gamedevlists-general — List for discussing general game development issues

Re: [GD-General] Developing games for PC with FP. Is this really needed?

[<ja...@qu...>]

Hi Pavel,

The question really goes the other way round. Are people with FFP cards a
significant part of your target market? If so, you should support them. If
not, you needn't bother. Of course, deciding your target market should be
something you sort out with your publisher.

There is no restricted information here, you just need to decide what's
right for you :)

Jamie


> Hello ppl,
>
> I'm just wonder if it's still needed for upcoming games to support
> fixed pipeline for rendering? and there for set as minimum
> requirements vs1_1 and ps_1_1.
> Or probably still a lot of users have GPU that doesn't support
> shaders? And how it can change in near two years?
>
> I'm not sure if this information is restricted (probably this info
> could know only publishers), but probably someone can reply smth...
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> --
> Best regards,
>  Pavel Tumik                          mailto:sa...@ro...
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
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[GD-General] Developing games for PC with FP. Is this really needed?

[Pavel T. <sa...@ro...>]

Hello ppl,

I'm just wonder if it's still needed for upcoming games to support
fixed pipeline for rendering? and there for set as minimum
requirements vs1_1 and ps_1_1.
Or probably still a lot of users have GPU that doesn't support
shaders? And how it can change in near two years?

I'm not sure if this information is restricted (probably this info
could know only publishers), but probably someone can reply smth...

Thanks in advance.

-- 
Best regards,
 Pavel Tumik                          mailto:sa...@ro...

Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[Megan F. <sha...@gm...>]

One handy, simple tool is perfmon.exe - set it to monitor the total
number of memory allocated for a single process (your process), and
watch the graph for a gradual increase.

Works best when you can automate your gameplay with some sort of
pre-recorded demo, to catch the cases that don't come up when your
player is simply standing in a meadow or what have you.

-Megan Fox

> On a PC, I imagine there are similar functions to return the amount of
> memory allocated by a particular process.

Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[Noel L. <nl...@co...>]

On a console, just check periodically that what you think is the total 
amount of memory allocated matches up with the amount of memory allocated 
reported by the system.

On a PC, I imagine there are similar functions to return the amount of 
memory allocated by a particular process.


--Noel
Games from Within
http://www.gamesfromwithin.com

On Wednesday 01 December 2004 11:35, Carl Bevil wrote:
> I'm in the process of installing a memory manager into our code, mainly
> by overriding new and delete.  One of the uncertainties I'm bumping up
> against is how to know if there are parts of our code that are not using
> the memory manager (allocating "unmanaged" memory).
>
> Has anyone come up with a good way of detecting "unmanaged" memory
> allocation?  If not, anyone have tips on minimizing this possiblity?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Carl

Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[Ivan K. <ik...@ab...>]

Hi,

I'm developing a C/C++ library of debugging utilities, you can find it at

http://www.ikolev.com/DebugTools

After a few unsatisfactory solutions, I finally decided to keep all managed allocations in a splay tree. Whenever a deallocation request arrives, I search the tree for the specified pointer. The performance hit is so negligible, that I decided to keep the memory tracker in release code.

Regards,
Ivan


> From: Carl Bevil <car...@ya...>
> To: Gam...@li...
> Subject: [GD-General] Memory manager question
> Reply-To: gam...@li...
> 
> I'm in the process of installing a memory manager into our code, mainly by overriding new and delete.  One of the uncertainties I'm bumping up against is how to know if there are parts of our code that are not using the memory manager (allocating "unmanaged" memory).
> 
> Has anyone come up with a good way of detecting "unmanaged" memory allocation?  If not, anyone have tips on minimizing this possiblity?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Carl

Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[<cas...@ya...>]

On Linux I also use electric fence. It´s quite good detecting memory
overrides and it´s super easy to use, you just have to add -lefence to your
LDFLAGS. I use it by default on all of the debug builds and does not had a
significant speed overhead. Depending on the options you choose it may
consume a lot of memory, though.

--
Ignacio Castaño
cas...@ya...

bac...@ke... escribió: 
> Hi
> 
> We have proted our engine to linux, and under debian we using the most
> popular software for this, valgrind.
> It's very slow, but in our cases it was 100% perfect.
> 
> Peter Balogh



		
______________________________________________
Renovamos el Correo Yahoo!: ¡100 MB GRATIS!
Nuevos servicios, más seguridad
http://correo.yahoo.es

Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[<phi...@pl...>]

We use hardcoded breakpoints in library routines. Seriously, we have some
code that splats a call to an assert handler into various malloc library
routines. Kind of a nuclear option, but it works.

