firebird-docs — chat stuff about documentation

Re: [Firebird-docs] Format documentation

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hi Frederic,

[ transportable backup format ]

> Yes, that's what I mean. Didn't find anything either in the sources,
> the docs, FirebirdSQL.org, IBPhoenix.com or various other sites in
> the ring, but maybe I didn't know how to look.

I can't find it either. Of course there must exist documents, but
they're probably at Borland. You might try their knowledgebase(s) but
maybe they didn't publish them.

If you don't find it there, or via a Google search, I think you should
ask in firebird-support and hope Ann Harrison has an answer. After
that, you may try *very politely* to ask your question in
firbird-devel or firebird-architect. These lists are not for support
questions but if you tried every other avenue and the information is
nowhere to be found, someone may help you there.

Failing that, all you can do is work through the source code to see
how it generates the backups.


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Format documentation

[FGM <fg...@os...>]

Hello Paul,

Yes, that's what I mean. Didn't find anything either in the sources, the
docs, FirebirdSQL.org, IBPhoenix.com or various other sites in the ring, but
maybe I didn't know how to look.

I also looked for a ODS specification, just to see if I was searching
properly, but didn't find anything either, so maybe I didn't search where I
should have: it seems strange that neither format has been specified.

> Subject: Re: [Firebird-docs] Format documentation
>
> Hello Frederic,
>
> > I have searched for a documentation of the (transportable) backup
> > format, but haven't been able to find one: even the burp sources do
> > not seem to make reference to a specification.
>
> You mean: the internal format of transportable backup files? Wouldn't
> know, have you done a search on www.ibphoenix.com? They have a lot of
> in-depth technical stuff.
>
> If you don't find it there, ask in firebird-support.
>
>
> Greetings,
> Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Format documentation

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hello Frederic,

> I have searched for a documentation of the (transportable) backup
> format, but haven't been able to find one: even the burp sources do
> not seem to make reference to a specification.

You mean: the internal format of transportable backup files? Wouldn't
know, have you done a search on www.ibphoenix.com? They have a lot of
in-depth technical stuff.

If you don't find it there, ask in firebird-support.


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

[Firebird-docs] Format documentation

[FGM <fg...@os...>]

Hello,

I have searched for a documentation of the (transportable) backup format,
but haven't been able to find one: even the burp sources do not seem to make
reference to a specification.

Is this documentation anywhere ?

Frederic

[Firebird-docs] user feedback

[Daniel U. <da...@se...>]

http://forums.devshed.com/showthread.php?p=638584#post638584
It's from firebird-website but it's also about fb documentation.

Best regards
Daniel Urban

[Firebird-docs] documentation wiki

[Daniel U. <da...@se...>]

For some weeks ago I've got an idea that we could run
a wiki page for firebird documentation
and invite everyone on FB newsgroups to help us
write the content for firebird documentation.
I think that it could be a good way to produce
documentation and involve much more people
e.g. developers.
Maybe we could use http://jaybirdwiki.firebirdsql.org/JayBirdHome
for start or I could run phpwiki (powered by FireBird) on
my company server.

Best regards
Daniel Urban

Re: [Firebird-docs] Hi

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hi Armando,

So you managed to subscribe after all? (I was just about to answer
your message in FFmembers when I saw this one appear).

> As you suggested, I subscribed to Firebird-docs. I'm willing to
> help, but I must admit this is an approach to writting that I never
> used before.

I was in the same situation when I joined the doc effort about 1,5
years ago. I'd never used DocBook and I really had to get used to it.
But I soon started to like it more and more.

> 1. Is there any global TOC so that we can pick up a subject from
> what is missing?

No, the TOC only contains the items that are really there. Anyway,
there have been some new developments during the last couple of days
that may lead to a change in our planning (certainly in mine):

- IBPhoenix are donating their QuickStart Guide to the project. This
  guide was already free, but (c) IBPhoenix. Author Helen Borrie is
  now writing an app to convert it to DocBook XML. Once that is done,
  we get the QSG in DocBook format and then it will be our job to
  update it to Firebird 1.5 and maintain it in the future. The
  QuickStart Guide is going to be part of the official Firebird
  release packages.

