rails-devel — List for discussion of Rails development

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[John D. G. <jd...@di...>]

> Volker Schnell wrote:
>> from the Rules (first german, then english)
>> 2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft worden, ist >> die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
>> 2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält der
>> Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der Gesellschaft.
>> 2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der AG auf
>> der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen Markern belegt, wird
>> er unter diese geschoben.
>>
>> english. [fixed spelling - JDG]
>> 2.7.1. If 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the company
>> "operates"
>> 2.7.2. At the time the company operates, the director receives the company
>> sheet and all company-tokens.
>> 2.7.3. One marker is laid at the marked Position of the company on the stock-
>> table.  If the field is already occupied by other tokens, then the token is
>> placed under the other tokens.

Placing a company's stock market token only when it operates seems wrong,
because normally the positions of the stock market tokens determine the order
in which all the major companies will operate.

Am I right in thinking this means that a company's home station also is laid
when it first operates, and not when it floats?  This would be exactly opposite
to both English versions of the rules (especially the first edition).  In those,
a company's home station is placed on the map during the stock round as soon as
50% is purchased.  (The second edition made BA an exception.)  This will make a
big difference in play -- especially in the case of HE, which often blocks other
companies as soon as it is placed.

I suggest that this behavior be made a setup option, because nobody I know is
going to want to change to your version.

Stefan Frey wrote:
> And another PS: Does anybody now when in general is the stock market 
> token placed for other 18xx with par prices? I do not have time to
> check that now, but I had guessed that it usually happens at the same 
> time that the par price is set (so after the president shares is bought).

That's correct for 1830 and most games with a similar market, because you can
sell shares to the bank pool right away, even if the company hasn't floated
yet.

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Mike B. <com...@ip...>]

That should be "sell shares" not "see shares"!

Mike



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Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Mike B. <com...@ip...>]

Sorry for any confusion, Stefan!

The two would seem to go hand-in-hand - you have to have a token on the
stock market board to reflect changed values if you can see shares. But I
think that the 1830 game and its variants are the only ones where this is
the case.

Most of the 18xx games explicitly state that you can't sell shares until the
company has floated, or (in some cases) actually had an operating round.

Mike Bourke
Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com



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Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Mike:
you really got me confused for a few moments: But I doubt that your 
first paragraph is correct for 1830 (at least the original game):
It is allowed to sell shares even if the company has not yet floated and 
this moves the stock market token down.

There are three conditions in the original rules of 1830 (rule 12):

"During his or her turn of a Stock Round a player may sell any amount of 
Railroad stock except that:
1) No stock may be sold during the first Stock Round.
2) No further stock in a Corporation may be sold if the Bank Pool 
already holds 50% of the stock in that Railroad.
3) The president’s stock certificate may NOT be sold into the Pool; it 
can only be disposed of as explained in 13.0."

It does not disallow selling stock of a company that has not yet floated.

And rule 8.1 of 1830 states that the stock market token is put down as 
soon as the president's certificate is taken from the bank.

But it might be different for other games, especially those which delay 
selling the first certificate (see 
http://www.fwtwr.com/18xx/rules_difference_list/2_3.htm)

Stefan


On 05/06/2012 02:55 PM, Mike Bourke wrote:
> In general, tokens are placed on the stock market chart only when sufficient
> shares are sold that the company can operate. Until then, the value remains
> the par value of the stock. One game's rules (I forget which, but one of
> those that does not have fixed par values) suggests placing the tokens on
> the stock market board upside down until the company launches.
>
> The other general rule is that whenever a token enters a space on the stock
> market, it is placed under (and therefore operates after) any counter that
> is already in the space. This rule also comes into effect when one (higher
> stock value) company withholds income while another with a lower stock value
> pays a dividend, such that they both end up in the same space on the stock
> market.
>
> In fact, I am not aware of any exceptions to these general rules, though
> that does not preclude the possibility of there being such an exception. And
> I've played _most_ of the major 18xx games (including 2056, which is an
> asteroid-mining game with many similar mechanics to the 18xx series), so I
> have a fair basis of comparison.
>
> Mike Bourke
> Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
> Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com
>
>
>
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Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Mike B. <com...@ip...>]

In general, tokens are placed on the stock market chart only when sufficient
shares are sold that the company can operate. Until then, the value remains
the par value of the stock. One game's rules (I forget which, but one of
those that does not have fixed par values) suggests placing the tokens on
the stock market board upside down until the company launches.

The other general rule is that whenever a token enters a space on the stock
market, it is placed under (and therefore operates after) any counter that
is already in the space. This rule also comes into effect when one (higher
stock value) company withholds income while another with a lower stock value
pays a dividend, such that they both end up in the same space on the stock
market.

In fact, I am not aware of any exceptions to these general rules, though
that does not preclude the possibility of there being such an exception. And
I've played _most_ of the major 18xx games (including 2056, which is an
asteroid-mining game with many similar mechanics to the 18xx series), so I
have a fair basis of comparison.

