From: Guntupalli K. <kar...@in...> - 2012-04-08 18:08:25
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On Sun, 8 Apr 2012 22:02:02 +0530 Mahesh T. Pai wrote: > das said on Sun, Apr 08, 2012 at 08:07:44PM +0530,: > > > If a hack really takes place that makes a character > > (struck-out-Ba) available to the Bengali script, which was never > > historically there, that project will not just be anachronistic, > > it will be in violation of all the social logic that go into > > language, the most social one of all our inheritances. Not just > > Bengali, all the other scripts in the lineage chain, like > > Assamese, from where it came, or like Oriya, what it became, are > > scripts that never contained a dual Ba/Va like Devnagari does. > > The character that looks like the Nagari Ba is actually ra, as > > our friends have already pointed out. > > Sir, please keep XYZ the script and the language written using the > XYZ script distinct. > > Sri Swarup's requirement is very specific - he wants to write > Sanskrit using Bangala / Bengali script. > > Right now, you are reading the Latin script. This mail is in in > English, written in Latin script. Some people (mostly in Goa and > Karnataka) use this same Latin script to write Konkani. But, I > write Konkani using the Malayalam script. But the constitution of > India says that for official purposes, Konkani should be written > using the Devanagari Script. > > Writing a language using the script usually used for another > language is very normal and common, especially for Sanskrit. > > This is not about "conflating two codepoints" (Sankarshan's reply > to Perrier's mail or as you are fearing, corrupting the Bengali > language. > Thats the point I would make, that its not tainting the Bengali code range or keymap. As for the keymap sent earlier perhaps it could be called something else - say bn-sanskrit or so, if calling it bn-baraha (originally conceived to write Bengali language only), taints it. > > I think, even if that hack is done, and that hack gets really > > popular among larger sections of the Bengali mass in the coming > > decades, what > > If this was not in the Bengali language for past 3 centuries, what > makes you think this will become populat in the coming decades? > > Please note that I am not taking sides. I am totally disinterested. > > And I really do not understand what Karnukar is trying to do. > Since existing code chart anyways will not change,so any existing character cannot be redefined. And for adding a new character its a long drawn process, so for OP's problem, if there is a way to distinctly represent sounds BA and VA for sanskrit written in bengali script. Currently perhaps its not possible, so some . Now OP wanted to use 09F0 (Assamese RA) for its similarity in shape to Nagri BA. So while input side problem is trivial, can the display side be solved by creating new character with shape of 09F0 but semantics of a BA - is what I agreed to work on. My idea was to use a PUA code point for now, and see what extent issue could be resolved. If mere font changes can fix it then well enough, if underlying rendering code also needs change then it is not fixable!.. Input and font can be tweaked to some extent to fix a need for personal/internal use, but not beyond that. In which case I would urge Swarup to take debate to wider level, bring in more users (folks who write Sanskrit in Bengali script), get a consensus and strong case for changes required and the approach concerned forums (GoWB, DIT, Unicode etc..) to find a solution - either extension in current Bengali script range, or new range altogether. eg. take the Devanagari range, the base set from ISCII and early unicode was much small, but it has now extended enough to occupy at the slots in code chart, some of the additions happening to support writing languages, which perhaps had history of being written older/other scripts, but now kind of mandated by GoI to be written in Devanagari. > IMHO, another alternative they (Karunakar and Swarup) ought to have > considered is use of a custom LOCALE. This is assuming that what > swarup wants a glyph which looks same as the character now used for > Assamese. > Perhaps at the font level and not system Locale. So say if Lang=Sanskrit then follow these rules for distinct BA , VA , for bn, as - default rules apply. Much like how Marathi, Nepali have different glyphs for same character in Devanagari range. Karunakar |