- Somewhere in the near future we'll also inherit the Using Firebird
  guide. This is a real monster so it'll give us a lot of work.

- IBPhoenix has an API Guide and an SQL Reference in the planning.
  These are *not* going to be free, but in light of our own situation
  (Michael Gloegl no time to work on SQL ref; myself barely started
  with API ref) it might be better to drop these items for now and
  work on other things: Reserved words list + Glossay, QuickStart
  Guide, Using Firebird... plus whatever other useful docs someone
  may come up with.


> 2. Would you agree if I tried to write a simple test text and send
> it to you or someone else just to check if I understood the way of
> working with docbook? (I never used it before).

Sure, you can send it to me. It doesn't even have to be a serious
Firebird-related text. Just try to use most of the basic elements:
chapter, sect1, sect2 (etc.), link, ulink, blockquote, emphasis,
filename, command, itemizedlist, orderedlist, variablelist,
programlisting, screen, note & friends, maybe a table... (see the
Docwriting Howto).

I do advise you to use XMLMind XML Editor, and then check the produced
DocBook source from time to time in a text editor (a disadvantage is
that you can't do that from within XXE). You can also write DocBook
XML directly in a text editor, but then you won't notice your mistakes
until you try to build a target.

Have you already checked out the existing docs from CVS? It may be
helpful to look at them as examples. The top document is
manual/src/docs/firebirddocs.xml, the individual docs are in
manual/src/docs/firebirddocs/*.xml


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

[Firebird-docs] Hi

[Armando H. <arm...@ac...>]

Hi Paul,

Paul Vinkenoog wrote:

>>4. User Documentation
> 
> 
>>Although I wrote 2 books on Delphi (in Portuguese), I never tried to
>>write user documentation on a product as complex as Firebird, but I
>>think I can give it a try. The difference between this topic and the
>>3 previous ones is that, for user documentation, I think it would be
>>preferable for me to try to write some before saying that you can
>>count on me for that.
> 
> 
> Looking at the way you write I have a very strong feeling that you can
> do this. But surely you could try it out by first writing e.g. a small
> task-oriented doc.
> 
> Could you please have a look at this page to get an idea of what we're
> trying to do, and how:
> 
>   http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php?op=devel&sub=doc
> 
> If you're interested to help, you can join the firebird-docs list -
> you'll find a link on the abovementioned page.


As you suggested, I subscribed to Firebird-docs. I'm willing to help, but I must
admit this is an approach to writting that I never used before.

Just 2 simple questions:

1. Is there any global TOC so that we can pick up a subject from what is missing?

2. Would you agree if I tried to write a simple test text and send it to you or
someone else just to check if I understood the way of working with docbook? (I
never used it before).

Regards

Armando Halpern

Re: [Firebird-docs] Re: Hello

[Lester C. <le...@ls...>]

Frank Ingermann wrote:

> Hi Paul / Michael,
> 
> wrt. docs on SQL reference:
> 
> You probably know that there is a very good Firebird
> SQL reference pdf on the IBPhoenix CD.

I thought the SQL reference was the Borland One?

> I remember Paul Beach saying in Fulda that at some
> time in the future (he didn't exactly say when) this
> pdf would be given to the project so it could be made
> available for anyone to download. (IBPhoenix paid for
> having them made by Helen iirc so it's understandable
> that atm they only make it available on the CD).

It was the beginners guide I thought he was referring to - I don't thing 
I'd had too much water when he said it.

> So, before you start writing your own, it would make sense
> to coordinate with Paul to avoid duplicate work. I cc'd
> this message to him as i'm not sure whether he follows
> this list.

If this is working
http://home.lsces.co.uk/TikiPro/wiki/index.php?page=Firebird+Words+Reference
Is an expansion of the cross reference, which I did while working on the 
MySQL paper. I need to fill in the SQL2003 column, and plan to expand 
the first column to link to individual pages - So any contributions are 
more than welcome :)
This will be reflected back into the docs project as well, but the wiki 
just makes things easier to work on at present ;) ( AND it's running on 
Firebird ... )

-- 
Lester Caine
-----------------------------
L.S.Caine Electronic Services

Re: [Firebird-docs] Re: Hello

[Frank I. <fr...@fi...>]

Hi Paul / Michael,

wrt. docs on SQL reference:

You probably know that there is a very good Firebird
SQL reference pdf on the IBPhoenix CD.

