chessdb-users — User mailing list - used by developers too.

[Chessdb-users] question about saving/reusing searches

[Peter H. <ph...@sp...>]

Hi - maybe a dumb couple of questions, but here goes.  What I'd like to 
do is to construct a .pgn file composed just of the games from the 
recent Aerosvit (Foros) tournament; other questions have arisen out of 
this desire.

I've got one main Chessdb database that's nothing more or less than the 
~700K games available through TWIC.  I can find the Foros games easily 
by doing a header search.  Here is where my questions arise:

1) The header search dialogue offers an option to "Save" as an .sso 
file.  This I take it is a way of saving the parameters of one's search 
so it can be repeated later?  If I close the header search dialogue and 
open the game list containing the games I just found (CTRL-L), there is 
another "Save" option - but I cannot figure out what I would use this 
second type of save file for?

2)  My main question - is it possible to create a .pgn of all of the 
games I've just found with my header search?

Thanks very much -

Re: [Chessdb-users] bug report

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Peter Horst wrote:
> Hi, I was attempting to save a list of games, by hitting the "Save..." 
> button within the Game List, when an error occurred.  At the time, the 
> Game List contained a subset of my main database that had been arrived 
> at by Searching for a particular position.  ChessDB 3.6.15, WinXP Pro.
> 
> Here is the error log:
> 
> <------------------->
> 
> missing close-bracket
> missing close-bracket
>     while compiling
> "set fname [tk_getSaveFile -filetypes $ftypes -parent .glexport  -title 
> [ tr ChessDBSaveGameList ]
>   if {$fname == ""} { return }
>   set showProgress 0

Hi Peter,

Thank you for the bug report, which was helpful. Any error messages 
generated, even if you find a workaround, should be reported. It's quite 
hard to detect such errors when building the software, as the language 
used (Tcl) is interpreted, not compiled. If a compiled language had been 
used, it would have been impossible to build the executable like that. 
But Scid was written in Tcl (mostly) and I'm not going to change it.

I had spotted this particular error  some time back, but I've not made a 
new release yes - I will do shortly. The problem is in the source file

tcl/windows/gamelist.tcl

This link highlights the error, which is a missing ']'

http://chessdb.cvs.sourceforge.net/chessdb/chessdb/tcl/windows/gamelist.tcl?r1=1.3&r2=1.4

(ignore the line number, as it will not necessarily be line 727 as in 
that link)

If you find the file c:\program files\chessdb\bin\chessdb.gui

then search for the bit of text with a simple text editor (notepad will 
do, but don't use something like Word) and just add the missing ']' and 
it should solve the problem.

PS, for unix users, the file will be something like

/usr/local/bin/chessdb

i.e. 'chessdb' and not 'chessdb.gui'


If you, or anyone else spots

[Chessdb-users] bug report

[Peter H. <ph...@sp...>]

Hi, I was attempting to save a list of games, by hitting the "Save..." 
button within the Game List, when an error occurred.  At the time, the 
Game List contained a subset of my main database that had been arrived 
at by Searching for a particular position.  ChessDB 3.6.15, WinXP Pro.

Here is the error log:

<------------------->

missing close-bracket
missing close-bracket
    while compiling
"set fname [tk_getSaveFile -filetypes $ftypes -parent .glexport  -title 
[ tr ChessDBSaveGameList ]
  if {$fname == ""} { return }
  set showProgress 0
..."
    (compiling body of proc "saveExportGList", line 4)
    invoked from within
"saveExportGList"
    invoked from within
".glexport.b.ok invoke"
    ("uplevel" body line 1)
    invoked from within
"uplevel #0 [list $w invoke]"
    (procedure "tk::ButtonUp" line 24)
    invoked from within
"tk::ButtonUp .glexport.b.ok"
    (command bound to event)

<------------------->

Thanks.

Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound to Tk?

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Will Mason wrote:
> I don't know how the duplicate message got through, especially after 
> such a long delay.

Sorry, that was my fault.


I got a lot of spam sent to the list. There were 22 or so junk mails and 
one that you sent a week or so ago that was not junk. I did not realise 
  you had resent it, so when i purged the junk today, I did not delete 
your mail.

Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound to Tk?

[Will M. <wil...@us...>]

I don't know how the duplicate message got through, especially after such a=
 long delay.=0A=0AI've actually started working through the surgery of un-T=
cl-ing the code, and it's really not too bad. So much of the code in there =
is dedicated to dealing with parsing the Tcl argument lists that once you e=
xtract just the code that actually does the work it comes out looking a lot=
 cleaner. Then you just wrap the C interface back in the Tcl to recreate th=
e Tcl interface so that the old GUI will still work.=0A=0AIf I can find the=
 time to finish this first stage of creating a new GUI, then I'll share the=
 results. I could very well just encounter the same problems you describe b=
elow, though. We'll see.=0A=0ACheers,=0AWill=0A=0A----- Original Message --=
--=0AFrom: Michal Rudolf <mr...@kd...>=0ATo: chessdb-users@lists.=
sourceforge.net=0ASent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 5:46:58 PM=0ASubject: Re: [Ch=
essdb-users] Tightly bound to Tk?=0A=0AWill Mason,  niedziela, 8 lipca 2007=
:=0A>Hello, list,=0A>I'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm rehas=
hing old news.=0A>=0A>ChessDB seemed to be exactly what I was looking for, =
so I downloaded the=0A> source and built it on Mac OS X. The first thing I =
noticed was that it did=0A> exactly what I was looking for a chess database=
 to do, and the second thing=0A> I noticed was that the UI was amazingly ug=
ly. I poked around in the source=0A> code for a while and came up with the =
following idea.=0A=0A>I think the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should be refac=
tored. Currently, the=0A> only real interface to the DB code is through Tcl=
/Tk. I think the=0A> primordial interface to the code should be in C, from =
which Tcl, Tk, Java,=0A> Ruby, Python and a host of other interfaces could =
be derived. From what=0A> I've seen of the code this would not be an amazin=
gly difficult thing to do:=0A> factor out the C (I know it's C++, but it re=
ally bears a greater=0A> resemblance to C code), expose the interface descr=
ibed in=0A> http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/tutorial/programmers-reference.p=
hp as a=0A> C-only interface, rebuild the Tcl/Tk interface on top of that, =
and finally=0A> build whatever other interfaces one might want. I, for one,=
 would build a=0A> Java interface, first exposing the C interface described=
 above through JNI.=0A>=0A>I write this suggestion to the list rather than =
simply embarking upon its=0A> implementation myself because I just don't ha=
ve time to undertake this=0A> project right now. Or I should say that if I =
did undertake such a project=0A> it would proceed at an extremely slow pace=
 due to my time restrictions.=0A>=0A>I thought I would throw this idea out =
to see if it might appeal to anyone.=0A> Thanks for your time, Will Mason=
=0AWe started similar project called NewScid, trying to use Scid as underly=
ing =0Adatabase and Java for GUI. But we encountered various problems that =
=0Adiscouraged us and convinced us to start another project instead (ChessX=
).=0A=0AOf course, somebody else may have more luck, but I am not sure if i=
t is not =0Aworth an effort  - Scid code seems quite tightly integrated wit=
h Tcl.=0A=0A-- =0AMichal Rudolf=0A=0A--------------------------------------=
-----------------------------------=0AThis SF.net email is sponsored by DB2=
 Express=0ADownload DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and tak=
e=0Acontrol of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now.=0Ahttp:=
//sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/=0A_________________________________________=
______=0AChessdb-users mailing lis...@li...=
=0Ahttps://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/chessdb-users=0A=0A=0A=0A=
=0A

Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound to Tk?

