gamedevlists-design

[GD-Design] Re: Gamedevlists-design digest, Vol 1 #38 - 10 msgs

[<ham...@tm...>]

on Wed, Feb 26, 2003 at 12:14:20PM -0800, gam...@li... wrote:
> Message: 8
> From: "Ivan-Assen Ivanov" <as...@ha...>
> 
> > A better example might be the aforementioned Combat Mission or CA's 
> > Medieval: Total War.  The Total War stuff has sold very, very well, 
> > and I think it's partly because it wasn't the same resource 
> > management RTS that everyone else has written a million times.
> 
> There is a fine line between making your game too similar in apparent
> gameplay
> to one of the classics, and making it too different so that no reviewer
> gets it in the 30 or so minutes he is able to devote.
> As our lead designer put it after the first few reviews, "No more
> *different*
> games from me".
> We've seen wildly varying reviews - people who "got it" and played the
> game
> we play, and people who didnt "get it" and play a vastly different,
> shallow and bland game. (Of course, the blame for this sits squarely on
> us, not them.) For that matter, we've seen reviews which say
> "great multiplayer/skirmish mode, but the single-player is a totally
> lame, boring attempt at an RPG" AND reviews which say
> "great single-player missions, but the multiplayer/skirmish mode
> is a totally lame standard RTS". We got good scores both from
> people who obviously had played the game for 5 minutes (probably
> due to good marketing on part of our publishers), and from people who
> understood it; however, most of the bad scores we got were from
> reviewers who judged the game completely superficially
> (what, 2D graphics? only two races? shallow tech tree? must be bad).
> 
> Maybe in the long term, it's gameplay that matters. But for good
> reviews in the initial period, you need not only glitzy technology,
> but also very accessible gameplay. No one cares if two of your advanced
> units form a very interesting symbiotic combination in the endspiel,
> or if there's a great scripted sequence after the incredibly difficult
> mission 8. The game must be obviously good, not just good.
>

Can you recall which reviewers gave the lazy reviews? Personally, if/when
the situation arises, I'd like to do my best to keep review copies out of
the hands of useless reviewers. I understand that you typically feel you
can't afford to reduce the amount of exposure you get, but if these people
aren't doing their job properly (perhaps includes people who don't even know
how to do their job properly?) and they're doing more harm than good, then
it's time to cut them out, surely? I'd have nothing against an honest, but
negative review (depressing, but...) - but a review that shows someone has
just been a lazy **** is another thing entirely... 

Re: [GD-Design] Re: Gamedevlists-design digest, Vol 1 #38 - 10 msgs

[Brian H. <ho...@py...>]

>Can you recall which reviewers gave the lazy reviews? 

There's no way you can really cull the bad reviewers out.  There=
 are 
many reasons for this:

- the biases of individual reviewers often change

- if they find out they've been blacklisted, they'll often=
 publicly 
accuse the developer or publisher of knowing that they'll give an=
 
"honest" review and thus this is obviously favoritism

- often review copies are handed out by publishers without the 
knowledge or consent of the developer

- review copies are often given to a magazine or a publisher or a=
 Web 
site, without knowing ahead of time which individual reviewer=
 will 
receive a copy

The fact of the matter is that the popularity of the Web has=
 allowed 
any idiot that knows FrontPage to throw up a Web site and have an=
 
opinion that someone will listen to.  Such is life, you just have=
 to 
hope that there are more level-headed, intelligent reviewers out=
 
there than dishonest, lazy and disinterested ones.

Brian

Re: [GD-Design] Dealing with the media

[Javier A. <ja...@py...>]

Brian,

You are absolutely right; dealing with the media in general (not just
reviewers) is a serious problem, and you have to take it very seriously.
Just yesterday, a national TV channel came to the office to film some
minute-long blurb about "Praetorians". They were not exactly professional...
one of the questions they asked our FMV team was "Which movie did you base
this off?" The natural answer was "Inspired by many, not one in particular",
but such answer didn't fit their "editorial approach", which they felt was
clearer to the audience if they could give something more concrete.

Obviously, we didn't want Praetorians to appear on TV as some kind of
unnofficial version of Gladiator. We had an argument with them, and among
the stuff mentioned was the idea that we preferred to forego such an
appearance on TV if we felt that the portray of the game was not accurate.
They couldn't understand that simple concept (after all, everyone wants to
be on TV, right?), and so kept arguing the point, accusing us of intrusion
and so on...

We have had journalists come over to one of our presentations, and tell us
that they didn't like RTS games anyway (I guess they _do_ like spending a
couple days in Rome or wherever, though).

We have had work-in-progress articles complain about lack of balance despite
the fact that we told them "game code is pretty much complete, we're now
starting the balancing and QA process which will take several months." They
were just angry they had lost while playing the preview code.

This kind of thing happens all the time, and you have to be ready for it.
There is a fine line between being strict and being offensive, and most
media types are offended by anything that does not go according to their
wishes. In the end, you really appreciate having PR specialists take care of
all this, nurturing the relationship with the media, but you must keep them
on their toes and remind them that they are on YOUR side.

That said, I wouldn't care much about "idiots with FrontPage". Yes they may
be annoying, but the truth is, they tend to attract idiots.

Finally, I would like to remind everyone of how important it is to have a
good digital signature system for your preview versions (oh and make it
batchable, so signing 80+ code builds is a no-brainer!). If you can keep the
signature tool out of the hands of your publisher, you may have the
opportunity of knowing exactly which versions have been sent, when and to
whom.

