From: Rafael L. <rla...@us...> - 2006-05-12 13:43:26
|
This is no scoop, since you probably saw the SF announcement from yesterday. You noticed that the hostname changed fro cvs.sf.net to cvs.plplot.sf.net. This mean that you should do a fresh cvs checkout to get the right URL in the working copies. It is also possible to cvs update your working copies by doing form the topdir: perl -pi -e 's/cvs\./plplot.cvs./' `find . -name Root` cvs update Off-topic: what about switching from CVS to Subversion, which is now supported at SF? -- Rafael |
From: Andrew R. <and...@us...> - 2006-05-12 15:46:32
|
Rafael, On Fri, May 12, 2006 at 03:43:16PM +0200, Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > This is no scoop, since you probably saw the SF announcement from yesterday. > You noticed that the hostname changed fro cvs.sf.net to cvs.plplot.sf.net. > This mean that you should do a fresh cvs checkout to get the right URL in > the working copies. It is also possible to cvs update your working copies > by doing form the topdir: > > perl -pi -e 's/cvs\./plplot.cvs./' `find . -name Root` *spot the test mistake -> cvs.plplot not plplot.cvs* > cvs update Thanks for the heads up about cvs. I didn't get sf announcement, so it may only have gone to project admins. Anyway, I can now connect to the new cvs service, but I can't update or checkout a clean plplot. I get the error message Cannot access /cvroot/plplot/CVSROOT No such file or directory Has the path changed as well? Cheers Andrew > > Off-topic: what about switching from CVS to Subversion, which is now > supported at SF? I have no personal experience of Subversion, but I have heard some good things. It has been on my "things to try" list for a while. Has anyone else used it much? |
From: Rafael L. <rla...@us...> - 2006-05-12 16:50:56
|
* Andrew Ross <and...@us...> [2006-05-12 16:46]: > I have no personal experience of Subversion, but I have heard some good > things. It has been on my "things to try" list for a while. Has anyone > else used it much? <ADVOCACY> For my personal projects, I use now exclusively Subversion. For every new public project that I started since one year or so (e.g. http://pkg-octave.alioth.debian.org), I have chosen Subversion whenever I could. CVS is a real crap, it is hack over hack on that initial RCS-based crazy design. I can hardly understand how it managed to live so long. I hope it will die soon and disappear from Earth. Subversion is not the perfect, ultimate version control system but has the big advantage of being a quasi-drop-in replacement for CVS. The learning curve is very steep. Besides, it has a clean design, does atomic commits, has provisions for renaming and moving files and directories, "svn diff" works without transactions with the server, etc, etc. In sum, it addresses all the weak points of CVS. There are plenty of good tutorials available on the web, not to mention the great book http://svnbook.red-bean.com/ I used cvs2svn tool to convert all my CVS repositories into SVN (http://cvs2svn.tigris.org/). It rocks! </ADVOCACY> That said, if you guys decide to stick with CVS, I will just sigh and keep going. -- Rafael |
From: Alan W. I. <ir...@be...> - 2006-05-12 18:54:14
|
On 2006-05-12 18:50+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > Subversion is not the perfect, ultimate version control system but has > the big advantage of being a quasi-drop-in replacement for CVS. That's good to hear. > The > learning curve is very steep. I presume/hope you meant _not_ very steep? :-) Alan __________________________ Alan W. Irwin Astronomical research affiliation with Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Victoria (astrowww.phys.uvic.ca). Programming affiliations with the FreeEOS equation-of-state implementation for stellar interiors (freeeos.sf.net); PLplot scientific plotting software package (plplot.org); the Yorick front-end to PLplot (yplot.sf.net); the Loads of Linux Links project (loll.sf.net); and the Linux Brochure Project (lbproject.sf.net). __________________________ Linux-powered Science __________________________ |
From: Rafael L. <rla...@us...> - 2006-05-12 20:20:30
|
* Alan W. Irwin <ir...@be...> [2006-05-12 11:53]: > On 2006-05-12 18:50+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > > > The learning curve is very steep. > > I presume/hope you meant _not_ very steep? :-) This is a language problem. I have already seen the expression "steep learning curve" used to mean "hard to learn", which is obviously wrong for me. Indeed, if a learnign curve is steep, this means that for smaller increments of time, larger gains in learning are accomplished. For something that is difficult to learn, I would use instead "shallow learning curve" or whatever. At any rate, English is not my native language and you probably know better than me. -- Rafael |
From: Arjen M. <arj...@wl...> - 2006-05-17 06:25:07
|
Rafael Laboissiere wrote: >* Alan W. Irwin <ir...@be...> [2006-05-12 11:53]: > > > >>On 2006-05-12 18:50+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: >> >> >> >>>The learning curve is very steep. >>> >>> >>I presume/hope you meant _not_ very steep? :-) >> >> > >This is a language problem. I have already seen the expression "steep >learning curve" used to mean "hard to learn", which is obviously wrong >for me. Indeed, if a learnign curve is steep, this means that for >smaller increments of time, larger gains in learning are accomplished. >For something that is difficult to learn, I would use instead "shallow >learning curve" or whatever. > >At any rate, English is not my native language and you probably know >better than me. > > Rafael, you are not the only one with that particular language problem :). I have always wondered myself why this expression is used and not something like "easy to learn", which seems more direct to me - steep usually has a ring of difficult or dangerous to it ... Regards, Arjen |
