binarycloud-dev — development list for binarycloud

Re: [binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

> 
>> this is almost certainly a session problem.
>> 
>> try commenting out start_session()
>> in htdocs/index.php, and see what happens.
>> 
> nope. that was not it. still a blank page. my apache is ver 1.3.19 btw if it
> makes any difference.
> 
> does binarycloud work with apache 2.0? my box is in an internal network so i
> dont have security issues to be concerned about. so i might try the new beta
> while im at it :)

I have not tested with 2.0.

Probably.

on to your issue.

what does the url look like in your browser?
try editing binarycloud/user/conf/prepend.inc

find this line:
check_permissions($perms_group);

and comment it out.

see what happens then.

_a



--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] r1 -> r2 and r2 development

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

> i've talked on this list about a community driven site i'm going to
> build, and i wondered what you guys think i should start with. i've
> taken a look at *a lot* of cms/web driven frameworks now, believe me,
> and i keep on coming back to either binarycloud or horde. horde is
> pretty mature, but it hasn't got a framework nicely structured and layed
> out such as binarycloud has (at least r2, don't know about r1).
> 
> that's why i'd want to start building with binarycloud. r2 still being
> in its infancy (although basic page rendering works, i admit ;)), is it
> a good idea to start doing the work with r1 and then try to convert it
> all to r2? 
> or just go along, start doing work with r2, and start helping and coding
> the bc backend if somethings missing? ;)

I would start working with r2.

for a couple reasons:
    -the page render pipeline is _far_ more mature than binarycloud r1's,
I've tested it a bit and I'm happy with the code.

    -no, auth and perm aren't done, but they will be fairly soon, and they
will both be more powerful and better structured than in r1.

    -I'll be publishing another shell revision soon that includes
XSLT_TemplateManager as an extension to TemplateManager (which other ware
invited to extend to support Smarty, FastTemplates, etc.

    -You will be building modules as classes, not as groups of functions as
in r1.
 

    -r2 is not in its infancy, it's the build effort from lessons learned in
r21. I.e. the code is better and more mature :)

> especially auth and perm classes are something i will need really soon.

ah, how soon?

> i am prepared to help anywhere i can, but someone (alex?) should give me
> advice as where to move in.

A caching class would help a great deal, as that is on my list for the r2
core classes.

You could also take the existing Lang class, and write the methods necessary
to have it set BC_LANG corrected (based on accept-language)

I will be publishing templateManager quite soon, so you should be able to
start building pages fairly quickly.

Auth/Perm is a major revision, I'll look into it and see where you can help
most.

> btw, is the sourceforge cvs depository the main r2 cvs depository?

no, the main cvs is internal at turing, I am happy to change that to be
binarycloud.com, so you can get access.

I update sourceforge every so often, but I dislike the way their cvs is run
(I can't get access to my own cvsroot!) so I don't run it there.

_alex


--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] binarycloud.php

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

this was done in cvs shortly after I released the last shell.

good that you're paying attention though :)

_a


> Hi,
> 
> --pedantic --march mybrain
> 
> just had a look over binarycloud.php. Are the varibles ($path,
> $path_from_base, etc.) used in other scripts or are they just 'internal' to
> set the BC_PATH constant? If so, it would be clean to unset them when done:
> 
> define('BC_PATH',$path);
> unset($cd_up, $path_from_base, $pieces, $count, $path);
> 
> --lax
> 
> cu
> Andi
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> binarycloud-dev mailing list
> bin...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev
> 


--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1

[Spiggy T. <th...@me...>]

> this is almost certainly a session problem.
>
> try commenting out start_session()
> in htdocs/index.php, and see what happens.
>
nope. that was not it. still a blank page. my apache is ver 1.3.19 btw if it
makes any difference.

