factor-talk — Discussion about the Factor programming language

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

Not to repeat my “I missed this also”, but could you point to the spacefrogg patch you’re talking about?

And also, from what I read ``/usr/bin/env -S nix-shell args…`` should work for you. It’s supposed to do in one line the equivalent of the two line change.  I spent some time poking at nixOS forums yesterday.  Anyway, I can’t test as I don’t have that setup for myself yet.

Thanks,
John.

> On Oct 16, 2026, at 2:39 AM, toastal <to...@po...> wrote:
> 
> Pretty great feature list!
> 
> We are trying to get Factor 0.102 into Nixpkgs as we speak
> <https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/573955> (apologies for the
> repo being on MS GitHub). Hopefully after 0.101 → 0.102 merge I can get
> some eyes into testing it on aarch64-{linux,darwin} to get these as
> supported platforms for Nixpkgs too. …Perhaps I can stop a bunch of
> services on my Linux phone to try to verify the aarch64 build 😂 (could
> work easily if the build stays under 2 GiB of RAM but haven’t checked)
> 
> I’m wondering if there’s anything to be considered about the patches
> spacefrogg required that could/should be upstreamed into mainline Factor
> to make it a the build more flexible (such as the adding that
> `$FACTOR_LD_SO_CACHE` or not assuming the `$PATH`?).
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[toastal <to...@po...>]

Pretty great feature list!

We are trying to get Factor 0.102 into Nixpkgs as we speak
<https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/573955> (apologies for the
repo being on MS GitHub). Hopefully after 0.101 → 0.102 merge I can get
some eyes into testing it on aarch64-{linux,darwin} to get these as
supported platforms for Nixpkgs too. …Perhaps I can stop a bunch of
services on my Linux phone to try to verify the aarch64 build 😂 (could
work easily if the build stays under 2 GiB of RAM but haven’t checked)

I’m wondering if there’s anything to be considered about the patches
spacefrogg required that could/should be upstreamed into mainline Factor
to make it a the build more flexible (such as the adding that
`$FACTOR_LD_SO_CACHE` or not assuming the `$PATH`?).

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

Hi Jon!

Yep, that’s true! Good idea, I’ll bump the post.

Thanks,
John.


