I'm using a Microsoft Surface 2 laptop (i7 1.9GHz, 8 GB ram) with Windows 10 and RME Babyface Pro FS. When I launch a private Jamulus server then connect a client at 128 Samples the Auto Buffers settle around 9 for the Client and 2 for the Server. The red buffer light illuminates every few seconds. When I monitor the server output I hear constant dropouts and clicks. I'm not connected to a network; so where is all the latency coming from? What am I doing wrong?
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-02
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As a further experiment, with Jamulus server running on a Dell workstation on my home gigabit network, when I connect the Jamulus client from the Surface laptop and move the Jamulus server window around on the Dell desktop, there are dropouts on the client. If I minimize the browser window I am using to compose this note on the Dell (server), audio on the Surface (client) cuts out while the window is minimizing.
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-02
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Thanks for the suggestion, DonC. In my 2nd test environment above, the CPU on the box running the server is <2%, the laptop running the Client is <7% with Jamulus accounting for 5%.
Further on the effects of minimizing and maximizing app windows on the server, these result in latency spikes on the client where Ping is momentarily > 150ms.
On the client, memory 46%, disk 1%, network 1%.
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Are you running in some super power saver mode that limits the processor power when it is needed?
On my years old Lenovo laptop I can do whatever I want on the screen with server and client both running and never see the buffers go above 3, ping is 0, or hear any kind of sound artifact.
When I connect to a server on my local network the only difference is that the ping goes up to 1.
Something is keeping your computers from keeping up.
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The power mode is normal and the laptop plugged in. The Microsoft Surface 2 connects via ethernet through a docking port which also provides power. Maybe this accessory is causing problems. I'll install Jamulus on an old Toshiba Tecra laptop and try running both the server and client on it. To run at 64 Frames is this the correct server command line: jamulus.exe -s -F
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Using a 15-year-old Toshiba Tecra laptop yields better performance than using a 2-year-old Microsoft Surface 2 laptop, both with Windows 10. Even with the Tecra's gigabit ethernet card degrading to 0.1 Gbps (not sure why). Testing client and server on the same machine yields excellent Ping and Overall Delay. And connecting to private servers gives superior performance, too. I did notice when moving the trackpad pointer around the screen that dropouts occur. The fewest dropouts occured with the screen locked.
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Launching Task Manager while Jamulus is running can be quite informative. Listen to the audio degrade when your antivirus runs a quick scan or some other process ramps up disk activity.
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I'm not certain about this yet but I am beginning to suspect that using Zoom earlier in the day might be part of the issue. If I use Zoom with the laptop's built-in mic and speakers, this sets the system audio to those drivers as seen in the Window 10 Sound applet. Afterwards when plugging in my Babyface to use Jamulus, those system settings are not updated. The result seems to be very rough sounding audio when it should be the best possible with both client and server on the same machine. I'll have to try reproducing the issue when I'm back in that environment but taking a moment now to post it here in case it's of help to anyone else with time to experiment.
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-14
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After struggling to run Jamulus connected to a local server on Windows 7 and 10, then with Jamulus OS, today I installed it on an Apple MacBook Air and everything worked perfectly. Using a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 the setup could not have been simpler or the results more satisfying. The pops, crackles and drops on all other systems were simply gone. What was left was pure, clean audio with the occasional muffled ripple and total delay under 16 ms.
This experience has restored my faith in Jamulus. I was ready to give up on it. If I couldn't overcome quality issues on a computer disconnected from networks then how could I expect satisfactory results from a remote server connection. In my testing these were simply returning the same unpleasant noises that my local servers were. It was frustrating and exhausting to listen through.
Now I have to figure out how to connect both the audio interface and an Ethernet adapter with only one USB-C port available on the Air. Can anyone offer some advice on that question? Do hubs add latency? Is a single adapter available? I already have individual USB-C to Ethernet and USB-C to USB adapters if these can be incorporated into a solution.
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Thanks for your response. I believe I am using ASIO4ALL as the driver. My
input and output is the Focusrite.
I will try to set up Jamulus OS and see if that helps. I have had
excellent jam sessions with many musicians as far away as Seattle, WA. I
am near Toronto, Canada using other public servers, but I just set up my
server. Here's a question. If I ran two computers in my house, both with
ethernet connection and put the server on one computer and used the server
on another computer, would that help decrease latency?
Hi Gilgongo. Yes, I was testing with the Scarlett (2i2) on Windows as well as the Babyface Pro FS (BPF). I used the Focusrite drivers and the RME drivers. I did not use the ASIO4All driver. I could not achieve an acceptable audio quality with either of these audio interfaces against a local server on a Windows Surface Laptop 2 with Win10, a Dell Vostro with Win7 or a Toshiba Tecra with Win10.
Today I also used the BFP in Class Compliant mode on the MacBook Air (from 2015) with excellent results. So both the 2i2 and the BFP with no special attention to drivers performed beautifully. The Jitter Buffer on manual with Local and Server set at 3 gave 12 - 14 ms Overall Delay.
Thanks for your suggestion on the UGreen USB-C hub.
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I'm using a Microsoft Surface 2 laptop (i7 1.9GHz, 8 GB ram) with Windows 10 and RME Babyface Pro FS. When I launch a private Jamulus server then connect a client at 128 Samples the Auto Buffers settle around 9 for the Client and 2 for the Server. The red buffer light illuminates every few seconds. When I monitor the server output I hear constant dropouts and clicks. I'm not connected to a network; so where is all the latency coming from? What am I doing wrong?