Mike Bourke
Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com



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Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Hmm, that's an 1835 rule detail that had slipped out of my mind (it's a long time ago that I played 1835), but you are obviously right.  
Rails now drops an SX token to indicate its price as soon as it starts, as in all other games.

1825, another game with fixed start prices, has the same rule.  Are people aware of other such games?

If the 1835 rule applies to all similar games, we need:
a) a provision to mark fixed start prices on the Stock Chart, to be shown only if a company hasn't yet floated,
b) for fixed start price companies, postpone stock chart token laying until floating time.

If exceptions exist, we'll also need a new game parameter to define the correct rule for each such game.

Erik.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Schnell, Volker [mailto:vol...@ar...]
> Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 11:09 PM
> To: rai...@li...
> Subject: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company
> 
> Hi
> 
> I found another Bug in 1835. Rails-Version 1.7.3 in the SDR 2 Shares of the
> Bayern were sold (92 > 88). In the same round but later the Sax was founded
> (50% sold shares).
> in the following OR Sax operates before the Bayern. see attached saved-file
> Thats wrong.
> 
> from the Rules (first german, then english)
> 2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft worden,
> ist die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
> 2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält der
> Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der Gesellschaft.
> 2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der AG
> auf der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen Markern
> belegt, wird er unter diese geschoben.
> 
> english.
> 2.7.1. if 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the company
> "operates"
> 2.7.2. at the Time, the company operates, the director receives the compony
> sheet and all company-token.
> 2.7.3. One marker is layed at the marked Position of the company on the
> stock-table. If the field is already occupied by other token, then the token is
> placed under the other token.
> 
> greetings
> 
> volker
> 
> --
> Volker Schnell
> email: vol...@ar...
> homepage: home.arcor.de\volker_schnell

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Volker:
thanks for catching this.

I have to admit that I did not know that rule by heart myself, I would 
have guessed that the (stock market) token is layed as soon as the 
president's share is available.
(So in effect BY and SX price markets are on the stock chart from the 
start of the game).

Rails currently lays the token as soon as the president's share is 
bought (so similar what I believe is correct for most 18xx), which given 
the rules quoted is wrong.

It seems that is not excessively hard to change that, but I want to wait 
for Erik's opinion on this.

I will delay the 1.7.4 release until this is fixed.

Stefan

PS: Volker do you know if Lemmi's moderator handles this correctly?

And another PS: Does anybody now when in general is the stock market 
token placed for other 18xx with par prices? I do not have time to
check that now, but I had guessed that it usually happens at the same 
time that the par price is set (so after the president shares is bought).


On 05/06/2012 11:07 AM, Schnell, Volker wrote:
> David, thanks for the hint.
> here is the right one.
>
>
> Am 06.05.2012 02:46, schrieb John David Galt:
>> The save file you attached is from an 18EU game.
>>
>> On 2012-05-05 14:09, Schnell, Volker wrote:
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> I found another Bug in 1835. Rails-Version 1.7.3
>>> in the SDR 2 Shares of the Bayern were sold (92> 88). In the same
>>> round but later the Sax was founded (50% sold shares).
>>> in the following OR Sax operates before the Bayern. see attached
>>> saved-file
>>> Thats wrong.
>>>
>>> from the Rules (first german, then english)
>>> 2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft
>>> worden, ist die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
>>> 2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält
>>> der Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der
>>> Gesellschaft.
>>> 2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der
>>> AG auf der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen
>>> Markern belegt, wird er unter diese geschoben.
>>>
>>> english.
>>> 2.7.1. if 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the
>>> company "operates"
>>> 2.7.2. at the Time, the company operates, the director receives the
>>> compony sheet and all company-token.
>>> 2.7.3. One marker is layed at the marked Position of the company on
>>> the stock-table. If the field is already occupied by other token,
>>> then the token is placed under the other token.
>>>
>>> greetings
>>>
>>> volker
>> If it happened in the first OR, I would agree that that is a bug.
>> I've seen Sx correctly operate before By (once) if Sx floats in SR2.
>
>
>
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Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Schnell, V. <vol...@ar...>]

David, thanks for the hint.
here is the right one.


Am 06.05.2012 02:46, schrieb John David Galt:
> The save file you attached is from an 18EU game.
>
> On 2012-05-05 14:09, Schnell, Volker wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> I found another Bug in 1835. Rails-Version 1.7.3
>> in the SDR 2 Shares of the Bayern were sold (92>  88). In the same round but later the Sax was founded (50% sold shares).
>> in the following OR Sax operates before the Bayern. see attached saved-file
>> Thats wrong.
>>
>> from the Rules (first german, then english)
>> 2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft worden, ist die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
>> 2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält der Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der Gesellschaft.
>> 2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der AG auf der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen Markern belegt, wird er unter diese geschoben.
>>
>> english.
>> 2.7.1. if 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the company "operates"
>> 2.7.2. at the Time, the company operates, the director receives the compony sheet and all company-token.
>> 2.7.3. One marker is layed at the marked Position of the company on the stock-table. If the field is already occupied by other token, then the token is placed under the other token.
>>
>> greetings
>>
>> volker
> If it happened in the first OR, I would agree that that is a bug.
> I've seen Sx correctly operate before By (once) if Sx floats in SR2.

