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From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-16 23:53:14
|
--- John De Oliveira <jo...@cy...> wrote: > I read through them, but I'm sure there are still > some > mistakes. So, if you let me know what you find, I'll make > corrections. please add : How can i compile this java code under linux? How can i export this daml under linux? mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: John De O. <jo...@cy...> - 2003-01-16 23:45:41
|
There is a new Frequently Asked Questions doc at: http://www.opencyc.org/faq/ Really they're not all frequently asked. Many of them were just asked once. I'm thinking about renaming it "Formerly Asked Questions". That's because, optimistically speaking, they shouldn't be asked again, since people can just read the FAQ! I read through them, but I'm sure there are still some mistakes. So, if you let me know what you find, I'll make corrections. Thanks, John D. Cycorp |
From: Richard H. M. <rh...@cd...> - 2003-01-08 17:21:03
|
The purpose of this note is to update you on my Stanford TAP KB efforts, = and the tools that I am using. 1. I have upgraded my Knowledge Explorer (KE) program to read all three = of the download formats=20 of the TAP KB: mcf, rdf, daml.. 2. I have written a command, mkrGetData, which translates MKR questions = into TAP KB queries which are passed to Rob McCool's Java TAP client to retrieve answers = from the TAP KB. 3. I am currently integrating TAP and tabula rasa contexts into a single = context. a. I downloaded tap.daml from TAP KB. b I translated it into MKR using my rdf2mkr command c. I am using MKR concept integration & differentiation commands, isi = and isd,=20 plus manual editing of hierarchy outlines (KE output becomes KE input) d. I am using MKR scripts to automatically rebuild the KB after edits. For the details of 3, you can browse my web site directory http://www.volcano.net/~rhm/knowledge/application/SemanticWeb/TAP=20 Specific files of interest are tap.daml TAP KB download (without instances) tap.mkr MKR KB (without instances) taphi1.ho merged TAP and tabula rasa context (partial KE output) tapisi.mkr MKR concept integration commands (first step) taphi2.ho integrated TAP and tabula rasa context (first step) = (partial KE output) tapscript.ho MKR script to read KB and apply integration rules I also have the full TAP KB in both rdf and mkr formats. I haven't = installed these=20 files on my web site because they're about 15 MB each. 4. As a fun project, I wrote an ExtractData command for a friend. GetLetter is a KornShell script which downloads the daily batch of = Letters to the Editor from the Fresno Bee web site, using either wget or rebol. =20 ExtractData is a Unicon procedure, integrated into KE, which parses each = Letter=20 (unfortunately, no RSS at Fresno Bee) and records the information in = MKR. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 Dick McCullough=20 knowledge :=3D man do identify od existent done knowledge haspart proposition list |
From: Sam L. <Sam...@le...> - 2003-01-08 13:43:17
|
-----Original Message----- From: Richard H. McCullough [mailto:rh...@cd...] Sent: 06 January 2003 20:38 To: ope...@li...; Rich Morin Cc: Rob McCool; Danny Ayers Subject: Re: [OpenCyc-devel] YACycL (CycL, in YAML) I have similar interests. I invented MKR, an English-like and UNIX(shell)-like knowledge representation language. I would like to develop an MKR interface to OpenCyc. I already have an MKR interface to the Stanford TAP KB. My Knowledge Explorer program can read TAP RDF & MCF files. My mkrGetData & mkrGetResourcesNamed commands use the TAP Java client to access the KB. ============ Dick McCullough knowledge <http://rhm.cdepot.net/> := man do identify od existent done [SJL] This actually looks more interesting than cycl because I can actually make it DO something. I've been looking for a DB system to know and organise relationships of responsibility and reporting without going mad making it, and I think I'll try this. Thanks Sam |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-07 07:39:37
|
--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: > At 1:59 PM -0800 1/6/03, James Michael DuPont wrote: > >yaml is cool. > >Ingy rules. > > > >I cannot even get the standard dumper running under linux > >even after i get it running, it terminates without message. > >can any of you export at all? > > This would be more appropriately asked in the YAML-Core list: Sorry, I mean under open-cyc. The 0.7 just does not dump anything, at least not for me under Debian GNU linux woody with JDK 1.4. I have messing with Cyc untill a new release comes out that works. mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: Rich M. <rd...@cf...> - 2003-01-07 04:59:15
|