does binarycloud work with apache 2.0? my box is in an internal network so i
dont have security issues to be concerned about. so i might try the new beta
while im at it :)

paivi

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Spiggy TheCat" <th...@me...>
> To: <bin...@li...>
> Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 8:06 PM
> Subject: [binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1
>
>
> > okie. i get a blank page with absolutely nothing in it. not even in the
> > source of the page.. i have tried the page with all the browsers i have
> > installed (win2k/linux)
> >
> > my setup is php4.0.5, mysql 3.23.37, redhat 7.1. i have lots of
> virtualhosts
> > and php/ mysql works. i took the virtualhost config from binarycloud.com
> and
> > pasted it to httpd.conf (only changed the paths). i have tried to change
> the
> > paths again (in defined_constants) just to test and that does produce an
> > error so i am assuming bc is finding everything correctly.
> >
> > have i missed something obvious?
> >
> > paivi

[binarycloud-dev] binarycloud.php

[Andreas A. <a.a...@th...>]

Hi,

--pedantic --march mybrain

just had a look over binarycloud.php. Are the varibles ($path,
$path_from_base, etc.) used in other scripts or are they just 'internal' to
set the BC_PATH constant? If so, it would be clean to unset them when done:

define('BC_PATH',$path);
unset($cd_up, $path_from_base, $pieces, $count, $path);

--lax

cu
Andi

[binarycloud-dev] r1 -> r2 and r2 development

[Nico G. <sc...@ac...>]

i've talked on this list about a community driven site i'm going to
build, and i wondered what you guys think i should start with. i've
taken a look at *a lot* of cms/web driven frameworks now, believe me,
and i keep on coming back to either binarycloud or horde. horde is
pretty mature, but it hasn't got a framework nicely structured and layed
out such as binarycloud has (at least r2, don't know about r1).

that's why i'd want to start building with binarycloud. r2 still being
in its infancy (although basic page rendering works, i admit ;)), is it
a good idea to start doing the work with r1 and then try to convert it
all to r2?=20
or just go along, start doing work with r2, and start helping and coding
the bc backend if somethings missing? ;)

especially auth and perm classes are something i will need really soon.
i am prepared to help anywhere i can, but someone (alex?) should give me
advice as where to move in.

btw, is the sourceforge cvs depository the main r2 cvs depository?

--nico

--
nico galoppo   -   tremelo/leuven, belgium
               -   erasmus/socrates student in grenoble, france
               -   4, rue b=E9ranger -- phone: +33-(0)76-85 23 19
---------------------------------------------------------------
[bash]:~$ man woman                 nico at crossbar dot net
No manual entry for woman           debian linux :: vim powered

Re: [binarycloud-dev] validating user input

[alex b. <en...@tu...>]

> This may be a little off-topic, but when is the best
> time to validate user input, and what is the best way
> to do it?
>
> Say there is an html form which takes user input, I
> imagine the data should be checked as soon as the user
> submits the form, but what is the best way to check
> that data? I've been using regular expressions so far.
>
> Will some kind of class for validating user input be
> included in binarycloud, or is it too dependent on the
> specific application?

Ah, this is good stuff.

the way it works with binarycloud r1, if you use formBuilder, is you declare
inputs, with 'simple types' like "this is text" "this is an email address"
etc which are checked with regex.

that works fairly well, but there are problems associated with doing the
validation that "high up" in the application.

in binarycloud r2, because all data I/O is through the entitymanager, we
check it there. that's 10x better for a number of reasons:
    -the same exact code is used to check _all_ incoming data, including xml
posts, html form posts, etc.
    -the same rules are associated with all data I/O
    -FormBuilder can be pretty dumb - this is great because it means you
will have central control over all of your errors, so you don't ever have to
write an error more than once, and it can be used in xml responses the same
as it is used in html forms.

so the idea with form builder, is it builds an XML profile of a form, based
on a form definition or just a default entity profile. we then run that xml
through an xsl to get html.

when the user submits data, formbuilder attempts to take that data and do an
Add() / Edit() operation for that entity. If the operation is successful,
formbuilder outputs the "success" xml, and the xslt handles it.

