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From: Andrew B. <and...@re...> - 2016-07-11 11:29:16
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Hello, We have implemented support for the QNX OS in libusb. We would like to push these changes back upstream. Are there particular requirements that need to be met for this to happen, e.g. any test suites that need to pass, etc? Please let me know the best way to proceed. Kind regards Andrew |
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From: Xiaofan C. <xia...@gm...> - 2016-07-11 13:01:43
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On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 7:13 PM, Andrew Black <and...@re...> wrote:
> We have implemented support for the QNX OS in libusb. We would like to push
> these changes back upstream. Are there particular requirements that need to
> be met for this to happen, e.g. any test suites that need to pass, etc?
> Please let me know the best way to proceed.
I think you can discuss using this mailing list on your patches.
You can create a pull request in Github. Something like this.
https://github.com/libusb/libusb/pull/177
The only problem seems to be that the maintainer can not test QNX since
it seems not easily accessible.
--
Xiaofan
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From: Matthew G. <ma...@gi...> - 2016-07-12 02:34:01
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Hi there, I used to work for QNX, and might be able to help out a bit. There's the 6.6 SDP and CAR2 platform which you could use for testing. They also provide a bunch of board support packages (BSPs) for various EVM/demo boards. http://community.qnx.com/sf/wiki/do/viewPage/projects.bsp/wiki/BSPAndDrivers That should allow for something better than testing with x86 vmware images. If you have a budget for it, your best bet might be to contact the maintainer and offer to ship a pre-configured dev board for testing purposes, along with maybe a test device or two, after you've gotten it working on your end. ============================================================ Matthew Giassa, MASc, BASc, EIT Security and Embedded Systems Specialist linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/giassa e-mail: ma...@gi... website: www.giassa.net On 07/11/16 06:01, Xiaofan Chen wrote: > On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 7:13 PM, Andrew Black <and...@re...> wrote: >> We have implemented support for the QNX OS in libusb. We would like to push >> these changes back upstream. Are there particular requirements that need to >> be met for this to happen, e.g. any test suites that need to pass, etc? >> Please let me know the best way to proceed. > > I think you can discuss using this mailing list on your patches. > > You can create a pull request in Github. Something like this. > https://github.com/libusb/libusb/pull/177 > > The only problem seems to be that the maintainer can not test QNX since > it seems not easily accessible. > > |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 19:33:26
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On 12/07/2016 21:39, "Tim Roberts" <ti...@pr...> wrote: >Licensing and copyrighting are not the same thing. That is correct. However, at least I, was not discussing that. The original point was that the premise was that a QNX was legally installed into a computer and the question was that weather moving that computer from one physical location to an other, and allowing libusb organisation (what ever if anything that is) to use it was 'legal'. >When you download >and install Qt, you are required to agree to a license agreement. That >agreement limits your activities to a much greater degree than simple >copyright. If the licensing agreement is enforceable and legal which depends of course on the terms and in which jurisdiction it is enforced. For example from here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine "In the case UsedSoftv Oracle, the European Court of Justice ruled that the sale of a software product, either through a physical support or download, constituted a transfer of ownership in EU law, thus the first sale doctrine applies; the ruling thereby breaks the "licensed, not sold" legal theory, but leaves open numerous questions." We (as we the people) should not be too willing to accept what the software industry says and their grabbing of copyright law to their own purposes for which it was never invented and intended. wbr Kusti This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Andrew B. <and...@re...> - 2016-07-12 08:00:58
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Yeah, the testing element is what concerned me, which is why I asked about test suites. I'm no lawyer but I would imagine that shipping a pre-configured dev board might go against QNX licensing? And to rebuild libusb for testing in the future would require access to the QNX SDP, which I'm sure requires some sort of license agreement with QNX? Cheers Andrew ________________________________________ From: Matthew Giassa <ma...@gi...> Sent: 12 July 2016 03:14 To: Xiaofan Chen; Andrew Black Cc: lib...@li... Subject: Re: [libusb] QNX support Hi there, I used to work for QNX, and might be able to help out a bit. There's the 6.6 SDP and CAR2 platform which you could use for testing. They also provide a bunch of board support packages (BSPs) for various EVM/demo boards. http://community.qnx.com/sf/wiki/do/viewPage/projects.bsp/wiki/BSPAndDrivers That should allow for something better than testing with x86 vmware images. If you have a budget for it, your best bet might be to contact the maintainer and offer to ship a pre-configured dev board for testing purposes, along with maybe a test device or two, after you've gotten it working on your end. ============================================================ Matthew Giassa, MASc, BASc, EIT Security and Embedded Systems Specialist linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/giassa e-mail: ma...@gi... website: www.giassa.net On 07/11/16 06:01, Xiaofan Chen wrote: > On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 7:13 PM, Andrew Black <and...@re...> wrote: >> We have implemented support for the QNX OS in libusb. We would like to push >> these changes back upstream. Are there particular requirements that need to >> be met for this to happen, e.g. any test suites that need to pass, etc? >> Please let me know the best way to proceed. > > I think you can discuss using this mailing list on your patches. > > You can create a pull request in Github. Something like this. > https://github.com/libusb/libusb/pull/177 > > The only problem seems to be that the maintainer can not test QNX since > it seems not easily accessible. > > |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 08:05:29