-- 
Volker Schnell
email: vol...@ar...
homepage: home.arcor.de\volker_schnell

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[John D. G. <jd...@di...>]

The save file you attached is from an 18EU game.

On 2012-05-05 14:09, Schnell, Volker wrote:
> Hi
> 
> I found another Bug in 1835. Rails-Version 1.7.3
> in the SDR 2 Shares of the Bayern were sold (92 > 88). In the same round but later the Sax was founded (50% sold shares).
> in the following OR Sax operates before the Bayern. see attached saved-file
> Thats wrong.
> 
> from the Rules (first german, then english)
> 2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft worden, ist die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
> 2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält der Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der Gesellschaft.
> 2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der AG auf der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen Markern belegt, wird er unter diese geschoben.
> 
> english.
> 2.7.1. if 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the company "operates"
> 2.7.2. at the Time, the company operates, the director receives the compony sheet and all company-token.
> 2.7.3. One marker is layed at the marked Position of the company on the stock-table. If the field is already occupied by other token, then the token is placed under the other token.
> 
> greetings
> 
> volker

If it happened in the first OR, I would agree that that is a bug.
I've seen Sx correctly operate before By (once) if Sx floats in SR2.

[Rails-devel] Bug in 1.7.3 1835, Token of a starting company

[Schnell, V. <vol...@ar...>]

Hi

I found another Bug in 1835. Rails-Version 1.7.3
in the SDR 2 Shares of the Bayern were sold (92 > 88). In the same round 
but later the Sax was founded (50% sold shares).
in the following OR Sax operates before the Bayern. see attached saved-file
Thats wrong.

from the Rules (first german, then english)
2.7.1 Sind von einer Gesellschaft mindestens 50% erstmalig verkauft 
worden, ist die Gesellschaft "in Betrieb".
2.7.2 In dem Moment, in dem die Gesellschaft in Betrieb geht, erhält der 
Direktor den entsprechenden Besitzbogen und alle Marker der Gesellschaft.
2.7.3 Einer der Marker wird auf das gekennzeichnete Startposition der AG 
auf der Aktienkurstafel gelegt. Ist das Feld schon von anderen Markern 
belegt, wird er unter diese geschoben.

english.
2.7.1. if 50% Shares of a company are sold for the first time, the 
company "operates"
2.7.2. at the Time, the company operates, the director receives the 
compony sheet and all company-token.
2.7.3. One marker is layed at the marked Position of the company on the 
stock-table. If the field is already occupied by other token, then the 
token is placed under the other token.

greetings

volker

-- 
Volker Schnell
email: vol...@ar...
homepage: home.arcor.de\volker_schnell

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Mike B. <com...@ip...>]

For clarification, I should mention that both of these bugs requires the use
of undo/"play from here" to replicate, but both occurred in direct play the
first time around.

Mike Bourke
Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com





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Re: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications

[Edward R. <ed...@we...>]

SMTP would almost certainly be blocked from desktops.   


On Thursday, 3 May 2012 at 16:00, Bob Probst wrote:

> SMTP wouldn't be blocked but an external host IP might be.  You could point it at a corporate SMTP relay - but that's probably a bigger breach of IT policy than playing games at work.
>  
> Of course, you could also use your local corporate mail client if that functionality were programmed and other than having the mail go through corporate servers, it would be fine.  
>  
> I don't use a local mail client so that option would not be of use to me.
>  
> On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 10:53 AM, Chris Shaffer <chr...@gm... (mailto:chr...@gm...)> wrote:
> > Would such systems work behind my work's corporate firewall?
> >  
> > --
> > Chris
> >  
> > Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.
> >  
> >  
> > On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 5:11 AM, Erik Vos <eri...@xs... (mailto:eri...@xs...)> wrote:
> > > This is an idea I’ve already had in mind for a potential PBEM option.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > But I don’t see why a dedicated SMTP server would be required.  I’m not sure
> > > what kind of email interface is supported by Java, but I would try to use
> > > either the user’s local email system, or his (or any) remote SMTP server.
> > > The former might not be portable, though.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Erik.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Bob Probst [mailto:bob...@gm...]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:17 PM
> > > To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> > > Subject: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Provided that there's an available SMTP relay (I might be able to host one -
> > > and there's plenty of them available for free albeit some for nefarious
> > > purposes), it would be convenient to add a "Notify by Email" option to a
> > > game.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Each player's email address would have to be entered but once there, when a
> > > player finished their move, they could notify the group/next player that it
> > > was their turn.  the email could automatically contain the last set of moves
> > > (as is the case with the copy buffer) and automatically add an appropriate
> > > subject line.  It could even attach the .rails file removing the need to use
> > > dropbox or other file store.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Just a thought, not a priority.
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Live Security Virtual Conference
> > > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> > > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> > > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> > > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Rails-devel mailing list
> > > Rai...@li... (mailto:Rai...@li...)
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
> > >
> >  
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and  
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions  
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware  
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>  
>  

