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From: Jan E. <ch...@in...> - 2003-06-05 08:29:52
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On Thu, 5 Jun 2003, Nalin Savara wrote: >Hi, > >This is Nalin Savara here. > >I"ve just created a network on Ryze.com (see: http://www.ryze.com ) which is >a premier business network site that's called "GameDevPros" or the "Game >Development Professionals Network" to serve as an online meeting place for >game development professionals of all backgrounds to network, meet and >discuss and exchange ideas and opportunities and support each other in >meeting challenges. Pointing my browser to http://www.ryze.com/ I saw nothing that had anything to do with games, not even a single mention of the word "game". Seems to just be some kind of blog. Seems you also *must* register to get anything. Avoid. -- Crowley was in Hell's bad books. Not that Hell has any other kind. -- Terry Pratchett & Neil Gaiman, Good Omens |
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From: Nalin S. <ns...@vs...> - 2003-06-05 08:02:23
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Hi, This is Nalin Savara here. I"ve just created a network on Ryze.com (see: http://www.ryze.com ) = which is a premier business network site that's called "GameDevPros" or the "Game Development Professionals Network" to serve as an online meeting place = for game development professionals of all backgrounds to network, meet and discuss and exchange ideas and opportunities and support each other in meeting challenges. Right now, it's somewhat small, since I've just created it; but your participation I guess is the only thing it's waiting for. Do check it out and become part of it. This network has game designers, programmers, digital artists, = animators, producers, audio engineers, and management & marketing specialists as members. This is where experts feed their minds with ideas, discussions = and contacts and discuss new gaming methods, technologies and business = models. Regards, Nalin Savara CEO and Technical Director, Darksun Technologies Pvt Ltd. http://www.darksuntech.com ns...@da... Ph: +91-9811109407 |
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From: Parveen K. <pk...@al...> - 2003-02-25 00:06:54
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On Mon, 2003-02-24 at 15:02, Brian Hook wrote: > I'm trying to do some basic research on the relative performance of=20 > threading implementations of the various like-Unix operating systems.=20 > There's a lot of conventional wisdom out there that Linux's=20 > threading implementation sucks, and that both Solaris and Irix have=20 > significantly superior implementations. >=20 There are two issues here. Creating threads and switching between threads. The new scheduler and pthread library is supposed to help. http://kerneltrap.org/node.php?id=3D422 For some anecdotal, non-scientific impressions. My friend and I both run Gentoo boxes with comparable processors and RAM. Gentoo provides 2.4 kernel sources with the new scheduler patched in. I use the new scheduler my friend does not. I don't have to fool around with nice and renice when I'm compiling apps in the background. KDE is still responsive when top claims that the CPU is running at 100%. However, this is on the desktop and I get the impression that you will be using this box as a server. > So, does anyone know the state of thread support on these operating=20 > systems or can someone point to a decent analysis of the relative=20 > pros/cons. An entry level 1U Sparc server is only $1000, and used=20 > Irix boxes aren't too horribly expensive, so I think cost isn't going=20 > to be that big a factor. Apache claims that they can fill a 10Mbps connection with something ridiculously slow as a P133. But you'll need something faster if you're gonna use php, perl or something else. Being in the game industry, there are advantages in choosing Linux. You can run UT and Quake servers. Sorry, that I couldn't be more helpful. What services are you wanting to run? PK pk...@al... http://www.sfu.ca/~pkaler |
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From: Brian H. <ho...@py...> - 2003-02-24 23:02:12
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I'm trying to do some basic research on the relative performance= of threading implementations of the various like-Unix operating= systems. There's a lot of conventional wisdom out there that Linux's threading implementation sucks, and that both Solaris and Irix= have significantly superior implementations. Unfortunately, there seem to be a lot of "ifs/ands/buts" on this= (e.g. Solaris on x86 may or may not be good; Irix is dying; Linux= 2.6 kernel might address this; OS X's implementation is unknown but likely related to FreeBSD; FreeBSD 5.0 might address this; yadda= yadda yadda), and some light Googling hasn't netted me any really= comprehensive information that isn't woefully out of date or too= forward thinking (the next version of [insert OS] will be= better!). So, does anyone know the state of thread support on these= operating systems or can someone point to a decent analysis of the relative= pros/cons. An entry level 1U Sparc server is only $1000, and= used Irix boxes aren't too horribly expensive, so I think cost isn't= going to be that big a factor. Thanks, -Hook |