Cheers,
Phil




                                                                           
             Carl Bevil                                                    
             <carl_bevil@yahoo                                             
             .com>                                                      To 
             Sent by:                  Gam...@li...urcefo 
             gamedevlists-gene         rge.net                             
             ral-admin@lists.s                                          cc 
             ourceforge.net                                                
                                                                   Subject 
                                       [GD-General] Memory manager         
             12/01/2004 11:35          question                            
             AM                                                            
                                                                           
                                                                           
             Please respond to                                             
             gamedevlists-gene                                             
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I'm in the process of installing a memory manager into our code, mainly by
overriding new and delete.  One of the uncertainties I'm bumping up against
is how to know if there are parts of our code that are not using the memory
manager (allocating "unmanaged" memory).

Has anyone come up with a good way of detecting "unmanaged" memory
allocation?  If not, anyone have tips on minimizing this possiblity?

Thanks!

Carl



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Re: [GD-General] Memory manager question

[<bac...@ke...>]

Hi

We have proted our engine to linux, and under debian we using the most
popular software for this, valgrind.
It's very slow, but in our cases it was 100% perfect.

Peter Balogh

> I'm in the process of installing a memory manager into our code, mainly by
> overriding new and delete.  One of the uncertainties I'm bumping up
> against is how to know if there are parts of our code that are not using
> the memory manager (allocating "unmanaged" memory).
>
> Has anyone come up with a good way of detecting "unmanaged" memory
> allocation?  If not, anyone have tips on minimizing this possiblity?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Carl
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide
> Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users.
> Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now.
> http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-general mailing list
> Gam...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> Archives:
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=557
>

[GD-General] Memory manager question

[Carl B. <car...@ya...>]

I'm in the process of installing a memory manager into our code, mainly by overriding new and delete.  One of the uncertainties I'm bumping up against is how to know if there are parts of our code that are not using the memory manager (allocating "unmanaged" memory).

Has anyone come up with a good way of detecting "unmanaged" memory allocation?  If not, anyone have tips on minimizing this possiblity?

Thanks!

Carl

[GD-General] S3TC/DXTn compression

[Jim K. <jim...@st...>]

I was wondering what which algorithm is most commonly used to compress
textures into S3TC format.
Up until now we've used a s3tc.lib from S3 but we're about upgrade our
development environment to 64-bit and the lib file is a 32-bit. I've
scavanged the net (using google) but the only thing I've come across are
dead links referring to code written by Jason Dorie.

Are everyone using the commandline tools supplied by ATI/nVidia?

--- Jim Kjellin
Starbreeze Studios

Re: [GD-General] Unit tests

[Noel L. <nl...@co...>]

On Friday 15 October 2004 04:44 am, Chris Raine wrote:
> I found unit-testing cumbersome as soon as you come to debugging your
> unit-test code.

I don't understand how unit tests can be cumbersome to debug. A unit test 
should be extremely simple and be just a few lines long. You will hardly ever 
have to debug (as in, step in the debugger) a unit test itself. The problem 
should always be obvious it if fails because a unit test tests one and only 
one thing.

> As soon as you come to terms with more abstract and highlevel design
> aspects of your engine, the time and effort spent in unit-testing (for
> us at least) did not outweigh the benefits.

It sounds like you didn't have a good architecture. It's easier to start 
testing low-level features, but to test the high-level code, you really need 
a modular architecture with a minimum of dependencies.

The best way to arrive at this architecture is to use test-driven development 
(TDD). I can't recommend it highly enough. If you develop things that way, it 
will become immediately obvious how to structure your AI code so it's easily 
testable. You'll find you can create just about any object on the stack and 
manipulate it in isolation from other objects/libraries.

> For high level, abstact functionality we abandoned the unit test
> approach and implemented a nightly build script

Automated builds and unit tests are completely different things. You really 
should have both, not one or the other. Same thing with functional tests, 
which test whole game behaviors instead of small units of functionality. 
Ideally you would do all three.


--Noel
Games from Within
http://www.gamesfromwithin.com

Re: [GD-General] Unit tests

[Jorrit T. <jor...@gm...>]

On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 13:44:17 +0200, Chris Raine <c....@gm...> wrote:
> This of course did not catch the bugs when the content was displayed
> incorrectly, or if other functionality was broken (e.g, ai behaving
> wrong, renderer displaying strange images), but these bugs cannot be
> caught by unit tests either but by a developer who tests his code
> extensively by running it and looking at the results.

