I think the people who created and maintain gcb would want as many users as possible and it become more popular.
It seems the linux distro assumes that the user is competant using their os.
The windows distro assumes you're thick so it's automated for you.
Is gcb 32bit only or is there a win 64bit version?
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I'm not so sure that the Windows version assumes you are 'thick'. The advantage that Windows has had over the last twenty five years or more is one of (relative) stability in the codebase, and one of near total backwards compatibility. Programs that I wrote to target Windows '95 still run in 2020 on Windows 10. That is not the case for almost any other operating system. Certainly not macOS which would have been running System 7 on the Motorola 68000, before the PowerPC versions, and well before OS-X, Intel processors or macOS, nor I suspect any Linux distribution from 1995. OS/2? If you could get it to run on a modern PC (or indeed any PC, I never got it to run. Ever.) it might run programs written for it but that is because it never progressed much past version 1.
That stability makes life much simpler for anyone writing programs for it and gives them a massive advantage. That in turn means that what works on one PC installation has a high chance of working on the next, and the next, and the next, and the next... Something that Linux distributions can only dream of. Were all Linux distributions to collaborate with one another, I don't doubt it could clean up, but it's fragmentation is it's own worst enemy. If GCB were to target (for example) Linux Mint 19.3, it could be possible to create a single, 'clickable' download and install. But it might not work in Knoppix, or Ubuntu, or even Linux Mint XFCE, maybe not Linux Mint 20.0. Which is a shame.
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Since were not accessing more than 2 gigs of memory, it's pretty pointless to invest the time and energy into doing 64 bit. It won't make it faster, but it would make it bigger.
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I am a Mac user. I could account for a large number of the downloads on the graph too! I have tried to 'streamline' the installations on my two machines to make upgrading the GCB compiler easier which took a few installation attempts and a number of downloads to succeed.
I am in debt to the kindness of everyone who works on GCB and the macOS binaries.
I use GCB not only here at home for my own projects, but at work too. Both 'computers' I use are Macs. Last year at work we made PCBs for various machines that we manufacture, maintain or upgrade. Of those boards, all that have a processor on them will have had every line of that code written on, and then programmed with, that Mac and the NSDSP programmer. This January we are launching a new machine for which the design and code (for four processors) has all been done on that Mac.
However, I realise that I am in the minority and that I should not (and indeed, do not) expect the world to stop using Windows and shift to Macs. It is my choice to do so, and if things don't work as slickly on the Mac as they do on Windows, well, I can live with that. I initially managed to do my work running a full Virtual Machine with a copy of XP on it. As I progressed, I found time to get SynWrite and the GCB to run under WINE. Finally I sat down one Bank Holiday and managed to compile a Mac binary compiler of my own. [Although shortly after, it was done much better by @Trev] I have been able to get the Geany editor to work in a way that suits my way of thinking in a fashion too. All of this just because I'm bloody minded about not wanting to use Windows!
So, although I am pitifully grateful for all the work that is added to the GCB workload to create the Mac 'port', I wouldn't want any of the developers to feel obliged to pander to a minority. Windows has, by far, the largest audience and surely 99.99% of the effort should be targeted towards Windows? Those of us who insist on being outside of the mainstream may have to do a little more in the way of self help. I can live with that.
Last edit: mkstevo 2020-01-06
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Excellent. Thank you for the feedback. That's enough for me to want to put effort into supporting macs. Too bad wine doesn't work better, it would make this all much easier.
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WINE for me worked very well. I had issues with the AutoComplete crashing SynWrite, once I turned that off it worked well. I couldn't integrate the programmer with WINE as it has little (no?) support for USB devices.
I'm most grateful to all who work on GCB, and if clever people are kind enough to assist in creating native macOS binaries, especially grateful.
Thanks to all.