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Stefan, below I'm returning one sub-issue back to you...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Bourke [mailto:com...@ip...]
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:27 AM
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2
> 
> While playing a game of 1830 (simple Option) recently, I noticed a pair of
> subtle bugs in the game system. Log files for these bugs are not available
but
> saved games are, and I have verified that the bugs are reproducible using
the
> specific techniques described below.
> 
> Bug #1: Problem ending company Op round when president has been forced
> to sell shares.
> 
> Details: The B&O president has just been forced to sell shares in order to
> raise the capital for a diesel. Play then moves to the newly-launched C&O,
> but the game freezes. C&O never gets to lay track, the map window (top
> left) reads "lay token" and "no token" and both choices are greyed out, as
> are the buttons at the bottom of the map window ("Done", "undo", "redo").

This kind of behaviour is typical of an uncatched exception.

> However, as soon as "save game" is performed, the problem clears itself.
> 
> To reproduce this bug:
> 
> 1. load 1830_20120415_0220_M4.rails.
> 2. In the game report, locate and click on the entry that reads "B&O does
not
> pay a dividend", then "play from here."
> 3. In the map window, click on "buy train". Note the relative order of L&N
> and C&O shares.
> 4. Sell 2 shares of PRR, 1 share of NYC, and (critical) 1 share of L&N.
Note that
> the relative order of L&N and C&O shares have changed because of the sale
> of shares.

But this is not (yet) reflected in the OR window.  See below.

> 5. Click "done".

And indeed an exception appears on the console:
Exception in thread "AWT-EventQueue-0" java.lang.NullPointerException
	at
rails.ui.swing.MapPanel.scrollPaneShowRectangle(MapPanel.java:113)
	at
rails.ui.swing.ORUIManager.setMapRelatedActions(ORUIManager.java:238)
	at rails.ui.swing.ORUIManager.updateStatus(ORUIManager.java:1677)
	at rails.ui.swing.ORUIManager.updateStatus(ORUIManager.java:1520)
	at rails.ui.swing.GameUIManager.updateUI(GameUIManager.java:562)
	at
rails.ui.swing.GameUIManager.processAction(GameUIManager.java:329)
	at rails.ui.swing.ORWindow.process(ORWindow.java:229)
	at rails.ui.swing.ORUIManager.processAction(ORUIManager.java:434)
	at rails.ui.swing.ORPanel.actionPerformed(ORPanel.java:912)

ORUIManager line 238 has:

                        mapPanel.scrollPaneShowRectangle(
                                NetworkVertex.getVertexMapCoverage(map,
companyGraph.vertexSet()));

and the rectangle passed is null, which causes the exception.
As a quick fix I'm now checking the rectangle in
MapPanel.scrollPaneShowRectangle, and do nothing if it is null. 
This fixes the immediate problem.  

I don't know if NetworkVertex.getVertexMapCoverage() returning a null
rectangle should be considered a bug.  I must leave that to Stefan.

There still is the underlying issue that the game engine does not change the
OR order immediately. 
In the game engine, the OR order is only checked at the point that a new
company turn is about to start.
Independently, the UI checks after every OR action if another company has
got the turn, and if so, it checks the current operating order and recreates
the OR panel grid if it has changed.
So there is no direct link between engine and UI on the OR order.  I
wouldn't be surprised if this disconnect would turn out not to be fully
undo-proof.

> Bug #2: Incorrect display of company names when returning to an earlier
> action and clicking "play from here".
> 
> Details: shortly thereafter in the same game, the L&O took its op round.
> Despite the "unlimited tiles option being turned on, the game would not
> permit a standard yellow city tile (57) to be placed at location H4, the
L&O's
> home base. This appears to be due to an incomplete processing of past
> actions in the "play from here" function, specifically stock movement
> resulting from the forced sale of shares.
> 
> To reproduce this bug:
> 
> 1. load 1830_20120415_0224_M2.rails
> 2. In the game report, locate and click on "M2 sells 1 10% certificate of
NYC to
> pool for $50", then "play from here".
> 3. In the Map window, note that the relative order of L&N and C&O shares
is
> the same as before the B&O president sold a share of the L&N even though
> the game report shows this event as having occurred.

That must also have been the case the first time that this action has been
performed.
At this point, the operating order has not yet been checked, so it is reset
to the old one, both in the game engine and in the UI.

> 4. In the Map Window, click "done".

And now the game engine (correctly) thinks that C&O has the turn, but the UI
does not reflect that, and appears confused in the following steps.
It is not clear to me why the UI order does not change in this case.
Perhaps it is related to the fact that game playing has stepped back to a
point in the middle of emergency money raising, rather than before that
process, as in the first problem.