It would be possible to do output tests too if you make a screenshot
from the rendering and compare that to a previous rendering. You can
use image comparison tools that do 'fuzzy' comparisons so that small
deviations are not flagged as errors.

Greetings,

Re: [GD-General] Unit tests

[Chris R. <c....@gm...>]

I found unit-testing cumbersome as soon as you come to debugging your
unit-test code.=20

As soon as you come to terms with more abstract and highlevel design
aspects of your engine, the time and effort spent in unit-testing (for
us at least) did not outweigh the benefits.

For low-level (math-, mesh/geometry-, animation related functionality,
where behaviour is well defined and results can be checked easily) there
was a huge benefit as unit tests resulted in catching code changes
breaking existing code paths.

For high level, abstact functionality we abandoned the unit test
approach and implemented a nightly build script, which checked if the
engine would compile and would load all finished content and compare the
standard output against wanted results (e.g, it would send a mail to all
developers if the word "error:" appeared in the output while loading the
content).

This of course did not catch the bugs when the content was displayed
incorrectly, or if other functionality was broken (e.g, ai behaving
wrong, renderer displaying strange images), but these bugs cannot be
caught by unit tests either but by a developer who tests his code
extensively by running it and looking at the results.=20

just mho and my 2 cents,=20

regards,=20
Chris=20



On Thu, 2004-10-14 at 19:28, Jason Bay wrote:
> I'm very curious to explore how (or whether) the XP-stoked unit test=20
> paradigm can work in games. Are any of you are using automated unit tests=
 in=20
> your game engine? If so, do you have any suggestions to help me along? Ca=
n=20
> you point me at any printed or online resources about unit testing that=20
> would apply to real time games?
>=20
> I've been making a concerted effort lately to work some small automated=20
> tests into our game engine code to do simple things like checking for=20
> alignment of related tables, checking math-related functions, etc. So far=
,=20
> it's been limited to a group of special test functions that get run when =
the=20
> game is launched, and which will assert if anything goes wrong.
>=20
> But I'm at a loss as to how go about constructing unit tests for most of =
the=20
> game functions, such as menu navigation, interacting with AI, etc. It see=
ms=20
> like this would require me to write some kind of module to simulate user=20
> input (cursor moves, button presses, etc.) and I'm not sure how I could=20
> possibly write something that could come close to simulating the input=20
> patterns of a human. Plus, I'm writing for resource-limited handheld=20
> consoles (currently the Nintendo GBA and DS), so I can't really use a=20
> separate app to poke at my game while it's running, as I might be able to=
 do=20
> on a PC.
>=20
> If you have any suggestions, anecdotes, or resources, I'd love to hear th=
em.
>=20
> Jason Bay
> Griptonite Games
>=20
> (P.S. I sent this message earlier in the week, but it didn't appear to sh=
ow=20
> up on the list. My apologies if this turns out to be a duplicate.)
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: IT Product Guide on ITManagersJournal
> Use IT products in your business? Tell us what you think of them. Give us
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re
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
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> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=3D557
>=20

Re: [GD-General] Unit tests

[Kent Q. <ken...@co...>]

Much testing can be done if you architect the application properly. In 
particular, it's very useful to create a very thin interface through which 
all variable input flows. This includes:

* Keystrokes
* Controllers (mouse, joystick, touchpad)
* Timing information
* Random numbers

You can then record and play back this stream to provide certain types of 
tests (as well as a handy macro capability).

You can also write simulators which can act like anything from random 
banging on the keyboard to structured testing.

On the other side of the same interface, you can write a simulator that 
checks to see if your input functions are generating the expected results.

If you're also careful to separate your user interface using some sort of 
pattern like Model-View-Controller, it becomes possible to write a View 
that has no graphics and simply reports results. This gives you the ability 
to record and play back user interface code without having to watch a screen.

And so forth. I must confess I've never successfully implemented all of 
this. Different bits on different projects, yes. But priorities vary per 
project.

Don't forget that most internal functions have no user interface and can be 
independently tested if you're clever about it.