From: Alan W. I. <ir...@be...> - 2006-05-12 17:23:28
|
On 2006-05-12 16:46+0100 Andrew Ross wrote: > Thanks for the heads up about cvs. I didn't get sf announcement, so it > may only have gone to project admins. Anyway, I can now connect to the > new cvs service, but I can't update or checkout a clean plplot. I get > the error message > > Cannot access /cvroot/plplot/CVSROOT > No such file or directory > > Has the path changed as well? cvs checkout _to a totally new directory_ works for me using, e.g., export CVSROOT=ai...@pl...:/cvsroot/plplot Note the change in server name from cvs.sourceforge.net to plplot.cvs.sourceforge.net. Furthermore, when I compare the freshly checked out tree with a PLplot tree with all my changes in it, it looks like all is well, that is, our repository did not seem to be hurt by the SourceForge disk crash, and the only differences are ones that I have introduced by my local changes. I will be committing those changes starting now. I will attempt to make the commits in an order that will keep CVS HEAD unbroken during the process, but no guarantees, of course. Thus, if CVS HEAD does not build for you today, please be patient and wait for the end of my commits (which I will announce here). Those using anon CVS will probably have to wait even longer. From the SourceForge announcement there will be a maximum sync delay of that service of 2 hours relative to the primary CVS server. Alan |
From: Alan W. I. <ir...@be...> - 2006-05-12 16:08:24
|
On 2006-05-12 15:43+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > This is no scoop, since you probably saw the SF announcement from yesterday. > You noticed that the hostname changed fro cvs.sf.net to cvs.plplot.sf.net. That's actually cvs.sourceforge.net ==> plplot.cvs.sourceforge.net so the "plplot.cvs" order in the perl below is correct (although I am still going to do a fresh checkout instead). > This mean that you should do a fresh cvs checkout to get the right URL in > the working copies. It is also possible to cvs update your working copies > by doing form the topdir: > > perl -pi -e 's/cvs\./plplot.cvs./' `find . -name Root` > cvs update > Alan __________________________ Alan W. Irwin Astronomical research affiliation with Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Victoria (astrowww.phys.uvic.ca). Programming affiliations with the FreeEOS equation-of-state implementation for stellar interiors (freeeos.sf.net); PLplot scientific plotting software package (plplot.org); the Yorick front-end to PLplot (yplot.sf.net); the Loads of Linux Links project (loll.sf.net); and the Linux Brochure Project (lbproject.sf.net). __________________________ Linux-powered Science __________________________ |
From: Rafael L. <rla...@us...> - 2006-05-12 16:21:58
|
* Alan W. Irwin <ir...@be...> [2006-05-12 09:07]: > That's actually cvs.sourceforge.net ==> plplot.cvs.sourceforge.net so the > "plplot.cvs" order in the perl below is correct Thanks for the heads up. > (although I am still going to do a fresh checkout instead). I do not understand the motivation of your decision, but it will represent extra work for you since you will have to copy your locally modified files into the freshly checked out directory tree. Your mileage may vary. I am lazy. Laziness is one of the three chief virtues of a programmer (http://lwn.net/2001/features/LarryWall/) -- Rafael |
From: Alan W. I. <ir...@be...> - 2006-05-12 16:37:29
|
On 2006-05-12 15:43+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > what about switching from CVS to Subversion, which is now > supported at SF? > I think we should do this. I have no experience with subversion, but according to everything I have read, subversion is a complete rewrite of CVS that has resulted in a solid product that removes a lot of the stupid restrictions of CVS. Now that SourceForge is supporting subversion, I suspect it is only a matter of time (probably still a few years, but finite) that they continue to support CVS. So I would rather we make the transition to subversion at a time of our choosing rather than in a rush under some deadline. Furthermore, I understand there is a script that allows you to convert all the information (including history) in a CVS repository into Subversion form. But how well that script works depends, of course, on how standard your CVS repository is. In the past, I found some difficult problems with our CVS repository (cvs export was resurrecting all sorts of long-deleted files). I believe I solved that particular issue, but there may be more. Rafael, would you be willing to lead such a conversion effort late this year when your personal time crunch (and mine as well) would have eased off a bit? Assuming you would like to do this, I would be willing to help (starting from zero knowledge of subversion). Here are some essential tests we should run to reassure people that we would not lose anything important in the conversion from CVS repository to subversion repository. (1) Can we produce the same complete ChangeLog with subversion as cvs2cl does with the CVS repo? This test confirms that we can get access to all our commit messages from day 1 using the subversion repository. (2) Can