If there is an error, formbuilder re-builds the xml profile of the form, but
with errors inline... and again, the xslt is responsible for turning that
xml form definition into an html layout - in this case, a layout with all
the user's data in it, and a few highlighted fields, maybe some
instructions.

so the answer is, do your validation at the data i/o level, it's clean,
central, and prevents you from ever having to unnecessarily replicate logic.

_alex


> Just fishing for some advice.
>
> Thanks,
> Curtis.
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
> http://auctions.yahoo.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> binarycloud-dev mailing list
> bin...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev
>

Re: [binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1

[alex b. <en...@tu...>]

this is almost certainly a session problem.

try commenting out start_session()
in htdocs/index.php, and see what happens.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Spiggy TheCat" <th...@me...>
To: <bin...@li...>
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 8:06 PM
Subject: [binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1


> okie. i get a blank page with absolutely nothing in it. not even in the
> source of the page.. i have tried the page with all the browsers i have
> installed (win2k/linux)
>
> my setup is php4.0.5, mysql 3.23.37, redhat 7.1. i have lots of
virtualhosts
> and php/ mysql works. i took the virtualhost config from binarycloud.com
and
> pasted it to httpd.conf (only changed the paths). i have tried to change
the
> paths again (in defined_constants) just to test and that does produce an
> error so i am assuming bc is finding everything correctly.
>
> have i missed something obvious?
>
> paivi
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alex Black" <en...@tu...>
> To: "binarycloud-dev" <bin...@li...>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 2:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [binarycloud-dev] functioning download available
>
>
> > > exactly what I did, should be ok for now.
> >
> > ah, good.
> >
> > >   [PATH_TRANSLATED] => /raidb4/iPlanet/server/docs/bc/index.php
> >
> > agh! not quite :)
> >
> > I don't see any Docroot or anything similar.
> >
> > What I'll do with the "distro" version of r2 is include the current code
> in
> > binarycloud.php, but commented out.
> >
> > The only code in the distro will be
> >
> > define("BC_PATH","/blah/blah/blah/binarycloud/");
> >
> >
> > > I'm also getting JS errors and missing images, are there any other
paths
> or
> > > switches that need setting?
> >
> > cd /raidb4/iPlanet/server/docs/bc/
> > cp -R resources ../
> >
> > reload
> >
> > > Also, this: Unable to call _pear_call_destructors() - function does
not
> > > exist in Unknown on line 0
> >
> > Yes, after looking quite carefully at PEAR_Error, I am sad to say that
it
> > isn't beefy enough.
> >
> > So, we'e going to do an error class as well. Snarf!
> >
> > > but I'm guessing you know about this one already.
> > yep.
> >
> > _alex
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > alex black, ceo
> > en...@tu...
> >
> > the turing studio, inc.
> > http://www.turingstudio.com
> >
> > vox+510.666.0074
> > fax+510.666.0093
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > binarycloud-dev mailing list
> > bin...@li...
> > http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> binarycloud-dev mailing list
> bin...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev
>

[binarycloud-dev] validating user input

[Curtis C. <c_c...@ya...>]

This may be a little off-topic, but when is the best
time to validate user input, and what is the best way
to do it?

Say there is an html form which takes user input, I
imagine the data should be checked as soon as the user
submits the form, but what is the best way to check
that data? I've been using regular expressions so far.

Will some kind of class for validating user input be
included in binarycloud, or is it too dependent on the
specific application?

Just fishing for some advice.