> 5. Game will not permit L&N to lay a tile in it's home base. The game is
> highlighting valid tile lays for the C&O (which SHOULD operate now) and
will
> permit either of those tiles to be layed.
> 6. If you lay a tile, click "no token", and buy a diesel, it is the C&O
who gains
> the train. Click "done".
> 7. Play then moves to the C&O according to the (incorrect) map window
> display, and all actions appropriate to the L&N's turn (tile lay at H4,
purchase
> of a diesel etc).

One possible approach could be to make the OR order an independent state
variable in the game engine, and have any change immediately trigger an UI
order update.
That's a similar approach as I have recently used to address player order
changes in start and stock rounds.

As emergency money raising is handled in a sub-round of the StockRound type,
I don't think that it is feasible to change the OR order immediately in the
UI. 
But the current approach to check the order at the start of a new turn
should remain sufficient.  

I'll continue sorting it all out later.

Erik.

Re: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications

[Bob P. <bob...@gm...>]

SMTP wouldn't be blocked but an external host IP might be.  You could point
it at a corporate SMTP relay - but that's probably a bigger breach of IT
policy than playing games at work.

Of course, you could also use your local corporate mail client if that
functionality were programmed and other than having the mail go through
corporate servers, it would be fine.

I don't use a local mail client so that option would not be of use to me.

On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 10:53 AM, Chris Shaffer <chr...@gm...>wrote:

> Would such systems work behind my work's corporate firewall?
>
> --
> Chris
>
> Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.
>
>
> On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 5:11 AM, Erik Vos <eri...@xs...> wrote:
> > This is an idea I’ve already had in mind for a potential PBEM option.
> >
> >
> >
> > But I don’t see why a dedicated SMTP server would be required.  I’m not
> sure
> > what kind of email interface is supported by Java, but I would try to use
> > either the user’s local email system, or his (or any) remote SMTP server.
> > The former might not be portable, though.
> >
> >
> >
> > Erik.
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Bob Probst [mailto:bob...@gm...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:17 PM
> > To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> > Subject: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications
> >
> >
> >
> > Provided that there's an available SMTP relay (I might be able to host
> one -
> > and there's plenty of them available for free albeit some for nefarious
> > purposes), it would be convenient to add a "Notify by Email" option to a
> > game.
> >
> >
> >
> > Each player's email address would have to be entered but once there,
> when a
> > player finished their move, they could notify the group/next player that
> it
> > was their turn.  the email could automatically contain the last set of
> moves
> > (as is the case with the copy buffer) and automatically add an
> appropriate
> > subject line.  It could even attach the .rails file removing the need to
> use
> > dropbox or other file store.
> >
> >
> >
> > Just a thought, not a priority.
> >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Live Security Virtual Conference
> > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> > _______________________________________________
> > Rails-devel mailing list
> > Rai...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>

Re: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications

[Chris S. <chr...@gm...>]

Would such systems work behind my work's corporate firewall?

--
Chris

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.


On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 5:11 AM, Erik Vos <eri...@xs...> wrote:
> This is an idea I’ve already had in mind for a potential PBEM option.
>
>
>
> But I don’t see why a dedicated SMTP server would be required.  I’m not sure
> what kind of email interface is supported by Java, but I would try to use
> either the user’s local email system, or his (or any) remote SMTP server.
> The former might not be portable, though.
>
>
>
> Erik.
>
>
>
> From: Bob Probst [mailto:bob...@gm...]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:17 PM
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications
>
>
>
> Provided that there's an available SMTP relay (I might be able to host one -
> and there's plenty of them available for free albeit some for nefarious
> purposes), it would be convenient to add a "Notify by Email" option to a
> game.
>
>
>
> Each player's email address would have to be entered but once there, when a
> player finished their move, they could notify the group/next player that it
> was their turn.  the email could automatically contain the last set of moves
> (as is the case with the copy buffer) and automatically add an appropriate
> subject line.  It could even attach the .rails file removing the need to use
> dropbox or other file store.
>
>
>
> Just a thought, not a priority.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>

Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Erik:
that is a good idea: I would prefer Treasury (not abbreviated) unless 
this skews the UI? Any more opinions on that?

I will wait until tomorrow for the 1.7.4 release if there are at least 
more than three supports for that I would add that change to 1.7.4.
Stefan

On 05/03/2012 01:47 PM, Erik Vos wrote:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2012 7:02 AM
>> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
>> Subject: Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856
>>
>> It is not a bug, however it highlights a subtle problem of the Rails UI:
>> I first thought that it is bug too, as I checked the available cash in the
> row
>> (that is the CV company cash) and not the column (the cash position of the
>> active player).
>>
>> I remember that I had problems with that before and if there will be a
>> redefine of the UI we could address that: The information about the
>> company cash is nice during the Stock Round however it should not lead
>> players to confuse it with the essential display of player cash.
>
> I don't see a real problem here.
> A conceivable change would be to replace [company] Cash by Treasury
> (abbreviated to Treas.).  In both windows, of course.  Would that help?
> Personally, I still prefer Cash.  One word to represent money anywhere
> (including the Bank).
>
> Erik.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

This is an idea I've already had in mind for a potential PBEM option.