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I used WINE, in conjunction with the stand alone (totally separate from MPLab) MPLabIPE. I could also use the NSDSP programmer this way. The Microchip/NSDSP programs being native to macOS (a Linux version of NSDSP is available too, I can't say for MPLabIPE) provide the USB support, and WINE provided the SynWrite/GCB support. For Arduino AVRDude AVRDudess are crossplatform and provide standalone programability of most Atmel processors.
Of course if you don't like the idea of using WINE (with it's lack of USB support) give VirtualBOX or QEMU a try and install Windows.
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What it needs is a youtube type video of 2 people. 1 using win and 1 using linux and watching the results of installing gcb.
Anyone can be the win user...well.. but who would the linux user be?
answers on a postcard etc.
It would be comical.
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I just read that pickitplus for linux is comming soon (right evan?) Maybe that would work with wine? Seems like these guys might be the solution. Though I can see why linux users would avoid wine if possible, I certainly avoid GTK if I can.
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I gave up upgrading Windows 7 to 10 due to hardware specs. Instead, I installed Debian Buster with Raspberry Pi Desktop.
Also, I have an old Mac mini (mid 2007) with same Debian Buster RPD.
Debian RPD is a strange distribution: linux kernel is 64bit but almost all libraries and packages are 32bit, therefore 64bit applications cannot run on it.
If Linux Pic Kit Plus supports 32bit OS, it will be "A New Hope" to me, because Microchip's MPLABX will drop 32bit OS support from version 4.0.
(My main machines are Macs running Catalina: of course Mac version of GCB is installed on them.)
Last edit: cosy 2020-01-07
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Anobium-"Our plan. There will be a 32-bit Linux exe and a 64-bit Linux exe. These will be entirely separate builds. We will sell as one user license."
Why are you now selling open source software for open source os?
Is gcb going to be a free limited trial soon, ie works with a few pics etc for 30 days ?
I paid for pickitplus although I use arduino for most projects...it was a way of saying thanks for gcb.
If I paid for a basic compiler for pic I'd want it to program 32 bit pics.
Even the arduino ide has support for 32bit boards. I got one but no good at C.
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Stan... the context was from the previous post, see here, regarding PICkitPlus NOTHING TO DO WITH Great Cow BASIC.
Anobium-"Our plan. There will be a 32-bit Linux exe and a 64-bit Linux exe. These will be entirely separate builds. We will sell as one user license."
Why are you now selling open source software for open source os?
No. This is was talking about PICKitPlus.
Is gcb going to be a free limited trial soon, ie works with a few pics etc for 30 days ?
No. This is was talking about PICKitPlus.
I paid for pickitplus although I use arduino for most projects...it was a way of saying thanks for gcb.
If I paid for a basic compiler for pic I'd want it to program 32 bit pics.
Even the arduino ide has support for 32bit boards. I got one but no good at C.
The context was about PICkitPlus which is a programming solution not a compiler.
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Sorry I misunderstood. Had an email from you about pickitautowatch.
My thoughts were gcb is going to be non free altogether.
I also thought as gcb is so difficult to install on linux that you were selling an easy install.
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Re Linux and Great Cow BASIC. Not my field of expertise. Others are better than I on this subject.
Re PiCkitPlus and Linux. It will be easy to install.
So why is installing gcb on linux a bad dream but pickitplus will be easy?
Re Linux and Great Cow BASIC. Not my field of expertise. Others are better than I on this subject.
So how do you know it will be easy?
Have you ever used linux? It can be nice then it can be difficult.
I am adapting to win 10 and tweaking for speed. It is supposed to be the last version of windows...so best get used to it.
It uses more pc ram/cpu than win 7 but we all supposed to have modern pc.
I liked win 7 more than win 10,
,,,,and yet I liked linux mint cinnamon ide....can't please some people :)
gbc and win 10 no problems to report.
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We have a nice community.
I think the people who created and maintain gcb would want as many users as possible and it become more popular.
It seems the linux distro assumes that the user is competant using their os.