Thanks,
Curtis.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/

[binarycloud-dev] blank page with binarycloud r1

[Spiggy T. <th...@me...>]

okie. i get a blank page with absolutely nothing in it. not even in the
source of the page.. i have tried the page with all the browsers i have
installed (win2k/linux)

my setup is php4.0.5, mysql 3.23.37, redhat 7.1. i have lots of virtualhosts
and php/ mysql works. i took the virtualhost config from binarycloud.com and
pasted it to httpd.conf (only changed the paths). i have tried to change the
paths again (in defined_constants) just to test and that does produce an
error so i am assuming bc is finding everything correctly.

have i missed something obvious?

paivi

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Black" <en...@tu...>
To: "binarycloud-dev" <bin...@li...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [binarycloud-dev] functioning download available


> > exactly what I did, should be ok for now.
>
> ah, good.
>
> >   [PATH_TRANSLATED] => /raidb4/iPlanet/server/docs/bc/index.php
>
> agh! not quite :)
>
> I don't see any Docroot or anything similar.
>
> What I'll do with the "distro" version of r2 is include the current code
in
> binarycloud.php, but commented out.
>
> The only code in the distro will be
>
> define("BC_PATH","/blah/blah/blah/binarycloud/");
>
>
> > I'm also getting JS errors and missing images, are there any other paths
or
> > switches that need setting?
>
> cd /raidb4/iPlanet/server/docs/bc/
> cp -R resources ../
>
> reload
>
> > Also, this: Unable to call _pear_call_destructors() - function does not
> > exist in Unknown on line 0
>
> Yes, after looking quite carefully at PEAR_Error, I am sad to say that it
> isn't beefy enough.
>
> So, we'e going to do an error class as well. Snarf!
>
> > but I'm guessing you know about this one already.
> yep.
>
> _alex
>
>
>
> --
> alex black, ceo
> en...@tu...
>
> the turing studio, inc.
> http://www.turingstudio.com
>
> vox+510.666.0074
> fax+510.666.0093
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> binarycloud-dev mailing list
> bin...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev
>
>

Re: [binarycloud-dev] Yet _more_ Page class status

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

> what i was wondering, if we're always trying to separate code and
> layout, how come we have a 'hello world' module that echo()'s a content?

because it takes three seconds to build, will never change, and doesn't need
to language or presentation independent.

I wanted something about as simple as possible, and I think that fits the
bill.

> ok i agree, it's an example module, so echo()'ing stuff is it's job (as
> in the "hello world" module definition), but shouldn't be the table
> layout defined in this module be somewhere else?
> 
> or am i missing the point once again?

sorta, but maybe this is a good point and I shouldn't put the idea in
people's heads :)

_alex


--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

> I asked Andrei here (PHP core developer) about this speed issue. He
> seems to think that echo should be marginally faster than breaking in
> and out of the HTML inline. He thinks this example is too short for a
> fair speed test (probably some state switching setup on the first time
> that won't happen on subsequent switches?), an atypical scenario. This
> is an extremely marginal difference, hardly a concern.

this is what I thought, that breaking, i.e.

?>
<html>
<?

does take a _tiny_ bit more time, but it is so small as to be negligible.
there's probably a similar difference between:

echo "text";
and
echo 'text';

(one is interpreted, the other is not)

---

_alex



--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

> Well according to the article at
> http://www.newbienetwork.net/sections.php?op=viewarticle&artid=15 tests
> have shown inline HTML to be twice as fast as using echo().  No results
> given to back it up though...

hehe,

further evidence that bad style = bad code :)

_a

--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

vox+510.666.0074
fax+510.666.0093

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Monte O. <mo...@is...>]

I asked Andrei here (PHP core developer) about this speed issue. He
seems to think that echo should be marginally faster than breaking in
and out of the HTML inline. He thinks this example is too short for a
fair speed test (probably some state switching setup on the first time
that won't happen on subsequent switches?), an atypical scenario. This
is an extremely marginal difference, hardly a concern.