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>I'm no lawyer but I would imagine that shipping a pre-configured dev board might go against QNX licensing? Me neither am no lawyer but since licensing is typically based on copyright and no copying takes place if you ship something how could this be a violation ? ;) This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Steinar H. G. <sgu...@bi...> - 2016-07-12 08:36:35
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On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 08:05:20AM +0000, Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > Me neither am no lawyer but since licensing is typically based on copyright > and no copying takes place if you ship something how could this be a > violation ? > > ;) Copyright governs use and distribution (duplication is a special case of distribution). I believe this answers your question. /* Steinar */ -- Homepage: https://www.sesse.net/ |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 08:13:36
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>Copyright governs use and distribution (duplication is a special case of >distribution). I believe this answers your question. And nor it does! Distribution without copying is perfectly legal/allowed, think about selling books... Your computer is full of copyrighted stuff, yet it is perfectly legal to sell your computer. cheers Kusti This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Steinar H. G. <sgu...@bi...> - 2016-07-12 08:24:54
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On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 08:13:27AM +0000, Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > Distribution without copying is perfectly legal/allowed, think about > selling books... Only due to other provisions (such as the first-sale doctrine), not because copyright doesn't cover distribution (because it does). > Your computer is full of copyrighted stuff, yet it is perfectly legal to > sell your computer. No, it's not that simple. If I'm writing a magazine and the software is a review copy, for instance, I can't sell the software on the computer. If the software is my employer's internal software, I can't sell the computer (even if my job contract doesn't stipulate this explicitly). If I warezed the software and as such didn't have rights to it in the first place, I can't sell the computer with the warezed software on. And so on. It is true that most jurisdictions' copyright laws accept plain distribution in most cases. This is, however, something else than copyright “not applying”. /* Steinar */ -- Homepage: https://www.sesse.net/ |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 08:39:31
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>Only due to other provisions (such as the first-sale doctrine), not because >copyright doesn't cover distribution (because it does). Copyright, as far as I understand from discussion with lawyers on a copyright course I attended, applies to copying AND distribution; the hard part for me was to understand that the word 'AND' means that it is perfectly okey to copy if you do not distribute and it is perfectly okey to distribute if you do not copy. The first one is the bases of the right to copy for personal use and the other part is pretty much given, if the copyright holder could control distribution by itself then sales of copyrighted material would pretty much impossible in practice. >No, it's not that simple. If I'm writing a magazine and the software is a >review copy, for instance, I can't sell the software on the computer. Why you think so? If you sell the computer you are not making a copy. Just like a book or painting or CD or DVD, definitely copyrighted material but no-one can stop you from selling them. >If the software is my employer's internal software, I can't sell the computer >(even if my job contract doesn't stipulate this explicitly). If I warezed the >software and as such didn't have rights to it in the first place, I can't >sell the computer with the warezed software on. And so on. That is a different scenario because there you made a copy in the first place and probably illegal copy if it was warezed. cheers Kusti This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 08:59:03
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On 12/07/2016 11:52, "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgu...@bi...> wrote: >seem to have invented a new doctrine for yourself, where distribution >somehow doesn't fall into the scope of copyright. If you set this as an >axiom, I'm sure you can make all sorts of interesting legal conclusions >follow, but the rest of the world does not work that way. :-) Well, me and the layers I've talked to will then have to disagree with you and the rest of the world. Selling/distributing physical goods (like a computer) does not constitute copying in our books and copyright does not apply. Using the copyrighted software on the computer is a different matter. > >> Just like a book or painting or CD or DVD, definitely copyrighted material >> but no-one can stop you from selling them. > >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vernor_v._Autodesk,_Inc. This does not apply as this was about the rights to use the software not about selling the computer or the media. cheers Kusti This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Tim R. <ti...@pr...> - 2016-07-12 18:39:38