[Michal R. <mr...@kd...>]

Will Mason,  niedziela, 8 lipca 2007:
>Hello, list,
>I'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm rehashing old news.
>
>ChessDB seemed to be exactly what I was looking for, so I downloaded the
> source and built it on Mac OS X. The first thing I noticed was that it did
> exactly what I was looking for a chess database to do, and the second thing
> I noticed was that the UI was amazingly ugly. I poked around in the source
> code for a while and came up with the following idea.

>I think the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should be refactored. Currently, the
> only real interface to the DB code is through Tcl/Tk. I think the
> primordial interface to the code should be in C, from which Tcl, Tk, Java,
> Ruby, Python and a host of other interfaces could be derived. From what
> I've seen of the code this would not be an amazingly difficult thing to do:
> factor out the C (I know it's C++, but it really bears a greater
> resemblance to C code), expose the interface described in
> http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/tutorial/programmers-reference.php as a
> C-only interface, rebuild the Tcl/Tk interface on top of that, and finally
> build whatever other interfaces one might want. I, for one, would build a
> Java interface, first exposing the C interface described above through JNI.
>
>I write this suggestion to the list rather than simply embarking upon its
> implementation myself because I just don't have time to undertake this
> project right now. Or I should say that if I did undertake such a project
> it would proceed at an extremely slow pace due to my time restrictions.
>
>I thought I would throw this idea out to see if it might appeal to anyone.
> Thanks for your time, Will Mason
We started similar project called NewScid, trying to use Scid as underlying 
database and Java for GUI. But we encountered various problems that 
discouraged us and convinced us to start another project instead (ChessX).

Of course, somebody else may have more luck, but I am not sure if it is not 
worth an effort  - Scid code seems quite tightly integrated with Tcl.

-- 
Michal Rudolf

Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound Tk?

[Will M. <wil...@us...>]

Thanks for the speedy response. I think any attempt to improve the UI of Ch=
essDB would have to start with my proposal. Right now, the code that access=
es the underlying DB manipulation code is very tightly bound to Tcl/Tk. My =
suggestion is simply to surgically separate the underlying interface from T=
cl/Tk, so that you could provide interfaces developed with Qt, WxWidgets, R=
uby, Java, Python, and any other of a field of semi-unlimited possibilities=
. And, like I said, extracting a pure C interface from the existing code is=
 not a terribly daunting task, just somewhat time consuming.=0A=0AWith a pu=
re C interface you are really beginning to speak a universal language. The =
current Tcl/Tk interface to the underlying DB code dictates how you must ta=
lk to ChessDB. I would like to see a more open environment in which I could=
 write a beautiful Java UI to the whole code base or a Ruby script that was=
 only meant to extract certain things. The current code structure disallows=
 the freedom that I'm talking about. If the basic interface were pure C, th=
en any language that could utilize a C interface would be able to utilize C=
hessDB. That sounds like a huge plus to me.=0A=0AThe upcoming features that=
 you describe sound very attractive. I really think that ChessDB has the be=
st and brightest future of free chess databases, but I would really like to=
 see a more open API, allowing for a more open range of UI possibilities.=
=0A=0AIf I can make the time, I will create a demo of what I'm talking abou=
t, so that you will see the advantages that I believe can exist,=0AWill=0A=
=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Dr. David Kirkby <david.kirkby@onete=
l.net>=0ATo: Will Mason <wil...@us...>=0ACc: chessdb <c=
hes...@li...>=0ASent: Saturday, July 7, 2007 9:58:15 =
PM=0ASubject: Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound Tk?=0A=0AWill Mason wrote:=
=0A> Hello, list,=0A> I'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm reha=
shing old news.=0A>=0A> ChessDB seemed to be exactly what I was looking for=
, so I downloaded =0A> the source and built it on Mac OS X. The first thing=
 I noticed was =0A> that it did exactly what I was looking for a chess data=
base to do, and =0A> the second thing I noticed was that the UI was amazing=
ly ugly. I poked =0A> around in the source code for a while and came up wit=
h the following idea.=0A>=0A> I think the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should =
be refactored. Currently, =0A> the only real interface to the DB code is th=
rough Tcl/Tk. I think the =0A> primordial interface to the code should be i=
n C, from which Tcl, Tk, =0A> Java, Ruby, Python and a host of other interf=
aces could be derived. =0A> From what I've seen of the code this would not =
be an amazingly =0A> difficult thing to do: factor out the C (I know it's C=
++, but it =0A> really bears a greater resemblance to C code), expose the i=
nterface =0A> described in =0A> http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/tutorial/pro=
grammers-reference.php as a =0A> C-only interface, rebuild the Tcl/Tk inter=
face on top of that, and =0A> finally build whatever other interfaces one m=
ight want. I, for one, =0A> would build a Java interface, first exposing th=
e C interface described =0A> above through JNI.=0A>=0A> I write this sugges=
tion to the list rather than simply embarking upon =0A> its implementation =
myself because I just don't have time to undertake =0A> this project right =
now. Or I should say that if I did undertake such a =0A> project it would p=
roceed at an extremely slow pace due to my time =0A> restrictions.=0A>=0A> =
I thought I would throw this idea out to see if it might appeal to =0A> any=
one. Thanks for your time,=0A> Will Mason=0AHi Will,=0AI would agree the in=
terface is not great, but I'm not so sure it would =0Abe easy to convert it=
 to write another interface. I don't know java, so =0Aif I was doing to do =
that, I'd look at one of the libraries such as Qt, =0AwxWidgets etc. ChessD=
B is not going to win any prizes for the best =0Alooking bit if software, b=
ut neither are ChessBase or Bookup.=0A=0AI have known of some people gettin=
g very poor results on OSX - it seems =0Ato depend on the fonts installed o=
n the Mac.=0A=0AI will be making another release of ChessDB within a week o=
r so. This =0Awill hopefully resolve the issues of downloading games from F=
ICS on =0ALinux. It also adds native UCI engine support, a database backup =
=0Afacility and several other things. Hence if any of the translators have =
=0Asome spare time, perhaps they could look in the CVS.=0A=0AI'm hoping to =
add soon code that determines if there is statistical =0Asignificance to re=
sults from the tree window. So if a move scores  well, =0AI hope to determi=
ne if thst could be due to a lack data or not. if it is =0Astatistically si=
gnificant.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A

Re: [Chessdb-users] Tightly bound Tk?

