers.
> The
> > > screenshots suggest a file called refdbquery.htm but I can't find
> it.
> > >
> > > Am I missing a section in the manual or tutorial, or is there
> something
> > > else obvious? I've used apache a fair bit and so have an idea how
> I'm
> > > supposed to handle the actual server and URL business. It is the
> > > specific refdb files I should be aiming at that I can't figure
> out.
> > >
> > > Appreciate any help...
> > >
> > > -d
> > > --
> > > Daniel Paul O'Donnell
> > > Associate Professor and Chair of English
> > > Director, Digital Medievalist Project
> > > <http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
> > > University of Lethbridge
> > > Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
> > > Canada
> > >
> > > Vox +1 403 329-2377
> > > Fax +1 403 382-7191
> > >
> > > :@caedmon/ubuntu
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > All the advantages of Linux Managed Hosting--Without the Cost and
> Risk!
> > > Fully trained technicians. The highest number of Red Hat
> certifications in
> > > the hosting industry. Fanatical Support. Click to learn more
> > >
>
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=107521&bid=248729&dat=121642
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Refdb-users mailing list
> > > Ref...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/refdb-users
> > >
> > 
> > 
> -- 
> Daniel Paul O'Donnell
> Associate Professor and Chair of English
> Director, Digital Medievalist Project
> <http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
> University of Lethbridge
> Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
> Canada
> 
> Vox +1 403 329-2377
> Fax +1 403 382-7191
> 
> :@caedmon/ubuntu
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> All the advantages of Linux Managed Hosting--Without the Cost and
> Risk!
> Fully trained technicians. The highest number of Red Hat
> certifications in
> the hosting industry. Fanatical Support. Click to learn more
>
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=107521&bid=248729&dat=121642
> _______________________________________________
> Refdb-users mailing list
> Ref...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/refdb-users
> 


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Re: [Refdb-users] What does one serve out to browsers

[Daniel O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

Unless it ends up somewhere odd, it looks like phpweb is not installed
with the debian binary (I'm assuming it would end up with the rest of
the directories in /usr/share/refdb?). I'll pull it out of the source
and try it out.

-d

On Wed, 2006-31-05 at 09:24 +0200, Markus Hoenicka wrote:
> Hi Daniel,
> 
> the web interface is one of these dusty corners that would require someone who
> really takes care of. Once there was a really simple CGI-based web interface
> including a manual section. I dropped that because it was too clumsy. Somebody
> was nice enough to donate a reimplementation in PHP, but all you get in terms
> of a manual is a INSTALL in the phpweb subdirectory. There was an inquiry just
> the other day to improve the interface, but I haven't heard anything since. I'd
> be more than happy if we had an improved interface and a manual section
> describing it.
> 
> If you followed the terse instructions in the phpweb/INSTALL file, you should be
> able to either open:
> 
> http://localhost/refdb/
> 
> (including the trailing slash) or
> 
> http://localhost/refdb/index.html
> 
> or from a remote box
> 
> http://hostname/refdb/index.html
> 
> regards,
> Markus
> 
> 
> Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:
> 
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Now that I figured out the config problem, I'm running great guns and
> > everything seems to be working. I'd like to enable web browser access.
> > I've read the manual and tutorial pretty carefully over the last two
> > days, but am not quite sure what I need to serve out to browsers. The
> > screenshots suggest a file called refdbquery.htm but I can't find it.
> >
> > Am I missing a section in the manual or tutorial, or is there something
> > else obvious? I've used apache a fair bit and so have an idea how I'm
> > supposed to handle the actual server and URL business. It is the
> > specific refdb files I should be aiming at that I can't figure out.
> >
> > Appreciate any help...
> >
> > -d
> > --
> > Daniel Paul O'Donnell
> > Associate Professor and Chair of English
> > Director, Digital Medievalist Project
> > <http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
> > University of Lethbridge
> > Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
> > Canada
> >
> > Vox +1 403 329-2377
> > Fax +1 403 382-7191
> >
> > :@caedmon/ubuntu
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > All the advantages of Linux Managed Hosting--Without the Cost and Risk!
> > Fully trained technicians. The highest number of Red Hat certifications in
> > the hosting industry. Fanatical Support. Click to learn more
> > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=107521&bid=248729&dat=121642
> > _______________________________________________
> > Refdb-users mailing list
> > Ref...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/refdb-users
> >
> 
> 
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell
Associate Professor and Chair of English
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
Canada