The windows distro assumes you're thick so it's automated for you.
Is gcb 32bit only or is there a win 64bit version?
I'm not so sure that the Windows version assumes you are 'thick'. The advantage that Windows has had over the last twenty five years or more is one of (relative) stability in the codebase, and one of near total backwards compatibility. Programs that I wrote to target Windows '95 still run in 2020 on Windows 10. That is not the case for almost any other operating system. Certainly not macOS which would have been running System 7 on the Motorola 68000, before the PowerPC versions, and well before OS-X, Intel processors or macOS, nor I suspect any Linux distribution from 1995. OS/2? If you could get it to run on a modern PC (or indeed any PC, I never got it to run. Ever.) it might run programs written for it but that is because it never progressed much past version 1.
That stability makes life much simpler for anyone writing programs for it and gives them a massive advantage. That in turn means that what works on one PC installation has a high chance of working on the next, and the next, and the next, and the next... Something that Linux distributions can only dream of. Were all Linux distributions to collaborate with one another, I don't doubt it could clean up, but it's fragmentation is it's own worst enemy. If GCB were to target (for example) Linux Mint 19.3, it could be possible to create a single, 'clickable' download and install. But it might not work in Knoppix, or Ubuntu, or even Linux Mint XFCE, maybe not Linux Mint 20.0. Which is a shame.
Since were not accessing more than 2 gigs of memory, it's pretty pointless to invest the time and energy into doing 64 bit. It won't make it faster, but it would make it bigger.
The macOS version of GCB is 64 bit, but only because it has to be because Catalina dropped all support for 32 bit applications.
I am a Mac user. I could account for a large number of the downloads on the graph too! I have tried to 'streamline' the installations on my two machines to make upgrading the GCB compiler easier which took a few installation attempts and a number of downloads to succeed.
I am in debt to the kindness of everyone who works on GCB and the macOS binaries.
I use GCB not only here at home for my own projects, but at work too. Both 'computers' I use are Macs. Last year at work we made PCBs for various machines that we manufacture, maintain or upgrade. Of those boards, all that have a processor on them will have had every line of that code written on, and then programmed with, that Mac and the NSDSP programmer. This January we are launching a new machine for which the design and code (for four processors) has all been done on that Mac.
However, I realise that I am in the minority and that I should not (and indeed, do not) expect the world to stop using Windows and shift to Macs. It is my choice to do so, and if things don't work as slickly on the Mac as they do on Windows, well, I can live with that. I initially managed to do my work running a full Virtual Machine with a copy of XP on it. As I progressed, I found time to get SynWrite and the GCB to run under WINE. Finally I sat down one Bank Holiday and managed to compile a Mac binary compiler of my own. [Although shortly after, it was done much better by @Trev] I have been able to get the Geany editor to work in a way that suits my way of thinking in a fashion too. All of this just because I'm bloody minded about not wanting to use Windows!
So, although I am pitifully grateful for all the work that is added to the GCB workload to create the Mac 'port', I wouldn't want any of the developers to feel obliged to pander to a minority. Windows has, by far, the largest audience and surely 99.99% of the effort should be targeted towards Windows? Those of us who insist on being outside of the mainstream may have to do a little more in the way of self help. I can live with that.
Last edit: mkstevo 2020-01-06
Excellent. Thank you for the feedback. That's enough for me to want to put effort into supporting macs. Too bad wine doesn't work better, it would make this all much easier.
WINE for me worked very well. I had issues with the AutoComplete crashing SynWrite, once I turned that off it worked well. I couldn't integrate the programmer with WINE as it has little (no?) support for USB devices.
I'm most grateful to all who work on GCB, and if clever people are kind enough to assist in creating native macOS binaries, especially grateful.
Thanks to all.
I thought wine would be good until I found it had no usb support.