> On Oct 14, 2026, at 7:31 AM, Jon Harper <jon...@gm...> wrote:
> 
> Congratulations to all who contributed to the release !
> Just to be sure, it's the first version where factor "works" on macos
> arm64 (since you are quoting about it) ? If so shouldn't it be the
> first biggest highlight of them all ? ( 101 doesn't have it
> https://re.factorcode.org/2025/12/factor-0-101-now-available.html )
> Cheers !
> Jon
> 
> On Wed, Oct 14, 2026 at 2:20 AM Harold Hausman <hha...@gm...> wrote:
>> 
>> Love to see it, great work everyone.
>> 
>> On Tue, Oct 13, 2026 at 5:21 PM John Benediktsson <mr...@gm...> wrote:
>>> 
>>> “You don’t want just to develop for ARM, you want to actually use ARM in your day-to-day work on the desktop.” - Linus Torvalds
>>> 
>>> I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.102! You can find download links on the Factor website:
>>> 
>>>    https://factorcode.org
>>> 
>>> This release includes 1,068 commits from the following contributors:
>>> 
>>> Aleksander Sabak, Andrii Puhachenko, Chris Double, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug Coleman, Eric Willigers, Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Leo Mehraban, Rudi Grinberg, Sebastiaan Speck, Zoltán Kéri, @knottio, @ronnie-w
>>> 
>>> Highlights of this release include:
>>> 
>>> * A new GTK4 UI backend, now the default on 64-bit Linux; 32-bit Linux continues to use GTK3, which remains a build option on other supported Linux architectures.
>>> * New 32-bit and 64-bit RISC-V Linux ports, with optimizing compiler backends, foreign calls and callbacks, and support in both the C++ and Zig VMs.
>>> * DirectWrite text rendering on Windows, including color glyphs, typography controls, and better support for large output and complex scripts.
>>> * More responsive rendering and selection of large text across platforms, with fixes for display scaling, listener scrolling, and adjacent text backgrounds.
>>> * Expanded native ARM64 SIMD support, half-precision and bfloat16 operations, and improved foreign calls, variadic callbacks, and native va_list support.
>>> * Experimental register allocators and optional compiler optimizations, alongside fixes to stack inference, generated code, and GC root tracking.
>>> * Updated Unicode data to 18.0.0 and timezone data to 2026c, with bindings for SQLite 3.53.4, Raylib 6.0, and Lua 5.5.
>>> * Faster process launching and native process-exit notifications on Linux, macOS, BSD, and Windows, with polling as a fallback.
>>> * Extensive fixes to HTTP parsing, TLS identity checks, cooperative waits, resource cleanup, signal handling, and VM memory safety.
>>> 
>>> Compatibility notes
>>> 
>>> * 64-bit Linux builds now select GTK4 by default; use -ui-backend=gtk3 when bootstrapping if GTK3 is required. 32-bit Linux uses GTK3 and does not support GTK4.
>>> * Windows UI text now uses DirectWrite by default, so text metrics and appearance may differ from the previous Uniscribe backend.
>>> callable is now a mixin that includes words; code that assumes all callables support the sequence protocol should use quotation-like instead.
>>> * Fixed-array struct fields now validate input buffer lengths, and stricter HTTP and multipart parsing rejects malformed or incomplete input previously accepted.
>>> * PEG repetition and list parsers now omit ignore values. Minimum counts refer to successful matches, so repeat1 and list-of-many can return empty output when all matched items are hidden.
>>> * The buffered HTTP client now decompresses gzip responses before character decoding and rejects unsupported content codings. with-http-request still provides bytes before content decompression.
>>> * Ambiguous Objective-C selectors now require a class-qualified name such as Class.selector when imported signatures differ.
>>> * Tuple literals reject duplicate slot names, and minimum and maximum now throw for empty iota and repetition instead of returning a value.
>>> * Command-line option names and aliases must now be unique, including the default --help option. Exact names take precedence over no- negation.
>>> * SQLite connections now use persistent WAL mode, which requires a local filesystem. with-transaction uses BEGIN IMMEDIATEand acquires the write lock at transaction start, including for read-only work. Write serialization is per process; wrap raw SQL and DDL writes in with-transaction or serialize-transaction to participate.
>>> * Building the experimental Zig VM now requires Zig 0.17.0.
>>> 
>>> For more details, please see the full announcement at:
>>> 
>>> https://re.factorcode.org/2026/10/factor-0-102-now-available.html
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Factor-talk mailing list
>>> Fac...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Factor-talk mailing list
>> Fac...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[Jon H. <jon...@gm...>]

Congratulations to all who contributed to the release !
Just to be sure, it's the first version where factor "works" on macos
arm64 (since you are quoting about it) ? If so shouldn't it be the
first biggest highlight of them all ? ( 101 doesn't have it
https://re.factorcode.org/2025/12/factor-0-101-now-available.html )
Cheers !
Jon