RM>This would be more appropriately asked in the YAML-Core list: List-Help: <mailto:yam...@li...?subject=help> ... And _I_ should be more careful about editing the "To:" line. Sorry all, I meant this as a private reply... -r -- email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection |
From: Rich M. <rd...@cf...> - 2003-01-07 04:46:17
|
At 1:59 PM -0800 1/6/03, James Michael DuPont wrote: >yaml is cool. >Ingy rules. > >I cannot even get the standard dumper running under linux >even after i get it running, it terminates without message. >can any of you export at all? This would be more appropriately asked in the YAML-Core list: List-Help: <mailto:yam...@li...?subject=help> List-Post: <mailto:yam...@li...> List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/yaml-core>, <mailto:yam...@li...?subject=subscribe> List-Id: <yaml-core.lists.sourceforge.net> List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/yaml-core>, <mailto:yam...@li...?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum=yaml-core> -r -- email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection |
From: Charles S. <cas...@cs...> - 2003-01-06 22:21:19
|
On Monday, January 6, 2003, at 02:21 PM, Rich Morin wrote: > > I'm a bit concerned, however, about the completeness of this approach. > This CYC example: > > CYC(1): (genls #$Person) > (#<(#$CollectionUnionFn > (#$TheSet #$Person #<(#$GroupFn #$Person)>) > )> > #$LegalAgent #$Agent #$Animal) > T > > uses some tokens (e.g., "<(" and ")>") that I don't see described in > "The Syntax of Cycl". Is there a more complete reference on CycL > syntax? > The token isn't <( ... )>. It's #< ... >. This a Lisp notation used for objects whose printed representation cannot be read back in using READ. Normally, when Lisp writes things like "(1 2 3 4)" to a string, it can read it back in to an equivalent representation using the function READ, just as you can in Perl by calling eval on the string "[1 2 3 4]". The #<...> is used for objects where you don't need/want to be able to do this; if you try to call read on a string that uses "#<", you get an error. In this case, the (CollectionUnionFn ...) is simply a non-atomic term (NAT). The first term in the list returned by your query is expressible by the CycL formula (#$CollectionUnionFn (#$TheSet #$Person (#$GroupFn #$Person))) that is, the collection that contains all people and groups of people. Why is #<...> not described in the CycL manual? Because it's not CycL. You can't type that in to any of the interfaces for knowledge engineers. When you type in functions at the listener window, you're talking to a dialect of Lisp, so you get Lisp-ish printing conventions. HTH, Charles -- Charles Sutton University of Massachusetts, Amherst cas...@cs... URL: http://www.cs.umass.edu/~casutton/ |
From: John De O. <jo...@cy...> - 2003-01-06 22:02:30
|
Rich, Re: > CYC(1): (genls #$Person) > (#<(#$CollectionUnionFn > (#$TheSet #$Person #<(#$GroupFn #$Person)>) > )> > #$LegalAgent #$Agent #$Animal) I don't think you have to support the above. I don't think that's valid CycL. It looks like some intermediate representation (I think it's an HL representation) that is explicitly marking NARTs by surrounding them with #< and >. I think you also need to support keywords, which look like :THIS. I'm going to try to scare up an old CycL Syntax document that may get more explicit about the language definition (in Backus Naur, I think). - John D. At 11:21 AM 1/6/2003 -0800, Rich Morin wrote: >I have been thinking about ways to fit CycL into a design that already >incorporates Perl and YAML (YAML Ain't Markup Language; www.yaml.org). >As described in the YAML Specification: > > YAML (rhymes with "camel" is a straightforward machine-parsable data > serialization format designed for human readability and interaction > with scripting languages such as Perl and Python. > >CycL statements are nested lists, so YACL's sequences are a good match. >We can also elide the "#$", as authorized by "The Syntax of Cycl": > > CYC constants are referred to with the prefix "#$" (read "hash-dollar). > These characters are sometimes omitted in documents describing CycL, > and they may be omitted by certain interface tools. > >Here is some CycL (from "The Syntax of Cycl"): > > ($#implies > ($#and > (#$isa ?TRANSFER $#TransferringPossession) > ($#fromPossessor ?TRANSFER ?FROM)) > ($#isa ?FROM $#SocialBeing)) > >The corresponding YACycL (YACycL Ain't CycL) could look like: > > [ implies, > [ and, > [ isa, ?TRANSFER, TransferringPossession ], > [ fromPossessor, ?TRANSFER, ?FROM ] ], > [ isa, ?FROM, SocialBeing ] ] > >This is a slight improvement, visually, but the real win is the fact >that the YaCycL version loads and dumps into Perl data structures. > >I'm a bit concerned, however, about the