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-02
As a further experiment, with Jamulus server running on a Dell workstation on my home gigabit network, when I connect the Jamulus client from the Surface laptop and move the Jamulus server window around on the Dell desktop, there are dropouts on the client. If I minimize the browser window I am using to compose this note on the Dell (server), audio on the Surface (client) cuts out while the window is minimizing.
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-02
It sounds like some other program is running in the background that is hogging processor power.
Thanks for the suggestion, DonC. In my 2nd test environment above, the CPU on the box running the server is <2%, the laptop running the Client is <7% with Jamulus accounting for 5%.
Further on the effects of minimizing and maximizing app windows on the server, these result in latency spikes on the client where Ping is momentarily > 150ms.
On the client, memory 46%, disk 1%, network 1%.
Are you running in some super power saver mode that limits the processor power when it is needed?
On my years old Lenovo laptop I can do whatever I want on the screen with server and client both running and never see the buffers go above 3, ping is 0, or hear any kind of sound artifact.
When I connect to a server on my local network the only difference is that the ping goes up to 1.
Something is keeping your computers from keeping up.
The power mode is normal and the laptop plugged in. The Microsoft Surface 2 connects via ethernet through a docking port which also provides power. Maybe this accessory is causing problems. I'll install Jamulus on an old Toshiba Tecra laptop and try running both the server and client on it. To run at 64 Frames is this the correct server command line: jamulus.exe -s -F
Using a 15-year-old Toshiba Tecra laptop yields better performance than using a 2-year-old Microsoft Surface 2 laptop, both with Windows 10. Even with the Tecra's gigabit ethernet card degrading to 0.1 Gbps (not sure why). Testing client and server on the same machine yields excellent Ping and Overall Delay. And connecting to private servers gives superior performance, too. I did notice when moving the trackpad pointer around the screen that dropouts occur. The fewest dropouts occured with the screen locked.
Launching Task Manager while Jamulus is running can be quite informative. Listen to the audio degrade when your antivirus runs a quick scan or some other process ramps up disk activity.
I'm not certain about this yet but I am beginning to suspect that using Zoom earlier in the day might be part of the issue. If I use Zoom with the laptop's built-in mic and speakers, this sets the system audio to those drivers as seen in the Window 10 Sound applet. Afterwards when plugging in my Babyface to use Jamulus, those system settings are not updated. The result seems to be very rough sounding audio when it should be the best possible with both client and server on the same machine. I'll have to try reproducing the issue when I'm back in that environment but taking a moment now to post it here in case it's of help to anyone else with time to experiment.
Last edit: Patrick Jackman 2021-02-14
We've had reports that things sometimes grab the audio hardware without you knowing under Windows, so maybe it's that?
After struggling to run Jamulus connected to a local server on Windows 7 and 10, then with Jamulus OS, today I installed it on an Apple MacBook Air and everything worked perfectly. Using a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 the setup could not have been simpler or the results more satisfying. The pops, crackles and drops on all other systems were simply gone. What was left was pure, clean audio with the occasional muffled ripple and total delay under 16 ms.
This experience has restored my faith in Jamulus. I was ready to give up on it. If I couldn't overcome quality issues on a computer disconnected from networks then how could I expect satisfactory results from a remote server connection. In my testing these were simply returning the same unpleasant noises that my local servers were. It was frustrating and exhausting to listen through.
Now I have to figure out how to connect both the audio interface and an Ethernet adapter with only one USB-C port available on the Air. Can anyone offer some advice on that question? Do hubs add latency? Is a single adapter available? I already have individual USB-C to Ethernet and USB-C to USB adapters if these can be incorporated into a solution.
Were you using the Focusrite with the Windows machine? I don't think you mentioned that. If so, were you using ASIO4All or another driver?
As to the USB thing, I've used this with Jamulus on a Macbook Pro for that and it was fine: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07RQLF6M8/
Thanks for your response. I believe I am using ASIO4ALL as the driver. My
input and output is the Focusrite.
I will try to set up Jamulus OS and see if that helps. I have had
excellent jam sessions with many musicians as far away as Seattle, WA. I
am near Toronto, Canada using other public servers, but I just set up my
server. Here's a question. If I ran two computers in my house, both with
ethernet connection and put the server on one computer and used the server
on another computer, would that help decrease latency?
On Mon, Feb 15, 2021 at 2:29 AM Gilgongo gilgongojones@users.sourceforge.net wrote:
Hi Gilgongo. Yes, I was testing with the Scarlett (2i2) on Windows as well as the Babyface Pro FS (BPF). I used the Focusrite drivers and the RME drivers. I did not use the ASIO4All driver. I could not achieve an acceptable audio quality with either of these audio interfaces against a local server on a Windows Surface Laptop 2 with Win10, a Dell Vostro with Win7 or a Toshiba Tecra with Win10.
Today I also used the BFP in Class Compliant mode on the MacBook Air (from 2015) with excellent results. So both the 2i2 and the BFP with no special attention to drivers performed beautifully. The Jitter Buffer on manual with Local and Server set at 3 gave 12 - 14 ms Overall Delay.
Thanks for your suggestion on the UGreen USB-C hub.