On Wed, Oct 14, 2026 at 2:20 AM Harold Hausman <hha...@gm...> wrote:
>
> Love to see it, great work everyone.
>
> On Tue, Oct 13, 2026 at 5:21 PM John Benediktsson <mr...@gm...> wrote:
>>
>> “You don’t want just to develop for ARM, you want to actually use ARM in your day-to-day work on the desktop.” - Linus Torvalds
>>
>> I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.102! You can find download links on the Factor website:
>>
>>     https://factorcode.org
>>
>> This release includes 1,068 commits from the following contributors:
>>
>> Aleksander Sabak, Andrii Puhachenko, Chris Double, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug Coleman, Eric Willigers, Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Leo Mehraban, Rudi Grinberg, Sebastiaan Speck, Zoltán Kéri, @knottio, @ronnie-w
>>
>> Highlights of this release include:
>>
>> * A new GTK4 UI backend, now the default on 64-bit Linux; 32-bit Linux continues to use GTK3, which remains a build option on other supported Linux architectures.
>> * New 32-bit and 64-bit RISC-V Linux ports, with optimizing compiler backends, foreign calls and callbacks, and support in both the C++ and Zig VMs.
>> * DirectWrite text rendering on Windows, including color glyphs, typography controls, and better support for large output and complex scripts.
>> * More responsive rendering and selection of large text across platforms, with fixes for display scaling, listener scrolling, and adjacent text backgrounds.
>> * Expanded native ARM64 SIMD support, half-precision and bfloat16 operations, and improved foreign calls, variadic callbacks, and native va_list support.
>> * Experimental register allocators and optional compiler optimizations, alongside fixes to stack inference, generated code, and GC root tracking.
>> * Updated Unicode data to 18.0.0 and timezone data to 2026c, with bindings for SQLite 3.53.4, Raylib 6.0, and Lua 5.5.
>> * Faster process launching and native process-exit notifications on Linux, macOS, BSD, and Windows, with polling as a fallback.
>> * Extensive fixes to HTTP parsing, TLS identity checks, cooperative waits, resource cleanup, signal handling, and VM memory safety.
>>
>> Compatibility notes
>>
>> * 64-bit Linux builds now select GTK4 by default; use -ui-backend=gtk3 when bootstrapping if GTK3 is required. 32-bit Linux uses GTK3 and does not support GTK4.
>> * Windows UI text now uses DirectWrite by default, so text metrics and appearance may differ from the previous Uniscribe backend.
>> callable is now a mixin that includes words; code that assumes all callables support the sequence protocol should use quotation-like instead.
>> * Fixed-array struct fields now validate input buffer lengths, and stricter HTTP and multipart parsing rejects malformed or incomplete input previously accepted.
>> * PEG repetition and list parsers now omit ignore values. Minimum counts refer to successful matches, so repeat1 and list-of-many can return empty output when all matched items are hidden.
>> * The buffered HTTP client now decompresses gzip responses before character decoding and rejects unsupported content codings. with-http-request still provides bytes before content decompression.
>> * Ambiguous Objective-C selectors now require a class-qualified name such as Class.selector when imported signatures differ.
>> * Tuple literals reject duplicate slot names, and minimum and maximum now throw for empty iota and repetition instead of returning a value.
>> * Command-line option names and aliases must now be unique, including the default --help option. Exact names take precedence over no- negation.
>> * SQLite connections now use persistent WAL mode, which requires a local filesystem. with-transaction uses BEGIN IMMEDIATEand acquires the write lock at transaction start, including for read-only work. Write serialization is per process; wrap raw SQL and DDL writes in with-transaction or serialize-transaction to participate.
>> * Building the experimental Zig VM now requires Zig 0.17.0.
>>
>> For more details, please see the full announcement at:
>>
>> https://re.factorcode.org/2026/10/factor-0-102-now-available.html
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Factor-talk mailing list
>> Fac...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[Harold H. <hha...@gm...>]

Love to see it, great work everyone.