completeness of this approach. >This CYC example: > > CYC(1): (genls #$Person) > (#<(#$CollectionUnionFn > (#$TheSet #$Person #<(#$GroupFn #$Person)>) > )> > #$LegalAgent #$Agent #$Animal) > T > >uses some tokens (e.g., "<(" and ")>") that I don't see described in >"The Syntax of Cycl". Is there a more complete reference on CycL >syntax? > >-r > >P.S. YAML.pm is the Perl version of YAML. The current version is > a bit out of date with the YAML spec, so it doesn't allow the > syntax shown above. Specifically, it requires quoting for > scalars which contain question marks and doesn't allow line > breaks in bracketed expressions. This, however, works: > > - implies > - > - and > - [ isa, '?TRANSFER', TransferringPossession ] > - [ fromPossessor, '?TRANSFER', '?FROM' ] > - [ isa, '?FROM', SocialBeing ] > >and generates the same Perl data structure. >-- >email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 >http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. >http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. >http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series >http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection > > >------------------------------------------------------- >This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek >Welcome to geek heaven. >http://thinkgeek.com/sf >_______________________________________________ >OpenCyc-devel mailing list >Ope...@li... >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opencyc-devel |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-06 21:59:25
|
--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: > I have been thinking about ways to fit CycL into a design that > already > incorporates Perl and YAML (YAML Ain't Markup Language; > www.yaml.org). yaml is cool. Ingy rules. I cannot even get the standard dumper running under linux even after i get it running, it terminates without message. can any of you export at all? mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: Richard H. M. <rh...@cd...> - 2003-01-06 20:38:50
|
I have similar interests. I invented MKR, an English-like and UNIX(shell)-like knowledge = representation language. I would like to develop an MKR interface to OpenCyc. I already have an MKR interface to the Stanford TAP KB. My Knowledge Explorer program can read TAP RDF & MCF files. My mkrGetData & mkrGetResourcesNamed commands use=20 the TAP Java client to access the KB. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 Dick McCullough=20 knowledge :=3D man do identify od existent done knowledge haspart proposition list ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Rich Morin=20 To: ope...@li...=20 Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 11:21 AM Subject: [OpenCyc-devel] YACycL (CycL, in YAML) I have been thinking about ways to fit CycL into a design that already incorporates Perl and YAML (YAML Ain't Markup Language; www.yaml.org). As described in the YAML Specification: YAML (rhymes with "camel" is a straightforward machine-parsable = data serialization format designed for human readability and interaction with scripting languages such as Perl and Python. CycL statements are nested lists, so YACL's sequences are a good = match. We can also elide the "#$", as authorized by "The Syntax of Cycl": CYC constants are referred to with the prefix "#$" (read = "hash-dollar). These characters are sometimes omitted in documents describing = CycL, and they may be omitted by certain interface tools. Here is some CycL (from "The Syntax of Cycl"): ($#implies ($#and (#$isa ?TRANSFER $#TransferringPossession) ($#fromPossessor ?TRANSFER ?FROM)) ($#isa ?FROM $#SocialBeing)) The corresponding YACycL (YACycL Ain't CycL) could look like: [ implies, [ and, [ isa, ?TRANSFER, TransferringPossession ], [ fromPossessor, ?TRANSFER, ?FROM ] ], [ isa, ?FROM, SocialBeing ] ] This is a slight improvement, visually, but the real win is the fact that the YaCycL version loads and dumps into Perl data structures. I'm a bit concerned, however, about the completeness of this approach. This CYC example: CYC(1): (genls #$Person) (#<(#$CollectionUnionFn (#$TheSet #$Person #<(#$GroupFn #$Person)>) )> #$LegalAgent #$Agent #$Animal) T uses some tokens (e.g., "<(" and ")>") that I don't see described in "The Syntax of Cycl". Is there a more complete reference on CycL syntax? -r P.S. YAML.pm is the Perl version of YAML. The current version is a bit out of date with the YAML spec, so it doesn't allow the syntax shown above. Specifically, it requires quoting for scalars which contain question marks and doesn't allow line breaks in bracketed expressions. This, however, works: - implies - - and - [ isa, '?TRANSFER', TransferringPossession ] - [ fromPossessor, '?TRANSFER', '?FROM' ] - [ isa, '?FROM', SocialBeing ] and generates the same Perl data structure. --=20 email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection ------------------------------------------------------- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf _______________________________________________ OpenCyc-devel mailing list Ope...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opencyc-devel |