  Javier Arevalo
  Pyro Studios

Brian Hook wrote:
>> Can you recall which reviewers gave the lazy reviews?
>
> There's no way you can really cull the bad reviewers out.  There are
> many reasons for this:
>
> - the biases of individual reviewers often change
>
> - if they find out they've been blacklisted, they'll often publicly
> accuse the developer or publisher of knowing that they'll give an
> "honest" review and thus this is obviously favoritism
>
> - often review copies are handed out by publishers without the
> knowledge or consent of the developer
>
> - review copies are often given to a magazine or a publisher or a Web
> site, without knowing ahead of time which individual reviewer will
> receive a copy
>
> The fact of the matter is that the popularity of the Web has allowed
> any idiot that knows FrontPage to throw up a Web site and have an
> opinion that someone will listen to.  Such is life, you just have to
> hope that there are more level-headed, intelligent reviewers out
> there than dishonest, lazy and disinterested ones.

RE: [GD-Design] Dealing with the media

[Jamie F. <ja...@qu...>]

Sadly, the best way i've seen of dealing with media folk in general is show
them around the studio, don't show them too much, then take them down the
pubs and clubs and get them totally s**t-faced.

Jamie

-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
Javier Arevalo
Sent: 27 February 2003 09:40
To: gam...@li...
Subject: Re: [GD-Design] Dealing with the media


Brian,

You are absolutely right; dealing with the media in general (not just
reviewers) is a serious problem, and you have to take it very seriously.
Just yesterday, a national TV channel came to the office to film some
minute-long blurb about "Praetorians". They were not exactly professional...
one of the questions they asked our FMV team was "Which movie did you base
this off?" The natural answer was "Inspired by many, not one in particular",
but such answer didn't fit their "editorial approach", which they felt was
clearer to the audience if they could give something more concrete.

Obviously, we didn't want Praetorians to appear on TV as some kind of
unnofficial version of Gladiator. We had an argument with them, and among
the stuff mentioned was the idea that we preferred to forego such an
appearance on TV if we felt that the portray of the game was not accurate.
They couldn't understand that simple concept (after all, everyone wants to
be on TV, right?), and so kept arguing the point, accusing us of intrusion
and so on...

We have had journalists come over to one of our presentations, and tell us
that they didn't like RTS games anyway (I guess they _do_ like spending a
couple days in Rome or wherever, though).

We have had work-in-progress articles complain about lack of balance despite
the fact that we told them "game code is pretty much complete, we're now
starting the balancing and QA process which will take several months." They
were just angry they had lost while playing the preview code.

This kind of thing happens all the time, and you have to be ready for it.
There is a fine line between being strict and being offensive, and most
media types are offended by anything that does not go according to their
wishes. In the end, you really appreciate having PR specialists take care of
all this, nurturing the relationship with the media, but you must keep them
on their toes and remind them that they are on YOUR side.

That said, I wouldn't care much about "idiots with FrontPage". Yes they may
be annoying, but the truth is, they tend to attract idiots.

Finally, I would like to remind everyone of how important it is to have a
good digital signature system for your preview versions (oh and make it
batchable, so signing 80+ code builds is a no-brainer!). If you can keep the
signature tool out of the hands of your publisher, you may have the
opportunity of knowing exactly which versions have been sent, when and to
whom.

  Javier Arevalo
  Pyro Studios

Brian Hook wrote:
>> Can you recall which reviewers gave the lazy reviews?
>
> There's no way you can really cull the bad reviewers out.  There are
> many reasons for this:
>
> - the biases of individual reviewers often change
>
> - if they find out they've been blacklisted, they'll often publicly
> accuse the developer or publisher of knowing that they'll give an
> "honest" review and thus this is obviously favoritism
>
> - often review copies are handed out by publishers without the
> knowledge or consent of the developer
>
> - review copies are often given to a magazine or a publisher or a Web
> site, without knowing ahead of time which individual reviewer will
> receive a copy
>
> The fact of the matter is that the popularity of the Web has allowed
> any idiot that knows FrontPage to throw up a Web site and have an
> opinion that someone will listen to.  Such is life, you just have to
> hope that there are more level-headed, intelligent reviewers out
> there than dishonest, lazy and disinterested ones.



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[GD-Design] FPS console controls

[Javier A. <ja...@py...>]

The issue of FPS controls in console games just came up in the algorithms
list, but it seems more appropriate here. People mentioned Halo and
Timesplitters as good examples (I personally disagree about TS), and Metroid
as a bad example. However, in Metroid the gameplay is well adapted to the
(limited) control scheme.

So, well, discuss...

  Javier Arevalo
  Pyro Studios

RE: [GD-Design] FPS console controls

[Jamie F. <ja...@qu...>]

I didn't go into detail on algorithms, but i like the Metroid control
system. It isn't an FPS control system, and the game's not an FPS :) I have
one niggle regarding the interaction of scanning and combat, though.

I still reckon the grandaddy is goldeneye :) halo worked well, timsplitters
i've not played much.

jamie


-----Original Message-----
From: gam...@li...
[mailto:gam...@li...]On Behalf Of
Javier Arevalo
Sent: 04 April 2003 15:48
To: gam...@li...
Subject: [GD-Design] FPS console controls


The issue of FPS controls in console games just came up in the algorithms
list, but it seems more appropriate here. People mentioned Halo and
Timesplitters as good examples (I personally disagree about TS), and Metroid
as a bad example. However, in Metroid the gameplay is well adapted to the
(limited) control scheme.

So, well, discuss...

  Javier Arevalo
  Pyro Studios



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