pipmak-users — Content creation for the Pipmak Game Engine

Re: proposal: loading the mirror image of a node

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Norfren wrote:
> In some situations, for example when wandering in tunnels, corridors, etc.,
> the number of available different nodes could be doubled without adding new
> images if the left/right or front/back mirror image of a node could be
> directly loaded (by appropriatly swapping or mirroring x-y coordinates in
> the loading procedure, developers know it better, how). Now it can be done
> only by a bit complex way.

That's a good idea, and is implemented now! Here's how to use it:
http://pipmak.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pipmak/trunk/pipmak/documentation/Reference.tex?r1=230&r2=229&pathrev=230

Comments on the implementation are welcome.

 -Christian

Re: Dissolve within schedule

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Addendum: It occurs to me that you could achieve your desired effect by doing it yourself instead of using a transition: have two patches on top of each other with adjacent frames of the animation, and fade the top one in or out using patch:setalpha().

 -Christian

Re: Dissolve within schedule

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Hi Norfren!

Sorry for the slow response, I've been really busy with Zik Clock and ULP this week.

> schedule function does not wait until dissolve finishes but continues and stucks again before the previous dissolve had been finished and so on.

This is correct, and is the intended behavior.

- Not waiting: Keep in mind that transition functions like pipmak.dissolve() only set up the transition, they don't wait until it is finished (pipmak functions can never wait for anything, they must return immediately, because Lua execution happens in lock-step with rendering - while your Lua code is running, the screen is not updated). What you return from a scheduled function is the interval to the next execution starting from the last execution (these are points in time, how much time the function actually takes to execute is irrelevant), not starting from when anything set in motion by the last execution finishes. Would you expect that when a scheduled function sets up a transition, the duration of the transition is added to the new interval it returns, so that the interval only appears to start after the transition is done? I think that would be an unnecessary restriction. If you want that, just add the transition duration yourself.

- Starting again: It is true that when you start a new transition while a transition is already running, the initial image of the second transition is taken from the current state of the world as it exists behind the running first transition, not from the currently visible state of the first transition. Whether that is a good thing is debatable - on the one hand it causes a visual discontinuity, on the other hand deforming an already deformed source image again may be undesired too.

So, I think the correct solution to your problem is to make the duration of the transition equal to the timer interval, e.g.

	pipmak.dissolve (1, 0.5)
	ring:setimage("n94_ring" .. ring_wave .. ".jpg")
	return 0.5

This makes the transitions exactly adjacent - no overlap, avoiding the discontinuity that would cause, and no period of static image in between.

Now that the animation still looks uneven with this is caused by a different effect: it is that the transitions are not linear, but start slowly, accelerate, decelerate, and end slowly again (a cubic curve with slope 0 at the beginning and end). When I experimentally make the transitions linear, the animation becomes much smoother. (It still doesn't feel completely even, I haven't examined whether that's an optical illusion because it alternates between blurry and sharp or whether there's still something wrong with the timing.) I guess something like "pipmak.lineardissolve()" could be introduced for that, or the transition curve could be made customizable in general.

However, another problem with continuous transitions like this is that you can't look around while a transition is running. This is because a transition happens between two static screenshots, not between two live 3D scenes. Changing that would be possible but not very simple. Because transitions can be (and are most commonly) used between two nodes, it would mean that two nodes (or stacks of nodes) would need to be kept running simultaneously, which the current code does not support.

Hope that helps clearing things up.

 -Christian

proposal: loading the mirror image of a node

[Norfren <nor...@ya...>]

In some situations, for example when wandering in tunnels, corridors, etc.,
the number of available different nodes could be doubled without adding new
images if the left/right or front/back mirror image of a node could be
directly loaded (by appropriatly swapping or mirroring x-y coordinates in
the loading procedure, developers know it better, how). Now it can be done
only by a bit complex way.    
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Dissolve within schedule

[Norfren <nor...@ya...>]

Download the norf94.pipmak file  http://www.gunda.hu/downloads/norf94.pipmak
from here   which contains a single node with a green rippling circle. The
moving ripples are made up of 8 pictures with the different phases. The
movement should be slower, but when the timing constant is greater than 0.1
the rippling starts to lag. So I decided to embed a dissolve method into the
schedule function hoping that the lagging caused by a longer timing could be
counterbalanced by the smoothed transition. 