On Tue, Oct 13, 2026 at 5:21 PM John Benediktsson <mr...@gm...> wrote:

> “You don’t want just to develop for ARM, you want to actually use ARM in
> your day-to-day work on the desktop.” - Linus Torvalds
>
> I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.102! You can find
> download links on the Factor website:
>
>     https://factorcode.org
>
> This release includes 1,068 commits from the following contributors:
>
> Aleksander Sabak, Andrii Puhachenko, Chris Double, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug
> Coleman, Eric Willigers, Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Leo Mehraban, Rudi
> Grinberg, Sebastiaan Speck, Zoltán Kéri, @knottio, @ronnie-w
>
> Highlights of this release include:
>
> * A new GTK4 UI backend, now the default on 64-bit Linux; 32-bit Linux
> continues to use GTK3, which remains a build option on other supported
> Linux architectures.
> * New 32-bit and 64-bit RISC-V Linux ports, with optimizing compiler
> backends, foreign calls and callbacks, and support in both the C++ and Zig
> VMs.
> * DirectWrite text rendering on Windows, including color glyphs,
> typography controls, and better support for large output and complex
> scripts.
> * More responsive rendering and selection of large text across platforms,
> with fixes for display scaling, listener scrolling, and adjacent text
> backgrounds.
> * Expanded native ARM64 SIMD support, half-precision and bfloat16
> operations, and improved foreign calls, variadic callbacks, and native
> va_list support.
> * Experimental register allocators and optional compiler optimizations,
> alongside fixes to stack inference, generated code, and GC root tracking.
> * Updated Unicode data to 18.0.0 and timezone data to 2026c, with bindings
> for SQLite 3.53.4, Raylib 6.0, and Lua 5.5.
> * Faster process launching and native process-exit notifications on Linux,
> macOS, BSD, and Windows, with polling as a fallback.
> * Extensive fixes to HTTP parsing, TLS identity checks, cooperative waits,
> resource cleanup, signal handling, and VM memory safety.
>
> Compatibility notes
>
> * 64-bit Linux builds now select GTK4 by default; use -ui-backend=gtk3
> when bootstrapping if GTK3 is required. 32-bit Linux uses GTK3 and does not
> support GTK4.
> * Windows UI text now uses DirectWrite by default, so text metrics and
> appearance may differ from the previous Uniscribe backend.
> callable is now a mixin that includes words; code that assumes all
> callables support the sequence protocol should use quotation-like instead.
> * Fixed-array struct fields now validate input buffer lengths, and
> stricter HTTP and multipart parsing rejects malformed or incomplete input
> previously accepted.
> * PEG repetition and list parsers now omit ignore values. Minimum counts
> refer to successful matches, so repeat1 and list-of-many can return empty
> output when all matched items are hidden.
> * The buffered HTTP client now decompresses gzip responses before
> character decoding and rejects unsupported content codings.
> with-http-request still provides bytes before content decompression.
> * Ambiguous Objective-C selectors now require a class-qualified name such
> as Class.selector when imported signatures differ.
> * Tuple literals reject duplicate slot names, and minimum and maximum now
> throw for empty iota and repetition instead of returning a value.
> * Command-line option names and aliases must now be unique, including the
> default --help option. Exact names take precedence over no- negation.
> * SQLite connections now use persistent WAL mode, which requires a local
> filesystem. with-transaction uses BEGIN IMMEDIATEand acquires the write
> lock at transaction start, including for read-only work. Write
> serialization is per process; wrap raw SQL and DDL writes in
> with-transaction or serialize-transaction to participate.
> * Building the experimental Zig VM now requires Zig 0.17.0.
>
> For more details, please see the full announcement at:
>
> https://re.factorcode.org/2026/10/factor-0-102-now-available.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>

[Factor-talk] Factor 0.102 now available

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

“You don’t want just to develop for ARM, you want to actually use ARM in your day-to-day work on the desktop.” - Linus Torvalds

I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.102! You can find download links on the Factor website:

    https://factorcode.org

This release includes 1,068 commits from the following contributors:

Aleksander Sabak, Andrii Puhachenko, Chris Double, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug Coleman, Eric Willigers, Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Leo Mehraban, Rudi Grinberg, Sebastiaan Speck, Zoltán Kéri, @knottio, @ronnie-w

Highlights of this release include:

* A new GTK4 UI backend, now the default on 64-bit Linux; 32-bit Linux continues to use GTK3, which remains a build option on other supported Linux architectures.
* New 32-bit and 64-bit RISC-V Linux ports, with optimizing compiler backends, foreign calls and callbacks, and support in both the C++ and Zig VMs.
* DirectWrite text rendering on Windows, including color glyphs, typography controls, and better support for large output and complex scripts.
* More responsive rendering and selection of large text across platforms, with fixes for display scaling, listener scrolling, and adjacent text backgrounds.
* Expanded native ARM64 SIMD support, half-precision and bfloat16 operations, and improved foreign calls, variadic callbacks, and native va_list support.
* Experimental register allocators and optional compiler optimizations, alongside fixes to stack inference, generated code, and GC root tracking.
* Updated Unicode data to 18.0.0 and timezone data to 2026c, with bindings for SQLite 3.53.4, Raylib 6.0, and Lua 5.5.
* Faster process launching and native process-exit notifications on Linux, macOS, BSD, and Windows, with polling as a fallback.
* Extensive fixes to HTTP parsing, TLS identity checks, cooperative waits, resource cleanup, signal handling, and VM memory safety.

Compatibility notes

* 64-bit Linux builds now select GTK4 by default; use -ui-backend=gtk3 when bootstrapping if GTK3 is required. 32-bit Linux uses GTK3 and does not support GTK4.
* Windows UI text now uses DirectWrite by default, so text metrics and appearance may differ from the previous Uniscribe backend.
callable is now a mixin that includes words; code that assumes all callables support the sequence protocol should use quotation-like instead.
* Fixed-array struct fields now validate input buffer lengths, and stricter HTTP and multipart parsing rejects malformed or incomplete input previously accepted.
* PEG repetition and list parsers now omit ignore values. Minimum counts refer to successful matches, so repeat1 and list-of-many can return empty output when all matched items are hidden.
* The buffered HTTP client now decompresses gzip responses before character decoding and rejects unsupported content codings. with-http-request still provides bytes before content decompression.
* Ambiguous Objective-C selectors now require a class-qualified name such as Class.selector when imported signatures differ.
* Tuple literals reject duplicate slot names, and minimum and maximum now throw for empty iota and repetition instead of returning a value.
* Command-line option names and aliases must now be unique, including the default --help option. Exact names take precedence over no- negation.
* SQLite connections now use persistent WAL mode, which requires a local filesystem. with-transaction uses BEGIN IMMEDIATEand acquires the write lock at transaction start, including for read-only work. Write serialization is per process; wrap raw SQL and DDL writes in with-transaction or serialize-transaction to participate.
* Building the experimental Zig VM now requires Zig 0.17.0.

For more details, please see the full announcement at:

https://re.factorcode.org/2026/10/factor-0-102-now-available.html

[Factor-talk] Multiline shebangs (bug?)

[toastal <to...@po...>]

I want to use nix-shell which allows getting all tooling for a script
<https://nix.dev/manual/nix/2.34/command-ref/nix-shell.html#options>.
I’m trying to do

    #!/usr/bin/env nix-shell
    #!nix-shell ./env.nix -i factor
    USE: io
    IN: hello-world
    
    : hello ( -- ) "Hello world" print ;
    
    MAIN: hello

But when trying to exec my new script, I get

    2: #!nix-shell ./env.nix -i factor
              ^
    No word named '#!nix-shell' found in current vocabulary search path

The error makes sense if multiline shebangs aren’t supported (yet), but
I think this a bug & probably trivial fix.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

NOTE: I would prefer to use plain `nix-shell -i factor` but the factor
the binary ends up with a lower priority than `factor` from GNU
coreutlis — which means I have to do a hack with an ./env.nix file:

    { pkgs ? import <nixpkgs> { } }:
    
    let
        inherit (pkgs) lib factor-lang mkShellNoCC nix nixfmt;
    in
    mkShellNoCC {
        buildInputs = [
           (lib.hiPrio factor-lang.override { guiSupport = false; })
           nix
           nixfmt
        ];
    }

Re: [Factor-talk] install

[Geb de V. <geb...@pr...>]

Thank you for your reaction. I fix things by creating symbolic links from the expected lib names to the versions names that I have (LMDE7). It seems to work well now. Thank you.