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From: Timothee B. <tt...@id...> - 2003-01-20 21:03:38
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Sweet! Exactly what I was looking for.. TTimo On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:38:04 +0100 "Marcelo E. Magallon" <mar...@bi...> wrote: > I'm sorry, sourceforge is being a bitch... > > On Mon, Jan 20, 2003 at 02:57:01PM +0100, Timothee Besset wrote: > > > - Even with an application grab of keyboard/mouse, I need to get a > > key combo through .. typically to a deamon. If the X server can't do > > that (which is why I was asking), I could probably get it through > > with sysctl at kernel level. > > Thou wish and thy gods shall grant... > > $ man XF86Config > > Option "AllowDeactivateGrabs" "boolean" > This option enables the use of the > Ctrl+Alt+Keypad-Divide key sequence to deactivate any > active keyboard and mouse grabs. Default: off. > > > - Once you *know* you need to release the grabs, how do you do it? Any way > > an X app can force a grab release on some other app? (That one might be > > harder to tackle) > > You can force an app to ungrab the pointer/keyboard by unmapping its > window. If you don't want to do that, you can just map an appropiate > window (override-something-or-another, can't remember) over the app. > > -- > Marcelo, betting this mail won't make it thru... > |
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From: Timothee B. <tt...@id...> - 2003-01-20 13:57:29
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I see two things required to achieve what I want: - Even with an application grab of keyboard/mouse, I need to get a key combo through .. typically to a deamon. If the X server can't do that (which is why I was asking), I could probably get it through with sysctl at kernel level. - Once you *know* you need to release the grabs, how do you do it? Any way an X app can force a grab release on some other app? (That one might be harder to tackle) TTimo On Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:08:11 -0700 "D. Stimits" <st...@at...> wrote: > Timothee Besset wrote: > > > Hey everyone > > > > I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. > > Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so > > that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing > > mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long > > load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. > > > You might be able to do something that fakes it. There is a rather old > but fun utility program you can look at to see what I'm talking about, > called x2x. It simply allows a pointer device and keyboard from a 2nd > X11 machine to take control of the first machine, but not interfere with > the mouse/keyboard of the first machine. It is sort of a poor man's > version of Xinerama across two machines, without the copy/paste or other > nice things of Xinerama. Basically, even if you can't alter the one > device (and you might be able to, I don't know), perhaps you could > create two virtual pointer devices, and have the hardware switch which > device it talks to at the moment (this would require that mouse and > keyboard device events are what are grabbed, and *not* the pointer > itself...if the pointer is free to do what it likes, and the > mouse/keyboard bindings are not, then tell your mouse/keyboard to attach > to a different virtual device which is not limited). Only the first > device would have the grab events applied to it. See: > http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/DEC/SRC/x2x/ > > D. Stimits, stimits AT attbi DOT com > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: FREE SSL Guide from Thawte > are you planning your Web Server Security? Click here to get a FREE > Thawte SSL guide and find the answers to all your SSL security issues. > http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0026en > _______________________________________________ > Gamedevlists-linux mailing list > Gam...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-linux > Archives: > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=554 > |
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From: D. S. <st...@at...> - 2003-01-19 22:06:39