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Will Mason wrote:
> Hello, list,
> I'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm rehashing old news.
>
> ChessDB seemed to be exactly what I was looking for, so I downloaded 
> the source and built it on Mac OS X. The first thing I noticed was 
> that it did exactly what I was looking for a chess database to do, and 
> the second thing I noticed was that the UI was amazingly ugly. I poked 
> around in the source code for a while and came up with the following idea.
>
> I think the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should be refactored. Currently, 
> the only real interface to the DB code is through Tcl/Tk. I think the 
> primordial interface to the code should be in C, from which Tcl, Tk, 
> Java, Ruby, Python and a host of other interfaces could be derived. 
> From what I've seen of the code this would not be an amazingly 
> difficult thing to do: factor out the C (I know it's C++, but it 
> really bears a greater resemblance to C code), expose the interface 
> described in 
> http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/tutorial/programmers-reference.php as a 
> C-only interface, rebuild the Tcl/Tk interface on top of that, and 
> finally build whatever other interfaces one might want. I, for one, 
> would build a Java interface, first exposing the C interface described 
> above through JNI.
>
> I write this suggestion to the list rather than simply embarking upon 
> its implementation myself because I just don't have time to undertake 
> this project right now. Or I should say that if I did undertake such a 
> project it would proceed at an extremely slow pace due to my time 
> restrictions.
>
> I thought I would throw this idea out to see if it might appeal to 
> anyone. Thanks for your time,
> Will Mason
Hi Will,
I would agree the interface is not great, but I'm not so sure it would 
be easy to convert it to write another interface. I don't know java, so 
if I was doing to do that, I'd look at one of the libraries such as Qt, 
wxWidgets etc. ChessDB is not going to win any prizes for the best 
looking bit if software, but neither are ChessBase or Bookup.

I have known of some people getting very poor results on OSX - it seems 
to depend on the fonts installed on the Mac.

I will be making another release of ChessDB within a week or so. This 
will hopefully resolve the issues of downloading games from FICS on 
Linux. It also adds native UCI engine support, a database backup 
facility and several other things. Hence if any of the translators have 
some spare time, perhaps they could look in the CVS.

I'm hoping to add soon code that determines if there is statistical 
significance to results from the tree window. So if a move scores  well, 
I hope to determine if thst could be due to a lack data or not. if it is 
statistically significant.

[Chessdb-users] Tightly bound Tk?

[Will M. <wil...@us...>]

Hello, list,=0AI'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm rehashing o=
ld news.=0A=0AChessDB=0Aseemed to be exactly what I was looking for, so I d=
ownloaded the source=0Aand built it on Mac OS X. The first thing I noticed =
was that it did=0Aexactly what I was looking for a chess database to do, an=
d the second=0Athing I noticed was that the UI was amazingly ugly. I poked =
around in=0Athe source code for a while and came up with the following idea=
.=0A=0AI=0Athink the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should be refactored. Curren=
tly,=0Athe only real interface to the DB code is through Tcl/Tk. I think th=
e=0Aprimordial interface to the code should be in C, from which Tcl, Tk,=0A=
Java, Ruby, Python and a host of other interfaces could be derived.=0AFrom =
what I've seen of the code this would not be an amazingly=0Adifficult thing=
 to do: factor out the C (I know it's C++, but it really=0Abears a greater =
resemblance to C code), expose the interface described=0Ain http://chessdb.=
sourceforge.net/tutorial/programmers-reference.php as a C-only interface, r=
ebuild the Tcl/Tk=0Ainterface on top of that, and finally build whatever ot=
her interfaces=0Aone might want. I, for one, would build a Java interface, =
first=0Aexposing the C interface described above through JNI.=0A=0AI write=
=0Athis suggestion to the list rather than simply embarking upon its=0Aimpl=
ementation myself because I just don't have time to undertake this=0Aprojec=
t right now. Or I should say that if I did undertake such a=0Aproject it wo=
uld proceed at an extremely slow pace due to my time=0Arestrictions.=0A=0AI=
 thought I would throw this idea out to see if it might appeal to anyone. T=
hanks for your time,=0AWill=0A Mason=0A

[Chessdb-users] Tightly bound to Tk?

[Will M. <tor...@ya...>]

Hello, list,=0AI'm new to the list, so please forgive me if I'm rehashing o=
ld news.=0A=0AChessDB seemed to be exactly what I was looking for, so I dow=
nloaded the source and built it on Mac OS X. The first thing I noticed was =
that it did exactly what I was looking for a chess database to do, and the =
second thing I noticed was that the UI was amazingly ugly. I poked around i=
n the source code for a while and came up with the following idea.=0A=0AI t=
hink the code in src/tkchessdb.cpp should be refactored. Currently, the onl=
y real interface to the DB code is through Tcl/Tk. I think the primordial i=
nterface to the code should be in C, from which Tcl, Tk, Java, Ruby, Python=
 and a host of other interfaces could be derived. From what I've seen of th=
e code this would not be an amazingly difficult thing to do: factor out the=
 C (I know it's C++, but it really bears a greater resemblance to C code), =
expose the interface described in http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/tutorial/p=
rogrammers-reference.php as a C-only interface, rebuild the Tcl/Tk interfac=
e on top of that, and finally build whatever other interfaces one might wan=
t. I, for one, would build a Java interface, first exposing the C interface=
 described above through JNI.=0A=0AI write this suggestion to the list rath=
er than simply embarking upon its implementation myself because I just don'=
t have time to undertake this project right now. Or I should say that if I =
did undertake such a project it would proceed at an extremely slow pace due=
 to my time restrictions.=0A=0AI thought I would throw this idea out to see=
 if it might appeal to anyone. Thanks for your time,=0AWill Mason=0A=0A

Re: [Chessdb-users] ChessDB 3.6.15 - Downloading history games from ICC...

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Caissafan wrote:
> Hi David,
>
> I downloaded a few days ago this ChessDB version knowing yet from SCID in
> past. And I did hope to manage to download games of some big guns from
> ICC.
>
>   
Yes, good idea although the TWIC download feature might be better, as it
is possible to download a lot more games from there. I tend to use the
ICC download for games from players of my own ability more.
> Well, installing ChessDB and configuring including ICC settings were fine.
> And I also managed to log in to ICC as guest!
>   
Yes, but ICC has effectively disabled the guest accounts now - much to
the annoyance of many. Logging in as guest you can do very little indeed.
However, you can log in anonymously IF you have a valid ICC account, by
adding an "!" in front of your username - so instead of foobar, use
!foobar. That is best, as it saves anyone else who might have you on
their notify list being told you have arrived. That could be a bit
annoying I suspect.
> I got the ICC Telnet window, was able to search for all recently running
> (c) accounts etc. And I put some (c) account handles into command line of
> ChessDB Download games window - but how to go on? In which way do I get
> games from the history of (c) accounts specified in command line?
>   
There are three ways to do this, but all need a valid ICC account. You
cant use a 7-day trial account either, as ICC only allow trial accounts
to be used with their own software (Blitzin and Dasher), but not ChessDB.