Vox +1 403 329-2377
Fax +1 403 382-7191

:@caedmon/ubuntu

[Fwd: Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved]

[<ste...@jo...>]

--=20
St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a, PhD.                  http://www.steletch.org
Unit=E9 Math=E9matique Informatique et G=E9nome http://migale.jouy.inra.f=
r/mig
INRA, Domaine de Vilvert                  T=E9l : (33) 134 652 891
78352 Jouy-en-Josas cedex, France         Fax : (33) 134 652 901

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi,

St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a <ste...@jo...> was heard to say:

> I may have misunderstood, but while packaging, i'm using those options =
:
>
> ./configure --disable-docs --with-db-server=3D3Dpgsql --disable-rpath
>
> * the --disable-docs is for avoiding the doc building problem (and sinc=
e=3D20
> they are provided, there is no point in having a rebuilding),

I believe I've figured out the problem why make attempted to rebuild the =
docs
although they were there. This should be fixed in the upcoming 0.9.7, and=
 you
should be able to make do without this switch.

> * --disable-rpath is to avoid the warning
> * i used --with-db-server=3D3Dpgsql
>
> Ok, after reading again p29 of the manual (chpater 4 - Installation), i=
=3D20
> see the option -with-db-server is only for getting preconfigurations fo=
r=3D20
> pgsql, mysql or sqlite, but all of them will be ok with the correct=3D2=
0
> configuration file ... Is there a mean to provide the three=3D20
> configurations so the admin can link the correct one to its situation ?
> Otherwise, i'll consider adding them on the package, using 3 differents=
=3D20
> builds to get the environnment in /usr/local/etc/refdb/*

I could provide refdbdrc.mysql, refdbdrc.pgsql and so on as templates
preconfigured for the supported database engines. They would all receive =
the
other relevant modifications (var dir, log dir etc) and be installed as
refdbdrc.mysql.example and so on. Users could copy and edit these files
appropriately. Package builders could just set a symlink to the appropria=
te
file, depending on which database engine the user selected when configuri=
ng the
package. Is that what you meant? I think this is a good solution.

>
> Thanks for the clarification, this was my last limiting step.
>
> As a sidenote, the command line on page 42 (the sed replacement for=3D2=
0
> InnoDB in mysql) is truncated :-)
>

Thanks for the reminder. I try to fix these truncated lines (there must b=
e a few
in the manual) before 0.9.7 is officially released.

regards,
Markus

--=20
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[<ste...@jo...>]

Markus Hoenicka a =E9crit :
> St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a writes:
>  > As a packager, one suggestion i could do is to split (or *pluginize*=
)=3D20
>  > the db connectors. Like this, one refdb-server package could exist=3D=
20
>  > (using by default sqlite) and if the mysql or pgsql connector is pre=
sent=3D20
>  > then it is used.
>  >=20
>=20
> What precisely do you mean with "db connectors"? What would these
> packages contain? As far as RefDB is concerned, you switch between
> database engines by changing one or two entries in refdbdrc and by
> creating the main database using the new engine.=20
>=20
> regards,
> Markus
>=20

I may have misunderstood, but while packaging, i'm using those options :

./configure --disable-docs --with-db-server=3Dpgsql --disable-rpath

* the --disable-docs is for avoiding the doc building problem (and since=20
they are provided, there is no point in having a rebuilding),
* --disable-rpath is to avoid the warning
* i used --with-db-server=3Dpgsql

Ok, after reading again p29 of the manual (chpater 4 - Installation), i=20
see the option -with-db-server is only for getting preconfigurations for=20
pgsql, mysql or sqlite, but all of them will be ok with the correct=20
configuration file ... Is there a mean to provide the three=20
configurations so the admin can link the correct one to its situation ?
Otherwise, i'll consider adding them on the package, using 3 differents=20
builds to get the environnment in /usr/local/etc/refdb/*

Thanks for the clarification, this was my last limiting step.

