Re: [Plastic-devs] [Fwd: Applications Messaging Standard]

[Pedro O. <Ped...@sc...>]

Dear all,


I think it might be wise to propose something like the following to the
IVOA:

- that the IVOA endorses the PLASTIC as it is (the name is just a detail
for me, the important thing would be the concept) through an IVOA doc
that describes the current PLASTIC spec.

- the IVOA "evolves" the aforementioned standard to become become
whichever future applications messaging protocol we all agree with.

This would allow currently working Plastic-interacting applications to
keep in sync and doing their job, and would stop a possible delay in the
publication of something which is nearly finished by now (and I agree
that the Applications Messaging Protocol would probably need many
discussions on things which are not in PLASTIC or that should be
changed, etc.).

There is a precedent on this, I believe: if you remember, at the last
Moscow meeting, the proposal was done to "bless" the Cone Search non-
standard document to become a standard one with a number, and leave it
there for reference (as there were many services implementing it). I
think it was generally agreed that this was a good idea (sort of
"legacy" standard) althuogh I am not 100% sure of what the final
decision was in this respect.

This is a general IVOA issue, I would say: how to cope with already-
existing de-facto standards when they are taken over by the IVOA. 

In any case, I think the PLASTIC is now at a stage where it might be
worth to try and pursue this. Then we'll fulfil several needs from
several sides.

Cheers,
P.



On Tue, 2007-01-30 at 11:15 +0000, John Taylor wrote:
> Dear All,
> The IVOA exec has decided to consider the issue of application messaging 
> in the new Applications Working Group.  This is a very early stage, 
> nothing is ruled in or out, and whether the outcome of the WG will 
> include an endorsement of PLASTIC, something derived from PLASTIC, or 
> something completely different is unknown.  If you have strong opinions 
> on what you need to have from an IVOA-endorsed apps messaging standard 
> then please keep a close eye on the ap...@iv... list.  In the 
> meantime, until things are clearer, feel free to continue to use this 
> list for questions and discussion related to PLASTIC.
> 
> John
> 
> PS
> Apologies for the multiple posting - I'm sure most of you received 
> Mark's original post.
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: 	Applications Messaging Standard
> Date: 	Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:31:48 +0100
> From: 	Mark Allen <al...@ne...>
> Reply-To: 	Mark Allen <al...@ne...>
> To: 	ap...@iv...
> 
> 
> 
> Dear Apps WG,
> 
> One of the first tasks of the Applications working group is to
> consider how an applications messaging standard may be developed as
> an IVOA standard. Plastic (see IVOA Note: PLASTIC - a protocol for
> desktop application interoperability Version 1.00) is a successful
> protocol which has been adopted by a several VO Applications and there
> is much interest in having a IVOA standard for semantics and syntax of
> application messaging.
> 
> John Taylor (Royal Obs Edinburgh) and Mike Fitzpatrick (NOAO) have
> agreed to lead an initial discussion on this mailing list about messaging
> between VO applications in general.
> 
> A proposed work-plan and time line are set out below. This is of course
> a draft, and is quite ambitious. I would however issue the challenge
> to have some well developed examples and demos by the May Interop
> meeting in Beijing.
> 
> -Mark.
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Draft Work-plan and Time-line.
> 
> 1. Investigate the scope of an Applications messaging IVOA standard.
> 
> 1.1 Open mailing list discussion on messaging between VO apps in general.
> - capture major concepts
> - identify interested parties
> (Feb 2007)
> 
> 1.2 Prepare a short note on "Applications messaging for VO tools"
> - define the scope of an Applications Messaging IVOA standard
> - outline the major issues involved, and put the current possibilities
> into the context of short and longer term goals.
> (end-Feb 2007)
> 
> 1.3 Draft mission plan for standard development
> (Mar 2007)
> 
> 2. IVOA Apps Applications Messaging Team
> 
> - small team (~10) defined by WG Chair and team leads. (Mar 2007)
> - finalise mission plan
> - develop the standard and to prepare an IVOA Working Draft.
> 
> 
> 3. First working draft by team (April ?)
> 
> 
> 4. May Interoperability Meeting (Beijing)
> - Working draft to mailing list before meeting
> - present status of Applications Messaging to IVOA community
> - Awe inspiring demo/examples
> 
> 5. Working Draft -> Proposed Recommendation
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Mark G. ALLEN
> Observatoire de Strasbourg
> +33 3 90 24 24 87
> 
> 
> 
-- 
Pedro Osuna Alcalaya

European Space Agency (ESA)
European Space Astronomy Centre (ESAC)
Research and Scientific Support Department (RSSD)
Astronomy Science Operations Division (SCI-SD)
e-mail: Ped...@es...
Tel + 34 91 813 13 14    Fax: +34 91 813 11 72
-------------------------------------------------                                                                                
European Space Astronomy Centre (ESAC)
P.O. Box 50727
E-28080 Villafranca del Castillo
MADRID - SPAIN

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