I remember Paul Beach saying in Fulda that at some
time in the future (he didn't exactly say when) this
pdf would be given to the project so it could be made
available for anyone to download. (IBPhoenix paid for
having them made by Helen iirc so it's understandable
that atm they only make it available on the CD).

So, before you start writing your own, it would make sense
to coordinate with Paul to avoid duplicate work. I cc'd
this message to him as i'm not sure whether he follows
this list.

cheers,
Frank

Re: [Firebird-docs] Re: Hello

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hello Michael,

>>   A little status report from me: I have finished my tests
>>   yesterday, and have made some drafts on how to organize the SQL
>>   reference I intend to write. I will work some on it in the next
>>   days, and hope to be able to present you an initial version
>>   around friday.
>>
>> Michael, if you're reading this, can you tell us how things are now?
>
> Unfortunately not much progress, I have been awfully busy in the
> last months - I still have this on my todo-list, but won't be able
> to put much time in it currently, so if anybody else wants to work
> on this too, I won't protest :)

Too bad. Do you have anything that could be of use for others to build
on, however incomplete?


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

[Firebird-docs] Re: Hello

[Michael G. <gl...@ma...>]

Hi,
 
>>I might well ask to step into an existing project, perhaps the SQL
>>and UDF Reference rather than go off on my own just yet.
> 
> 
>>Who is working on the SQL and UDF Reference?
> 
> 
> Michael Gloegl. His last message on the subject dates from 24 Feb:
> 
>   A little status report from me: I have finished my tests yesterday,
>   and have made some drafts on how to organize the SQL reference I
>   intend to write. I will work some on it in the next days, and hope
>   to be able to present you an initial version around friday.
> 
> Michael, if you're reading this, can you tell us how things are now?

Unfortunately not much progress, I have been awfully busy in the last months - I still have this on my todo-list, but won't be able to put much time in it currently, so if anybody else wants to work on this too, I won't protest :)

Greetings from Germany,
Michael

RE: [Firebird-docs] Hello

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hello Mike,

> I'll be downloading, building documents, and generally playing over
> the weekend. And DocBook XML format is fine.

Good :-)

> I might well ask to step into an existing project, perhaps the SQL
> and UDF Reference rather than go off on my own just yet.

> Who is working on the SQL and UDF Reference?

Michael Gloegl. His last message on the subject dates from 24 Feb:

  A little status report from me: I have finished my tests yesterday,
  and have made some drafts on how to organize the SQL reference I
  intend to write. I will work some on it in the next days, and hope
  to be able to present you an initial version around friday.

Michael, if you're reading this, can you tell us how things are now?


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

RE: [Firebird-docs] Hello

[Mike L. <Mik...@t-...>]

Thank you Paul,

I have read through the DocBuilding DocWriting Howto documents to get some
idea of how you work and what tools are needed. I'll be downloading,
building documents, and generally playing over the weekend. And DocBook XML
format is fine.

I might well ask to step into an existing project, perhaps the SQL and UDF
Reference rather than go off on my own just yet.

Replies from me on this address may sometimes be slow as I only use it
Wednesdays, Thursdays and Fridays - but I am here.

Who is working on the SQL and UDF Reference?

Mike
+44(0)7717 458 268

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Vinkenoog [mailto:pa...@vi...] 
Sent: 20 May 2004 23:23
To: fir...@li...
Subject: Re: [Firebird-docs] Hello

Hello Mike,

> I live and work in the UK as a technical project manager. I've been
> known to produce the odd bit of technical documentation (very odd
> some of it) and would like to contribute to the Firebird project.

Great! We don't have a lot of docwriters here, and the ones we do have
don't have a lot of spare time, so every helping hand is welcome.

> At the moment I'm plodding my way through the existing
> documentation, trying to get an understanding of and a feel for the
> extent of what is already there. I would be very open to suggestions
> or requests for assistance in particular areas.