As a sidenote, the command line on page 42 (the sed replacement for=20
InnoDB in mysql) is truncated :-)

St=E9phane

--=20
St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a, PhD.                  http://www.steletch.org
Unit=E9 Math=E9matique Informatique et G=E9nome http://migale.jouy.inra.f=
r/mig
INRA, Domaine de Vilvert                  T=E9l : (33) 134 652 891
78352 Jouy-en-Josas cedex, France         Fax : (33) 134 652 901

Re: [Refdb-users] What does one serve out to browsers

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi Daniel,

the web interface is one of these dusty corners that would require someone who
really takes care of. Once there was a really simple CGI-based web interface
including a manual section. I dropped that because it was too clumsy. Somebody
was nice enough to donate a reimplementation in PHP, but all you get in terms
of a manual is a INSTALL in the phpweb subdirectory. There was an inquiry just
the other day to improve the interface, but I haven't heard anything since. I'd
be more than happy if we had an improved interface and a manual section
describing it.

If you followed the terse instructions in the phpweb/INSTALL file, you should be
able to either open:

http://localhost/refdb/

(including the trailing slash) or

http://localhost/refdb/index.html

or from a remote box

http://hostname/refdb/index.html

regards,
Markus


Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:

> Hi all,
>
> Now that I figured out the config problem, I'm running great guns and
> everything seems to be working. I'd like to enable web browser access.
> I've read the manual and tutorial pretty carefully over the last two
> days, but am not quite sure what I need to serve out to browsers. The
> screenshots suggest a file called refdbquery.htm but I can't find it.
>
> Am I missing a section in the manual or tutorial, or is there something
> else obvious? I've used apache a fair bit and so have an idea how I'm
> supposed to handle the actual server and URL business. It is the
> specific refdb files I should be aiming at that I can't figure out.
>
> Appreciate any help...
>
> -d
> --
> Daniel Paul O'Donnell
> Associate Professor and Chair of English
> Director, Digital Medievalist Project
> <http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
> University of Lethbridge
> Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
> Canada
>
> Vox +1 403 329-2377
> Fax +1 403 382-7191
>
> :@caedmon/ubuntu
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> All the advantages of Linux Managed Hosting--Without the Cost and Risk!
> Fully trained technicians. The highest number of Red Hat certifications in
> the hosting industry. Fanatical Support. Click to learn more
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=107521&bid=248729&dat=121642
> _______________________________________________
> Refdb-users mailing list
> Ref...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/refdb-users
>


-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

[Refdb-users] What does one serve out to browsers

[Daniel O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

Hi all,

Now that I figured out the config problem, I'm running great guns and
everything seems to be working. I'd like to enable web browser access.
I've read the manual and tutorial pretty carefully over the last two
days, but am not quite sure what I need to serve out to browsers. The
screenshots suggest a file called refdbquery.htm but I can't find it.

Am I missing a section in the manual or tutorial, or is there something
else obvious? I've used apache a fair bit and so have an idea how I'm
supposed to handle the actual server and URL business. It is the
specific refdb files I should be aiming at that I can't figure out.

Appreciate any help...

-d
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell
Associate Professor and Chair of English
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
Canada

Vox +1 403 329-2377
Fax +1 403 382-7191

:@caedmon/ubuntu

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi Dan,

Markus Hoenicka writes:
 >  > Finally, I wonder if supplying values for dbase and username in the
 >  > config files is really wise, especially in the case of the dbase
 >  > username (nobody is likely to use Joe User, so this can ONLY cause
 >  > trouble), and probably in the case of SqlLite, since many people will
 >  > want to use either MySql or PostGres.
 >  > 
 > 
 > This is basically a good point. The clients are written to
 > use the login name as a fallback if no database user name is
 > supplied. I'll change the config files accordingly.
 > 

I checked the config file examples, and none of them defines a
database username, so all should be well. Where did you take "Joe
User" from? Is that something you typed off the manual?

BTW the reason to pick SQLite as a default was to allow the easiest
possible package installation using precompiled binaries. RefDB needs
at least one database engine to start with, and SQLite is small and
requires no administration. That is, with some script magic a *BSD or
Linux package builder can package RefDB in a way that it is ready to
run right after installation. Setting up the refdb database in MySQL
or PostgreSQL.requires knowledge of the database admin password, and
in the case of PostgreSQL it may require running commands from the
postgres user account. This is far harder to do from a run-of-the-mill
installation script.