Open the node.lua file, enable the dissolve method and experience with the
timing constant and the return time. I have the feeling that schedule
overrides dissolve - in other words schedule function does not wait until
dissolve finishes but continues and stucks again before the previous
dissolve had been finished and so on. Therefore it is difficult to stretch
the transitions and to preserve smoothness on the same way. Am I right?
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Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

--- On Wed, 6/29/11, Urs Holzer <ur...@an...> wrote:


From: Urs Holzer <ur...@an...>
Subject: Re: Randomizing from a list of variables
To: pip...@li...
Date: Wednesday, June 29, 2011, 2:42 AM


Hi James

James C. Wilson wrote:
> Thanks! I'm afraid I don't know what an array is, however...Could you
> explain if possible?

A value in Lua can be of type table. A table actually associates a key 
(which is also just a value) to another value. Of course it can have 
many entries. Say foo is a table, then

foo["bar"]

returns the value associated to the key "bar". Using

foo["bar"] = 1

Sets the value associated to the key "bar" to 1. In other words, a table 
stores values which you can read and set by key.

Lua does not know arrays as other programming languages do, since in 
Lua, an array is realized by a table which only has integers as keys. So 
if I say "array" here, I mean actually a table which has only integers 
as keys.

Example:

local sound = {}  -- create a table
sound[1] = sound1  -- sound now associates the value sound1 to the key 1
sound[2] = sound2  -- sound now associates the value sound2 to the key 2
sound[3] = sound3  -- sound now associates the value sound3 to the key 3

local n = 2  -- Store value 2 in the variable n
sound[n]  -- Returns the value associated to the key 2

You can read up more about tables here: http://www.lua.org/pil/2.5.html

Description from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Associative_array:
An associative array (also associative container, map, mapping, 
dictionary, finite map, table, and in query-processing an index or index 
file) is an abstract data type composed of a collection of unique keys 
and a collection of values, where each key is associated with one value 
(or set of values). The operation of finding the value associated with a 
key is called a lookup or indexing, and this is the most important 
operation supported by an associative array. The relationship between a 
key and its value is sometimes called a mapping or binding. For example, 
if the value associated with the key "bob" is 7, we say that our array 
maps "bob" to 7. Associative arrays are very closely related to the 
mathematical concept of a function with a finite domain. As a 
consequence, a common and important use of associative arrays is in 
memoization.

Hope this helps

Greetings
Urs


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Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Thank you Urs! That worked spendidly, thank you.
 
-James

--- On Wed, 6/29/11, Urs Holzer <ur...@an...> wrote:


From: Urs Holzer <ur...@an...>
Subject: Re: Randomizing from a list of variables
To: pip...@li...
Date: Wednesday, June 29, 2011, 2:42 AM


Hi James

James C. Wilson wrote:
> Thanks! I'm afraid I don't know what an array is, however...Could you
> explain if possible?

A value in Lua can be of type table. A table actually associates a key 
(which is also just a value) to another value. Of course it can have 
many entries. Say foo is a table, then

foo["bar"]

returns the value associated to the key "bar". Using

foo["bar"] = 1

Sets the value associated to the key "bar" to 1. In other words, a table 
stores values which you can read and set by key.

Lua does not know arrays as other programming languages do, since in 
Lua, an array is realized by a table which only has integers as keys. So 
if I say "array" here, I mean actually a table which has only integers 
as keys.

Example:

local sound = {}  -- create a table
sound[1] = sound1  -- sound now associates the value sound1 to the key 1
sound[2] = sound2  -- sound now associates the value sound2 to the key 2
sound[3] = sound3  -- sound now associates the value sound3 to the key 3

local n = 2  -- Store value 2 in the variable n
sound[n]  -- Returns the value associated to the key 2

You can read up more about tables here: http://www.lua.org/pil/2.5.html

Description from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Associative_array:
An associative array (also associative container, map, mapping, 
dictionary, finite map, table, and in query-processing an index or index 
file) is an abstract data type composed of a collection of unique keys 
and a collection of values, where each key is associated with one value 
(or set of values). The operation of finding the value associated with a 
key is called a lookup or indexing, and this is the most important 
operation supported by an associative array. The relationship between a 
key and its value is sometimes called a mapping or binding. For example, 
if the value associated with the key "bob" is 7, we say that our array 
maps "bob" to 7. Associative arrays are very closely related to the 
mathematical concept of a function with a finite domain. As a 
consequence, a common and important use of associative arrays is in 
memoization.

Hope this helps

Greetings
Urs


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Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

[Urs H. <ur...@an...>]

Hi James

James C. Wilson wrote:
> Thanks! I'm afraid I don't know what an array is, however...Could you
> explain if possible?

A value in Lua can be of type table. A table actually associates a key 
(which is also just a value) to another value. Of course it can have 
many entries. Say foo is a table, then

foo["bar"]

returns the value associated to the key "bar". Using

foo["bar"] = 1

Sets the value associated to the key "bar" to 1. In other words, a table 
stores values which you can read and set by key.