Have you already seen this page, and the stuff it links to?

  http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php?op=devel&sub=doc


In principle you can decide for yourself what you want to contribute,
as long as it isn't already there. And we'd really like you to make
your contributions in DocBook XML format - but maybe you already knew
that.

Right now I'm a bit annoyed (mainly with myself) because there hasn't
been any progress in the last few months. I want to work on an API
Reference (starting with the functions that differ from InterBase's)
but the framework is only half ready. Someone else is working on a
glossary (linked to a reserved words list; framework is complete) and
yet another person is preparing an SQL and UDF reference. These are
all documents that can be worked on on a per-entry basis, which means
several persons can work on them without getting in each other's way.

If you want to step into one of these, I'm sure that can be arranged.
But... it's *your* time and effort, so if you have other ideas - or
maybe dreams of some fantastic in-depth technical monster doc - please
feel free to set that up. As long as it's got fiery wings! :-)


Greetings, nice to have you on board!
Paul Vinkenoog


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Re: [Firebird-docs] Hello

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hello Mike,

> I live and work in the UK as a technical project manager. I've been
> known to produce the odd bit of technical documentation (very odd
> some of it) and would like to contribute to the Firebird project.

Great! We don't have a lot of docwriters here, and the ones we do have
don't have a lot of spare time, so every helping hand is welcome.

> At the moment I'm plodding my way through the existing
> documentation, trying to get an understanding of and a feel for the
> extent of what is already there. I would be very open to suggestions
> or requests for assistance in particular areas.

Have you already seen this page, and the stuff it links to?

  http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php?op=devel&sub=doc


In principle you can decide for yourself what you want to contribute,
as long as it isn't already there. And we'd really like you to make
your contributions in DocBook XML format - but maybe you already knew
that.

Right now I'm a bit annoyed (mainly with myself) because there hasn't
been any progress in the last few months. I want to work on an API
Reference (starting with the functions that differ from InterBase's)
but the framework is only half ready. Someone else is working on a
glossary (linked to a reserved words list; framework is complete) and
yet another person is preparing an SQL and UDF reference. These are
all documents that can be worked on on a per-entry basis, which means
several persons can work on them without getting in each other's way.

If you want to step into one of these, I'm sure that can be arranged.
But... it's *your* time and effort, so if you have other ideas - or
maybe dreams of some fantastic in-depth technical monster doc - please
feel free to set that up. As long as it's got fiery wings! :-)


Greetings, nice to have you on board!
Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Grzegorz <e_h...@op...>]

Hi Paul,


> Ah... that was the one in the HEAD branch. In the B1_5_Release branch
> there's a recent version (Jan 2004). If you've downloaded the source
> for 1.5 you also have the recent version.

Yes! Now I have it. Somehow I got fooled by 'platform-independent' and did
not look there.

Thanks,
grzegorz

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hello Grzegorz,

Maybe you've already found it but just in case:

> Now, I *was* going to tell you that the installer source is in an
> .iss file in the CVS tree, so you can check it out with a CVS client
> or browse it at SF... but the one I found in the CVS tree is 7
> months old. That means it's outdated because the installation
> options have since changed.
>
> Maybe I looked in the wrong place (module firebird2, directory
> builds/install/arch-specific/win32)

Ah... that was the one in the HEAD branch. In the B1_5_Release branch
there's a recent version (Jan 2004). If you've downloaded the source
for 1.5 you also have the recent version.


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hi Grzegorz,

It took a little longer because when I came home I couldn't log into
my Win2000 system anymore :-(    Working from laptop now.

>>> how could I make Polish version of the installer?

> Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is only executable of the windows
> installer on sourceforge... or? if there is source anywhere then I
> can translate, use it for myself and make available for anybody else
> who might be interested.

The source package is platform-independent, you don't find it in the
firebird-win32 section but in the top section on the Files page, which
is just called "firebird".

Now, I *was* going to tell you that the installer source is in an .iss
file in the CVS tree, so you can check it out with a CVS client or
browse it at SF... but the one I found in the CVS tree is 7 months
old. That means it's outdated because the installation options have
since changed.