Therefore David (the now-gone Debian package builder) convinced me to
use SQLite as a default in the tarball too. You just have to provide
the proper switch to the ./configure script to use a different
engine. That script even prints your choice at the end of the output
to make sure you notice what it did. It's just hard to find a way to
make users aware of the configure switch in time.

regards,
Markus

-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a writes:
 > As a packager, one suggestion i could do is to split (or *pluginize*=
)=3D20
 > the db connectors. Like this, one refdb-server package could exist=3D=
20
 > (using by default sqlite) and if the mysql or pgsql connector is pre=
sent=3D20
 > then it is used.
 >=20

What precisely do you mean with "db connectors"=3F What would these
packages contain=3F As far as RefDB is concerned, you switch between
database engines by changing one or two entries in refdbdrc and by
creating the main database using the new engine.=20

regards,
Markus

--=20
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[<ste...@jo...>]

Markus Hoenicka a =E9crit :
> Dan O'Donnell writes:
>  > While agreeing with Rich, I think this specific case the solution wo=
uld

I agree!

>  > A better approach IMO would be to use a script to ask users for the
>  > username and dbase server type (the way mediawiki do for username);
>  > failing that leaving them blank and *requiring* users to fill in the
>  > requisite fields of the config files might be an answer that would
>  > prevent some grief. Since they have to go in to change the username
>  > anyway, it seems to me not to hurt the installation setup process an=
y.
>  >=20
>=20
> I have pondered this too, but I've seen problems everywhere. I'm not
> sure whether package builders can handle this appropriately, since
> RefDB is usually split at least into a server and a client package
> which need to be configured differently. And besides, if users don't
> care to configure their config files because they don't know they have
> to, would they be likely to run a script that they don't know about?
> That's why I attempted to put as much configuration as possible into
> the most natural place for this - the configure script.
>=20
> In any case, I welcome any suggestions to handle this better, as the
> current approach apparently causes more problem than I'd like. Please
> feel free to let the ideas flow.
>=20
> regards,
> Markus

As a packager, one suggestion i could do is to split (or *pluginize*)=20
the db connectors. Like this, one refdb-server package could exist=20
(using by default sqlite) and if the mysql or pgsql connector is present=20
then it is used.

i'm not sure this is trivial, but i see one major advantage :=20
facilitating password/users and db maintenance (the connector would need=20
to be filled with those informations to work), getting the possibility=20
to have other db connectors (after all, you're not working on db, but on=20
biblio stored on a db).

As i said i'm not using it for now (i must finish the packages *and*=20
test them) but i'm on my way to, and this is one point that seems an=20
improvement, since you're asking for new directions ;-)

Keep up the work!

Yours,

St=E9phane

--=20
St=E9phane T=E9letch=E9a, PhD.                  http://www.steletch.org
Unit=E9 Math=E9matique Informatique et G=E9nome http://migale.jouy.inra.f=
r/mig
INRA, Domaine de Vilvert                  T=E9l : (33) 134 652 891
78352 Jouy-en-Josas cedex, France         Fax : (33) 134 652 901

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Dan O'Donnell writes:
 > While agreeing with Rich, I think this specific case the solution would
 > be to add a line to the troubleshooting page, since it is a recurring
 > problem, and we have similar specific and common error messages already
 > listed there. Basically two lines, one saying: "Main Database to Old or
 > Corrupt": the most likely cause of this error is a faulty setting in the
 > config. files. Check that you have indicated the correct database in
 > file xxx; and also that you have changed the user name in xxxx."
 > 

I've added a few lines about the database too old or corrupt
error. The username/password stuff is already explained in that
section as it causes a different kind of error message.

 > I also think there should be an indication that the desired dbase system
 > needs to be set in the config files, otherwise the default is SqlLite.
 > 

This is already described in the manual as well as in the ./configure
--help output (but it is a known fact that users don't read. I'm not
complaining here, it is just a fact we have to live with and work
around if possible).

 > Finally, I wonder if supplying values for dbase and username in the
 > config files is really wise, especially in the case of the dbase
 > username (nobody is likely to use Joe User, so this can ONLY cause
 > trouble), and probably in the case of SqlLite, since many people will
 > want to use either MySql or PostGres.
 > 

This is basically a good point. The clients are written to
use the login name as a fallback if no database user name is
supplied. I'll change the config files accordingly.

