gamedevlists-windows — List for discussing game development on the Windows platform

RE: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Andras B. <bn...@ma...>]

True, but I want the exact (as much as possible) same stuff running on
multiple platforms. Also, we use some 3rd party libraries that use malloc,
and we want them to use our memory manager too. The macro trick would work
(for the libs you have source for), except that I've heard some horror
stories when the macro was not included everywhere for some reason, leading
to long and frustrating bug hunts.

BTW: having your own crt0 is fun :)


Andras


> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Alen Ladavac
> Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 3:43 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> 
> Hm, I thought the issue was MSVC, not consoles, right?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 09:01
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> 
> 
> > Yes, because diffferent platforms have different bugs in their memory
> > implementations.  Also, you need better debugging of memory at runtime
> on
> > consoles.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Alen Ladavac" <ale...@cr...>
> > To: <gam...@li...>
> > Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 3:48 PM
> > Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> >
> >
> > > Sounds a bit obvious, but still... would maybe something like:
> > >
> > > #define malloc my_malloc
> > > #define free my_free
> > > etc.
> > >
> > > work for you? Do you really need your own malloc called even by the
> code
> > > that you don't have sources for?
> > >
> > > Alen
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Andras Balogh" <bn...@ma...>
> > > To: <gam...@li...>
> > > Cc: <gam...@li...>
> > > Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 01:06
> > > Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> > >
> > >
> > > > [note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]
> > > >
> > > > I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking
> error
> > > only
> > > > happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to
> > solve
> > > > this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really
> > need
> > > > the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own
> malloc
> > in
> > > > place, but this brings some other problems:
> > > >
> > > > WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then
> uses
> > the
> > > > Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory
> > > block..
> > > >
> > > > So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle
> _crtheap,
> > but
> > > of
> > > > course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets
> > called
> > > > instead)
> > > >
> > > > So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt
> > > routines??
> > > > This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many
> people
> > use
> > > > their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??
> > > >
> > > > Any ideas are welcome!
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Andras
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: gam...@li...
> > > > > [mailto:gam...@li...] On
> Behalf
> Of
> > > > > Brett Bibby
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> > > > > To: Gam...@li...
> > > > > Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> > > > >
> > > > > I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general
> might
> be
> > > > > okay.
> > > > >
> > > > > Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's
> malloc
> > and
> > > so
> > > > > far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in
> and
> > > > > replace
> > > > > the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with
> different
> > > side
> > > > > effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker
> > emits
> > > a
> > > > > warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but
> > > correctly
> > > > > chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and
> > emits
> > > no
> > > > > warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently
> > (although
> > > > > the
> > > > > original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On
> MSVC
> > it
> > > is
> > > > > an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18
> target
> > > > > builds
> > > > > across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the
> offending
> > > > > libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as
> they
> > are
> > > > > built into a single library.
> > > > >
> > > > > Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that
> all
> > > > > references to memory management functions only see my definition?
> It
> > > > > seems
> > > > > that many people must have done this before....
> > > > >
> > > > > If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom
> > > release
> > > > > and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the
> functions
> I
> > > > > want
> > > > > to remove <shudder>.
> > > > >
> > > > > Brett
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> > > > > Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> > > > > GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in
> Norway
> > > > > http://2004/guadec.org
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> > > > > Gam...@li...
> > > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> > > > > Archives:
> > > > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > > > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java
> Developer
> > > > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco,
> CA
> > > > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code
> NWMGYKND
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > > > Gam...@li...
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > > > Archives:
> > > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> > > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco,
> CA
> > > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code
> NWMGYKND
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > > Gam...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > > Archives:
> > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> _______________________________________________
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> Archives:
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Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Alen L. <ale...@cr...>]

Hm, I thought the issue was MSVC, not consoles, right?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 09:01
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs


> Yes, because diffferent platforms have different bugs in their memory
> implementations.  Also, you need better debugging of memory at runtime on
> consoles.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alen Ladavac" <ale...@cr...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 3:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
>
>
> > Sounds a bit obvious, but still... would maybe something like:
> >
> > #define malloc my_malloc
> > #define free my_free
> > etc.
> >
> > work for you? Do you really need your own malloc called even by the code
> > that you don't have sources for?
> >
> > Alen
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Andras Balogh" <bn...@ma...>
> > To: <gam...@li...>
> > Cc: <gam...@li...>
> > Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 01:06
> > Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> >
> >
> > > [note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]
> > >
> > > I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking
error
> > only
> > > happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to
> solve
> > > this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really
> need
> > > the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own
malloc
> in
> > > place, but this brings some other problems:
> > >
> > > WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then uses
> the
> > > Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory
> > block..
> > >
> > > So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle _crtheap,
> but
> > of
> > > course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets
> called
> > > instead)
> > >
> > > So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt
> > routines??
> > > This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many people
> use
> > > their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??
> > >
> > > Any ideas are welcome!
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > >
> > > Andras
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: gam...@li...
> > > > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf
Of
> > > > Brett Bibby
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> > > > To: Gam...@li...
> > > > Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> > > >
> > > > I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general might
be
> > > > okay.
> > > >
> > > > Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's malloc
> and
> > so
> > > > far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in and
> > > > replace
> > > > the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with different
> > side
> > > > effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker
> emits
> > a
> > > > warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but
> > correctly
> > > > chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and
> emits
> > no
> > > > warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently
> (although
> > > > the
> > > > original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On MSVC
> it
> > is
> > > > an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18 target
> > > > builds
> > > > across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the
offending
> > > > libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as they
> are
> > > > built into a single library.
> > > >
> > > > Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that all
> > > > references to memory management functions only see my definition?
It
> > > > seems
> > > > that many people must have done this before....
> > > >
> > > > If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom
> > release
> > > > and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the functions
I
> > > > want
> > > > to remove <shudder>.
> > > >
> > > > Brett
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> > > > Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> > > > GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in
Norway
> > > > http://2004/guadec.org
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> > > > Gam...@li...
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> > > > Archives:
> > > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> > > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco,
CA
> > > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code
NWMGYKND
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > > Gam...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > > Archives:
> > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives:
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
>

RE: [GD-Windows] graphics cards texture offset thing

[Richard F. <gd...@th...>]

thats what i meant, i have an app that runs fine on my ATI 9800, but
looks like the UVs are shifted down by 1/W  in both dimensions when
running on my GeForce 5800.

when i run the app on a PSP, the same UVs generate correct looking
text... I am assuming that it is GeForces that get it wrong... is this a
known thing? and how do you detect when to fix it and when its "just
works" as in the case of the ATI card.

------------------
On the other hand
I may be talking
complete drivel.
------------------ 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li... 
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On 
> Behalf Of Javier Arevalo
> Sent: 18 June 2004 12:36 PM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] graphics cards texture offset thing
> 
> 
> Richard Fabian wrote:
> > How do you go about determining what UVs to give the 
> characters when 
> > the values you give may be hardware transposed to somewhere unknown?
> 
> There are sub-pixel accuracy issues regarding the location of 
> the pixel center, which are usually solved by using point 
> filtering and adding .5f / W or .375f / W to the UV 
> coordinates (W is the width / height of the texture).
> 
> Other than that, no the hardware doesn't magically change 
> your UVs unless there's a bug somewhere.
> 
> -- 
>   Javier Arevalo
>   Pyro Studios
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) 
> Conference Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's 
> Worldwide Java Developer Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the 
> Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA REGISTER AND SAVE! 
http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
_______________________________________________
Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
Gam...@li...
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555

Re: [GD-Windows] graphics cards texture offset thing

[Javier A. <ja...@py...>]

Richard Fabian wrote:
> How do you go about determining what UVs to give the characters when
> the values you give may be hardware transposed to somewhere unknown?

There are sub-pixel accuracy issues regarding the location of the pixel
center, which are usually solved by using point filtering and adding .5f / W
or .375f / W to the UV coordinates (W is the width / height of the texture).

Other than that, no the hardware doesn't magically change your UVs unless
there's a bug somewhere.

-- 
  Javier Arevalo
  Pyro Studios

[GD-Windows] graphics cards texture offset thing

[Richard F. <gd...@th...>]

Hi, i'm pretty new to rendering code, and have stumbled upon a problem i
have never thought about before: how do you write games that "know"
whether the textures are offset by a pixel or not?

I use textures for fonts, and this is where artefacts show up most.
How do you go about determining what UVs to give the characters when the
values you give may be hardware transposed to somewhere unknown?

------------------
On the other hand
I may be talking
complete drivel.
------------------ 

Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Brett B. <res...@ga...>]

Yes, because diffferent platforms have different bugs in their memory
implementations.  Also, you need better debugging of memory at runtime on
consoles.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alen Ladavac" <ale...@cr...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 3:48 PM
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs


> Sounds a bit obvious, but still... would maybe something like:
>
> #define malloc my_malloc
> #define free my_free
> etc.
>
> work for you? Do you really need your own malloc called even by the code
> that you don't have sources for?
>
> Alen
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andras Balogh" <bn...@ma...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Cc: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 01:06
> Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
>
>
> > [note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]
> >
> > I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking error
> only
> > happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to
solve
> > this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really
need
> > the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own malloc
in
> > place, but this brings some other problems:
> >
> > WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then uses
the
> > Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory
> block..
> >
> > So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle _crtheap,
but
> of
> > course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets
called
> > instead)
> >
> > So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt
> routines??
> > This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many people
use
> > their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??
> >
> > Any ideas are welcome!
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> > Andras
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: gam...@li...
> > > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> > > Brett Bibby
> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> > > To: Gam...@li...
> > > Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> > >
> > > I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general might be
> > > okay.
> > >
> > > Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's malloc
and
> so
> > > far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in and
> > > replace
> > > the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with different
> side
> > > effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker
emits
> a
> > > warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but
> correctly
> > > chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and
emits
> no
> > > warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently
(although
> > > the
> > > original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On MSVC
it
> is
> > > an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18 target
> > > builds
> > > across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the offending
> > > libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as they
are
> > > built into a single library.
> > >
> > > Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that all
> > > references to memory management functions only see my definition?  It
> > > seems
> > > that many people must have done this before....
> > >
> > > If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom
> release
> > > and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the functions I
> > > want
> > > to remove <shudder>.
> > >
> > > Brett
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> > > Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> > > GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in Norway
> > > http://2004/guadec.org
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> > > Gam...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> > > Archives:
> > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> > Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> > Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> > REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555
> >
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by The 2004 JavaOne(SM) Conference
> Learn from the experts at JavaOne(SM), Sun's Worldwide Java Developer
> Conference, June 28 - July 1 at the Moscone Center in San Francisco, CA
> REGISTER AND SAVE! http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf Priority Code NWMGYKND
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives:
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=555

Re: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Alen L. <ale...@cr...>]

Sounds a bit obvious, but still... would maybe something like:

#define malloc my_malloc
#define free my_free
etc.

work for you? Do you really need your own malloc called even by the code
that you don't have sources for?

Alen

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andras Balogh" <bn...@ma...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Cc: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 01:06
Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs


> [note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]
>
> I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking error
only
> happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to solve
> this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really need
> the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own malloc in
> place, but this brings some other problems:
>
> WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then uses the
> Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory
block..
>
> So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle _crtheap, but
of
> course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets called
> instead)
>
> So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt
routines??
> This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many people use
> their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??
>
> Any ideas are welcome!
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Andras
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> > Brett Bibby
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> > To: Gam...@li...
> > Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> >
> > I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general might be
> > okay.
> >
> > Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's malloc and
so
> > far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in and
> > replace
> > the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with different
side
> > effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker emits
a
> > warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but
correctly
> > chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and emits
no
> > warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently (although
> > the
> > original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On MSVC it
is
> > an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18 target
> > builds
> > across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the offending
> > libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as they are
> > built into a single library.
> >
> > Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that all
> > references to memory management functions only see my definition?  It
> > seems
> > that many people must have done this before....
> >
> > If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom
release
> > and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the functions I
> > want
> > to remove <shudder>.
> >
> > Brett
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> > Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> > GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in Norway
> > http://2004/guadec.org
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
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RE: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Andras B. <bn...@ma...>]

Okay, I just realized that LIBCD contains much more than just the std c
routines (for example it contains the crt0 itself, and a bunch of other
functions that are required for runtime checks), so I just can't drop LIBCD
altogether (at least not for the debug build).

So I decided to just bite the bullet and implement my own crt0 (which,
eventually doesn't seem to be too hard :) and I also specify the
/FORCE:MULTIPLE linker flag (this will link with multiple definitions,
although you have to make sure, that it's your stuff that gets linked in).

There's a great docs about rolling your own crt0 here:
http://www.microsoft.com/msj/archive/S569.aspx

Cheers,

Andras
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Andras Balogh
> Sent: Thursday, June 17, 2004 5:07 PM
> To: gam...@li...
> Cc: gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs
> 
> [note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]
> 
> I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking error
> only
> happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to solve
> this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really need
> the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own malloc in
> place, but this brings some other problems:
> 
> WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then uses the
> Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory
> block..
> 
> So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle _crtheap, but
> of
> course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets called
> instead)
> 
> So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt
> routines??
> This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many people use
> their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??
> 
> Any ideas are welcome!
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> 
> Andras
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> > Brett Bibby
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> > To: Gam...@li...
> > Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> >
> > I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general might be
> > okay.
> >
> > Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's malloc and
> so
> > far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in and
> > replace
> > the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with different
> side
> > effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker emits
> a
> > warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but
> correctly
> > chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and emits
> no
> > warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently (although
> > the
> > original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On MSVC it
> is
> > an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18 target
> > builds
> > across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the offending
> > libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as they are
> > built into a single library.
> >
> > Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that all
> > references to memory management functions only see my definition?  It
> > seems
> > that many people must have done this before....
> >
> > If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom
> release
> > and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the functions I
> > want
> > to remove <shudder>.
> >
> > Brett
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> > Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> > GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in Norway
> > http://2004/guadec.org
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
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[GD-Windows] Re: multiply defined functions in libs