Maybe I looked in the wrong place (module firebird2, directory
builds/install/arch-specific/win32) but under the circumstances I
think it's best if you contact the guy who makes the Win32
installation kits directly. His name is Paul Reeves and his email is:
preeves ibphoenix.com (connect with @ to get email address).

Or post to firebird-devel with "ATTN Paul Reeves" or "Win32 Installer"
somewhere in the subject line.


Good luck!

Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Paul V. <pa...@vi...>]

Hi Grzegorz,

>> This group is for discussion of Firebird documentation writing, not
>> for support questions. Ask your question in
>> fir...@ya...,

> Well, I have been directed from firebird-support to this group by
> Helen, so probably it won't do any good if I go back there with this
> question.

Hmmm... we COULD bounce you back and forth a couple of times, just for
fun :-)

No, seriously: I don't know why she directed you here but I'll be home
in an hour, look up one or two things and give you the information you
need - at least enough to get you started.


Greetings,
Paul Vinkenoog

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Grzegorz <e_h...@op...>]

> > I'm distributing my app with current Firebird installer and the fact,
> > that it's in English (especially error messages) causes problems to
> > some users, so:
> >
> > how could I make Polish version of the installer?
>
> This group is for discussion of Firebird documentation writing, not for
> support questions. Ask your question in fir...@ya...,
> I'm sure someone will be able to help you there (as I know there are other
> people who have made translations).

Well, I have been directed from firebird-support to this group by Helen, so
probably it won't do any good if I go back there with this question. Correct
me if I'm wrong, but there is only executable of the windows installer on
sourceforge... or? if there is source anywhere then I can translate, use it
for myself and make available for anybody else who might be interested.

grzegorz

Re: [Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Paul V. <pa...@so...>]

Hi Grzegorz,

> I'm distributing my app with current Firebird installer and the fact,
> that it's in English (especially error messages) causes problems to
> some users, so:
>
> how could I make Polish version of the installer?

This group is for discussion of Firebird documentation writing, not for
support questions. Ask your question in fir...@ya...,
I'm sure someone will be able to help you there (as I know there are other
people who have made translations).

If they _really_ can't help you in firebird-support, try
fir...@li... - but only as a last resort,
because that's the core developers list. (Once your translation is
finished and you want to donate it to the project, this is a good place
to offer it.)


Good luck with your translation!

Paul Vinkenoog

[Firebird-docs] Polish language version of the win installer

[Grzegorz <e_h...@op...>]

Hi,

I'm distributing my app with current Firebird installer and the fact, that
it's in English (especially error messages) causes problems to some users,
so:

how could I make Polish version of the installer? by translating some text
file, msi database? In the end this could be usefil for anybody in Poland.

do you consider creating multilingual installer at all?

Grzegorz Modlinski

Re: [Firebird-docs] Firebird Trigger

[Aage J. <aag...@on...>]

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:47:43 +0000 (UTC), Peter Kong wrote:

> I am trying to upgrade my existing Firebird db. However due to some 
> tables
> modification may fire my triggers which will end up disturbing or even
> corrupting my existing data on another table. Is there a way that I can
> switch all triggers during my database upgrade?


Wrong group.  Try http://groups.yahoo.com/group/firebird-support/ 

Re: [Firebird-docs] FB and win2000 problem

[Aage J. <aag...@on...>]

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:47:43 +0000 (UTC), news.kamsoft.pl wrote:

> I'm using FB on W2k Server but when i try to connect to Server via 
> Terminal
> client via ISDN adapter it looks like FB doesn't listen on my ISDN 
> interface
> In control manager I got the message "The firebird server is running", 
> but
> the button is set to START message (no stop) and FB icon is crossed out.



Wrong group.  Try http://groups.yahoo.com/group/firebird-support/

[Firebird-docs] FB and win2000 problem

[news.kamsoft.pl <krz...@me...>]

Hi,
I'm using FB on W2k Server but when i try to connect to Server  via Terminal
client via ISDN adapter it looks like FB doesn't listen on my ISDN interface
In control manager I got the message "The firebird server is running" , but
the button is set to START message (no stop) and FB icon is crossed out.

Wat is the problem?
In Firebird Manager and config file i can see FB server is listening on all
interfaces I have.

Thanks
Krzysztof Musial
krz...@me...