 > A better approach IMO would be to use a script to ask users for the
 > username and dbase server type (the way mediawiki do for username);
 > failing that leaving them blank and *requiring* users to fill in the
 > requisite fields of the config files might be an answer that would
 > prevent some grief. Since they have to go in to change the username
 > anyway, it seems to me not to hurt the installation setup process any.
 > 

I have pondered this too, but I've seen problems everywhere. I'm not
sure whether package builders can handle this appropriately, since
RefDB is usually split at least into a server and a client package
which need to be configured differently. And besides, if users don't
care to configure their config files because they don't know they have
to, would they be likely to run a script that they don't know about?
That's why I attempted to put as much configuration as possible into
the most natural place for this - the configure script.

In any case, I welcome any suggestions to handle this better, as the
current approach apparently causes more problem than I'd like. Please
feel free to let the ideas flow.

regards,
Markus

-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Dan O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

While agreeing with Rich, I think this specific case the solution would
be to add a line to the troubleshooting page, since it is a recurring
problem, and we have similar specific and common error messages already
listed there. Basically two lines, one saying: "Main Database to Old or
Corrupt": the most likely cause of this error is a faulty setting in the
config. files. Check that you have indicated the correct database in
file xxx; and also that you have changed the user name in xxxx."

I also think there should be an indication that the desired dbase system
needs to be set in the config files, otherwise the default is SqlLite.

Finally, I wonder if supplying values for dbase and username in the
config files is really wise, especially in the case of the dbase
username (nobody is likely to use Joe User, so this can ONLY cause
trouble), and probably in the case of SqlLite, since many people will
want to use either MySql or PostGres.

A better approach IMO would be to use a script to ask users for the
username and dbase server type (the way mediawiki do for username);
failing that leaving them blank and *requiring* users to fill in the
requisite fields of the config files might be an answer that would
prevent some grief. Since they have to go in to change the username
anyway, it seems to me not to hurt the installation setup process any.

-d

On Mon, 2006-29-05 at 09:49 -0700, Rich Shepard wrote:
> On Mon, 29 May 2006, Markus Hoenicka wrote:
> 
> > Flexibility seems to have its price. How can we prevent mishaps like this
> > one in the future? Better debug information? Better error messages? Better
> > docs? All of the above?
> 
> Markus,
> 
>    Perhaps by not letting us new users install the software until we've read
> the admin manual completely -- and passed a test on it. :-)
> 
>    Of course, your mail volume would drop substantially in this case, but that
> might be a Good Thing.
> 
> Rich
> 
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell, PhD
Acting Chair and Associate Professor of English
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
Canada

Vox: +1 (403) 329-2378/-2377
Fax: +1 (403) 382-7191

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Rich Shepard <rsh...@ap...> was heard to say:

> Markus,
>
>    Perhaps by not letting us new users install the software until we've read
> the admin manual completely -- and passed a test on it. :-)
>

The RCSI (RefDB certified system installer) test? Let's see whether I can
incorporate a multiple choice test into the configure script...

regards,
Markus

-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Mon, 29 May 2006, Markus Hoenicka wrote:

> Flexibility seems to have its price. How can we prevent mishaps like this
> one in the future? Better debug information? Better error messages? Better
> docs? All of the above?

Markus,

   Perhaps by not letting us new users install the software until we've read
the admin manual completely -- and passed a test on it. :-)

   Of course, your mail volume would drop substantially in this case, but that
might be a Good Thing.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.             |  The Environmental Permitting
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.(TM)  |          Accelerator
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi Dan,

Holy s...! We could have solved this months ago by simply looking at the output
of the refdb-bug script (which was designed to find configuration errors like
this). I should have insisted on having a look.

Flexibility seems to have its price. How can we prevent mishaps like this one in
the future? Better debug information? Better error messages? Better docs? All of
the above?

regards,
Markus

Dan O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:

> A redfaced solution.
>
> I think I figured out what the problem is. It doesn't speak well of me,
> but since I hate people who answer their own queries with "nevermind, I
> solved it" I'll specify:
>
> There were always two problems: 1) I was getting a dbase too old or
> corrupt, and 2) I didn't seem to be using MySql. The solution to both
> problems lay in the config files: you need to change the default dbase
> to MySql (if that's what you want), and you need to change the default
> username to whatever is required by the dbase.
>
> This gets rid of the errors I've been having all along. Now I don't seem
> able to able to finish the creation or new users or databases, but that
> may be simply a result of my never reading the manual past trouble
> shooting, since I couldn't get past the "main db corrupt" error.
>



-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Dan O'D. <dan...@ul...>]

A redfaced solution.