[Andras B. <bn...@ma...>]

[note: I moved this thread to gamedevlists-windows]

I'm also fighting with this problem right now. For me the linking error only
happened in the debug build (couldn't figure out why). What I did to solve
this was to link against LIBC instead of LIBCD (since I don't really need
the debug version of that library anyway).. So now I have my own malloc in
place, but this brings some other problems:

WinMainCRTStartup calls malloc to allocate some memory, and then uses the
Win32 API function ::HeapSize to query the size of that same memory block..

So it assumes, that malloc uses ::HeapAlloc with the handle _crtheap, but of
course, in this case, it does not (since it is my routine that gets called
instead)

So, I'm also stuck.. What can I do? Do I have to roll my own crt routines??
This sounds a bit too hardcore. I would have thought that many people use
their own memory manager. But how do they solve these things??

Any ideas are welcome!

Thanks,


Andras

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Brett Bibby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:58 PM
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-General] multiply defined functions in libs
> 
> I have no idea where to ask this quesiton, so I guess general might be
> okay.
> 
> Recently I have switched our memory management to Doug Lea's malloc and so
> far so good.  The biggest problem is that I'm trying to drop in and
> replace
> the normal ansi calls.  This generally works although with different side
> effects on different platforms.  For example, CodeWarrior's linker emits a
> warning that multiple "malloc" symbols are defined on Win32, but correctly
> chooses to use mine anyway if I set the link order correctly, and emits no
> warnings at all on PS2 and GCN and seems to use mine silently (although
> the
> original malloc is listed in the linker map, just unused!).  On MSVC it is
> an error and won't build the Win32 version.  Since we have 18 target
> builds
> across mutliple platforms this is messy.  I can't remove the offending
> libraries without also removing a bunch of needed functions as they are
> built into a single library.
> 
> Is there any sort of pragma or some other way to make sure that all
> references to memory management functions only see my definition?  It
> seems
> that many people must have done this before....
> 
> If not, the only way I see to fix this properly is to build custom release
> and debug libs from each platform's source and exclude the functions I
> want
> to remove <shudder>.
> 
> Brett
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: GNOME Foundation
> Hackers Unite!  GUADEC: The world's #1 Open Source Desktop Event.
> GNOME Users and Developers European Conference, 28-30th June in Norway
> http://2004/guadec.org
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> Archives:
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557

RE: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting

[Stefan B. <Ste...@di...>]

   Yeah, I know there are Python implementations on CLR, and a Lua
implementation is in progress too. But I was replying in the context of
my previous reply which referred to Python.NET by Zope.
=20
/Stefan
=20
________________________________

From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
Mat Noguchi (BUNGIE)
Sent: 20 May 2004 18:22
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting
=20
Uh, python runs on the CLR.
=20
MSN
=20
________________________________

From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
Stefan Boberg
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:59 AM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting
=20
   Like all other .CLR languages, JScript.NET is compiled into MSIL,
which is JIT-compiled into native code.
=20
   While it's true that you could use any .NET language to "script", Lua
and Python offers some nice features that no CLR language can offer
today. On the other hand, it lacks some things which are useful in a CLR
environment (strong typing and static checks for example).
=20
/Stefan
=20
________________________________

From: gam...@li... on behalf of
Parveen Kaler
Sent: Thu 5/20/2004 3:55 AM
To: Gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting
Brett Bibby wrote:
> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in
> game development?
>
> Meanwhile....
>
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming
> from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a
> magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?
> Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting
> solutions?
>

JIT?  Isn't JScript.NET compiled down into native code?
http://www.gotdotnet.com/team/jscript/

Pick a language:
http://www.dotnetpowered.com/languages.aspx

There's gotta be one that you like and will compile to native code if
you need it to.

-- PK



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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[David N. <dno...@mi...>]

Floating point will be much better in the next rev of the CLR. And it =
was already comparable (on par) in shipped versions to the best Java =
VMs.

This said, currently the JIT compiler has constraints (time and space) =
that a native compiler doesn't have, so don't expect complete parity.