         Kent

At 01:28 PM 10/14/2004, you wrote:
>I'm very curious to explore how (or whether) the XP-stoked unit test 
>paradigm can work in games. Are any of you are using automated unit tests 
>in your game engine? If so, do you have any suggestions to help me along? 
>Can you point me at any printed or online resources about unit testing 
>that would apply to real time games?
>
>I've been making a concerted effort lately to work some small automated 
>tests into our game engine code to do simple things like checking for 
>alignment of related tables, checking math-related functions, etc. So far, 
>it's been limited to a group of special test functions that get run when 
>the game is launched, and which will assert if anything goes wrong.
>
>But I'm at a loss as to how go about constructing unit tests for most of 
>the game functions, such as menu navigation, interacting with AI, etc. It 
>seems like this would require me to write some kind of module to simulate 
>user input (cursor moves, button presses, etc.) and I'm not sure how I 
>could possibly write something that could come close to simulating the 
>input patterns of a human. Plus, I'm writing for resource-limited handheld 
>consoles (currently the Nintendo GBA and DS), so I can't really use a 
>separate app to poke at my game while it's running, as I might be able to 
>do on a PC.
>
>If you have any suggestions, anecdotes, or resources, I'd love to hear them.
>
>Jason Bay
>Griptonite Games
>
>(P.S. I sent this message earlier in the week, but it didn't appear to 
>show up on the list. My apologies if this turns out to be a duplicate.)
>
>
>
>
>-------------------------------------------------------
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>Use IT products in your business? Tell us what you think of them. Give us
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----
Kent Quirk
CTO, CogniToy

Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Staffan L. <sta...@gb...>]

> I don't think so. I think it's more that they're catching up with iso
> c++ 99 standard, as most compilers, including MS ones, do. In fact,
> that change happened at the same time they rewrote their c++ parser
> from scratch to attain better standard conformance.
> They refer is as "cast-to-lvalue *extension*", which imo imply that
> it's not part of the standard.

None of the constructs in this thread have been using the "cast-as-lvalue 
extension" of GCC. The extension is transparently converting an rvalue to an 
lvalue. That's why the example,

char *p;
((int *) p)++;

compiles. The cast (int*) should result in an rvalue, hence applying the 
post inc. operator shouldn't be legal. There is no rule that explicitly 
prohibits casting an lvalue of one type to an lvalue of another type.

But I agree that (char*&)BufferPtr+=stride looks unintuitive.

Staffan 

[GD-General] Unit tests

[Jason B. <bay...@ho...>]

I'm very curious to explore how (or whether) the XP-stoked unit test 
paradigm can work in games. Are any of you are using automated unit tests in 
your game engine? If so, do you have any suggestions to help me along? Can 
you point me at any printed or online resources about unit testing that 
would apply to real time games?

I've been making a concerted effort lately to work some small automated 
tests into our game engine code to do simple things like checking for 
alignment of related tables, checking math-related functions, etc. So far, 
it's been limited to a group of special test functions that get run when the 
game is launched, and which will assert if anything goes wrong.

But I'm at a loss as to how go about constructing unit tests for most of the 
game functions, such as menu navigation, interacting with AI, etc. It seems 
like this would require me to write some kind of module to simulate user 
input (cursor moves, button presses, etc.) and I'm not sure how I could 
possibly write something that could come close to simulating the input 
patterns of a human. Plus, I'm writing for resource-limited handheld 
consoles (currently the Nintendo GBA and DS), so I can't really use a 
separate app to poke at my game while it's running, as I might be able to do 
on a PC.

If you have any suggestions, anecdotes, or resources, I'd love to hear them.

Jason Bay
Griptonite Games

(P.S. I sent this message earlier in the week, but it didn't appear to show 
up on the list. My apologies if this turns out to be a duplicate.)

Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Antoine C. <a.c...@gm...>]

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 15:11:04 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...> wrote:
> if you are referring to this:
> 
> http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html
> from the section starting:
> "The cast-as-lvalue extension has been removed for C++ and deprecated
> for C and Objective-C. In particular, code like this: "
> 
> then that is just that GCC has caught up with MS compilers in
> dissallowing the implicit lvalue return of standard C style casts
> 
> Still appears to be perfectly legal to cast to an explicit lvalue type...
> 
> Please correct me if i am wrong on this... At least in my head it
> certainly seems to make no sense to take out casting to a modifiable
> type...
> 

Alright, my apologies, for I misunderstood what they meant. The
comments in gcc release notes were only refering to gcc extension of
cast-as-lvalue as in the additional stuff they allowed there, not as
cast-as-lvalue as a whole.