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Timothee Besset wrote: > Hey everyone > > I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. > Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so > that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing > mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long > load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. You might be able to do something that fakes it. There is a rather old but fun utility program you can look at to see what I'm talking about, called x2x. It simply allows a pointer device and keyboard from a 2nd X11 machine to take control of the first machine, but not interfere with the mouse/keyboard of the first machine. It is sort of a poor man's version of Xinerama across two machines, without the copy/paste or other nice things of Xinerama. Basically, even if you can't alter the one device (and you might be able to, I don't know), perhaps you could create two virtual pointer devices, and have the hardware switch which device it talks to at the moment (this would require that mouse and keyboard device events are what are grabbed, and *not* the pointer itself...if the pointer is free to do what it likes, and the mouse/keyboard bindings are not, then tell your mouse/keyboard to attach to a different virtual device which is not limited). Only the first device would have the grab events applied to it. See: http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/DEC/SRC/x2x/ D. Stimits, stimits AT attbi DOT com |
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From: Sam L. <sl...@de...> - 2003-01-19 20:29:26
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> Hey everyone > I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. > Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so > that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing > mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long > load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. Not that I know of. -Sam Lantinga, Software Engineer, Blizzard Entertainment |
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From: Timothee B. <tt...@id...> - 2003-01-19 15:30:12
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Not using SDL. It's not an interesting option for us. TTimo On Sun, 19 Jan 2003 10:18:53 -0500 "Thatcher Ulrich" <tu...@tu...> wrote: > On Jan 19, 2003 at 02:49 +0100, Timothee Besset wrote: > > Hey everyone > > > > I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. > > Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so > > that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing > > mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long > > load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. > > I don't have an answer, but I'm curious: are you using SDL? Once I > started using SDL I (gladly) forgot all the X I had learned. > > -- > Thatcher Ulrich > http://tulrich.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: FREE SSL Guide from Thawte > are you planning your Web Server Security? Click here to get a FREE > Thawte SSL guide and find the answers to all your SSL security issues. > http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0026en > _______________________________________________ > Gamedevlists-linux mailing list > Gam...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-linux > Archives: > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=554 > |
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From: Thatcher U. <tu...@tu...> - 2003-01-19 15:23:02
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On Jan 19, 2003 at 02:49 +0100, Timothee Besset wrote: > Hey everyone > > I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. > Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so > that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing > mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long > load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. I don't have an answer, but I'm curious: are you using SDL? Once I started using SDL I (gladly) forgot all the X I had learned. -- Thatcher Ulrich http://tulrich.com |
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From: Timothee B. <tt...@id...> - 2003-01-19 13:49:52
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Hey everyone I am playing with X keyboard/mouse grabs stuff for our next game. Wondering if there's a way to configure the X server (or anything else) so that even with the grabs on in the game you could do a key combo forcing mouse/keyboard release on the application? For instance during a long load, or on a gdb breakpoint etc. TTimo |
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From: Tom H. <to...@3d...> - 2002-11-08 03:58:08
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Hi again folks! As of this email, we're changing over the following mailing lists to reply-to-list: gdalgorithms gd-consoles gd-design gd-general gd-linux gd-windows A vote was conducted on the algorithms list since that has the highest number of subscribers (~2000) and most of the people on the other lists are also on the algorithms list. Of the responses I got, 30 wanted us to change and 4 wanted us to stay the way we were. I haven't gotten another vote for 10 hours, so I figure that's probably all the votes we're going to get. Thanks for your time! Tom |
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From: <cas...@ya...> - 2002-10-28 02:05:25
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From: Ryan C. G. <ic...@cl...> - 2002-05-10 16:32:56