Some of my thoughts on managed code for games:

http://www.xplsv.com/blogs/devdiary/2003_07_01_archive.html#1058658127517=
80370

Some comments on the code quality of Quake 2 (software rendering) =
recompiled to run in the CLR:

http://www.xplsv.com/blogs/devdiary/2003_07_01_archive.html#1058039602152=
38840


David



-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li... =
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of =
Jon Watte
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 9:41 AM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


The current CLR doesn't appear to optimize floating-point math much
at all, so no matter what the languate, it's unlikely to be well =
suitable
for most 3D gaming applications.

Cheers,

			/ h+


-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
Brett Bibby
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 6:58 PM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


I should clarify my question as I don't think I was clear.

It seems that JScript combined with JIT is an efficient solution.  A =
fast
scripting language like Lua outperforms a traditional Javascript
implementation enough that it is worthwhile to use Lua for our intended =
use
in a realtime game.  So I'm wondering if anybody could comment how C# =
using
JScript might stack up against a C++ app with embedded Lua in terms of =
raw
performance (Or any other language/script combo, my point being to =
benchmark
between native code and "managed" code).

Hmm... maybe I made it even more unclear? :-)


----- Original Message -----
From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in =
game
development?
>
> Meanwhile....
>
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming =
from
our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a magnitude =
slower
to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  Would you recommend
developers to implement their own scripting solutions?
>
> Brett
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>
>
> > The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing =
this
> > exact functionality.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf =
Of
> > Mitch Walker
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> > You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain =
and
> > run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> > AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> > permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> > well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  =
This
> > would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile =
them
> > on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  =
If
> > you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, =
I
> > would definitely take a look at this option.
> >
> > -Mitch
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf =
Of
> > Lewin, Gareth
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> > Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> > AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
> >
> > _________________________________________
> > Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
> >
> > "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> > remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> > To: Gam...@li...
> > Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> >
> > Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> > directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> > requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something =
like
> > Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> > Brett
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >
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> >
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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Jon W. <hp...@mi...>]

> It would be nice if there were more effective benchmarks
> for C# performance in the games domain but I am not sure
> what those would be.


Maybe those would be more readily available if the licensing for the 
.NET runtime didn't explicitly forbid you from publiching benchmark 
numbers that Microsoft hasn't given its seal of approval to.

Any technology that has to come with those kinds of heavy-handed 
tactics just screams "not ready for competition" to me. Maybe I'm 
just extra sensitive.

Anyway, this was in the context of "why don't you write a whole 
game in C#" -- I agree that for typical scripting things, top-notch 
FP performance isn't necessary.

Cheers,

			/ h+

RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Paul B. <pa...@mi...>]

FP math doesn't seem to be optimized in many scripting languages
either.  I suspect most people who are interested in scripting
languages are acknowledging some amount of performance bleed.


For those that are interested, there is an article that benchmarks
numerical computing performance of the CLR using C# at

http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdnmag/issues/04/03/ScientificC/=20

The performance isn't ideal but I suspect it is better than most
scripting languages and should continue to improve.

SciMark scores for various Java implementations:

http://math.nist.gov/cgi-bin/ScimarkSummary

Another paper talking about HPC and .NET & Java.

http://www.sc-conference.org/sc2003/paperpdfs/pap251.pdf


On the subject of JIT vs static-native, there is a paper on
Marmot at http://research.microsoft.com/act/marmot.pdf. One
could suspect these techniques could be applied to .NET=20
languages as well.

It would be nice if there were more effective benchmarks
for C# performance in the games domain but I am not sure
what those would be.