From: Rich M. <rd...@cf...> - 2003-01-06 19:22:12
|
I have been thinking about ways to fit CycL into a design that already incorporates Perl and YAML (YAML Ain't Markup Language; www.yaml.org). As described in the YAML Specification: YAML (rhymes with "camel" is a straightforward machine-parsable data serialization format designed for human readability and interaction with scripting languages such as Perl and Python. CycL statements are nested lists, so YACL's sequences are a good match. We can also elide the "#$", as authorized by "The Syntax of Cycl": CYC constants are referred to with the prefix "#$" (read "hash-dollar). These characters are sometimes omitted in documents describing CycL, and they may be omitted by certain interface tools. Here is some CycL (from "The Syntax of Cycl"): ($#implies ($#and (#$isa ?TRANSFER $#TransferringPossession) ($#fromPossessor ?TRANSFER ?FROM)) ($#isa ?FROM $#SocialBeing)) The corresponding YACycL (YACycL Ain't CycL) could look like: [ implies, [ and, [ isa, ?TRANSFER, TransferringPossession ], [ fromPossessor, ?TRANSFER, ?FROM ] ], [ isa, ?FROM, SocialBeing ] ] This is a slight improvement, visually, but the real win is the fact that the YaCycL version loads and dumps into Perl data structures. I'm a bit concerned, however, about the completeness of this approach. This CYC example: CYC(1): (genls #$Person) (#<(#$CollectionUnionFn (#$TheSet #$Person #<(#$GroupFn #$Person)>) )> #$LegalAgent #$Agent #$Animal) T uses some tokens (e.g., "<(" and ")>") that I don't see described in "The Syntax of Cycl". Is there a more complete reference on CycL syntax? -r P.S. YAML.pm is the Perl version of YAML. The current version is a bit out of date with the YAML spec, so it doesn't allow the syntax shown above. Specifically, it requires quoting for scalars which contain question marks and doesn't allow line breaks in bracketed expressions. This, however, works: - implies - - and - [ isa, '?TRANSFER', TransferringPossession ] - [ fromPossessor, '?TRANSFER', '?FROM' ] - [ isa, '?FROM', SocialBeing ] and generates the same Perl data structure. -- email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection |
From: Stephen R. <re...@cy...> - 2003-01-06 17:16:52
|
Send me your code and I will perform the diff. You might also include a test case for your change in org.opencyc.api.UnitTest I will merge your changes and perform the CVS repository update. For new modules I would permit you to directly update the CVS repository. -Steve On Mon, 6 Jan 2003, Yeb Havinga wrote: > Hello developers > > Suppose I made some changes to CycAccess. What would be a good way to have > this code reviewed to get integrated in the public cvs? Send output of some > kind of diff command to ? > > -- Yeb > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek > Welcome to geek heaven. > http://thinkgeek.com/sf > _______________________________________________ > OpenCyc-devel mailing list > Ope...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opencyc-devel > -- =========================================================== Stephen L. Reed phone: 512.342.4036 Cycorp, Suite 100 fax: 512.342.4040 3721 Executive Center Drive email: re...@cy... Austin, TX 78731 web: http://www.cyc.com download OpenCyc at http://www.opencyc.org =========================================================== |
From: Yeb H. <yeb...@po...> - 2003-01-06 16:41:44
|
Hello developers Suppose I made some changes to CycAccess. What would be a good way to have this code reviewed to get integrated in the public cvs? Send output of some kind of diff command to ? -- Yeb |
From: <wh...@ly...> - 2003-01-03 22:14:34
|
Hello All, Here are two "bugs" that turned out to be my own misunderstanding. In each case, better documentation would have helped. I submitted a bug that said: "The function all-genls seems to be only using BaseKB, even when an mt is specified. The documentation says: "Returns all genls of collection COL (ascending transitive closure; inexpensive)" at http://www.opencyc.org/doc/cycapi. (all-genls #$Dog) returns: (#$Thing #$Individual #$Dog) When using the optional 'mt' parameter: (all-genls #$Dog #$EverythingPSC) returns: (#$Thing #$Individual #$Dog) However, (cyc-query '(#$genls #$Dog ?WHAT) #$InferencePSC) returns the expected long list of collections." I got the following response: "#$EverythingPSC and #$InferencePSC are not microtheories, but problem solving