1) Click Login, then type 'hist someuser' in the UPPER box to see the
history of 'someuser'. Then if you want to save say game number 12, type
in the UPPER box

spgn someuser 12

(spgn is an ICC command to print the game in PGN format).

2) The second, and more convenient way, is to download ALL the games the
history of a player. In this case put the usernames (I suggest no more
than 5) into the lower window. Then click "Login" and ChessDB will
connect to ICC and download all games in the history. ChessDB is not
reliably handling logging out and back in again, so you might find you
have to restart under some circumstances.


3) You can retrieve games from the library of players IF they have saved
any games to their library. For this enter in the UPPER box

liblist someuser (to list games in the library)
spgn someuser %23 (to list game 23 from the library)

Notes
i) The upper box can be used for any ICC command, but it is not
particularly convenient for downloading multiple games, as you need to
type the commands many times.
ii) The lower box is set up specifically for downloading from the
history. It basically executes

spgn someuser -1
spgn someuser -2
spgn someuser -3
to
spgn someuser -20

iii) ICC limits access to the history, so after 100 games (5 players),
you will only be able to download one game every 30 seconds or so.
> Saving any games from history directly is not allowed to guests on ICC. So
> I had the hope to get them with a ChessDB procedure running beyond those
> restrictions.  :-/
>
>   
No, sorry, I know of know way to do that without having an account. You
might be able to tell ICC you are a linux user and get a 7-day trial
account which will work with any software. Then ChessDB will work, but
not as a guest or as a normal trial account.

I will build a windows binary which works on FICS. Although I have not
tested it fully, the source will work on FICS, but last time I knew
there was a problem with only part of longer games being downloaded.
This never appeared on my Solaris system, but I have increased some
buffer sizes, so hopefully that will be OK now. But I have not yet built
a windows binary which supports FICS - I will do so soon.

Re: [Chessdb-users] regarding source distribution

[Christian P. Z. <chr...@gm...>]

On Sat, Jun 09, 2007 at 03:22:16AM +0100, Dr. David Kirkby wrote:
> Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> >hi,
> >
> >I want to tell you some personal comments about your chessdb source
> >distribution.
> >
> >1. The file "ratings.ssp" has the following copyright:
> ># This file is ONLY for use in the Scid chess database program.
> ># For any other use, please contact the author first for permission.
> >This is a very restrictive usage and in my opinionn it's no clear to be
> >allowed to use this file in chessdb. Asking in debian-legal a member
> >told me that, in his opinion, is not free software.
> >
>=20
> I'll look into that. The person maintaining that file has certainly sent=
=20
> me copies of it, and has let me know when he updated it.
>=20

It would be great if the person maintaining the file distributes it
under GPL license or any free license. Otherwise it's a thing to remark
in the chessdb distribution (and the future debian package :)).

> >2. The file "init.tcl" has the following copyright:
> ># Copyright (c) 1991-1993 The Regents of the University of California.
> ># Copyright (c) 1994-1996 Sun Microsystems, Inc.
> ># Copyright (c) 1998-1999 Scriptics Corporation.
> >#
> ># See the file "license.terms" for information on usage and
> ># redistribution
> ># of this file, and for a DISCLAIMER OF ALL WARRANTIES.
> >But there is no license.terms file included in the source distribution.
> >I don't know if this file is used or needed by chessdb or it could be
> >deleted.
>=20
> It can be deleted. It is distributed with tcl, the license of which is at:
>=20
> http://www.tcl.tk/software/tcltk/license.html
>=20

OK

>=20
> >By other side, a lot of files has a "All rights reserved" sentence. I
> >don't know much about licenses and legal issues but a sentence like this
> >in my opinion is opposite to free software and GPL license. I think that
> >sentences like these in source files should be avoided.
>=20
> That text appeas on all the original source files from Scid, which is=20
> clearly GPL'ed.
> Here is the file 'COPYING' from there. Note looking at that, there
> may be an issue with the endgame tablebase code, so i will try to
> clarify that with the author. Note however, that the original author of
> Scid (Shane Hudson), has not been contactable for some years.
>=20

Yes I understand that the license of those files with "All rights
reserved" line is GPL because they were done by Shane and distributed
under GPL (indicated by the COPYING file). But this could be confusing
because this line is opposite to the meaning of the GPL license. The
file distributed under GPL shouldn't have a so restrictive declaration
and should include the lines proposed by the GNU project [1].

[1] http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html#SEC4

In any case it's not an important thing to waste your time, it's only a
comment or recommendation for future developments. :)

Regards,

--=20
Christian Pinedo Zamalloa (zako)
PGP key at: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=3Dget&search=3D0x828D0C80
Fingerprint: 7BFF 4105 F46B 7977 BD96  348C 1007 4FF8 828D 0C80

Re: [Chessdb-users] regarding source distribution

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> hi,
> 
> I want to tell you some personal comments about your chessdb source
> distribution.
> 
> 1. The file "ratings.ssp" has the following copyright:
> # This file is ONLY for use in the Scid chess database program.
> # For any other use, please contact the author first for permission.
> This is a very restrictive usage and in my opinionn it's no clear to be
> allowed to use this file in chessdb. Asking in debian-legal a member
> told me that, in his opinion, is not free software.
> 

I'll look into that. The person maintaining that file has certainly sent 
me copies of it, and has let me know when he updated it.

> 2. The file "init.tcl" has the following copyright:
> # Copyright (c) 1991-1993 The Regents of the University of California.
> # Copyright (c) 1994-1996 Sun Microsystems, Inc.
> # Copyright (c) 1998-1999 Scriptics Corporation.
> #
> # See the file "license.terms" for information on usage and
> # redistribution
> # of this file, and for a DISCLAIMER OF ALL WARRANTIES.
> But there is no license.terms file included in the source distribution.
> I don't know if this file is used or needed by chessdb or it could be
> deleted.

It can be deleted. It is distributed with tcl, the license of which is at:

http://www.tcl.tk/software/tcltk/license.html


> By other side, a lot of files has a "All rights reserved" sentence. I
> don't know much about licenses and legal issues but a sentence like this
> in my opinion is opposite to free software and GPL license. I think that
> sentences like these in source files should be avoided.

That text appeas on all the original source files from Scid, which is 
clearly GPL'ed.
Here is the file 'COPYING' from there. Note looking at that, there
may be an issue with the endgame tablebase code, so i will try to
clarify that with the author. Note however, that the original author of
Scid (Shane Hudson), has not been contactable for some years.




This copyright notice applies to all the files contained in this
distribution of Scid. To contact the author and copyright holder,
email: sg...@us...