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> I would send the signal by doing something like this: > pthread_t threadId_; > pthread_kill( threadId_, SIGKILL ); > > (Kill actually kills my entire process not just the target thread). > > Any ideas on the signal to use? Hhmm...threads should be separate processes, so I didn't think it would affect the signalling thread. Still, SIGKILL can't be blocked/ignored/handled, so you shouldn't be using that anyhow. You could try using signal() and setting up a do-nothing signal handler for each thread when it first starts executing. After that, SIGALRM is probably a good candidate. (Hypothetically, you could just have the thread call alarm() before the blocking recv(), and if you get the signal, see if it's time to shutdown, otherwise, reset the alarm() and go back to recv() again...that may or may not be less ugly, depending on what your design looks like. If this is all too hackish for you, you could consider using select() with the socket and polling for new data before calling recv(), which will also avoid the blocking behaviour. --ryan. |
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From: Hal A. <ha...@cl...> - 2002-05-10 14:08:52
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I saw EINTR in the man pages - I couldn't figure out which signal to the thread though. I would send the signal by doing something like this: pthread_t threadId_; pthread_kill( threadId_, SIGKILL ); (Kill actually kills my entire process not just the target thread). Any ideas on the signal to use? -----Original Message----- From: gam...@li... [mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of Ryan C. Gordon Sent: 10 May 2002 14:49 To: gam...@li... Subject: Re: [GD-Linux] Cancelling blocking recv calls on Linux > Anybody got anything better or is this infact the correct way to use > blocking sockets with threads? Have you tried sending a signal to the blocked thread? When you do, recv() should return -1 and set errno to EINTR. From there the thread can check a global variable or something that symbolizes that the system is shutting down, and exit cleanly if it's set. --ryan. _______________________________________________________________ Have big pipes? SourceForge.net is looking for download mirrors. We supply the hardware. You get the recognition. Email Us: ban...@so... _______________________________________________ Gamedevlists-linux mailing list Gam...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-linux Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=554 |
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From: Ryan C. G. <ic...@cl...> - 2002-05-10 13:44:58
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> Anybody got anything better or is this infact the correct way to use > blocking sockets with threads? Have you tried sending a signal to the blocked thread? When you do, recv() should return -1 and set errno to EINTR. From there the thread can check a global variable or something that symbolizes that the system is shutting down, and exit cleanly if it's set. --ryan. |
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From: Hal A. <ha...@cl...> - 2002-05-10 11:27:51
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I wonder if anybody else has run into this and come up with a satisfactory solution. Part of my app uses TCP with blocking BSD sockets. Each "accept"ed connection has its own thread which simply recv's data and pumps it into the main thread. This all works fine and dandy on Linux and Windows. The problem comes when it comes to disconnecting the socket. The worker thread will generally be blocked at the recv call and so the main thread has to somehow overcome this - under WinSock1.1 a simple combination of shutdown( fd_, RD_BOTH ); // fd_ is the file descriptor of the socket. WSACancelBlockingCall(); // (this is Winsock 1.1 so this call is fine). Will cause the recv to immediately fail and the worker thread to terminate and so the call to closesocket( fd_ ) doesn't lock and everything is great. Under linux I use shutdown( fd_, SHUT_RDWR ) followed by close( fd_ ). This close then locks - the recv call never returns. I've tried: Setting the socket to non-blocking just before the close (i.e. it will already be involved in a recv call). My current solution is to use pthread_cancel to cancel the recv thread. This terminates the recv and the close then works fine. Anybody got anything better or is this infact the correct way to use blocking sockets with threads? |
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From: Timothee B. <tt...@id...> - 2002-03-11 18:15:11