I think I figured out what the problem is. It doesn't speak well of me,
but since I hate people who answer their own queries with "nevermind, I
solved it" I'll specify:

There were always two problems: 1) I was getting a dbase too old or
corrupt, and 2) I didn't seem to be using MySql. The solution to both
problems lay in the config files: you need to change the default dbase
to MySql (if that's what you want), and you need to change the default
username to whatever is required by the dbase.

This gets rid of the errors I've been having all along. Now I don't seem
able to able to finish the creation or new users or databases, but that
may be simply a result of my never reading the manual past trouble
shooting, since I couldn't get past the "main db corrupt" error.

-d


On Mon, 2006-29-05 at 11:14 +0200, Markus Hoenicka wrote:
> Hi Daniel,
> 
> as much as I'd like to resolve this issue before the next release (I'm almost
> done), I was not able to reproduce it yet. I need input from anyone who ever
> bumped into this problem. Unfortunately it is likely that users experiencing
> this problem get frustrated and toss refdb instead of subscribing to the list.
> Did you run the tests that I suggested in my previous reply:
> 
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=10200584&forum_id=1798
> 
> regards,
> Markus
> 
> Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:
> 
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm making one of my periodic attempts to get refdb set up under Ubuntu
> > (this time in dapper using mysql5). I've got the database too old or
> > corrupt error again.
> >
> > As this ever been solved? This installation was on a clean system.
> 
> 
> 
-- 
Daniel Paul O'Donnell, PhD
Acting Chair and Associate Professor of English
Director, Digital Medievalist Project
<http://www.digitalmedievalist.org/>
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4
Canada

Vox: +1 (403) 329-2378/-2377
Fax: +1 (403) 382-7191

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Mon, 29 May 2006, Markus Hoenicka wrote:

> I just recalled a nifty "feature" of PostgreSQL on Debian. To increase
> security, you had to be logged in as the postgres (or pgsql, don't recall
> the exact name) user in order to do administrative stuff. Does anyone know
> whether MySQL on Debian uses a similar trick these days?

Markus,

   No, I don't know that answer because I don't use mysql. For future
reference, the username is 'postgres' in PostgreSQL.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.             |  The Environmental Permitting
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.(TM)  |          Accelerator
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi,

I just recalled a nifty "feature" of PostgreSQL on Debian. To increase security,
you had to be logged in as the postgres (or pgsql, don't recall the exact name)
user in order to do administrative stuff. Does anyone know whether MySQL on
Debian uses a similar trick these days?

regards,
Markus

Markus Hoenicka <mar...@mh...> was heard to say:

> Hi Daniel,
>
> as much as I'd like to resolve this issue before the next release (I'm almost
> done), I was not able to reproduce it yet. I need input from anyone who ever
> bumped into this problem. Unfortunately it is likely that users experiencing
> this problem get frustrated and toss refdb instead of subscribing to the
> list.



-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de

Re: [Refdb-users] was database too old or corrupt error on debian ever solved

[Markus H. <mar...@mh...>]

Hi Daniel,

as much as I'd like to resolve this issue before the next release (I'm almost
done), I was not able to reproduce it yet. I need input from anyone who ever
bumped into this problem. Unfortunately it is likely that users experiencing
this problem get frustrated and toss refdb instead of subscribing to the list.
Did you run the tests that I suggested in my previous reply:

http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=10200584&forum_id=1798

regards,
Markus

Daniel O'Donnell <dan...@ul...> was heard to say:

> Hi,
>
> I'm making one of my periodic attempts to get refdb set up under Ubuntu
> (this time in dapper using mysql5). I've got the database too old or
> corrupt error again.
>
> As this ever been solved? This installation was on a clean system.



-- 
Markus Hoenicka
mar...@ca...
(Spam-protected email: replace the quadrupeds with "mhoenicka")
http://www.mhoenicka.de