Paul


> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...=20
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On=20
> Behalf Of Jon Watte
> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 11:41 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> The current CLR doesn't appear to optimize floating-point math much
> at all, so no matter what the languate, it's unlikely to be=20
> well suitable
> for most 3D gaming applications.
>=20
> Cheers,
>=20
> 			/ h+
>=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
> Brett Bibby
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 6:58 PM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> I should clarify my question as I don't think I was clear.
>=20
> It seems that JScript combined with JIT is an efficient=20
> solution.  A fast
> scripting language like Lua outperforms a traditional Javascript
> implementation enough that it is worthwhile to use Lua for=20
> our intended use
> in a realtime game.  So I'm wondering if anybody could=20
> comment how C# using
> JScript might stack up against a C++ app with embedded Lua in=20
> terms of raw
> performance (Or any other language/script combo, my point=20
> being to benchmark
> between native code and "managed" code).
>=20
> Hmm... maybe I made it even more unclear? :-)
>=20
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 8:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> > Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the=20
> use of C# in game
> development?
> >
> > Meanwhile....
> >
> > I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box,=20
> but coming from
> our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a=20
> magnitude slower
> to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  Would you recommend
> developers to implement their own scripting solutions?
> >
> > Brett
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
> > To: <gam...@li...>
> > Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> >
> > > The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample=20
> showing this
> > > exact functionality.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: gam...@li...
> > > [mailto:gam...@li...]=20
> On Behalf Of
> > > Mitch Walker
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> > > To: gam...@li...
> > > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> > >
> > > You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new=20
> AppDomain and
> > > run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> > > AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> > > permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are=20
> compiler APIs as
> > > well so you can compile the code that you want to host on=20
> the fly.  This
> > > would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file=20
> format, compile them
> > > on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when=20
> applicable.  If
> > > you are writing managed code and need scripting type=20
> functionality, I
> > > would definitely take a look at this option.
> > >
> > > -Mitch
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: gam...@li...
> > > [mailto:gam...@li...]=20
> On Behalf Of
> > > Lewin, Gareth
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> > > To: gam...@li...
> > > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> > >
> > > Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out=20
> of the box
> > > AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
> > >
> > > _________________________________________
> > > Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
> > >
> > > "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything=20
> that's even
> > > remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> > > To: Gam...@li...
> > > Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> > >
> > >
> > > Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting=20
> languages that
> > > directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> > > requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue=20
> something like
> > > Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be=20
> ugly. Thanks,
> > > Brett
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net=20
> Broadband Sign-up now
> > > for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768=20
> connection for
> > > only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
> > > http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id%62&alloc_ida84&op=3Dick
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > > Gam...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > > Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> > >
> > >
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> > > Archives:
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> > >
> > >
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> > > Archives:
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> > >
> > >
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> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > > Archives:
> > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> > >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: Oracle 10g
> > Get certified on the hottest thing ever to hit the=20
> market... Oracle 10g.
> > Take an Oracle 10g class now, and we'll give you the exam FREE.
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> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
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>=20
>=20
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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Jon W. <hp...@mi...>]

The current CLR doesn't appear to optimize floating-point math much
at all, so no matter what the languate, it's unlikely to be well suitable
for most 3D gaming applications.

Cheers,

			/ h+


-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
Brett Bibby
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 6:58 PM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


I should clarify my question as I don't think I was clear.

It seems that JScript combined with JIT is an efficient solution.  A fast
scripting language like Lua outperforms a traditional Javascript
implementation enough that it is worthwhile to use Lua for our intended use
in a realtime game.  So I'm wondering if anybody could comment how C# using
JScript might stack up against a C++ app with embedded Lua in terms of raw
performance (Or any other language/script combo, my point being to benchmark
between native code and "managed" code).

Hmm... maybe I made it even more unclear? :-)


----- Original Message -----
From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in game
development?
>
> Meanwhile....
>
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming from
our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a magnitude slower
to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  Would you recommend
developers to implement their own scripting solutions?
>
> Brett
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>
>
> > The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing this
> > exact functionality.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> > Mitch Walker
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> > You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
> > run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> > AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> > permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> > well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  This
> > would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile them
> > on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  If
> > you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
> > would definitely take a look at this option.
> >
> > -Mitch
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> > Lewin, Gareth
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> > Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> > AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
> >
> > _________________________________________
> > Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
> >
> > "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> > remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> > To: Gam...@li...
> > Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >
> >
> > Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> > directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> > requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something like
> > Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> > Brett
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband Sign-up now
> > for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768 connection for
> > only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
> > http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id%62&alloc_ida84&op=ick
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband
> > Sign-up now for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest
> > 6.0/768 connection for only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband
> > Sign-up now for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest
> > 6.0/768 connection for only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband
> > Sign-up now for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest
> > 6.0/768 connection for only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
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RE: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting

[Stefan B. <Ste...@di...>]

   Like all other .CLR languages, JScript.NET is compiled into MSIL, =
which is JIT-compiled into native code.
=20
   While it's true that you could use any .NET language to "script", Lua =
and Python offers some nice features that no CLR language can offer =
today. On the other hand, it lacks some things which are useful in a CLR =
environment (strong typing and static checks for example).
=20
/Stefan

________________________________

From: gam...@li... on behalf of =
Parveen Kaler
Sent: Thu 5/20/2004 3:55 AM
To: Gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting



Brett Bibby wrote:
> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in
> game development?
>
> Meanwhile....
>
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming
> from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a
> magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?
> Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting
> solutions?
>

JIT?  Isn't JScript.NET compiled down into native code?
http://www.gotdotnet.com/team/jscript/

Pick a language:
http://www.dotnetpowered.com/languages.aspx

There's gotta be one that you like and will compile to native code if
you need it to.