Scid website: http://scid.sourceforge.net/

All the files that comprise Scid (except a few contributed files, see
below) are copyright (C) 1999-2003 Shane Hudson and are distributed under
the terms of the Gnu General Public License (GPL), a popular license
used for free software. A copy of the GPL is provided below. As I
understand the GPL, it basically means you can distribute Scid freely,
and may modify it, but any modifications you make must also be made
freely available as source code under the terms of the GPL.

The only files in Scid NOT distributed under the GPL (since they have
a different author and copyright, but they are freely distributable)
are the Zlib library (see the src/zlib directory), a Tcl package
for sending email using SMTP (see the tcl/ezsmtp directory), and
endgame tablebase decoding source code (see the src/egtb directory).

Please note: although there is no explicit copyright notice in the
tablebase decoding code, all rights are reserved by its author
Eugene Nalimov and you should ask for permission before using it.
He has granted permission for its distribution in Scid, and out of
courtesy I ask that if you make use of the tablebase code outside
of Scid, please ask Eugene first. His email address is at the end of
the file src/egtb/probe.txt.

Please note that all the Scid programs and source code are provided
with absolutely no warranty of any kind.

Shane Hudson
sg...@us...
January 2003

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

                     GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE
                        Version 2, June 1991

  Copyright (C) 1989, 1991 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
                           675 Mass Ave, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA

<rest of standard GPL stuff removed for brevity>

[Chessdb-users] regarding source distribution

[Christian P. Z. <chr...@gm...>]

hi,

I want to tell you some personal comments about your chessdb source
distribution.

1. The file "ratings.ssp" has the following copyright:
# This file is ONLY for use in the Scid chess database program.
# For any other use, please contact the author first for permission.
This is a very restrictive usage and in my opinionn it's no clear to be
allowed to use this file in chessdb. Asking in debian-legal a member
told me that, in his opinion, is not free software.

2. The file "init.tcl" has the following copyright:
# Copyright (c) 1991-1993 The Regents of the University of California.
# Copyright (c) 1994-1996 Sun Microsystems, Inc.
# Copyright (c) 1998-1999 Scriptics Corporation.
#
# See the file "license.terms" for information on usage and
# redistribution
# of this file, and for a DISCLAIMER OF ALL WARRANTIES.
But there is no license.terms file included in the source distribution.
I don't know if this file is used or needed by chessdb or it could be
deleted.

By other side, a lot of files has a "All rights reserved" sentence. I
don't know much about licenses and legal issues but a sentence like this
in my opinion is opposite to free software and GPL license. I think that
sentences like these in source files should be avoided.

This is all. Best regards,

--=20
Christian Pinedo Zamalloa (zako)
PGP key at: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=3Dget&search=3D0x828D0C80
Fingerprint: 7BFF 4105 F46B 7977 BD96  348C 1007 4FF8 828D 0C80

Re: [Chessdb-users] Setting ChessDB as default PGN program?

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Kareem Talhouni wrote:
> Hello all,
> 
> I'd like to have ChessDB be my default PGN reader
> instead of ChessAssistant Lite which is my default
> now, but I don't know how to set that up. Can someone
> help me out?
> (I'm on Windows XP by the way.)
> 
> Thanks,
> Kareem

Hi,
Click on Start, then 'My Computer', select 'Local disk C', Select 
'Tools' then 'Folder Options'. Click the 'File types' tab and you should 
be able to set it there.

Dave

[Chessdb-users] Setting ChessDB as default PGN program?

[Kareem T. <ko...@ya...>]

Hello all,

I'd like to have ChessDB be my default PGN reader
instead of ChessAssistant Lite which is my default
now, but I don't know how to set that up. Can someone
help me out?
(I'm on Windows XP by the way.)

Thanks,
Kareem


 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate 
in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367

[Chessdb-users] Character encoding problem in ChessDB

[Juan M. R. <ri...@ts...>]

O.S: linux debian with KDE desktop.
ChessDB version 3.6.15.

When I enter comments with non-USacsii characters (i.e. accents), the comme=
nt=20
editor window shows a 2-byte code instead of my accented character.=20

However, I can enter the characters in another editor using latin-1 encodin=
g=20
and paste them into the comment editor window. Characters comming from .pgn=
=20
files with latin-1 encoding are also displayed correctly.

I saved the 2-byte code created by ChessDB in a latex file, and opening the=
=20
file with a text editor reveals that the 2-byte code is not UTF-8, as one=20
might think.

How could I enter accented characters in ChessDB comment editor window?

Thanks your your help.

Juan

=2D-=20
_______________________________________________________
Juan M. Rius
Dpt. Teoria del Senyal i Comunicacions
Universitat Polit=C3=A8cnica de Catalunya
Campus Nord UPC, Edifici D-3
Jordi Girona, 1-3
08034 - BARCELONA
Spain
Phone: 34-93-4017219
=46ax: 34-93-4017232
e-mail: ri...@ts... <mailto:ri...@ts...> http://www.tsc.upc.edu/e=
ef

Re: [Chessdb-users] Size or annotation limit on games?

[Cory H. <cor...@ya...>]

Thanks for the update, Warren.

Best regards,
Cory

Warren Lewis <war...@mi...> wrote: Cory,

 I have been able to replicate your problem with the command line tools 
pgnchessdb and sc_import. I hope to
track this down in the next day or two. Thanks for your patience.