Lua does not know arrays as other programming languages do, since in 
Lua, an array is realized by a table which only has integers as keys. So 
if I say "array" here, I mean actually a table which has only integers 
as keys.

Example:

local sound = {}  -- create a table
sound[1] = sound1  -- sound now associates the value sound1 to the key 1
sound[2] = sound2  -- sound now associates the value sound2 to the key 2
sound[3] = sound3  -- sound now associates the value sound3 to the key 3

local n = 2  -- Store value 2 in the variable n
sound[n]  -- Returns the value associated to the key 2

You can read up more about tables here: http://www.lua.org/pil/2.5.html

Description from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Associative_array:
An associative array (also associative container, map, mapping, 
dictionary, finite map, table, and in query-processing an index or index 
file) is an abstract data type composed of a collection of unique keys 
and a collection of values, where each key is associated with one value 
(or set of values). The operation of finding the value associated with a 
key is called a lookup or indexing, and this is the most important 
operation supported by an associative array. The relationship between a 
key and its value is sometimes called a mapping or binding. For example, 
if the value associated with the key "bob" is 7, we say that our array 
maps "bob" to 7. Associative arrays are very closely related to the 
mathematical concept of a function with a finite domain. As a 
consequence, a common and important use of associative arrays is in 
memoization.

Hope this helps

Greetings
Urs

Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Thanks! I'm afraid I don't know what an array is, however...Could you explain if possible?
 
Thanks,
 James

From: Urs Holzer <ur...@an...>
To: pip...@li...
Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 6:11 AM
Subject: Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

Hi James

James C. Wilson wrote:
> I don't suppose there's a way to randomly reference a variable, is
> there? Suppose I had four sounds, each preloaded into a local
> variable, perhaps named "local sound_1", local sound_2", etc, and
> wanted to play one of them at random every six seconds? I can do this
> by loading straight from the hard drive, but I'd like to be able to do
> it via locals, if possible.

Put them into an array instead. Say, the first sound in sound[1], the 
second one in sound[2] and so on. Then generate a random number, like 
that:

rand = math.random[sound.maxn]

Then you can use sound[rand] to get the sound you want to play.

I hope this is what you need.

Greetings
Urs


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threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes 
sense of it. IT sense. And common sense.
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Re: Randomizing from a list of variables

[Urs H. <ur...@an...>]

Hi James

James C. Wilson wrote:
> I don't suppose there's a way to randomly reference a variable, is
> there? Suppose I had four sounds, each preloaded into a local
> variable, perhaps named "local sound_1", local sound_2", etc, and
> wanted to play one of them at random every six seconds? I can do this
> by loading straight from the hard drive, but I'd like to be able to do
> it via locals, if possible.

Put them into an array instead. Say, the first sound in sound[1], the 
second one in sound[2] and so on. Then generate a random number, like 
that:

rand = math.random[sound.maxn]

Then you can use sound[rand] to get the sound you want to play.

I hope this is what you need.

Greetings
Urs

Randomizing from a list of variables

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Hi all,
 
I don't suppose there's a way to randomly reference a variable, is there?
Suppose I had four sounds, each preloaded into a local variable, perhaps named "local sound_1", local sound_2", etc, and wanted to play one of them at random every six seconds? I can do this by loading straight from the hard drive, but I'd like to be able to do it via locals, if possible.
 
Thanks,
 James

Re: Subdirectories

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Hello John

> I would like to know if it's possible to organize the node
> directories in any way. For a project with a lot of nodes it would be
> nice if they could be consolidated into separate directories rather
> than just all being placed in the root directory.

This is not possible in the last released version of Pipmak (0.2.7), 
however it is possible in the current development version. Nodes are now 
referred to by arbitrary names, no longer by numbers, and can be located 
in arbitrarily nested subfolders.

This is documented in the reference manual, you can see what has changed 
at a glance at
<http://pipmak.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pipmak/trunk/pipmak/documentation/Reference.tex?r1=209&r2=208&pathrev=209>

If you are set up to build Pipmak from source, you are welcome to play 
with this. If not, you will have to wait either for the next release (no 
date is planned for that yet) or for someone else to provide a build for 
your platform. (I could look into it myself if needed, but no promises.)