-- PK



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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Tom M. <tm...@wi...>]

AFAIK, there isnt' a list dedicated to that subject yet..  I try to pay =
attention to the newsgroups, etc, and all the mailing lists I'm aware =
of..

As a general rule, I would rarely recommend rolling your own anything.. =
I'm a big advocate of not re-inventing the wheel unless there's a viable =
reason.  With the upcoming Whidbey release, the performance of managed =
code (either as a scripting language or as a full application) will be =
much improved, and be the first step to be 'competitive' (using that =
term loosely) with unmanaged code perf wise.  Not that it isn't close =
now, but there is a small perf hit currently, and many of these are =
being addressed with whidbey, and areas that aren't will be addressed in =
post whidbey releases.

-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li... =
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of =
Brett Bibby
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 5:52 PM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in =
game development?

Meanwhile....

I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming =
from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a =
magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  =
Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting =
solutions?

Brett

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


> The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing this
> exact functionality.=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Mitch Walker
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
> You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
> run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  =
This
> would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile =
them
> on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  =
If
> you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
> would definitely take a look at this option.
>=20
> -Mitch
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Lewin, Gareth
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
> Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
>=20
> _________________________________________
> Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
>=20
> "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something =
like
> Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> Brett
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband Sign-up =
now
> for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768 connection for
> only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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> _______________________________________________
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> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
>=20
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>=20
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> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives:
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
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> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives:
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>=20
>=20
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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[tweety <mi...@sy...>]

Actually it's not that big a deal... You just compile your thing and that's
it... The api is very clear and if you do get stuck, there are TONS of
examples out there (there is one project of mine on sf.net, too, if anyone's
interested...)

What I would like to see from ms is a full-featured 3d game in c#... With
sources, part of the dx sdk. Just to see the "right" kind of coding to get
the monster running decently in .net 1.1...

On a side note (waaay ot), I'm really amused that people (me, too) are
trying to execute tes arena on a high-end computer (I've got a xp2500+) and
barely succeding... I can run far cry with no problems, and can't run arena
:))

----------------------------------
Peace and love,
Tweety
mi...@sy... - twe...@us...
YahooID: tweety_04_01



> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li... 
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On 
> Behalf Of Tom Miller
> Sent: May 19, 2004 2:37 PM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> 
> The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing this
> exact functionality. 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Mitch Walker
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> 
> You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
> run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the 
> fly.  This
> would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, 
> compile them
> on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when 
> applicable.  If
> you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
> would definitely take a look at this option.
> 
> -Mitch
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Lewin, Gareth
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> 
> Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
> 
> _________________________________________
> Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
> 
> "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> 
> 
> Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue 
> something like
> Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> Brett
> 
> 
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[GD-Windows] Re: C# scripting

[Parveen K. <pk...@al...>]

Brett Bibby wrote:
> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in
> game development?
> 
> Meanwhile....
> 
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming
> from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a
> magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?
> Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting
> solutions?
> 

JIT?  Isn't JScript.NET compiled down into native code?
http://www.gotdotnet.com/team/jscript/

Pick a language:
http://www.dotnetpowered.com/languages.aspx

There's gotta be one that you like and will compile to native code if 
you need it to.

-- PK

Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Brett B. <res...@ga...>]

I should clarify my question as I don't think I was clear.

It seems that JScript combined with JIT is an efficient solution.  A =
fast scripting language like Lua outperforms a traditional Javascript =
implementation enough that it is worthwhile to use Lua for our intended =
use in a realtime game.  So I'm wondering if anybody could comment how =
C# using JScript might stack up against a C++ app with embedded Lua in =
terms of raw performance (Or any other language/script combo, my point =
being to benchmark between native code and "managed" code).

Hmm... maybe I made it even more unclear? :-)


----- Original Message -----=20
From: "Brett Bibby" <res...@ga...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


> Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in =
game development?
>=20
> Meanwhile....
>=20
> I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming =
from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a =
magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  =
Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting =
solutions?
>=20
> Brett
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----=20
> From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
> To: <gam...@li...>
> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> > The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing =
this
> > exact functionality.=20
> >=20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf =
Of
> > Mitch Walker
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >=20
> > You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain =
and
> > run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> > AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> > permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> > well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  =
This
> > would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile =
them
> > on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  =
If
> > you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, =
I
> > would definitely take a look at this option.
> >=20
> > -Mitch
> >=20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gam...@li...
> > [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf =
Of
> > Lewin, Gareth
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> > To: gam...@li...
> > Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >=20
> > Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> > AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
> >=20
> > _________________________________________
> > Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
> >=20
> > "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> > remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
> >=20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> > To: Gam...@li...
> > Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
> >=20
> >=20
> > Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> > directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> > requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something =
like
> > Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> > Brett
> >=20
> >=20
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband Sign-up =
now
> > for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768 connection for
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> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > -------------------------------------------------------
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> > _______________________________________________
> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >=20
> >=20
> > -------------------------------------------------------
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> > Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> > Gam...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >=20
> >=20
> > -------------------------------------------------------
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> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> > Archives:
> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
> >=20
>=20
>=20
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Re: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Brett B. <res...@ga...>]

Tom, is there a better list than this one to discuss the use of C# in =
game development?