cheers - Warren


Cory Helfrich wrote:
> Hello Warren,
>
> Did my attachment help? I have attached the pgn from a different game 
> that recently gave me the same error to this email. I should point out 
> that these game are created and annotated entirely within ChessDB. As 
> in the previous case, I kludged a solution by exporting the pgn 
> without comments and re-importing the pgn. The only downside to this, 
> aside from the hassle, is that I lose my annotations.
>
> Best regards,
> Cory
>
> */Cory Helfrich /* wrote:
>
>     Hello Warren,
>
>     Attached are the original exported pgn (with comments) and the
>     present version of the game (after I stripped the comments and
>     began adding comments from that point. This game resides in a
>     database that has 164 games in it, so it is a fairly small
>     database. Please let me know if you need anything else.
>
>     Thanks,
>     Cory
>     Cory Helfrich
>     cor...@ya... 
>
>
>
>     On 30-Mar-07, at 4:07 AM, war...@mi...
>      wrote:
>
>>     Hi Cory,
>>
>>     If you have an empty database and you import this game that
>>     causes problems does it give you the corrupt message?
>>     Or do you need a fairly large database before this happens? If
>>     you have such a game could you send it to me, so I can
>>     use it to try and determine the cause of this issue?
>>
>>     cheers - Warren
>>
>>         -----Original Message-----
>>         From: Cory Helfrich
>>         Sent: Mar 28, 2007 2:00 AM
>>         To: che...@li...
>>         , David Kirkby
>>         Subject: [Chessdb-users] Size or annotation limit on games?
>>
>>         Hello Dr. Kirkby,
>>
>>         I have been happily using ChessDB. Thanks for continuing
>>         development on this project.
>>
>>         I have a question regarding any limits on the comments within
>>         games. I play mostly email chess, so my games tend to be
>>         rather full of annotations and variations. After the games
>>         reach a certain size, I start to receive a "Sorry, this game
>>         appears to be corrupt" dialog box. The Details button reveals
>>         the following:
>>         Begin "Details" log
>>         Sorry, this game appears to be corrupt.
>>         Sorry, this game appears to be corrupt.
>>             while executing
>>         "sc_game load $selection"
>>             (procedure "::game::Load" line 7)
>>             invoked from within
>>         "::game::Load $number"
>>             (procedure "::game::LoadNextPrev" line 12)
>>             invoked from within
>>         "::game::LoadNextPrev last"
>>             (menu invoke)
>>         End "Details" log
>>
>>         Note that I regularly compact the game file, as even adding
>>         one move to some of my games bloats this fill by 50 K. Also
>>         note that I am running version 3.6.12-beta-1 on a Windows
>>         machine and the January 1 release on a Mac machine (I am at
>>         my Windows machine, so I am not sure of the version on the
>>         Mac). This problem occurs on both machines.
>>
>>         When I receive this message, I restore the backup copy of the
>>         database (learned this lesson the hard way), delete the game,
>>         and import a pgn of the game without comments (but with
>>         variations). I then continue until the problem happens again
>>         and then repeat the process. This kludge works, but I lose
>>         all of my annotations from past moves. Note that simply
>>         deleting the game and reimporting with the comments results
>>         in the same "Sorry, this game appears to be corrupt" dialog box.
>>
>>         Do you have any suggestions for avoiding this?
>>
>>         Best regards,
>>         Cory
>>
>>
>>
>>         Cory Helfrich
>>         cor...@ya... 
>>
>>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>         The best gets better. See why everyone is raving about the
>>         *All-new Yahoo! Mail.*
>>         
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> Cory Helfrich
> cor...@ya...
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. *Go to 
> Yahoo! Answers.*  




Cory Helfrich
cor...@ya...
       
---------------------------------
Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers. 

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs

[Christian P. Z. <chr...@gm...>]

On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 05:39:17PM +0100, Dr. David Kirkby wrote:
> Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> >I did this question because in the COPYING file there are only two
> >Copyrights about the ChessDB software, Shane and David, but in some
> >files other copyrights appear: download.tcl (Warren Lewis & David),
>=20
>=20
> But COPYING does say:
>=20
> "Other copyrights exists for some parts of ChessDB too. See the source=20
> files."
>=20
> Its difficult to make a totally exhaustive list, since the information=20
> is not always readily available. I
>=20

Sorry. I didn't see this sentence in the COPYING.

> >In the case of sounds and bitmaps, they form part of scid/chessdb and if
> >they was made by scid project the license and copyrights are clear.
>=20
> Well that is no different to zlib, since that was part of Scid.
>

Here I meant that if sounds and bitmaps were *made* by the scid project
I understand that the authors (copyright) and license is the same of the
scid project because there is no more information. But if scid only uses
them (sounds and bitmaps) the copyright and license are the initial they
had. In case of modifying this files (sounds and bitmaps) and using
originally GPL license, the files would mantain the GPL license but in
the copyrigth statement should appear the original author plus the
scid/chessdb project.

The case of zlib is probably different because, as I know, you only
use/distribute zlib without modifying so the copyright and license is
clear, don't change.

I hope that I explain better.

> >I don't want to say to you what you should delete from ChessDB source
> >realease or not. You make a great software and I enjoy it. If you
> >consider that is better for the general user to distribute
> >phalanx/tablebases/zlib instead of indicating the software
> >needed/recommended in a file like README or INSTALL I could agree with
> >you. But I would be very pleased if the contributions of third party
> >software should be better indicated or better organized because I will
> >have to delete them before uploading to Debian.
>=20
> OK, will do. I think I will delete phalanx and zlib anyway. I'm not sure=
=20
> they serve a particularly useful purpose.
>=20

Other rare directory that I don't know if you use it is the "lib.old", I
say it just in case. Regards,

--=20
Christian Pinedo Zamalloa (zako)
PGP key at: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=3Dget&search=3D0x828D0C80
Fingerprint: 7BFF 4105 F46B 7977 BD96  348C 1007 4FF8 828D 0C80

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 08:50:20AM +0100, Dr. David Kirkby wrote:
> 
>>Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
>>
>>>Hello,
>>>
>>>I'm Christian Pinedo (my nickname zako) and I was working some time ago
>>>with Dr. Kirkby on making a Debian package of ChessDB. Preliminary
>>>packages are available at [1] and a debian developer has emailed me and
>>>said that he's interested on sponsoring the package. A great new.
>>>
>>>[1] http://bipt106.bi.ehu.es/debian/packages/chessdb/
>>>
>>>But to package chessdb some issues about the copyright and licenses
>>>should be well defined. I think this issues should be also interesting
>>>for you and so I have opened some bugs in the BTS of chessdb.
>>>
>>>1. The chessdb source distribution "chessdb-3.6.15.tar.gz" includes
>>>software from third parties: phalanx, zlib, ... That in my opinion
>>>shouldn't been distributed but you should write in the readme/install
>>>file that should be necesary/recommended to have installed some software in
>>>order to compile/use chessdb. This is the standard way. 
>>
>>Yes, I tend to agree with you about zlib. I based ChessDB on Scid, where 
>>Shane had included zlib. I think he did it as a convenience. In any 
>>case, I find it hard to believe there are that many people will not have 
>>zlib installed, or if they don't, it would be listed as a dependency.
>>
> 
> 
> In fact, in order to compile chessdb from source in GNU/Linux I need to
> have installed zlib development files (in debian they are available
> thanks to the  zlib1g-dev package) because if I don't have this package
> the configuration process gives the following error:
> 
> # ./configure 
> ...
> Checking if your system already has zlib installed: no.
> ...
> 
> So I understand that the zlib sources provided by ChessDB are not really
> used in the build process.
> 
> 
>>The Phalanx is not actually used at all, so I was thinking of removing 
>>that.
>>
>>
>>>2. Furthermore, some parts chessdb is based on like sounds, bitmaps,
>>>bitmaps2, tablebases, ... could have copyright and license
>>>different of the chessdb.
>>
>>The sounds were distributed with scid which was GPL'ed. I can't say I 
>>know exactly the source of them, but they have been available in a 
>>GPL'ed software for a very long time.
>>
>>I can't see what is the problem with the bitmaps either. They are from 
>>the GPL'ed Scid and appear to be modified versions of bitmaps released 
>>under the GPL.
>>
>>I will concede I am not sure about the tablebases. Perhaps all the 
>>tablebases should be removed, and added as an "extras" package which may 
>>or may not be available on debian. Perhaps that will improve matters.
>>
> 
> 
> I did this question because in the COPYING file there are only two
> Copyrights about the ChessDB software, Shane and David, but in some
> files other copyrights appear: download.tcl (Warren Lewis & David),


But COPYING does say:

"Other copyrights exists for some parts of ChessDB too. See the source 
files."