 

But I don't see why a dedicated SMTP server would be required.  I'm not sure
what kind of email interface is supported by Java, but I would try to use
either the user's local email system, or his (or any) remote SMTP server.
The former might not be portable, though.

 

Erik.

 

From: Bob Probst [mailto:bob...@gm...] 
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:17 PM
To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
Subject: [Rails-devel] Enhancement Idea: Automated emails notifications

 

Provided that there's an available SMTP relay (I might be able to host one -
and there's plenty of them available for free albeit some for nefarious
purposes), it would be convenient to add a "Notify by Email" option to a
game.  

 

Each player's email address would have to be entered but once there, when a
player finished their move, they could notify the group/next player that it
was their turn.  the email could automatically contain the last set of moves
(as is the case with the copy buffer) and automatically add an appropriate
subject line.  It could even attach the .rails file removing the need to use
dropbox or other file store.

 

Just a thought, not a priority.

Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2012 7:02 AM
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856
> 
> It is not a bug, however it highlights a subtle problem of the Rails UI:
> I first thought that it is bug too, as I checked the available cash in the
row
> (that is the CV company cash) and not the column (the cash position of the
> active player).
> 
> I remember that I had problems with that before and if there will be a
> redefine of the UI we could address that: The information about the
> company cash is nice during the Stock Round however it should not lead
> players to confuse it with the essential display of player cash.

I don't see a real problem here.  
A conceivable change would be to replace [company] Cash by Treasury
(abbreviated to Treas.).  In both windows, of course.  Would that help?
Personally, I still prefer Cash.  One word to represent money anywhere
(including the Bank).

Erik.

Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856

[Phil D. <de...@gm...>]

Agreed, I personally think player cash in columns and company cash in
rows makes sense but I might be blinded from having played so many
games via Rails :p

On 2 May 2012 16:29, Chris Shaffer <chr...@gm...> wrote:
> I think transforming from rows to columns, or vice versa, based on
> context, would be a mistake.
>
> --
> Chris
>
> Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.
>
>
> On Tue, May 1, 2012 at 10:02 PM, Stefan Frey <ste...@we...> wrote:
>> It is not a bug, however it highlights a subtle problem of the Rails UI:
>> I first thought that it is bug too, as I checked the available cash in
>> the row (that is the CV company cash) and not the column (the cash
>> position of the active player).
>>
>> I remember that I had problems with that before and if there will be a
>> redefine of the UI we could address that: The information about the
>> company cash is nice during the Stock Round however it should not lead
>> players to confuse it with the essential display of player cash.
>>
>> Another more general thought: Would someone prefer to have players in
>> rows during the SR? There are two principles conflicting: Have companies
>> in rows (both in SR and OR) or have the acting entity (players in SR,
>> companies in OR) in rows.
>>
>> Stefan
>>
>> On 04/29/2012 07:15 AM, Mike Bourke wrote:
>>> That's because the price per share is $200 and he doesn't have enough money
>>> for a share. No bug here.
>>>
>>> Mike Bourke
>>>
>>> Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
>>>
>>> Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: John David Galt [mailto:jd...@di...]
>>> Sent: Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:02 PM
>>> To: rai...@li...
>>> Subject: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856
>>>
>>> At the point of the attached save file, Biff should be, but is not, allowed
>>> to buy a share of CV from the bank pool.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean.
>>> Virus Database (VPS): 120427-1, 28/04/2012
>>> Tested on: 29/04/2012 3:15:48 PM
>>> avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2012 AVAST Software.
>>> http://www.avast.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Rails-devel mailing list
>>> Rai...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rails-devel mailing list
>> Rai...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856

[Chris S. <chr...@gm...>]

I think transforming from rows to columns, or vice versa, based on
context, would be a mistake.

--
Chris

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.


On Tue, May 1, 2012 at 10:02 PM, Stefan Frey <ste...@we...> wrote:
> It is not a bug, however it highlights a subtle problem of the Rails UI:
> I first thought that it is bug too, as I checked the available cash in
> the row (that is the CV company cash) and not the column (the cash
> position of the active player).
>
> I remember that I had problems with that before and if there will be a
> redefine of the UI we could address that: The information about the
> company cash is nice during the Stock Round however it should not lead
> players to confuse it with the essential display of player cash.
>
> Another more general thought: Would someone prefer to have players in
> rows during the SR? There are two principles conflicting: Have companies
> in rows (both in SR and OR) or have the acting entity (players in SR,
> companies in OR) in rows.
>
> Stefan
>
> On 04/29/2012 07:15 AM, Mike Bourke wrote:
>> That's because the price per share is $200 and he doesn't have enough money
>> for a share. No bug here.
>>
>> Mike Bourke
>>
>> Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
>>
>> Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: John David Galt [mailto:jd...@di...]
>> Sent: Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:02 PM
>> To: rai...@li...
>> Subject: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856
>>
>> At the point of the attached save file, Biff should be, but is not, allowed
>> to buy a share of CV from the bank pool.
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean.
>> Virus Database (VPS): 120427-1, 28/04/2012
>> Tested on: 29/04/2012 3:15:48 PM
>> avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2012 AVAST Software.
>> http://www.avast.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rails-devel mailing list
>> Rai...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Erik & Mike:
sorry I confused both of you (but each in a different way ;-)) by using 
the words "save" and "reload". What I meant by simulating "save and 
reload" this is basically the replaying the game as Erik suggested below.