Cordially,

Geb de Valk

Sent from [Proton Mail](https://proton.me/mail/home) for Android.

-------- Original Message --------
On Monday, 09/21/26 at 09:28 Andrey Pugachenko <and...@gm...> wrote:

> Hi Geb,
>
> Could you try the approach described in the README?
>
> As far as I remember, after running sudo apt install libgtk-3-dev, Factor started as expected.
>
> This applies to the latest version of Factor.
>
> For Factor 0.101, you'll need to find and install libgtkglext1_1.2.0-11_amd64.deb from a previous version of Debian.
>
> BR,
> Andrew
>
> пн, 21 сент. 2026 г. в 09:55, Geb de Valk via Factor-talk <fac...@li...>:
>
>> Hi there, I am truying to install the linux version, first 0.101 now the latest buid of 2025-06-15, but i keep getting errors for missing C libraries. I am running LMDE7 based on Debian13.
>> Is there a solution for that.
>> Thanks in advance for tips.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Geb de Valk
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Factor-talk mailing list
>> Fac...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] install

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

In 0.101 and previous versions they require the developer libraries linked so ``libgtk-3.so <http://libgtk-3.so/>`` links to ``lib-gtk3.so <http://lib-gtk3.so/>.1``.

That should be fixed in 0.102 which we hope to get out in the next couple of weeks.

Thanks,

> On Sep 21, 2026, at 12:28 AM, Andrey Pugachenko <and...@gm...> wrote:
> 
> Hi Geb, 
> 
> Could you try the approach described in the README?
> 
> As far as I remember, after running sudo apt install libgtk-3-dev, Factor started as expected.
> 
> This applies to the latest version of Factor.
> 
> For Factor 0.101, you'll need to find and install libgtkglext1_1.2.0-11_amd64.deb from a previous version of Debian.
> 
> BR,
> Andrew
> 
> 
> пн, 21 сент. 2026 г. в 09:55, Geb de Valk via Factor-talk <fac...@li... <mailto:fac...@li...>>:
>> Hi there, I am truying to install the linux version, first 0.101 now the latest buid of 2025-06-15, but i keep getting errors for missing C libraries. I am running LMDE7 based on Debian13.
>> Is there a solution for that.
>> Thanks in advance for tips.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Geb de Valk
>> _______________________________________________
>> Factor-talk mailing list
>> Fac...@li... <mailto:Fac...@li...>
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] install

[Andrey P. <and...@gm...>]

Hi Geb,

Could you try the approach described in the README?

As far as I remember, after running sudo apt install libgtk-3-dev, Factor
started as expected.

This applies to the latest version of Factor.

For Factor 0.101, you'll need to find and install
libgtkglext1_1.2.0-11_amd64.deb from a previous version of Debian.

BR,
Andrew

пн, 21 сент. 2026 г. в 09:55, Geb de Valk via Factor-talk <
fac...@li...>:

> Hi there, I am truying to install the linux version, first 0.101 now the
> latest buid of 2025-06-15, but i keep getting errors for missing C
> libraries. I am running LMDE7 based on Debian13.
> Is there a solution for that.
> Thanks in advance for tips.
>
> Regards,
>
> Geb de Valk
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>

[Factor-talk] install

[Geb de V. <geb...@pr...>]

Hi there, I am truying to install the linux version, first 0.101 now the latest buid of 2025-06-15, but i keep getting errors for missing C libraries. I am running LMDE7 based on Debian13.
Is there a solution for that.
Thanks in advance for tips.