Its difficult to make a totally exhaustive list, since the information 
is not always readily available. I


> pane.tcl (Lucent Technologies & Mark Harrison), telnet.tcl (Todd J
> Martin), 

I asked Todd Martin whether I could incorportant his tcltelnet package 
some months back, since it it *not* a GPL'ed program. This was his reply:

 > There is no problem with that.  This is exactly why I chose the
 > BSD license.  I want people to be able to easily use this and
 > embed it in other applications.  I'm glad you find tcltelnet useful.


so that was is easy to solve.

> init.tcl (Regents of the University of California, Sun
> Microsystems, ...), ... 

I think init.tcl is distibuted along with the gpl'ed tcl package. I'll 
check that one.

> Although I don't know if last files are part of
> ChessDB or are third party software distributed inside ChessDB.

> In case of being part of scid/chessdb there is no problem because the
> license is GPL "version 2 or any later". But in case of being part of
> other software should be explained more detailed which part is a third
> party software with which copyright and which license.

OK, I will do this.

> In the case of sounds and bitmaps, they form part of scid/chessdb and if
> they was made by scid project the license and copyrights are clear.

Well that is no different to zlib, since that was part of Scid.

> About the tablebases, you should know who is their author (copyright) and the
> licensed under they are distributed (public domain, GPL, ...)

The tablebases are the most complex, as I fully admit I don't know.

> I don't want to say to you what you should delete from ChessDB source
> realease or not. You make a great software and I enjoy it. If you
> consider that is better for the general user to distribute
> phalanx/tablebases/zlib instead of indicating the software
> needed/recommended in a file like README or INSTALL I could agree with
> you. But I would be very pleased if the contributions of third party
> software should be better indicated or better organized because I will
> have to delete them before uploading to Debian.

OK, will do. I think I will delete phalanx and zlib anyway. I'm not sure 
they serve a particularly useful purpose.

> This is my point of view that could be wrong. My english is very basic
> so if something sounds impolite that is not my intention :-). 
> 
> Regards,

Leave it with me. I will make a new release, removing some of these 
extra files, with some extra notes/explanations in places.

Dave

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs

[Christian P. Z. <chr...@gm...>]

On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 08:50:20AM +0100, Dr. David Kirkby wrote:
> Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> >Hello,
> >
> >I'm Christian Pinedo (my nickname zako) and I was working some time ago
> >with Dr. Kirkby on making a Debian package of ChessDB. Preliminary
> >packages are available at [1] and a debian developer has emailed me and
> >said that he's interested on sponsoring the package. A great new.
> >
> >[1] http://bipt106.bi.ehu.es/debian/packages/chessdb/
> >
> >But to package chessdb some issues about the copyright and licenses
> >should be well defined. I think this issues should be also interesting
> >for you and so I have opened some bugs in the BTS of chessdb.
> >
> >1. The chessdb source distribution "chessdb-3.6.15.tar.gz" includes
> >software from third parties: phalanx, zlib, ... That in my opinion
> >shouldn't been distributed but you should write in the readme/install
> >file that should be necesary/recommended to have installed some software=
 in
> >order to compile/use chessdb. This is the standard way.=20
>=20
> Yes, I tend to agree with you about zlib. I based ChessDB on Scid, where=
=20
> Shane had included zlib. I think he did it as a convenience. In any=20
> case, I find it hard to believe there are that many people will not have=
=20
> zlib installed, or if they don't, it would be listed as a dependency.
>

In fact, in order to compile chessdb from source in GNU/Linux I need to
have installed zlib development files (in debian they are available
thanks to the  zlib1g-dev package) because if I don't have this package
the configuration process gives the following error:

# ./configure=20
=2E..
Checking if your system already has zlib installed: no.
=2E..

So I understand that the zlib sources provided by ChessDB are not really
used in the build process.

> The Phalanx is not actually used at all, so I was thinking of removing=20
> that.
>=20
> >2. Furthermore, some parts chessdb is based on like sounds, bitmaps,
> >bitmaps2, tablebases, ... could have copyright and license
> >different of the chessdb.
>=20
> The sounds were distributed with scid which was GPL'ed. I can't say I=20
> know exactly the source of them, but they have been available in a=20
> GPL'ed software for a very long time.
>=20
> I can't see what is the problem with the bitmaps either. They are from=20
> the GPL'ed Scid and appear to be modified versions of bitmaps released=20
> under the GPL.
>=20
> I will concede I am not sure about the tablebases. Perhaps all the=20
> tablebases should be removed, and added as an "extras" package which may=
=20
> or may not be available on debian. Perhaps that will improve matters.
>=20

I did this question because in the COPYING file there are only two
Copyrights about the ChessDB software, Shane and David, but in some
files other copyrights appear: download.tcl (Warren Lewis & David),
pane.tcl (Lucent Technologies & Mark Harrison), telnet.tcl (Todd J
Martin), init.tcl (Regents of the University of California, Sun
Microsystems, ...), ... Although I don't know if last files are part of
ChessDB or are third party software distributed inside ChessDB.

In case of being part of scid/chessdb there is no problem because the
license is GPL "version 2 or any later". But in case of being part of
other software should be explained more detailed which part is a third
party software with which copyright and which license.

In the case of sounds and bitmaps, they form part of scid/chessdb and if
they was made by scid project the license and copyrights are clear.
About the tablebases, you should know who is their author (copyright) and t=
he
licensed under they are distributed (public domain, GPL, ...)

I don't want to say to you what you should delete from ChessDB source
realease or not. You make a great software and I enjoy it. If you
consider that is better for the general user to distribute
phalanx/tablebases/zlib instead of indicating the software
needed/recommended in a file like README or INSTALL I could agree with
you. But I would be very pleased if the contributions of third party
software should be better indicated or better organized because I will
have to delete them before uploading to Debian.

This is my point of view that could be wrong. My english is very basic
so if something sounds impolite that is not my intention :-).=20

Regards,

--=20
Christian Pinedo Zamalloa (zako)
PGP key at: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=3Dget&search=3D0x828D0C80
Fingerprint: 7BFF 4105 F46B 7977 BD96  348C 1007 4FF8 828D 0C80

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs - third party sources

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Richard Vaughn wrote:

> As far as zlib is concerned there should be no problem whatever in  
> distributing the software even  in a commercial program.  The link to  
> the license is here http://www.zlib.net/zlib_license.html and it  
> states in part:
> "[...]
> Permission is granted to anyone to use this software for any purpose,
>    including commercial applications, and to alter it and  
> redistribute it
>    freely, subject to the following restrictions:  [...]"

I think you are right, but its probably best if it is removed. The 
chance are that if anyone did not have zlib, they would get better 
performance by updating to the latest version.

