Re: [SM-DEVEL] Button placement

[Paul L. <pa...@sq...>]

Erin, you forgot to reply to the list.  :)

>>  Recently using yahoo webmail, I realized that I really get goofed up
>>trying to use 1.5 with the delete button where it is.  In 1.4, it's
>>reasonably easy to use, since it's always the last button on the right
>>side of the mailbox list (cept I hate when I have to scroll for it) and
>>the text link is pretty easy to find on the read screen.
>>
>>  However, the Delete button placement in devel, while good in that it
>>is (er, almost) consistent between mailbox list and message view
>>screens, is, I think, misplaced.
>>
>>  Delete is surely the most frequently used button, while unread
>>certainly is not (I think delete should be on the far left where unread is).
>>
>>  On the message view screen, having the Reply buttons on the left is
>>more in spirit with placing commonly used buttons in places that are
>>quick and easy to find (without actually reading the buttons every time
>>-- doing it using your "mouse/muscle memory").  However, I think delete
>>is still more common than reply, and since delete could be on the far
>>left in both screens (which would be VERY GOOD GUI design IMO), I'd
>>argue that the reply buttons should be moved.  The user WILL *always*
>>have to specifically read and select a target folder when moving
>>messages, so the move controls in my opinion do NOT need to be in an
>>easy-for-your-hand-muscles-to-remember place.  Thus, I'd think putting
>>the reply buttons on the far right of the message view screen would be best.
>>
> The placement of delete was done like that for three reasons:
> 
> 1) to keep it more in the centered (i.e. less mouse movement all the
> way to the right side...

I don't think there's any reason to think the mouse will for some reason 
always be closer to the middle of that frame than to the left or 
right... I think we could argue til the cows come home about least mouse 
movement.  Instead, I think the argument about muscle memory is a better 
one, which is why I think placing the most frequently used buttons in 
static places is best.  The only real static places we have are the far 
left and far right sides of that bar.  That's why I think Delete, surely 
the most oft used button, should be in the number one easiest place for 
your hand to go without your mind needing to actually read the button.

> 2) to make it easy to find between the message list and message view screens

Placed in the middle as it is, it is NOT in the same place between those 
two pages (close, but no cigar).  Putting it on the left would achieve 
this goal.

> 3) to group the placement of the "Bypass trash" checkbox with the
> Delete button without making the toolbar look too strange.

Yeah, I know that one's a hard one to make look nice.  However, if any 
plugins that place more buttons on that bar are used, you get buttons 
after that checkbox anyway (and doesn't really look that bad anyway), so 
I think it ends up not much different if the default buttons looked like:

mailbox list:
Delete, Bypass Trash, Unread, Read, Forward........ Move

message view:
Delete, Bypass Trash....... Move, Forward, As Attachment, Reply All, Reply

I also like the idea of having the Unread (and Flag) button(s) on the 
message view, FWIW:

Delete, Bypass Trash, Unread....... Move, Forward, As Attachment, Reply 
All, Reply

In fact, it might be better to make the Forward buttons a bit more 
similar, so change the mailbox list page to be:

Delete, Bypass Trash, Unread, Read........ Move, Forward


> If anything should be changed, Read/Unread, Flag/Unflag should be
> either: collapsed under one button (drop-down-list style)

wouldn't that take more room to have a drop-down and button?

> or moved over by move..

Yeah, they are way out of place.  IMO, they belong before/after read/unread:

mailbox list:
Delete, Bypass Trash, Unread, Read, Flag, Unflag........ Move, Forward

message view:
Delete, Bypass Trash, Unread, Flag, Unflag....... Move, Forward, As 
Attachment, Reply All, Reply

> I think collapsing those toggles to one button (that would line up
> over the checky boxes) wouldn't be a bad thing..

I'd love to see that, I just can't envision it.

> (button could be
> called Toggle, with read, unread, flag, unflag as choices... )

Oh, OK, that's reasonable

> OTOH,
> gmail has a drop down titled "More Actions..." with other stuff
> underneath.. this would also be a viable way to tuck read/unread,
> flag/unflag into one button..
> 
> Move should stay on it's own, really. The move and the folder
> selection are intuitive where they are...

I disagree.  Again, it's about muscle memory.  Give the 
frequently-used-without-thinking buttons the easy to find positioning... 
something like Move should be considered the *easy* choice for pushing 
into the middle exactly because the act of moving requires that you 
select a folder, which means you *DO* have to read the drop-down, make a 
choice, etc...  you can't do that one by muscle memory, so it does not 
deserve such prime real estate.