Peter Bowyer wrote:
> 
> At 08:57 PM 5/23/01 -0400, you wrote:
> >we have an asp application in use at work.. it uses a lot of
> >document.write"<table><tr><td>some data here</td></tr></table>" type of
> >coding, which works like the php echo (as far as i can understand). i dont
> >like this style at all, it makes the code hard to read.. (plus playing with
> >the quotes is a serious pain in the rear end). then in the code there is a
> >part where the programmer actually did it "my way" which means close code
> >tags and do html as plain html and open code tags when theres code to spit
> >out. my boss says this is bad and slows it down.
> 
> Well according to the article at
> http://www.newbienetwork.net/sections.php?op=viewarticle&artid=15 tests
> have shown inline HTML to be twice as fast as using echo().  No results
> given to back it up though...
> 
> Peter.
> 
> -oOo-
> Maple Design - web design, hosting, domain names
> http://www.mapledesign.co.uk
> -oOo-
> 
> _______________________________________________
> binarycloud-dev mailing list
> bin...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/binarycloud-dev

--
Monte Ohrt <mo...@is...>
http://www.ispi.net/

Re: [binarycloud-dev] Yet _more_ Page class status

[Nico G. <sc...@ac...>]

--* Alex Black (Tue, May 22, 2001 at 12:11:06AM -0700) *--

> master templates, and module layouts, are normal php-in-html for a numb=
er of
> reasons, not least of which we'd have to generate a huge amount of xml =
for
> every page render, only to be hurt by using xsl.
>
> some examples:
>     -you can entirely omit the $bc_page[templates] array (you don't hav=
e to
> have a master template.. if you don't the module groups will just be pr=
inted
> in sequence.

what i was wondering, if we're always trying to separate code and
layout, how come we have a 'hello world' module that echo()'s a content?

ok i agree, it's an example module, so echo()'ing stuff is it's job (as
in the "hello world" module definition), but shouldn't be the table
layout defined in this module be somewhere else?

or am i missing the point once again?

--nicolas


--
nico galoppo   -   tremelo/leuven, belgium
               -   erasmus/socrates student in grenoble, france
               -   4, rue b=E9ranger -- phone: +33-(0)76-85 23 19
---------------------------------------------------------------
[bash]:~$ man woman                 nico at crossbar dot net
No manual entry for woman           debian linux :: vim powered

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Peter B. <re...@f2...>]

At 08:57 PM 5/23/01 -0400, you wrote:
>we have an asp application in use at work.. it uses a lot of
>document.write"<table><tr><td>some data here</td></tr></table>" type of
>coding, which works like the php echo (as far as i can understand). i dont
>like this style at all, it makes the code hard to read.. (plus playing with
>the quotes is a serious pain in the rear end). then in the code there is a
>part where the programmer actually did it "my way" which means close code
>tags and do html as plain html and open code tags when theres code to spit
>out. my boss says this is bad and slows it down.

Well according to the article at 
http://www.newbienetwork.net/sections.php?op=viewarticle&artid=15 tests 
have shown inline HTML to be twice as fast as using echo().  No results 
given to back it up though...

Peter.


-oOo-
Maple Design - web design, hosting, domain names
http://www.mapledesign.co.uk
-oOo-

[binarycloud-dev] sorry everybody

[TAO R. <ron...@ho...>]

Hi,

sorry everybody, some problem with my IE, I make a mistake in send out
the email, only the first one with subject 
"[binarycloud-dev][binarycloud-dev]"
contain the file, I'm so sorry.

Ronald TAO
ron...@ho...
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

[binarycloud-dev] New binarycloud.php patch

[TAO R. <ron...@ho...>]

Hi,

After about half an hour hard work, the new version of 
binarycloud.php is coming out. This version should work
fine in PWS, IIS4.0+ and Apache Win32, please try and
report any problem found. have fun :)


Ronald TAO
ron...@ho...
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

[binarycloud-dev] [binarycloud-dev]

[TAO R. <ron...@ho...>]

Hi,

After about half an hour hard work, the new version of 
binarycloud.php is coming out. This version should work
fine in PWS, IIS4.0+ and Apache Win32, please try and
report any problem found. have fun :)


Ronald TAO
ron...@ho...
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Curtis C. <c_c...@ya...>]

> You're welcome to use that "example" xsl/xml I
> posted, I've tested it and it
> works quite well.
> Part of r2 will be a complete xslt library of form
> elements and basic
> form+list templates.