contexts. They specify mt-relevance functions, not really mts. At the all-genls level of interface, there isn't support for problem solving contexts as mt arguments. When an mt argument is specified for an SBHL function, it means to use that mt with relevant-mt-is-genl-mt as the mt-relevance function. To get that behavior you want, you could do: (with-all-mts (all-genls #$Dog))" --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I also submitted the following bug: "The documentation at http://www.opencyc.org/doc/cycapi says: function CYC-QUERY : (sentence &optional mt properties) but, when using the function, the microtheory does not appear to be optional. What is the source of this auto-generated output. Is it a doc string in the code that must be edited?" I received the following response: It is optional. If SENTENCE is an #$ist sentence, you do not need to specify the mt. |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-02 15:40:24
|
--- Stephen Reed <re...@cy...> wrote: > Thanks Michael for bringing these bugs to my attention. These errors > were > caused by a refactoring of the java code and I will fix them. > > -Steve Thanks for looking into it. I am sorry if my tone was a bit nasty! I really like opencyc and am looking forward to making the intrspector output compatible DAML. We have sucessfully converted the xml into rdf and are using redland now. Next step for us is to create a DAML ont for the introspector data model. mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-02 15:37:49
|
Security based on webservices is built on standards. 1. The server side program that accepts the connection must be made usng standard means. You can limit that on the server file system and with apache configuration, basically, if you can browse to it then you can make a connection. 2. The communcation can be done over ssl and using LWP/OpenSSLeay on the client. The only real difference between a perl soap client and a perl client that parses the webpages is that the a soap client is easier to program and the interface is standardized. 3. Once you have a data stream, of course you need to then login and do everything that you would on the done inside of the application. I can imagine that you will then have a login command to authenicate yourself against the server, like the web application does. Also, the connection cookies can be handled just like the web application does, in fact a web service behaves much like a web client and I would suggest basically start by replacing the code that emits html with code that emits soap/xmlrpc : I can imagine this is written in java and part of opencyc? mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: Stephen R. <re...@cy...> - 2003-01-02 15:25:58
|
Thanks Michael for bringing these bugs to my attention. These errors were caused by a refactoring of the java code and I will fix them. -Steve On Wed, 1 Jan 2003, James Michael DuPont wrote: > Dear all, > I am having problems with opencyc for linux > > 1. opencyc-0.7.0/scripts/linux/run-export-daml.sh is broken > the class paths are not being set right. > > 2. java -classpath > /home/mdupont/development/opencyc/opencyc-0.7.0/lib/xerces.jar:/home/mdupont/development/opencyc/opencyc-0.7.0/lib/OpenCyc.jar > org.opencyc.xml.ExportDaml > produces the error : > Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoSuchMethodError: main > it looks like main was removed. > > 3. The 0.6 contained it. > http://xbean.cs.ccu.edu.tw/~dan/opencyc-0.6.0/doc/org/opencyc/xml/ExportDaml.html > > 4. The cvs is broken for ant > ant : BUILD FAILED > file:/opencyc/org/build.xml:16: destination directory > "/mnt/hda4/development/development2/opencyc/org/classes" does not exist > or is not a directory > I changed that to : > <property name="build" value="opencyc"/> > > the classpath is for windows? > > classpath="h:\jars\junit.jar;h:\jars\jakarta-oro-2.0.3.jar;h:\jars\commons-collections.jar:."/> > > So, I am trying to get the classpath set, based on the libs from the > original 0.7 release, but i have to say that I am a bit dissappointed > at the state of things. > > mike > > > > ===== > James Michael DuPont > http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek > Welcome to geek heaven. > http://thinkgeek.com/sf > _______________________________________________ > OpenCyc-devel mailing list > Ope...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opencyc-devel > -- =========================================================== Stephen L. Reed phone: 512.342.4036 Cycorp, Suite 100 fax: 512.342.4040 3721 Executive Center Drive email: re...@cy... Austin, TX 78731 web: http://www.cyc.com download OpenCyc at http://www.opencyc.org =========================================================== |
From: Yeb H. <yeb...@po...> - 2003-01-02 14:25:23