 From the back-end side of Rails starting a new game inside the existing 
Rails instance is not an issue anymore (as I fixed the few showstoppers 
for the automated testing where all games are replayed sequentially in 
one instance of a java vm), so it is possible to start a new game 
without having troubles with the other.

There might still be problems arise from the UI side, but it should be 
not that difficult as I cannot remember any "global" state used in the 
UI, but I am not the expert there.

Stefan



On 05/02/2012 02:07 PM, Erik Vos wrote:
>> I can confirm both bugs. Both are related to the fact the undo mechanism
> of
>> Rails still has a few bugs remaining.
>>
>> As going back in game history is based on the undo mechanism it shares the
>> issues.
>>
>> This is one of the issues which will be addressed in Rails2.x and will be
>> (hopefully) easier to identifier and fix.
>> As I focus on the core of the rails2.x now (and this is harder work or
> better
>> more tedious work as I hoped it to be), I abstain from looking into the
> precise
>> nature of the bugs (though I have some ideas where to start). Maybe Erik
> will
>> have a look into it?
>
> I will try.  Hints are welcome.
>
>> Usually the effects will not survive reload (as it replays the game from
> the
>> beginning and thus does not use undo). So either the game is loaded in a
>> correct state (most cases) or it is broken and unloadable (only a few
> cases). A
>> general workaround would be a menu item that allows an automatic replay
>> which simulates the sequence of a save and reload and will get the game
>> back into a reasonable state automatically?
>
> Reload does not actually reprocess previous actions, it only checks if all
> saved game actions are either identical to the actions currently in memory,
> or new (i.e. later than the last action currently in memory).   The problem
> is that we don't yet have a good way to clear a whole game other than by
> exiting and restarting Rails.  Perhaps it would work, but I'm afraid the
> hard part is cleaning up memory.  There are thousands of (old and current)
> objects holding references to each other, and I expect a thorough cleanup
> will require a lot of extra code.
>
> Erik
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

> I can confirm both bugs. Both are related to the fact the undo mechanism
of
> Rails still has a few bugs remaining.
> 
> As going back in game history is based on the undo mechanism it shares the
> issues.
> 
> This is one of the issues which will be addressed in Rails2.x and will be
> (hopefully) easier to identifier and fix.
> As I focus on the core of the rails2.x now (and this is harder work or
better
> more tedious work as I hoped it to be), I abstain from looking into the
precise
> nature of the bugs (though I have some ideas where to start). Maybe Erik
will
> have a look into it?

I will try.  Hints are welcome.

> Usually the effects will not survive reload (as it replays the game from
the
> beginning and thus does not use undo). So either the game is loaded in a
> correct state (most cases) or it is broken and unloadable (only a few
cases). A
> general workaround would be a menu item that allows an automatic replay
> which simulates the sequence of a save and reload and will get the game
> back into a reasonable state automatically?

Reload does not actually reprocess previous actions, it only checks if all
saved game actions are either identical to the actions currently in memory,
or new (i.e. later than the last action currently in memory).   The problem
is that we don't yet have a good way to clear a whole game other than by
exiting and restarting Rails.  Perhaps it would work, but I'm afraid the
hard part is cleaning up memory.  There are thousands of (old and current)
objects holding references to each other, and I expect a thorough cleanup
will require a lot of extra code.

Erik

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Mike B. <com...@ip...>]

I think that the proposed solution probably doesn't go far enough - when
"undoing" an action, the game should retreat to the step before the action
from which play is to continue, the game should be saved and automatically
reloaded, and then that final step repeated, so that play always continues
in a "clean" environment.

Repeating that final action rather than saving and reloading at that point
would ensure that the entry into the action to be repeated always took place
in as "game natural" an environment as possible, bypassing any complications
from the save/reload process. That might not be necessary, and it would
almost certainly be a more complicated implementation, but it has other
advantages.

Another possibility is to automatically save the current game and BEFORE
implementing an "undo" action so that a "redo" is possible.

Mike Bourke
Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com



---
avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean.
Virus Database (VPS): 120501-0, 01/05/2012
Tested on: 2/05/2012 7:41:49 PM
avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2012 AVAST Software.
http://www.avast.com

Re: [Rails-devel] Bug Report 1830 Rails1.7.2

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Mike:
thanks for the (detailed) bug reports.