we reproduce, say, the 499j "Texas" tarball as well as a good selection of our SourceForge release tarballs using appropriate dates and release tags? I am sure the tarballs would be of slightly different format, but the question is whether once they are unpacked are the files, dates, and permissions identical? This test shows that our code base is accessible by both date and tag from a variety of past times using our subversion repository. Assuming the subversion repository we created from our cvs repository passed the tests above, I would be happy to start using that subversion repository at SourceForge. Alan __________________________ Alan W. Irwin Astronomical research affiliation with Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Victoria (astrowww.phys.uvic.ca). Programming affiliations with the FreeEOS equation-of-state implementation for stellar interiors (freeeos.sf.net); PLplot scientific plotting software package (plplot.org); the Yorick front-end to PLplot (yplot.sf.net); the Loads of Linux Links project (loll.sf.net); and the Linux Brochure Project (lbproject.sf.net). __________________________ Linux-powered Science __________________________ |
From: Rafael L. <rla...@us...> - 2006-05-12 17:01:41
|
* Alan W. Irwin <ir...@be...> [2006-05-12 09:36]: > On 2006-05-12 15:43+0200 Rafael Laboissiere wrote: > > >what about switching from CVS to Subversion, which is now > >supported at SF? > > > > I think we should do this. [snip] Our messages crossed. I am glad you also wish to do the switch. > Rafael, would you be willing to lead such a conversion effort late this > year when your personal time crunch (and mine as well) would have eased > off a bit? Assuming you would like to do this, I would be willing to > help (starting from zero knowledge of subversion). I guess I have no choice than stepping forward, after doing so much advocacy. However, I would only start investigating the issue when all the developers either do not care or wish the move. This is the sine qua non condition. Furthermore, I am afraid it will have to be delayed for some months, because I will be moving this Summer. -- Rafael |
From: <mj...@br...> - 2006-05-21 03:30:55
|
Alan W. Irwin writes: > .. > Here are some essential tests we should run to reassure people that we would > not lose anything important in the conversion from CVS repository to > subversion repository. > .. I too regard a switch to subversion as an inevitability. In fact I've looked forward to switching for some time, since first reading about it. Just a matter of timing. If Alan's criteria can be satisfied, and it represents a minimal diversion, I've no aversion to the conversion to subversion. :) -- Maurice LeBrun mj...@br... |
From: Alan W. I. <ir...@be...> - 2006-05-21 04:58:22
|
On 2006-05-20 22:30-0500 mj...@br... wrote: > Alan W. Irwin writes: > > .. > > Here are some essential tests we should run to reassure people that we would > > not lose anything important in the conversion from CVS repository to > > subversion repository. > > .. > > I too regard a switch to subversion as an inevitability. In fact I've looked > forward to switching for some time, since first reading about it. Just a > matter of timing. If Alan's criteria can be satisfied, and it represents a > minimal diversion, I've no aversion to the conversion to subversion. :) Which version of subversion for the conversion without diversion or adversion? :-) Alan __________________________ Alan W. Irwin Astronomical research affiliation with Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Victoria (astrowww.phys.uvic.ca). Programming affiliations with the FreeEOS equation-of-state implementation for stellar interiors (freeeos.sf.net); PLplot scientific plotting software package (plplot.org); the Yorick front-end to PLplot (yplot.sf.net); the Loads of Linux Links project (loll.sf.net); and the Linux Brochure Project (lbproject.sf.net). __________________________ Linux-powered Science __________________________ |
From: <mj...@br...> - 2006-05-21 06:28:50
|
Alan W. Irwin writes: > On 2006-05-20 22:30-0500 mj...@br... wrote: > > I too regard a switch to subversion as an inevitability. In fact I've looked > > forward to switching for some time, since first reading about it. Just a > > matter of timing. If Alan's criteria can be satisfied, and it represents a > > minimal diversion, I've no aversion to the conversion to subversion. :) > > Which version of subversion for the conversion without diversion or adversion? Oh, whatever's good for our immersion and detersion without recursion or reversion. (hmm.. too bad no Iranians on the dev team.. heh :) -- Maurice LeBrun |
From: Arjen M. <arj...@wl...> - 2006-05-22 07:21:36
|
Alan W. Irwin wrote: > On 2006-05-20 22:30-0500 mj...@br... wrote: > >> Alan W. Irwin writes: >> > .. >> > Here are some essential tests we should run to reassure people that >> we would >> > not lose anything important in the conversion from CVS repository to >> > subversion repository. >> > .. >> >> I too regard a switch to subversion as an inevitability. In fact >> I've looked >> forward to switching for some time, since first reading about it. >> Just a >> matter of timing. If Alan's criteria can be satisfied, and it >> represents a >> minimal diversion, I've no aversion to the conversion to subversion. :) > > > Which version of subversion for the conversion without diversion or > adversion? I just checked: subversion is available for Cygwin - that was my main concern. I have no objection to this motion. Regards, Arjen |