Re: [myhdl-list] It's a beautiful day (somewhat long response)
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Re: [myhdl-list] It's a beautiful day (somewhat long response)
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From: Angel E. <ang...@gm...> - 2011-06-08 10:15:49
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On Wed, Jun 8, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Christopher Felton <chr...@gm...> wrote: > On 6/8/11 4:07 AM, Angel Ezquerra wrote: >> On Wed, Jun 8, 2011 at 10:45 AM, Christopher Felton >> <chr...@gm...> wrote: >>> On 6/7/11 7:15 AM, Jan Decaluwe wrote: >>>> A few weeks ago, I posted the following: >>>> >>>>> From: Jan Decaluwe<ja...@ja...> >>>>> Newsgroups: gmane.comp.python.myhdl >>>>> Subject: My take on MyHDL weaknesses - and solutions >>>>> Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2011 11:00:23 +0200 >>>>> ... >>>>> Solution 2: The PyPy project (future). Python doesn't have >>>>> to be slow: by employing clever JIT techniques, performance >>>>> can be improved drastically e.g. 5-10x. I believe that MyHDL >>>>> is a good candidate for this type of optimization. The day >>>>> this happens would be one of the most important ones in >>>>> MyHDL's history: the performance limitations would for a >>>>> large part go away, and it would be the ultimate validation >>>>> of the concept: benefitting from advances without having to >>>>> do anything yourself :-) >>>> >>>> I'm very happy to report that it looks like this day has >>>> arrived now. PyPy 1.5 is compatible with Python 2.7, and >>>> I'm seeing really spectacular speedup factors. >>>> >>>> I have documented my findings extensively here: >>>> >>>> http://www.myhdl.org/doku.php/performance >>>> >>>> Obviously, I would like to create some buzz about this, but >>>> I want to move carefully. First I would like to know if >>>> people with relevant simulations get similar results. >>>> >>>> Feedback is therefore very welcome; I think everything needed >>>> to get started is documented on the page mentioned above. >>>> >>>> Jan >>>> >>> >>> The following are some notes at my attempt to use pypy on some of my >>> projects today. >>> >>> Jump to the Chase >>> ================= >>> My experience was mixed. Majority of my projects, simulations, utilize >>> numpy and other packages (matplotlib, etc). Most of these do not work >>> with pypy. Majority of my project simulations failed with pypy. I read >>> there are efforts to get numpy working with pypy. But it is unknown >>> when these would be available. Most of my active projects have some >>> dependency that failed and prevented the simulations from running with >>> pypy. >>> >>> Note: My testbenches utilize numpy and other common Python libraries. >>> The hardware descriptions do *not* use the libraries. >>> >>> >>> Disclaimer >>> ========== >>> I did not set out to run a set of simulations to preform similar task >>> that Jan Decaluwe did in his excellent write-up. But rather test pypy >>> against existing projects (in existing states) and record the results >>> with minimal modifications and effort. Other than getting the >>> *existing* simulations to run no additional work was performed to create >>> a good test suite. >>> >>> >>> Notes on Installing pypy >>> ======================== >>> I usually work on an ancient mac and pypy1.5 is available through >>> macports. Should be easy to install ... >>> >>> ``>> port install pypy`` >>> >>> But, it failed to build and it wasn't clear why, next step try building >>> from the source, binaries not available for my machine. This was >>> confusing. The pypy installing PYPY page_ has instructions where to get >>> the source (tarball or hg). But then jumps to testing the install and >>> not the actual act of installing? >>> >>> .. _page: pypy.org/download.html#install >>> >>> But installing on the Ubuntu box was pretty straight forward. Download >>> the binaries and off you go. The simulations were attempted on an >>> Ubuntu system. Verified pypy worked. >>> >>> >>> Simulations >>> =========== >>> As discussed, the first couple simulations I tried failed because of the >>> unsupported dependencies. Which required some investigation on the >>> failures and possible solutions. At this time there is no solution for >>> the numpy and company other than rewriting the simulations, not to use >>> numpy. The following is the list of my projects I attempted to run with >>> pypy. Most of these are described on the myhdl wiki. >>> >>> 1. Recursive FFT (failed, numpy) >>> 2. GnuRadio Compatible USRP CIC Filter (failed, numpy) >>> 3. Fixed-Point SOS (failed, numpy) >>> 4. USBP (FX2 USB Interface) (failed in myhdl??) >>> >>> All in all, I could not get any of them to run with pypy? Some were >>> expected but some were not. >>> >>> >>> Summary >>> ======= >>> I think pypy is very promising but there are some limitations. I don't >>> know how many others would be affected by the limitations but for me it >>> was fairly severe. But I also need to devote some more time resolving >>> the non-dependency issues and working through those. I look forward to >>> the day more packages are supported by pypy! >>> >>> Chris Felton >> >> Chris, >> >> it seems that you are not the only one who'd like to get numpy to work >> with pypy. Check these two posts on the pypy blog: >> >> http://morepypy.blogspot.com/2011/05/numpy-in-pypy-status-and-roadmap.html >> http://morepypy.blogspot.com/2011/06/report-back-from-our-survey.html >> >> In short, they know this is important, they have a plan on how to >> proceed, they believe they can make numpy even faster than it is, but >> they don't have many resources allocated to the task (yet?). >> >> So I think we can be cautiously optimist that this problem will be >> solved eventually. >> >> In the meantime I'd love to know if your projects work when you remove >> the numpy stuff. >> >> Angel > > I imagine I could get them to work without the numpy. I really only use > the numerical packages to create the input signals and analyze the > output signals. A bunch of it is for analyzing the response, creating > psd plots, etc. If I remove a bunch of the post-simulation analysis I > should be able to reproduce the signal generation with lists and the > basic Python math libs. At that point I could measure the speed > improvements with pypy. > > Thanks for the links! > > Chris > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > EditLive Enterprise is the world's most technically advanced content > authoring tool. Experience the power of Track Changes, Inline Image > Editing and ensure content is compliant with Accessibility Checking. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/ephox-dev2dev > _______________________________________________ > myhdl-list mailing list > myh...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/myhdl-list > Someone posted the following story to the python subreddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/httng/pypy_gives_massive_speed_boost_to_myhdl/ There is already a question asking whether someone uses MyHDL for serious work. I think it is an excellent opportunity to let people now that MyHDL can be used instead of the regular VHDL or Verilog workflow :-) Angel |