I will definitely be using binarycloud as code and as
examples.

Thanks for the help.
Curtis.


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[alex b. <en...@tu...>]

> I concur with regard to the echo statements in the
> code. I wrote a small database application in PHP with
> a lot of if-then statements, and echo, print
> statements. If I want to change the way each form of
> the application looks, I have to go into the code and
> change all the echo/print statements.

And that's the rub.


> I am currently working on a OOP version of the same
> system and I am going to try to have it dump the data
> into XML and use XLST to transform it, but I'll be
> swimming below water for a couple of weeks before I
> figure it out.

You're welcome to use that "example" xsl/xml I posted, I've tested it and it
works quite well.
Part of r2 will be a complete xslt library of form elements and basic
form+list templates.

Also, if you have any problems with xslt/etc post 'em here and I'm glad to
answer what I can.

> Anyways, echo statements pretty much ruin web gui
> code, as far as I'm concerned.

well said.

_a

Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[Curtis C. <c_c...@ya...>]

I concur with regard to the echo statements in the
code. I wrote a small database application in PHP with
a lot of if-then statements, and echo, print
statements. If I want to change the way each form of
the application looks, I have to go into the code and
change all the echo/print statements.

I am currently working on a OOP version of the same
system and I am going to try to have it dump the data
into XML and use XLST to transform it, but I'll be
swimming below water for a couple of weeks before I
figure it out.

Anyways, echo statements pretty much ruin web gui
code, as far as I'm concerned.

Thanks,
Curtis.

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Re: [binarycloud-dev] functioning download available

[alex b. <en...@tu...>]

great!

> you know, my patch is only work on Apache Win32, I will make it work with
> IIS and PWS as well today.
>
> Ronald TAO
> ron...@ho...

Re: [binarycloud-dev] functioning download available

[TAO R. <ron...@ho...>]

>hi ronald,
>
>thanks for the code, I've tested it on linux, it doesn't interfere,
>committed it.
>
>you're in CREDITS now :)
>
>_alex

hi alex,

you know, my patch is only work on Apache Win32, I will make it work with 
IIS and PWS as well today.

Ronald TAO
ron...@ho...

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Re: [binarycloud-dev] coding standards

[alex b. <en...@tu...>]

dude, good nick.
onwards..

> this is slightly off topic... but my boss and i disagree on the
"preferred"
> coding style. he is an asp-guy and i am for php so maybe that makes
> adifference.. ill let you decide since i am hardly the expert:

I will refrain from the, uh, comparison (for the moment)

> we have an asp application in use at work.. it uses a lot of
> document.write"<table><tr><td>some data here</td></tr></table>" type of
> coding, which works like the php echo (as far as i can understand). i dont
AGH!

> like this style at all, it makes the code hard to read.. (plus playing
with
> the quotes is a serious pain in the rear end). then in the code there is a
> part where the programmer actually did it "my way" which means close code
> tags and do html as plain html and open code tags when theres code to spit
> out. my boss says this is bad and slows it down.
> so which way is faster? i know echoing html is considered bad coding style
> (at least with php)

There's probably, oh, _maybe_ 0.0001 seconds difference in a fairly large
application between closing tags and "echo".

One of the reasons echo is _specifically_ mentioned in the binarycloud code
standards is because it effectively makes the code useless.

Why? well, if I want to integrate your code with all your echos into my
site, but I want to _change_ the look of your application, I am now screwed.
If you had separate template files, I could just make new copies of those
and be on my merry way.

The reason I am so rabidly in favor of xslt is because it is a fully xml
compliant way of cleanly abstracting presentation from logic. This is a huge
boon to any project for a number of reasons, not least of which that the
code is maintainable, and you can make multiple stylesheets for the same
collection of data. And your code starts to be elegant. You start to enjoy
it... wheeee

so, your boss is wrong :)

the best thing you can do is generate xml from your application and run it
through xsl, but if you're not willing to do that at least separate your
markup from your logic.

_alex