Meanwhile....

I know that C# can already support JScript out of the box, but coming =
from our current PlayStation2 engine that uses Lua, it must be a =
magnitude slower to use JScript inside a JIT environment isn't it?  =
Would you recommend developers to implement their own scripting =
solutions?

Brett

----- Original Message -----=20
From: "Tom Miller" <tm...@wi...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 2:36 AM
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


> The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing this
> exact functionality.=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Mitch Walker
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
> You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
> run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
> AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
> permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
> well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  =
This
> would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile =
them
> on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  =
If
> you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
> would definitely take a look at this option.
>=20
> -Mitch
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Lewin, Gareth
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
> Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
> AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'
>=20
> _________________________________________
> Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com
>=20
> "Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
> remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
>=20
> Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something =
like
> Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
> Brett
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband Sign-up =
now
> for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768 connection for
> only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
> http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id%62&alloc_ida84&op=3Dick
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-windows mailing list
> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
> Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_idU5
>=20
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
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> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-windows
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>=20
>=20
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>=20
>=20
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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Tom M. <tm...@wi...>]

The upcoming update for the DirectX SDK includes a sample showing this
exact functionality.=20

-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
Mitch Walker
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:48 AM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  This
would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile them
on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  If
you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
would definitely take a look at this option.

-Mitch

-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
Lewin, Gareth
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'

_________________________________________
Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com

"Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.

-----Original Message-----
From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
To: Gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something like
Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
Brett


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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Mitch W. <mi...@mi...>]

You can also use the CLR to host code.  You create a new AppDomain and
run the code inside of this.  You can apply permissions to this
AppDomain, so, for example, the code inside it has "ExecuteOnly"
permissions (Can't do IO, Sockets, etc).  There are compiler APIs as
well so you can compile the code that you want to host on the fly.  This
would allow you to keep all of your scripts in file format, compile them
on start up and possibly detect changes and reload when applicable.  If
you are writing managed code and need scripting type functionality, I
would definitely take a look at this option.

-Mitch

-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
Lewin, Gareth
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:27 AM
To: gam...@li...
Subject: RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'

_________________________________________
Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com

"Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.

-----Original Message-----
From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
To: Gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something like
Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
Brett


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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Lewin, G. <gl...@ea...>]

Well, C# supports the microsoft scripting host stuff out of the box
AFAIK, so Javascript, VBScript etc should 'just work'

_________________________________________
Gareth Lewin - http://www.garethlewin.com

"Facts are useless. You can use facts to prove anything that's even
remotely true. Facts shmacts!" -- Homer Jay Simpson.

-----Original Message-----
From: Brett Bibby [mailto:res...@ga...]=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:47 PM
To: Gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting


Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something like
Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly. Thanks,
Brett


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for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest 6.0/768 connection for
only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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RE: [GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Stefan B. <Ste...@di...>]

 LuaInterface interfaces Lua with the CLR:

   http://www.inf.puc-rio.br/~mascarenhas/luainterface/=20

 There's also Python.NET, which does basically the same thing for
Python:

   http://www.zope.org/Members/Brian/PythonNet/index_html=20

 I've not used them that much though so I can't offer an opinion on
which is the better option. Personally I prefer Lua though since it's
smaller and thus more beautiful :)

/Stefan

Stefan Boberg
Chief Technical Officer
Digital Illusions CE AB
=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...] On Behalf Of
> Brett Bibby
> Sent: 19 May 2004 08:47
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-Windows] C# scripting
>=20
> Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that
> directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a
> requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something
like
> Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly.
> Thanks,
> Brett
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: SourceForge.net Broadband
> Sign-up now for SourceForge Broadband and get the fastest
> 6.0/768 connection for only $19.95/mo for the first 3 months!
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> Archives:
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[GD-Windows] C# scripting

[Brett B. <res...@ga...>]

Howdy.  Does anybody know if there are any scripting languages that =
directly support embedding into C#?  At this point speed is not a =
requirement, just doing some research.  I know I can glue something like =
Lua into it, but since it's unmanaged code it would be ugly.
Thanks,
Brett