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From: "Rich Morin" <rd...@cf...> > > I should probably clarify my request a bit. I want to be able to > talk to Cyc from Perl, both on a single machine and from a remote > client. Security may be an issue. About security: This may sound a bit superfluous, but I think it's a good idea in discussions to mention what kind of security is being mentioned: filtering of ports / encryption of connections / authentication / authorization. Protection of your network (LAN) from the outside should be done by a firewall; I'd suggest not opening any of the opencyc ports to the public. So this is done outside opencyc server / protocol implementation. What remains is application security; authorization and authentication. As far as I know anybody who has (network level) access to the ascii or binary ports of the opencyc server may change all the KB contents. Assertions made on the binary (cfasl) interface get bookkeeped with 'Guest'. In the browser interface Guest cannot change anything, so as it seems this is only enforced by the webserver in opencyc, and not the result of an internal 'authentication' mechanism. I think this is the reason why remote access was disabled completely in 0.6 and default off in 0.7. There is also a note somewhere (forgot where but I read) that says that anyone enabling it should make sure that the ports are not reacheable from the outside. (It says something about when wanting to limit access to e.g. the browser, do it with redirecting from another webserver that forwards requests to the OpenCyc browser). > IIRC, it's possible to access Cyc via telnet, but this isn't really > efficient on a single machine, nor secure over the Internet. So: > > * Is a Perl API in the works? not that I know. > * Is there a secure, language-independent protocol for accessing > Cyc from a remote client? I've browsed a bit in CfaslOutputStream.java but have not found any authentication stuff in it. So I think this is a 'no' for the authentication part. Cfasl is language independent (i think). > I _could_ set up a Perl daemon to securely answer remote requests, > passing them to Cyc via local telnet, but this seems WRONG. I think a protocol that includes authentication (and maybe authorization) would be nice to have. Maybe it's possible to define something like an 'extended cfasl' protocol and write a daemon that forwards (or gateway's) requests normal cfasl after an authentication handshake has been done. Maybe this is not much work when using PAM (pluggible authentication modules). Encryption of the tcp connection from client to gateway should be done externally from this protocol, with an ssh tunnel or ipsec tunnel. It should only authenticate + forward. IMHO. What kind of authorization levels would be handy? - may add/edit/kill all - may add/edit/kill edit only in 'list of mt's?' - limit kinds of predicates (e.g. a client can add only facts like '(isa Foo Bar)') I am very much interested in this! -- Yeb |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-02 13:39:49
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--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: > >--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: > >> Actually, my interest lies in using the Cyc server remotely, via > >> Perl. Is there a recommended mechanism for doing XML-based RPC? > > I should probably clarify my request a bit. I want to be able to > talk to Cyc from Perl, both on a single machine and from a remote > client. Security may be an issue. That is what I mean. Via XML RPC, http://xml.apache.org/xmlrpc/index.html you can publish functions to clients. Via Soap::Lite you can call them. Using LWP/HTTP/SSL transport you can encrypt the connection I would say, find the appropiate Java API, wrap that in a XML RPC server and then serve to the perl scripts on the client. I dont know about the java side, i guess you can use topcat to handle the requests... But i am sure that someone else can tell you more. We were testing the other way around, a java client and perl server, but both should work. mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: Rich M. <rd...@cf...> - 2003-01-02 12:34:28
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>--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: >> Actually, my interest lies in using the Cyc server remotely, via >> Perl. Is there a recommended mechanism for doing XML-based RPC? I should probably clarify my request a bit. I want to be able to talk to Cyc from Perl, both on a single machine and from a remote client. Security may be an issue. IIRC, it's possible to access Cyc via telnet, but this isn't really efficient on a single machine, nor secure over the Internet. So: * Is a Perl API in the works? * Is there a secure, language-independent protocol for accessing Cyc from a remote client? I _could_ set up a Perl daemon to securely answer remote requests, passing them to Cyc via local telnet, but this seems WRONG. -r -- email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-02 11:41:09