  -Christian

Subdirectories

[John A. <hi...@jo...>]

Hello fellow Pipmak users,
I'm considering pursuing a project using the Pipmak engine, but I would like
to know if it's possible to organize the node directories in any way. For a
project with a lot of nodes it would be nice if they could be consolidated
into separate directories rather than just all being placed in the root
directory. That is, if a room in the game contains eight different nodes,
there could be a directory that contains nodes 1-8 rather than having nodes
1-8 in root along with all the games other nodes. Is this possible? If not,
how difficult would it be to implement this feature?
Thanks for any suggestions about this.
-John Allie

Re: Sweet Home 3D and other plus equirectangular-to-cubic converter

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Andrea Viarengo wrote:
> An idea for Christian:
>
> What do you think about adding the equirectangular node?
>
> equirect("picture.png")

Yes, that's what I meant by

> It seems to me that the proper solution for the problem would be to
> implement support for equirectangular panoramas in Pipmak.

  -Christian

Re: Sweet Home 3D and other plus equirectangular-to-cubic converter

[Andrea V. <and...@gm...>]

Thanks Stefan for the link.

I have also found an insteresting java cross-platform tool:

http://www.panoramically.com/equirectangular-to-cubic-converter

The tool can be download from bottom of that page,

It's just one jar archive, I tryed and works fine.
It works from command line, here a Windows example:

java -Xmx1024m -jar EquirectangularToCubic.jar \
     -outputdir C:\out_folder \
     -interpolation lanczos2 \
     C:\inp_folder

You put an equirectangular picture inside folder inp_folder,
run command and get six pictures inside out_folder

Parameter -Xmx1024m is a JVM option to increments ram used by java
(in this case I put 1024MByte, but you can decrease this value)

This tool is distributed with GPL license, so should be simple add a
java GUI....

An idea for Christian:

What do you think about adding the equirectangular node?

equirect("picture.png") 

Bye

Andrea

Re: Sweet Home 3D and other

[Stefan G. <net...@we...>]

I'm not an expert in panoramas an all these things, but it seems to me
that there should already be enough scripts and programsfor this task,
using the PanoTools? (I just did a little google search - but maybe I am
getting something completely wrong)

http://archive.bigben.id.au/tutorials/360/readme/scripts.html
http://www.jotschi.de/?p=391
http://vinayhacks.blogspot.com/2010/11/converting-equirectangular-panorama-to.html


Am Donnerstag, den 31.03.2011, 21:32 +0200 schrieb Christian Walther:
> equirectangular

-- 
Glücklich kann sich derjenige schätzen, der im Brett vor dem Kopf ein
Astloch gefunden hat.

Re: Sweet Home 3D and other

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

Andrea Viarengo wrote:
> Who knows a opensource/free converting tool for passing from equirectangular
> to cubic?

No idea. If all else fails, my tool of choice would be POV-Ray, but if 
you're not already familiar with it, its learning curve is probably 
disproportionate to such a trivial goal.

> An idea: Why didn't include, inside Pipmak, a series of tools/functions
> to convert various panorama formats?
>
> For example, saveequirect() is very usefull function,
> so we can include also other functions like:
>
> bottom_img = getfromequirect(equi_img, "bottom")
> left_img = getfromequirect(equi_img, "left")
>
> What do you thinking about that?

I think it would be very inefficient to do this at runtime.

It seems to me that the proper solution for the problem would be to 
implement support for equirectangular panoramas in Pipmak.

If conversion is necessary, then it should be done at authoring time, 
and a tool for that could just be shipped along with Pipmak. (OK, I 
guess it could be integrated as well.)

  -Christian

Sweet Home 3D and other

[Andrea V. <and...@gm...>]

Hello,

Sweet Home 3D (http://www.sweethome3d.com/index.jsp) is an amazing 
cross-platform tool (it is entirely written in Java) which permits,
in a very simple way, to create house interiors (and also exteriors). 

I think it could be very usefull to generate scenes for Pipmak, rendering is
quite good, with shadows and reflections.

It's possible to export spherical panoramas into equirectangular format.

Who knows a opensource/free converting tool for passing from equirectangular 
to cubic?

I have found "Pano2VR", which is very nice, but it isn't free
(Trial version put watermasks on outputs)

An idea: Why didn't include, inside Pipmak, a series of tools/functions
to convert various panorama formats? 

For example, saveequirect() is very usefull function, 
so we can include also other functions like:

bottom_img = getfromequirect(equi_img, "bottom")
left_img = getfromequirect(equi_img, "left")

What do you thinking about that?

See you

-Andrea

Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Ah, okay! Thanks for your assistence.
 