I can confirm both bugs. Both are related to the fact the undo mechanism 
of Rails still has a few bugs remaining.

As going back in game history is based on the undo mechanism it shares
the issues.

This is one of the issues which will be addressed in Rails2.x and will 
be (hopefully) easier to identifier and fix.
As I focus on the core of the rails2.x now (and this is harder work or 
better more tedious work as I hoped it to be), I abstain from looking 
into the precise nature of the bugs (though I have some ideas where to 
start). Maybe Erik will have a look into it?

Usually the effects will not survive reload (as it replays the game from 
the beginning and thus does not use undo). So either the game is loaded 
in a correct state (most cases) or it is broken and unloadable (only a 
few cases). A general workaround would be a menu item that allows an 
automatic replay which simulates the sequence of a save and reload and 
will get the game back into a reasonable state automatically?

Stefan


On 04/18/2012 07:26 AM, Mike Bourke wrote:
> While playing a game of 1830 (simple Option) recently, I noticed a pair of
> subtle bugs in the game system. Log files for these bugs are not available
> but saved games are, and I have verified that the bugs are reproducible
> using the specific techniques described below.
>
> Bug #1: Problem ending company Op round when president has been forced to
> sell shares.
>
> Details: The B&O president has just been forced to sell shares in order to
> raise the capital for a diesel. Play then moves to the newly-launched C&O,
> but the game freezes. C&O never gets to lay track, the map window (top left)
> reads "lay token" and "no token" and both choices are greyed out, as are the
> buttons at the bottom of the map window ("Done", "undo", "redo"). However,
> as soon as "save game" is performed, the problem clears itself.
>
> To reproduce this bug:
>
> 1. load 1830_20120415_0220_M4.rails.
> 2. In the game report, locate and click on the entry that reads "B&O does
> not pay a dividend", then "play from here."
> 3. In the map window, click on "buy train". Note the relative order of L&N
> and C&O shares.
> 4. Sell 2 shares of PRR, 1 share of NYC, and (critical) 1 share of L&N. Note
> that the relative order of L&N and C&O shares have changed because of the
> sale of shares.
> 5. Click "done".
>
> Bug #2: Incorrect display of company names when returning to an earlier
> action and clicking "play from here".
>
> Details: shortly thereafter in the same game, the L&O took its op round.
> Despite the "unlimited tiles option being turned on, the game would not
> permit a standard yellow city tile (57) to be placed at location H4, the
> L&O's home base. This appears to be due to an incomplete processing of past
> actions in the "play from here" function, specifically stock movement
> resulting from the forced sale of shares.
>
> To reproduce this bug:
>
> 1. load 1830_20120415_0224_M2.rails
> 2. In the game report, locate and click on "M2 sells 1 10% certificate of
> NYC to pool for $50", then "play from here".
> 3. In the Map window, note that the relative order of L&N and C&O shares is
> the same as before the B&O president sold a share of the L&N even though the
> game report shows this event as having occurred.
> 4. In the Map Window, click "done".
> 5. Game will not permit L&N to lay a tile in it's home base. The game is
> highlighting valid tile lays for the C&O (which SHOULD operate now) and will
> permit either of those tiles to be layed.
> 6. If you lay a tile, click "no token", and buy a diesel, it is the C&O who
> gains the train. Click "done".
> 7. Play then moves to the C&O according to the (incorrect) map window
> display, and all actions appropriate to the L&N's turn (tile lay at H4,
> purchase of a diesel etc).
>
> Mike Bourke
> Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
> Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
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> avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2012 AVAST Software.
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Re: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

It is not a bug, however it highlights a subtle problem of the Rails UI: 
I first thought that it is bug too, as I checked the available cash in 
the row (that is the CV company cash) and not the column (the cash 
position of the active player).

I remember that I had problems with that before and if there will be a 
redefine of the UI we could address that: The information about the 
company cash is nice during the Stock Round however it should not lead 
players to confuse it with the essential display of player cash.

Another more general thought: Would someone prefer to have players in 
rows during the SR? There are two principles conflicting: Have companies 
in rows (both in SR and OR) or have the acting entity (players in SR, 
companies in OR) in rows.

Stefan

On 04/29/2012 07:15 AM, Mike Bourke wrote:
> That's because the price per share is $200 and he doesn't have enough money
> for a share. No bug here.
>
> Mike Bourke
>
> Campaign Mastery http://www.campaignmastery.com
>
> Co-author, Assassin's Amulet http://www.legaciescampaignsetting.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John David Galt [mailto:jd...@di...]
> Sent: Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:02 PM
> To: rai...@li...
> Subject: [Rails-devel] Rails 1.7.3 bug - 1856
>
> At the point of the attached save file, Biff should be, but is not, allowed
> to buy a share of CV from the bank pool.
>
>
>
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