I tried to compile this with gcc 3.4.0:
	void *ptr;
	(char*&)ptr += 5;

and indeed, it worked.

Trying to compile
	void *ptr;
	(char)ptr += 5;

gave the following error message:
"error: ISO C++ forbids cast to non-reference type used as lvalue"

Which confirm that the standard allows using cast as a reference, and
only them, as lvalues, so you were right.

I'll be banging my head on some nearby wall.

RE: SPAM-LOW: Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Peter L. <pe...@to...>]

the other problem was that pointer arithmetic can't be done on a void* since
the size of the object it points to isn't defined. One of his casts let the
compiler treat it as a char* pointer - the other form did the arithmetic on
a void* and then cast it to a char*.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gam...@li...
> [mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
> Richard Fabian
> Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 7:11 AM
> To: gam...@li...
> Subject: SPAM-LOW: Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer
>
>
> if you are referring to this:
>
> http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html
> from the section starting:
> "The cast-as-lvalue extension has been removed for C++ and deprecated
> for C and Objective-C. In particular, code like this: "
>
> then that is just that GCC has caught up with MS compilers in
> dissallowing the implicit lvalue return of standard C style casts
>
> Still appears to be perfectly legal to cast to an explicit lvalue type...
>
> Please correct me if i am wrong on this... At least in my head it
> certainly seems to make no sense to take out casting to a modifiable
> type...
>
> Regarding Ola Olsson: static_cast is a little bit safer, as the types
> Cavey Gerard was referring to were reasonably compatible. AFAIK
> reinterpret_cast is used to allow you to do more "dodgy" casting, e.g.
> between a function pointer and a float, something which static_cast
> does not do...
> Again, please correct me if i am wrong.
>
>
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 13:42:53 +0200, Antoine Chavasse
> <a.c...@gm...> wrote:
> > On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:23:16 +0100, Richard Fabian
> <ra...@gm...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > so really it just boils down to what you're comfortable with, with te
> > > caveat that maybe you should be comfortable with using cast to lvalue.
> >
> > However, afaik using cast as lvalues isn't standard.
> > It's deprecated now in gcc.
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
>
>
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Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Antoine C. <a.c...@gm...>]

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 15:11:04 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...> wrote:
> if you are referring to this:
> 
> http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html
> from the section starting:
> "The cast-as-lvalue extension has been removed for C++ and deprecated
> for C and Objective-C. In particular, code like this: "
> 
> then that is just that GCC has caught up with MS compilers in
> dissallowing the implicit lvalue return of standard C style casts

I don't think so. I think it's more that they're catching up with iso
c++ 99 standard, as most compilers, including MS ones, do. In fact,
that change happened at the same time they rewrote their c++ parser
from scratch to attain better standard conformance.
They refer is as "cast-to-lvalue *extension*", which imo imply that
it's not part of the standard.

> 
> Still appears to be perfectly legal to cast to an explicit lvalue type...

Not if you consider that "cast-as-lvalue", as they put it, might mean
"using a cast expression as if it was a lvalue". I don't see any
exception being made here depending on what you're casting to.

> 
> Please correct me if i am wrong on this... At least in my head it
> certainly seems to make no sense to take out casting to a modifiable
> type...

I don't know, it doesn't surprise me they forbid it. It seems to me
that about the only thing it could be used for is to specify the size
of data pointed by a void pointer, as you shown before. What would it
mean in other cases ? What would it do ?

> 
> Regarding Ola Olsson: static_cast is a little bit safer, as the types
> Cavey Gerard was referring to were reasonably compatible. AFAIK
> reinterpret_cast is used to allow you to do more "dodgy" casting, e.g.
> between a function pointer and a float, something which static_cast
> does not do...

reinterpret_cast is indeed the most permissive C++ cast, but iirc it's
usage is not guaranteed to be portable (for reasons like endianess)

Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Richard F. <ra...@gm...>]

if you are referring to this:

http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html
from the section starting:
"The cast-as-lvalue extension has been removed for C++ and deprecated
for C and Objective-C. In particular, code like this: "

then that is just that GCC has caught up with MS compilers in
dissallowing the implicit lvalue return of standard C style casts

Still appears to be perfectly legal to cast to an explicit lvalue type...

Please correct me if i am wrong on this... At least in my head it
certainly seems to make no sense to take out casting to a modifiable
type...