-James

--- On Mon, 3/14/11, Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...> wrote:


From: Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...>
Subject: Re: Problem with hotspots linking
To: "Content creation for the Pipmak Game Engine" <pip...@li...>
Date: Monday, March 14, 2011, 4:48 PM


> I opened eqirect.bmp in GIMP, created a new layer, opened hotspot-palette.gif, inkdropped the first color from the palette image, painted a hotspot on new layer of equirect.bmp, repeated three times with next three colors on palette. Removed bottom layer of equirect.bmp to leave only colors and white background. Changed mode of image to Indexed, and selected hotspot.palette.gif to index the image. Saved as hotspotmap.png.

OK, I can reproduce the problem by following these instructions. It appears that GIMP takes the liberty of reordering the colors when you have "remove unused colors from palette" checked in the indexed conversion dialog. Unchecking that box fixes the problem. This results in a larger color palette than strictly necessary, but the effect of that is probably negligible. I haven't found an option for trimming the palette to the used colors afterwards in GIMP.

-Christian
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Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

> I opened eqirect.bmp in GIMP, created a new layer, opened hotspot-palette.gif, inkdropped the first color from the palette image, painted a hotspot on new layer of equirect.bmp, repeated three times with next three colors on palette. Removed bottom layer of equirect.bmp to leave only colors and white background. Changed mode of image to Indexed, and selected hotspot.palette.gif to index the image. Saved as hotspotmap.png.

OK, I can reproduce the problem by following these instructions. It appears that GIMP takes the liberty of reordering the colors when you have "remove unused colors from palette" checked in the indexed conversion dialog. Unchecking that box fixes the problem. This results in a larger color palette than strictly necessary, but the effect of that is probably negligible. I haven't found an option for trimming the palette to the used colors afterwards in GIMP.

 -Christian

Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Christian,

As far as I can tell, the standard method.
 
I opened eqirect.bmp in GIMP, created a new layer, opened hotspot-palette.gif, inkdropped the first color from the palette image, painted a hotspot on new layer of equirect.bmp, repeated three times with next three colors on palette. Removed bottom layer of equirect.bmp to leave only colors and white background. Changed mode of image to Indexed, and selected hotspot.palette.gif to index the image. Saved as hotspotmap.png.
 
How's that look?
--- On Sun, 3/13/11, Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...> wrote:


From: Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...>
Subject: Re: Problem with hotspots linking
To: pip...@li...
Date: Sunday, March 13, 2011, 5:15 AM


> Any idea how this could have happened, and how to avoid it?

Not without knowing how you made the image.

  -Christian


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Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

> Any idea how this could have happened, and how to avoid it?

Not without knowing how you made the image.

  -Christian

Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[James C. W. <jfc...@ya...>]

Thanks, I'll give it a try.
Any idea how this could have happened, and how to avoid it?
 
Thanks,
 James

--- On Fri, 3/11/11, Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...> wrote:


From: Christian Walther <cwa...@gm...>
Subject: Re: Problem with hotspots linking
To: pip...@li...
Date: Friday, March 11, 2011, 4:49 PM


> I mailed this list a few months ago about this issue and after a few
> exchanges, no more replies got to me for months. So I'm resstarting
> this, hope no-one minds:

Oooh, I'm sorry! That must have completely slipped by my attention. Please don't hesitate to ask again sooner in such situations. It sometimes happens that I'm busy when a question comes in and later forget about it.

Anyway, in the attached image (top row) you see the color palette of your file, as seen by the "Rearrange Colormap" dialog in GIMP. Compared with the original color palette of hotspot-palette.gif (bottom row), you can see that the colors have actually been reordered, as I suspected.

You can fix that using that dialog, if you're using GIMP.

-Christian

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Re: Problem with hotspots linking

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

> I mailed this list a few months ago about this issue and after a few
> exchanges, no more replies got to me for months. So I'm resstarting
> this, hope no-one minds:

Oooh, I'm sorry! That must have completely slipped by my attention. 
Please don't hesitate to ask again sooner in such situations. It 
sometimes happens that I'm busy when a question comes in and later 
forget about it.

Anyway, in the attached image (top row) you see the color palette of 
your file, as seen by the "Rearrange Colormap" dialog in GIMP. Compared 
with the original color palette of hotspot-palette.gif (bottom row), you 
can see that the colors have actually been reordered, as I suspected.

You can fix that using that dialog, if you're using GIMP.

  -Christian

Re: New Pipmak Tutorials

[Christian W. <cwa...@gm...>]

andylegate wrote:
> This is just a message to let you all know that I'll be adding more
> tutorials to Pipmak's Wiki.
> 
> I've already placed 4 on there that I had made several months ago, and as
> time goes by, I'll be adding more.

Thank you Andy! As I've already told you, I think your tutorials are 
very well written and I hope they will be useful to newcomers. While 
we've been doing quite well on reference documentation and example code, 
there has been a distinct lack of tutorials up to now.

  -Christian