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Agreed We are making games, and games have to look sexy. They need good looking installers, because that's part of the package. I am happy that the average Linux gamer usually has a bit more knowledge about his system than the average win32 gamer. It makes bug tracking a bit easier (except for the fact that Linux is so heterogeneous that it has way more tricky issues than win32). But overall what we see on Q3 and mostly RTCW over the past few months, is that there are more and more 'newbie' Linux users/gamers, which really rely on very easy-to-setup installers. And they use RH 7.2 or Mandrake 8 obviously ... and this is GOOD. TTimo -- Linux technology contractor - Id software inc. On Mon, 25 Feb 2002 23:21:51 -0800 Brian Hook <bri...@py...> wrote: > At 03:48 PM 2/27/2002 -0600, Steve Baker wrote: > >Cute. Not something I'd pay actual money for though. > > We don't expect most Linux user to pay money for it, actually, but we're > hoping that we can engender enough good will that hardcore Linux types will > actually tell their friends and relatives that use one of the other > operating systems we support (OS X, Windows, MacOS) to check it out. > > We've even got a BeOS version coming out =) > > Thanks for the pointer to happypenguin.org, going there right now! > > Brian > > > _______________________________________________ > Gamedevlists-linux mailing list > Gam...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gamedevlists-linux > Archives: > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=554 > |
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From: Vincent Penquerc'h <Vin...@ar...> - 2002-03-11 18:02:11
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> > Why don't people complain that there isn't a unified way to do > > ANYTHING in Linux instead? That would solve the problem much > > better...we could remove half of SDL's code, and 75% of the > > installer system. > > Evolutionary systems don't norm towards such standards until the > respective areas have become so entrenched as to no longer be > (significantly) subject to evolutionary forces. Or more simply: > norming happens when the potential value of norming to the > individual exceeds the perceived value of differentiation. Indeed. About the top comment, I'm not too sure it is the right question. In fact, the perceived unified way of doing things in Win32 is only that, perceived. There are a number of installation programs that work in a very similar way. Much of it is because the majority of users are not computer specialists. They thus need something that gets the job done and don't care how it does so. They would be very happy if the underlying program mangled their filesystem, provided it did work. Programmers, on the other hand, routinely deal with the filesystem or other areas of a computer the typical Windows user would not use, or only when unable to do otherwise. I then understand that one doesn't like a given way of doing things, like a non technical computer user would not like an installation program to, say, put some icons in the wrong menu, or something. For instance, I don't like how the Windows installation programs default to spamming the c:\Program\ Files directory, or tend to put data in strange places within the filesystem tree (this may have changed with XP which apparently really handles users), etc. But to many users, these things do not matter. That's just system internals. Linux users just tend to have more programmers and technical people. They also have more whiners (I know, I'm one) too, I grant you :) But all this to say that I don't think the question is the right one. The lack of a standard way is caused by the lack of a good one way that could become a standard. For now. -- Vincent Penquerc'h |
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From: Brian H. <bri...@py...> - 2002-03-11 17:58:36
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At 09:44 AM 3/11/2002 -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
>script that does the actual install. Simple, small, fast, and most
>decidedly not GUI (which I prefer but you may not).
One thing to consider is that the notion of "Linux users are hardcore" is
slowly becoming outmoded. With distros like RH and Mandrake that are
targeting ease of use and installation, Linux is become more appealing to
people that actually need it for other reasons than "to tinker with". For
example, I know several Windows oriented types that are using Linux because
certain tools they need are only available on that system.
I fall pretty staunchly under that classification. I'm using Mandrake 8.1,
and while I wish I understood the fundamentals of the distro mechanism
better, I'm definitely appreciative of the fact that I didn't need to
configure the X server myself. RPM package management through a
centralized software installer has pretty much hidden all the nastiness tar
-xvf and chmod from me. Selecting "Workstation", "Developer", and "Office"
when I installed just to make sure that gcc, make, cvs, etc. were installed
instead of doing all that manually was also a lifesaver.
So I'm a Linux user, but I only know enough to do the simplest
stuff. Sure, I learn a bit more every day as I try to win a battle of
wills with it ("GODDAMIT, YOU WILL SWAP CAPS-LOCK AND CONTROL OR YOU WILL
DIE!"), but by and large if I don't NEED to know something about it, then I
don't WANT to know something about it.
In a way, I'm just trying to make my Linux box feel as much like Unix as OS
X (sadly enough, on OS X you still need to know quite a bit about Unix if
you need to do stuff though).
So when Linux apps are brain dead simple to install, that helps out Linux
(because it reduces alienation from new users).