I used WINE, in conjunction with the stand alone (totally separate from MPLab) MPLabIPE. I could also use the NSDSP programmer this way. The Microchip/NSDSP programs being native to macOS (a Linux version of NSDSP is available too, I can't say for MPLabIPE) provide the USB support, and WINE provided the SynWrite/GCB support. For Arduino AVRDude AVRDudess are crossplatform and provide standalone programability of most Atmel processors.
Of course if you don't like the idea of using WINE (with it's lack of USB support) give VirtualBOX or QEMU a try and install Windows.
What it needs is a youtube type video of 2 people. 1 using win and 1 using linux and watching the results of installing gcb.
Anyone can be the win user...well.. but who would the linux user be?
answers on a postcard etc.
It would be comical.
I just read that pickitplus for linux is comming soon (right evan?) Maybe that would work with wine? Seems like these guys might be the solution. Though I can see why linux users would avoid wine if possible, I certainly avoid GTK if I can.
Linux is next in the pipeline for PicKitPlus. I will work with anyone willing to test.
I gave up upgrading Windows 7 to 10 due to hardware specs. Instead, I installed Debian Buster with Raspberry Pi Desktop.
Also, I have an old Mac mini (mid 2007) with same Debian Buster RPD.
Debian RPD is a strange distribution: linux kernel is 64bit but almost all libraries and packages are 32bit, therefore 64bit applications cannot run on it.
If Linux Pic Kit Plus supports 32bit OS, it will be "A New Hope" to me, because Microchip's MPLABX will drop 32bit OS support from version 4.0.
(My main machines are Macs running Catalina: of course Mac version of GCB is installed on them.)
Last edit: cosy 2020-01-07
Our plan. There will be a 32-bit Linux exe and a 64-bit Linux exe. These will be entirely separate builds. We will sell as one user license.
We are testing that a 32-bit version will work on a 64-bit system. It may well not.
I will be asking for Beta testers very shortly in two weeks - we are focused on getting PickitAutoWatch for Windows out the door.
Anobium-"Our plan. There will be a 32-bit Linux exe and a 64-bit Linux exe. These will be entirely separate builds. We will sell as one user license."
Why are you now selling open source software for open source os?
Is gcb going to be a free limited trial soon, ie works with a few pics etc for 30 days ?
I paid for pickitplus although I use arduino for most projects...it was a way of saying thanks for gcb.
If I paid for a basic compiler for pic I'd want it to program 32 bit pics.
Even the arduino ide has support for 32bit boards. I got one but no good at C.
Stan... the context was from the previous post, see here, regarding PICkitPlus NOTHING TO DO WITH Great Cow BASIC.
No. This is was talking about PICKitPlus.
No. This is was talking about PICKitPlus.
The context was about PICkitPlus which is a programming solution not a compiler.
Sorry I misunderstood. Had an email from you about pickitautowatch.
My thoughts were gcb is going to be non free altogether.
I also thought as gcb is so difficult to install on linux that you were selling an easy install.
Great Cow BASIC and PickitAutoWatch are very different things.
Great Cow BASIC is Open Source. And, unless there is a revolution. It will remain that way.
Re Linux and Great Cow BASIC. Not my field of expertise. Others are better than I on this subject.
Re PiCkitPlus and Linux. It will be easy to install.
Re Linux and Great Cow BASIC. Not my field of expertise. Others are better than I on this subject.
Re PiCkitPlus and Linux. It will be easy to install.
So why is installing gcb on linux a bad dream but pickitplus will be easy?
Re Linux and Great Cow BASIC. Not my field of expertise. Others are better than I on this subject.
So how do you know it will be easy?
Have you ever used linux? It can be nice then it can be difficult.
I am adapting to win 10 and tweaking for speed. It is supposed to be the last version of windows...so best get used to it.
It uses more pc ram/cpu than win 7 but we all supposed to have modern pc.
I liked win 7 more than win 10,
,,,,and yet I liked linux mint cinnamon ide....can't please some people :)
gbc and win 10 no problems to report.