There is also some hope that the algorithm can be run on parallel 
computers. There have been some modified version of gzip posted on the 
net which exploit multiple CPUs. My Sun here is 4x450 and my laptop 
2x2.0 GHz (dual core). I'm guessing that if a parallel gzip can be made 
to work, a parallel version of zlib can too, as they are basically the 
same algorithm. With more and more dual-core CPUs around now, that must 
be a good thing.

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs

[Dr. D. K. <dav...@on...>]

Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I'm Christian Pinedo (my nickname zako) and I was working some time ago
> with Dr. Kirkby on making a Debian package of ChessDB. Preliminary
> packages are available at [1] and a debian developer has emailed me and
> said that he's interested on sponsoring the package. A great new.
> 
> [1] http://bipt106.bi.ehu.es/debian/packages/chessdb/
> 
> But to package chessdb some issues about the copyright and licenses
> should be well defined. I think this issues should be also interesting
> for you and so I have opened some bugs in the BTS of chessdb.
> 
> 1. The chessdb source distribution "chessdb-3.6.15.tar.gz" includes
> software from third parties: phalanx, zlib, ... That in my opinion
> shouldn't been distributed but you should write in the readme/install
> file that should be necesary/recommended to have installed some software in
> order to compile/use chessdb. This is the standard way. 

Yes, I tend to agree with you about zlib. I based ChessDB on Scid, where 
Shane had included zlib. I think he did it as a convenience. In any 
case, I find it hard to believe there are that many people will not have 
zlib installed, or if they don't, it would be listed as a dependency.

The Phalanx is not actually used at all, so I was thinking of removing 
that.

> 2. Furthermore, some parts chessdb is based on like sounds, bitmaps,
> bitmaps2, tablebases, ... could have copyright and license
> different of the chessdb.

The sounds were distributed with scid which was GPL'ed. I can't say I 
know exactly the source of them, but they have been available in a 
GPL'ed software for a very long time.

I can't see what is the problem with the bitmaps either. They are from 
the GPL'ed Scid and appear to be modified versions of bitmaps released 
under the GPL.

I will concede I am not sure about the tablebases. Perhaps all the 
tablebases should be removed, and added as an "extras" package which may 
or may not be available on debian. Perhaps that will improve matters.


Dave

Re: [Chessdb-users] some bugs - third party sources

[Allen F. <dr...@gm...>]

Richard Vaughn wrote:
 > On Apr 8, 2007, at 3:08 PM, Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:
 >
 >
 >> Message: 1
 >> Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 16:03:54 +0200
 >> From: Christian Pinedo Zamalloa <chr...@gm...>
 >> Subject: [Chessdb-users] some bugs
 >> To: che...@li...
 >> Message-ID: <200...@ta...>
 >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
 >>
 >> Hello,
 >>
 >> I'm Christian Pinedo (my nickname zako) and I was working some time  ago
 >> with Dr. Kirkby on making a Debian package of ChessDB.
 >>
 >
 >     [...]
 >
 >> But to package chessdb some issues about the copyright and licenses
 >> should be well defined. I think this issues should be also interesting
 >> for you and so I have opened some bugs in the BTS of chessdb.
 >>
 >> 1. The chessdb source distribution "chessdb-3.6.15.tar.gz" includes
 >> software from third parties: phalanx, zlib, ... That in my opinion
 >> shouldn't been distributed but you should write in the readme/install
 >> file that should be necesary/recommended to have installed some 
software in
 >>
 > [...]
 >
 > As far as zlib is concerned there should be no problem whatever in 
distributing the software even  in a commercial program.  The link to 
the license is here http://www.zlib.net/zlib_license.html and it  states 
in part:
 > "[...]
 > Permission is granted to anyone to use this software for any purpose,
 >    including commercial applications, and to alter it and 
redistribute it
 >    freely, subject to the following restrictions:  [...]"
 >
 > The license must be included in any source distribution and any 
alterarions of the source must be clearly marked -- as stated in the 
license.
 >
First, Windows users, this doesn't really effect you, but you may find 
it interesting none the less.

Having ran a Debian desktop for a little while I believe I can help on 
this point at least. Debian distributes things in packages made up of 
only the specific things for that software. Many packages are of 
commonly used libraries with necessary supporting files like licensing 
and such. zlib is already such a package in the Debian library. So the 
ChessDB package would include a dependency for the zlib package. This 
way a person installing the ChessDB package would see zlib was 
necessary, and package management software would install zlib 
automatically before ChessDB when ChessDB was requested.

To get a better idea of this concept take a look at package description 
for SCID at: http://packages.debian.org/stable/games/scid . You will see 
several dependencies listed which would be, if not already, installed 
when the SCID package was requested through Aptitude or Synaptic (two 
package managers for Debian).
 > What is necessary for other parts of the chessdb distribution, I am 
not certain but I should think it would have to be clarified before 
chessdb would be hosted somewhere.
As for the sound files and any images (chess pieces or otherwise), 
several programs with extra bits like this have the extra things 
distributed in a separate package, so ChessDB would be the minimum 
install with a ChessDB-extras being the added stuff (similar to the 
eboard Debian package setup).

This is a lot for a fella to say who doesn't know the first thing about 
building a Debian package himself, but I believe  I'm on solid ground.

Just my thoughts, and I hope they are worth what you paid for them,
Allen

-- 
Allen Farley
drax946[at]gmail.com
Linux User #437334

[Chessdb-users] some bugs - third party sources

[Richard V. <rjv...@ma...>]

On Apr 8, 2007, at 3:08 PM, Christian Pinedo Zamalloa wrote:

>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 16:03:54 +0200
> From: Christian Pinedo Zamalloa <chr...@gm...>
> Subject: [Chessdb-users] some bugs
> To: che...@li...
> Message-ID: <200...@ta...>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hello,
>
> I'm Christian Pinedo (my nickname zako) and I was working some time  
> ago
> with Dr. Kirkby on making a Debian package of ChessDB.

	[...]
> But to package chessdb some issues about the copyright and licenses
> should be well defined. I think this issues should be also interesting
> for you and so I have opened some bugs in the BTS of chessdb.
>
> 1. The chessdb source distribution "chessdb-3.6.15.tar.gz" includes
> software from third parties: phalanx, zlib, ... That in my opinion
> shouldn't been distributed but you should write in the readme/install
> file that should be necesary/recommended to have installed some  
> software in
[...]

As far as zlib is concerned there should be no problem whatever in  
distributing the software even  in a commercial program.  The link to  
the license is here http://www.zlib.net/zlib_license.html and it  
states in part:
"[...]
Permission is granted to anyone to use this software for any purpose,
   including commercial applications, and to alter it and  
redistribute it
   freely, subject to the following restrictions:  [...]"

The license must be included in any source distribution and any  
alterarions of the source must be clearly marked -- as stated in the  
license.

What is necessary for other parts of the chessdb distribution, I am  
not certain but I should think it would have to be clarified before  
chessdb would be hosted somewhere.

Rick