Brian
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From: J C L. <cl...@ka...> - 2002-03-11 17:44:07
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On Tue, 26 Feb 2002 18:56:00 -0500 (EST) Ryan C Gordon <ic...@cl...> wrote: > ...but if it was a ten meg game with a one meg installer, it would > be alright, apparently. I like the BitKeeper installer -- IIRC its essentially a tiny binary that unshars/uncompresses itself under /tmp to then reveal a shell script that does the actual install. Simple, small, fast, and most decidedly not GUI (which I prefer but you may not). -- J C Lawrence ---------(*) Satan, oscillate my metallic sonatas. cl...@ka... He lived as a devil, eh? http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Evil is a name of a foeman, as I live. |
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From: J C L. <cl...@ka...> - 2002-03-11 17:38:59
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On Tue, 26 Feb 2002 16:22:50 -0500 (EST) Ryan C Gordon <ic...@cl...> wrote: > Why don't people complain that there isn't a unified way to do > ANYTHING in Linux instead? That would solve the problem much > better...we could remove half of SDL's code, and 75% of the > installer system. Evolutionary systems don't norm towards such standards until the respective areas have become so entrenched as to no longer be (significantly) subject to evolutionary forces. Or more simply: norming happens when the potential value of norming to the individual exceeds the perceived value of differentiation. -- J C Lawrence ---------(*) Satan, oscillate my metallic sonatas. cl...@ka... He lived as a devil, eh? http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Evil is a name of a foeman, as I live. |
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From: Mark C. <me...@th...> - 2002-02-27 13:58:58
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On Thursday 28 February 2002 9:23 pm, Steve Baker wrote: > I think the issue is/was whether the game itself was statically linked to > GTK. That would presumably be contary to the LGPL rules. > > I dunno - he just asked you a perfectly reasonable question - it wasn't an > accusation. I just don't think that's a reason to get into the whole "Why > the heck should we support Linux when people just complain" thing. Thanks Steve... Seeing as I'm going through The Book From Hell right now, I can quickly look at the LGPL (see, the 10% of licenses does have a use *grin*), and it forbids linking against closed source applications, and section 4 is the relevent clause here (you must include machine readable source with the distrobution), or offer equivilent access. Ryan informed us that the installer is statically linked, and as there is no note informing us about where to get the GTK source, this is a violation. It's not a major one, but there are probably some people out there who will make a big deal about it (I'm not, I was just trying to make you aware of a potential problem, which you took personally). I didn't intend to start a flamewar here (first time for everything, I guess), I was just trying to be helpful, and offer some constructibe criticisism (sp?) --- === Mark 'Nurgle' Collins Lead Author - Linux Game Programming (Premiere Press) Author - Advanced AI Game Development (WordWare) Email: me...@th... Phone: +44 7761 774 152 Email: nu...@is... Spam: sp...@th... |
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From: Ryan C. G. <ic...@cl...> - 2002-02-27 10:23:43
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> I haven't tried Candy Cruncher, but it seems like you've done a good job. > Something that would be nice to see on the site is a few screenshots, or > maybe I just missed them? There's one, with the Mac OS X and Win32 shots, on the main page (I think we posted the Linux-specific page earlier): http://www.pyrogon.com/games/candycruncher/index.php --ryan. |
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From: Jan E. <ch...@in...> - 2002-02-27 10:09:21
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On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, Ryan C. Gordon wrote:
>...but if it was a ten meg game with a one meg installer, it would be
>alright, apparently.
:)
When our game some day will be released I don't look forward to the
religious flames that will start. Right now we're close to a 20Mb
download, with a lot of graphics and audio still missing. Same people that
just downloaded a 400Mb Windows demo will most certainly whine about our
20Mb download... :)
--
And it came to pass that in time the Great God Om spake unto Brutha,
the Chosen One: "Psst!"
-- Terry Pratchett, Small Gods
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