MS-DOS limits a normal 3.5" floppy size to 1.44MB. However 1.785MB are possible with normal 3.5" floppies and drives.
It requires a special formatting software and a DOS-driver. Both works fine with MS-DOS but as I see it, not with Freedos.
A free application which can format 3.5" floppies to above formats is: VgaCopy (Freeware)
Download from: http://www.moenk.de/index.php?serendipity\[subpage]=downloadmanager&thiscat=2&file=1
Usage instructions:
- Execute vgacopy.exe
- Press "ESC"-Key on Splashscreen
- Click "Formfill" (with your mouse)
- Choose the desired format (for example 1.785MB)
- Click "Write" (with your mouse)
- (Formatting floppy - This will also put the driver vgaread.exe on the floppy)
- Click Quit
Surprisingly you can run the driver directly from the floppy. (MS-DOS supports this!)
(It is necessary to run the driver to be able to access the complete floppy.)
Now you can use the floppy just as any other floppy, but with more space!
Of course users would copy the driver to their harddrive and add it to their autoexec.bat.
I tried to use it with Freedos. Unfortunately it cannot see such floppies. With and without running the driver from harddrive I get the typical read error with "abort", "retry", "ignore", "error" message.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
- The VgaCopy freeware mentioned earlier works fine under WinXP, unfortunately the vgaread.exe driver (which is needed for normal floppy) use doesn't.
- (I need the hi-format functionality to transfer some nostalgic data from my floppies to harddrive)
It would be more then welcome if Freedos would support these floppies completely without drivers.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
I assume that in the meantime the usage of these special formats goes only to zero.
For using diskettes in virtual machines you can create virtual 2,8 MB diskette images (supported by kernel and by format) and use it. Additional you have more free space.
Enclosed an empty image that only contains kernel, command.com and mkeyb. I think the thread can be closed.
Actually, I think the user is referring to something else.
For example, PC-DOS 7 was supplied on multiple 1.44MB floppy diskettes. The first diskette was using a standard format. It would boot the PC and load an XDF driver. The remainder of the floppy diskettes used for the install were not formatted normally. The used an alternate format to place more data on the 1.44mb diskette therefore reducing the total number of disks required to install the operating system. As a side note, those files were also compressed to further decrease the number of required diskettes.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
He talked only about Mönkemeiers VGAcopy that is still available for download (as freeware). https://archive.org/details/vgacp625 I remember it.
I know that there were several tools for creating oversizes, 2.8 MB diskette drives were very expensive.
At the moment my USB diskette drive tries to format a diskette to 1,785 kB, after felt 15 minutes it is at sector 46. I will report later about the result.
This were the good old times where you needed a lot of time for formatting one diskette!
Okay, I am a little bit further now:
I was able to create high formatted floppy disks with vgacopy under Win XP on bare metal and a real diskette drive - and FreeDOS was able to read them (even from an USB disk) in virtualbox, see enclosed picures. But the same diskette drive had problems with creating disks in virtual box and an USB drive.
So it seems to me that virtualbox refuses to write more than 1,4 MB.
I will try to run some more tests with bare metal.
Okay, it is now sure that it is not the debt of FD when VGACopy does not work. I just tested it with two diskettes, one of them booted FD and started vgacopy on pure metal, the second was formatted (1,7 MB) and works fine!
It can even be made bootable!
If you have a closer look at VGACopy05.png you may see that there were problems with the oversize (marked in yellow) in virtualbox in combination with USB diskette drive.
As this ticket is related to VGACopy I think it can be closed.
--- Some more information ---
Typical "high" formats were:
1.6MB 20Sectors 2Heads 80Tracks
1.68MB 21Sectors 2Heads 80Tracks
1.722MB 21Sectors 2Heads 82Tracks
1.785MB 21Sectors 2Heads 85Tracks
A free application which can format 3.5" floppies to above formats is: VgaCopy (Freeware)
Download from: http://www.moenk.de/index.php?serendipity\[subpage]=downloadmanager&thiscat=2&file=1
Usage instructions:
- Execute vgacopy.exe
- Press "ESC"-Key on Splashscreen
- Click "Formfill" (with your mouse)
- Choose the desired format (for example 1.785MB)
- Click "Write" (with your mouse)
- (Formatting floppy - This will also put the driver vgaread.exe on the floppy)
- Click Quit
Surprisingly you can run the driver directly from the floppy. (MS-DOS supports this!)
(It is necessary to run the driver to be able to access the complete floppy.)
Now you can use the floppy just as any other floppy, but with more space!
Of course users would copy the driver to their harddrive and add it to their autoexec.bat.
I tried to use it with Freedos. Unfortunately it cannot see such floppies. With and without running the driver from harddrive I get the typical read error with "abort", "retry", "ignore", "error" message.
--- Even more information --
- The VgaCopy freeware mentioned earlier works fine under WinXP, unfortunately the vgaread.exe driver (which is needed for normal floppy) use doesn't.
- (I need the hi-format functionality to transfer some nostalgic data from my floppies to harddrive)
It would be more then welcome if Freedos would support these floppies completely without drivers.
I forgot to add: The (very small!) driver would just remove the DOS limitation of 1.44MB. The filesystem used is a normal FAT.
I assume that in the meantime the usage of these special formats goes only to zero.
For using diskettes in virtual machines you can create virtual 2,8 MB diskette images (supported by kernel and by format) and use it. Additional you have more free space.
Enclosed an empty image that only contains kernel, command.com and mkeyb.
I think the thread can be closed.
Actually, I think the user is referring to something else.
For example, PC-DOS 7 was supplied on multiple 1.44MB floppy diskettes. The first diskette was using a standard format. It would boot the PC and load an XDF driver. The remainder of the floppy diskettes used for the install were not formatted normally. The used an alternate format to place more data on the 1.44mb diskette therefore reducing the total number of disks required to install the operating system. As a side note, those files were also compressed to further decrease the number of required diskettes.
He talked only about Mönkemeiers VGAcopy that is still available for download (as freeware). https://archive.org/details/vgacp625 I remember it.
I know that there were several tools for creating oversizes, 2.8 MB diskette drives were very expensive.
At the moment my USB diskette drive tries to format a diskette to 1,785 kB, after felt 15 minutes it is at sector 46. I will report later about the result.
This were the good old times where you needed a lot of time for formatting one diskette!
Last edit: fritz.mueller 2024-08-17
Okay, I am a little bit further now:
I was able to create high formatted floppy disks with vgacopy under Win XP on bare metal and a real diskette drive - and FreeDOS was able to read them (even from an USB disk) in virtualbox, see enclosed picures. But the same diskette drive had problems with creating disks in virtual box and an USB drive.
So it seems to me that virtualbox refuses to write more than 1,4 MB.
I will try to run some more tests with bare metal.
Last edit: fritz.mueller 2024-08-18
Okay, it is now sure that it is not the debt of FD when VGACopy does not work. I just tested it with two diskettes, one of them booted FD and started vgacopy on pure metal, the second was formatted (1,7 MB) and works fine!
It can even be made bootable!
If you have a closer look at VGACopy05.png you may see that there were problems with the oversize (marked in yellow) in virtualbox in combination with USB diskette drive.
As this ticket is related to VGACopy I think it can be closed.
Last edit: fritz.mueller 2024-08-18