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Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > On 12/07/2016 11:52, "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgu...@bi...> wrote: >> seem to have invented a new doctrine for yourself, where distribution >> somehow doesn't fall into the scope of copyright. If you set this as an >> axiom, I'm sure you can make all sorts of interesting legal conclusions >> follow, but the rest of the world does not work that way. :-) > Well, me and the layers I've talked to will then have to disagree with > you and the rest of the world. > > Selling/distributing physical goods (like a computer) does not constitute > copying in our books and copyright does not apply. Licensing and copyrighting are not the same thing. When you download and install Qt, you are required to agree to a license agreement. That agreement limits your activities to a much greater degree than simple copyright. -- Tim Roberts, ti...@pr... Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc. |
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From: Kustaa N. <Kus...@pl...> - 2016-07-12 20:08:24
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I had a look at the QNX licensing, or rather I tried to, but it was a nightmare. I would not touch it with 3657.60 mm barge pole if I were developing a product. I could not even find what gives the final end user of a product that embeds QNX the right to run the software and what rights are given. They can run the software if there is an 'R' in the month I guess. So indeed maintaining and testing QNX port of libusb looks like a can of worms... br Kusti This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. |
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From: Matthew G. <ma...@gi...> - 2016-07-14 01:15:01
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I don't see what the ongoing issue is. The tester can just create a Foundry27/myQNX account, and login to download the BSP for the device under test (DUT) that is shipped out to them for testing libusb. The 6.6.0 SDP and other tools require licenses, but the BSP (ie: bootloader, OS image, etc), doesn't. Even if the BSP has distribution constraints, there's nothing stopping any random person on the Internet from making a free account and downloading the BSP. This of course, will be tedious for the tester, as he/she won't be able to rebuild anything provided to them. ============================================================ Matthew Giassa, MASc, BASc, EIT Security and Embedded Systems Specialist linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/giassa e-mail: ma...@gi... website: www.giassa.net On 07/12/16 13:08, Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > I had a look at the QNX licensing, or rather I tried to, but it was a nightmare. > > I would not touch it with 3657.60 mm barge pole if I were developing a product. > > I could not even find what gives the final end user of a product that embeds QNX > the right to run the software and what rights are given. They can run the > software if there is an 'R' in the month I guess. > > So indeed maintaining and testing QNX port of libusb looks like a can of worms... > > br Kusti > > > > > This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic > patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are > consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, > J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning > reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev > _______________________________________________ > libusb-devel mailing list > lib...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel > |
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From: Graeme G. <gr...@ar...> - 2016-07-14 04:56:52
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Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > The original point was that the premise was that a QNX was legally installed > into a computer and the question was that weather moving that computer from one physical > location to an other, and allowing libusb organisation (what ever if > anything that is) to use it was 'legal'. Very dependent on legal jurisdiction, but my impression of the legal situation in the USA is that such things are unresolved. First sale doctrine says it's legal, but that hasn't stopped some companies attempting to restrict it in their licensing conditions (i.e. Autodesk), and sometimes succeeding in their attempts at prosecution. Graeme Gill. |
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From: David G. <dav...@gm...> - 2016-07-14 07:13:45
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The GPL is one license that has language in it that dictates under what conditions you can "distribute copies" of the copyrighted software. If you put software on a computer, that's a copy. If you then give the computer to someone else, you are distributing a copy of that software, and you have to do it under a bunch of conditions, e.g. you have to make the source code of the software available to the recipient. Well, that's just my understanding, and I can't find any sources/evidence to back that up right now. --David On Wed, Jul 13, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Graeme Gill <gr...@ar...> wrote: > Kustaa Nyholm wrote: >> The original point was that the premise was that a QNX was legally installed >> into a computer and the question was that weather moving that computer from one physical >> location to an other, and allowing libusb organisation (what ever if >> anything that is) to use it was 'legal'. > > Very dependent on legal jurisdiction, but my impression of the legal > situation in the USA is that such things are unresolved. > First sale doctrine says it's legal, but that hasn't stopped some > companies attempting to restrict it in their licensing conditions > (i.e. Autodesk), and sometimes succeeding in their attempts at prosecution. > > Graeme Gill. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic > patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are > consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, > J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning > reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev > _______________________________________________ > libusb-devel mailing list > lib...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel |
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From: Andrew B. <and...@re...> - 2016-07-14 09:01:35
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I was under the impression that the BSPs typically contain the stuff you need to build an OS image, but not the image itself. Building the image from the BSP requires the SDP, which as you point out is only available under license. Regardless, as you say, there is still the issue of being able to produce the binaries to test in the first place. Andrew ________________________________________ From: Matthew Giassa <ma...@gi...> Sent: 14 July 2016 02:14 To: Kustaa Nyholm; Libusb Mailing List Subject: Re: [libusb] QNX support I don't see what the ongoing issue is. The tester can just create a Foundry27/myQNX account, and login to download the BSP for the device under test (DUT) that is shipped out to them for testing libusb. The 6.6.0 SDP and other tools require licenses, but the BSP (ie: bootloader, OS image, etc), doesn't. Even if the BSP has distribution constraints, there's nothing stopping any random person on the Internet from making a free account and downloading the BSP. This of course, will be tedious for the tester, as he/she won't be able to rebuild anything provided to them. ============================================================ Matthew Giassa, MASc, BASc, EIT Security and Embedded Systems Specialist linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/giassa e-mail: ma...@gi... website: www.giassa.net On 07/12/16 13:08, Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > I had a look at the QNX licensing, or rather I tried to, but it was a nightmare. > > I would not touch it with 3657.60 mm barge pole if I were developing a product. > > I could not even find what gives the final end user of a product that embeds QNX > the right to run the software and what rights are given. They can run the > software if there is an 'R' in the month I guess. > > So indeed maintaining and testing QNX port of libusb looks like a can of worms... > > br Kusti > > > > > This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic > patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are > consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, > J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning > reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev > _______________________________________________ > libusb-devel mailing list > lib...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev _______________________________________________ libusb-devel mailing list lib...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel |
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From: Andrew B. <and...@re...> - 2016-07-14 11:52:50
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Apparently QNX offer non-commercial licenses for certain projects (http://www.qnx.com/legal/licensing/non_commercial.html). I have contacted them about this and am waiting to hear back. Andrew ________________________________________ From: Andrew Black <and...@re...> Sent: 14 July 2016 10:01 To: Matthew Giassa; Kustaa Nyholm; Libusb Mailing List Subject: Re: [libusb] QNX support I was under the impression that the BSPs typically contain the stuff you need to build an OS image, but not the image itself. Building the image from the BSP requires the SDP, which as you point out is only available under license. Regardless, as you say, there is still the issue of being able to produce the binaries to test in the first place. Andrew ________________________________________ From: Matthew Giassa <ma...@gi...> Sent: 14 July 2016 02:14 To: Kustaa Nyholm; Libusb Mailing List Subject: Re: [libusb] QNX support I don't see what the ongoing issue is. The tester can just create a Foundry27/myQNX account, and login to download the BSP for the device under test (DUT) that is shipped out to them for testing libusb. The 6.6.0 SDP and other tools require licenses, but the BSP (ie: bootloader, OS image, etc), doesn't. Even if the BSP has distribution constraints, there's nothing stopping any random person on the Internet from making a free account and downloading the BSP. This of course, will be tedious for the tester, as he/she won't be able to rebuild anything provided to them. ============================================================ Matthew Giassa, MASc, BASc, EIT Security and Embedded Systems Specialist linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/giassa e-mail: ma...@gi... website: www.giassa.net On 07/12/16 13:08, Kustaa Nyholm wrote: > I had a look at the QNX licensing, or rather I tried to, but it was a nightmare. > > I would not touch it with 3657.60 mm barge pole if I were developing a product. > > I could not even find what gives the final end user of a product that embeds QNX > the right to run the software and what rights are given. They can run the > software if there is an 'R' in the month I guess. > > So indeed maintaining and testing QNX port of libusb looks like a can of worms... > > br Kusti > > > > > This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, indirect, special or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being passed on or as of transmission of this e-mail in general. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic > patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are > consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, > J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning > reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev > _______________________________________________ > libusb-devel mailing list > lib...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev _______________________________________________ libusb-devel mailing list lib...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow, J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning reports.http://sdm.link/zohodev2dev _______________________________________________ libusb-devel mailing list lib...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/libusb-devel |