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--- Rich Morin <rd...@cf...> wrote: > Actually, my interest lies in using the Cyc server remotely, via > Perl. Is > there a recommended mechanism for doing XML-based RPC? Cool I would be interested in helping out with that. The SOAP::Lite and Apache/XMLRPC java i have tested with each other. mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |
From: Rich M. <rd...@cf...> - 2003-01-02 11:09:39
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At 11:38 AM +0100 1/2/03, Yeb Havinga wrote: >Find 'parameters.lisp' somewhere in run/init. There are comments in the file >that describe various options. Thanks! Specifically, I needed to change (csetq *TCP-LOCALHOST-ONLY?* T) --- (csetq *TCP-LOCALHOST-ONLY?* NIL) >Note that it's now also possible to use the >java api against a 'remote' cyc server. (cool!) Actually, my interest lies in using the Cyc server remotely, via Perl. Is there a recommended mechanism for doing XML-based RPC? -r -- email: rd...@cf...; phone: +1 650-873-7841 http://www.cfcl.com/rdm - my home page, resume, etc. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta - The FreeBSD Browser, Meta Project, etc. http://www.ptf.com/dossier - Prime Time Freeware's DOSSIER series http://www.ptf.com/tdc - Prime Time Freeware's Darwin Collection |
From: Yeb H. <yeb...@po...> - 2003-01-02 10:32:07
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> Address: http://www.cfcl.com/3602/cgi-bin/cyccgi/cg?cb-start > > Unfortunately, this gives me a nastygram: > > The attempt to load 'Accessing URL: http://www.cfcl.com:...' failed. > > Again, I recall having this problem with 0.6.0. The email dialog was: > This being the "next release", I'd like to know whether the setting is now > available and where I might find out how to use it. Find 'parameters.lisp' somewhere in run/init. There are comments in the file that describe various options. Note that it's now also possible to use the java api against a 'remote' cyc server. (cool!) -- Yeb |
From: James M. D. <mdu...@ya...> - 2003-01-02 02:54:13
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--- Charles Sutton <cas...@cs...> wrote: > At one time I would have known what I was talking about with this, > but > now I'm just > blowing hot air. Hopefully it's helpful hot air.... Well, I had fired off a couple mails in anger myself, after wasting hours on what was called a release. I think it can be safely called a call for testing, a release candidate, but not a release. > > On Wednesday, January 1, 2003, at 06:08 PM, James Michael DuPont > wrote: > > > Also, the cyc docs on the web > > > http://www-ksl-svc.stanford.edu:5915/doc/hpkb/mini-eval-1-results/TQM/ > > > TFS/ikb-pred-p-2.html > > BTW, from the URL, these don't look like official documentation for > OpenCyc. They appear to be for > a different release of Cyc used for certain DARPA projects. > (Obviously, there will be overlap between > the releases...) Well, it was documentation for some important classes. I will check if there is something similar in opencyc. > > > say : > > E-Mail Comments to: do...@cy... > > > > I believe that list is an internal mailing list used by the Cycorp > employees who update the documentation. > I don't think it is a forum for open source development. Ok, your right : http://opencyc250.homelinux.org:3603/cycdoc/vocab/organization-vocab.html#pointOfContact that points to ope...@cy... But again, I retain that it should point to a general list where we can see what people have for questions. It is very simple : an open source project lives from a open knowledge base. Because google is so good at finding things, you can learn from other peoples errors. Manytimes i google my way out of problems. > > We need to start whipping this into shape, I am going to take over > > making a debian package out of this puppy, there does not seem to > be > > anyone who is working with this stuff under linux. > > I don't know who uses OpenCyc, and I haven't looked at the code at > all, > but I can say that in general Cyc has supported Linux for some time. OK, but running a monolith is one thing, and working on it is another. I would like to package this thing in a way that it can be installed and built in a debian conformant manner. Also that it can be tested under debian without much pain. Then we can test releases before they get announced. mike ===== James Michael DuPont http://introspector.sourceforge.net/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com |