Regarding Ola Olsson: static_cast is a little bit safer, as the types
Cavey Gerard was referring to were reasonably compatible. AFAIK
reinterpret_cast is used to allow you to do more "dodgy" casting, e.g.
between a function pointer and a float, something which static_cast
does not do...
Again, please correct me if i am wrong.


On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 13:42:53 +0200, Antoine Chavasse
<a.c...@gm...> wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:23:16 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...> wrote:
> 
> >
> > so really it just boils down to what you're comfortable with, with te
> > caveat that maybe you should be comfortable with using cast to lvalue.
> 
> However, afaik using cast as lvalues isn't standard.
> It's deprecated now in gcc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Ola O. <ola...@gm...>]

Well, its quite a difference between using different coding styles that are
standard conformant and writing code that may not compile on the next
platform you want to target...

So, thanks for pointing that out, Antoine.

And really, you should be using reinterpret_cast ;)

cheers
.ola

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Richard Fabian" <ra...@gm...>
To: <gam...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer


> We can carry on forever on this e.g. "you should be using static_cast"
>
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 13:42:53 +0200, Antoine Chavasse
> <a.c...@gm...> wrote:
> > On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:23:16 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...>
wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > so really it just boils down to what you're comfortable with, with te
> > > caveat that maybe you should be comfortable with using cast to lvalue.
> >
> > However, afaik using cast as lvalues isn't standard.
> > It's deprecated now in gcc.
> >

Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Richard F. <ra...@gm...>]

We can carry on forever on this e.g. "you should be using static_cast"

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 13:42:53 +0200, Antoine Chavasse
<a.c...@gm...> wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:23:16 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...> wrote:
> 
> >
> > so really it just boils down to what you're comfortable with, with te
> > caveat that maybe you should be comfortable with using cast to lvalue.
> 
> However, afaik using cast as lvalues isn't standard.
> It's deprecated now in gcc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: IT Product Guide on ITManagersJournal
> Use IT products in your business? Tell us what you think of them. Give us
> Your Opinions, Get Free ThinkGeek Gift Certificates! Click to find out more
> http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/guidepromo.tmpl
> _______________________________________________
> Gamedevlists-general mailing list
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-general
> Archives:
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>

Re: [GD-General] Offset a void pointer

[Antoine C. <a.c...@gm...>]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:23:16 +0100, Richard Fabian <ra...@gm...> wrote:

> 
> so really it just boils down to what you're comfortable with, with te
> caveat that maybe you should be comfortable with using cast to lvalue.

However, afaik using cast as lvalues isn't standard.
It's deprecated now in gcc.

RE: [GD-General] Program for managing project, stuff, etc.

[Jamie F. <ja...@qu...>]

Sadly, I would agree that MS Project isn't great, but it's still the best
thing we've used.

Jamie


-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
Pavel Tumik
Sent: 13 October 2004 10:48
To: gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-General] Program for managing project, stuff, etc.


Hello,

Could someone assist with choosing programm for managing project,
stuff, time (deadlines, etc), etc.
I have tried MS Project 2002, but seems like it's not working good for
me with a lot of small tasks.
So, are there any good alternatives for managing project (lot of small
tasks for different persons, departments), to manage cooperation
between departments (like, that tasks are dependable on another
tasks). That are the main requirements for such programm.

Also, what programm are you using for managing project?

Thanks in advance.

--
Best regards,
 Pavel Tumik                          mailto:sa...@ro...



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Use IT products in your business? Tell us what you think of them. Give us
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_______________________________________________
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Archives:
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RE: [GD-General] Program for managing project, stuff, etc.

[Ivan-Assen I. <as...@ha...>]

> Could someone assist with choosing programm for managing project,
> stuff, time (deadlines, etc), etc.
> I have tried MS Project 2002, but seems like it's not working good for
> me with a lot of small tasks.
> So, are there any good alternatives for managing project (lot of small
> tasks for different persons, departments), to manage cooperation
> between departments (like, that tasks are dependable on another
> tasks). That are the main requirements for such programm.

We tried Microsoft Project 2003, and, after overcoming the initial revulsion,
found it to be actually quite powerful. It took a couple of simple VBA scripts,
however.

My advice is to force yourself to spend at least 4 hours with it, entering
all your data - including dependencies, deadlines, and assigning tasks.

I don't know what you mean by "lot of small tasks" - we have on the 
order of 300 tasks for the software team, and 700 art asset tasks;
tasks are estimated to take something between 1 and 5 days.