Regards,

Geb de Valk

Re: [Factor-talk] Factor 0.101 now available

[Jon H. <jon...@gm...>]

Very nice ! Now with this version number, all the universities in the
world won't have any excuses not to offer a "Factor 101" course :)
Jon

On Tue, Dec 9, 2025 at 5:56 AM John Benediktsson <mr...@gm...> wrote:
>
> *"Keep thy airspeed up, lest the earth come from below and smite thee." -
> William Kershner*
>
> I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.101! You can find download
> links on the Factor website:
>
>     https://factorcode.org
>
> This release is brought to you with almost 700 commits by the following
> individuals:
>
>     Aleksander Sabak, Andy Kluger, Cat Stevens, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug Coleman,
>     Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Jon Harper, Jonas Bernouli, Leo Mehraban,
>     Mike Stevenson, Nicholas Chandoke, Niklas Larsson, Rebecca Kelly, Samuel
>     Tardieu, Stefan Schmiedl, @Bruno-366, @bobisageek,
>     @coltsingleactionarmyocelot @inivekin, @knottio, @timor.
>
> Besides some bug fixes and library improvements, I want to highlight the
> following changes:
>
>  * Moved the UI to render buttons and scrollbars rather than using images,
>    which allows easier theming.
>  * Fixed HiDPI scaling on Linux and Windows, although it currently doesn’t
>    update the window settings when switching between screens with different
>    scaling factors.
>  * Update to Unicode 17.0.0.
>  * Plugin support for the Neovim editor.
>
> Some possible backwards compatibility issues:
>
>  * The argument order to ltake was swapped to be more consistent with words
>    like head.
>  * The environment vocabulary on Windows now supports disambiguating f and ""
>    (empty) values
>  * The misc/atom folder was removed in favor of the factor/atom-language-factor
>    repo.
>  * The misc/Factor.tmbundle folder was removed in favor of the
>    factor/factor.tmbundle repo.
>  * The misc/vim folder was removed in favor of the factor/factor.vim repo.
>  * The http vocabulary request tuple had a slot rename from post-data to data.
>  * The furnace.asides vocabulary had a slot rename from post-data to data, and
>    might require running ALTER TABLE asides RENAME COLUMN "post-data" TO data;.
>  * The html.streams vocabulary was renamed to io.streams.html
>  * The pdf.streams vocabulary was renamed to io.streams.pdf
>
> For more details, please see the full announcement at:
>
>   https://re.factorcode.org/2025/12/factor-0-101-now-available.html
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

[Factor-talk] Factor 0.101 now available

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

*"Keep thy airspeed up, lest the earth come from below and smite thee." -
William Kershner*

I'm very pleased to announce the release of Factor 0.101! You can find
download
links on the Factor website:

    https://factorcode.org

This release is brought to you with almost 700 commits by the following
individuals:

    Aleksander Sabak, Andy Kluger, Cat Stevens, Dmitry Matveyev, Doug
Coleman,
    Giftpflanze, John Benediktsson, Jon Harper, Jonas Bernouli, Leo
Mehraban,
    Mike Stevenson, Nicholas Chandoke, Niklas Larsson, Rebecca Kelly, Samuel
    Tardieu, Stefan Schmiedl, @Bruno-366, @bobisageek,
    @coltsingleactionarmyocelot @inivekin, @knottio, @timor.

Besides some bug fixes and library improvements, I want to highlight the
following changes:

 * Moved the UI to render buttons and scrollbars rather than using images,
   which allows easier theming.
 * Fixed HiDPI scaling on Linux and Windows, although it currently doesn’t
   update the window settings when switching between screens with different
   scaling factors.
 * Update to Unicode 17.0.0.
 * Plugin support for the Neovim editor.

Some possible backwards compatibility issues:

 * The argument order to ltake was swapped to be more consistent with words
   like head.
 * The environment vocabulary on Windows now supports disambiguating f and
""
   (empty) values
 * The misc/atom folder was removed in favor of the
factor/atom-language-factor
   repo.
 * The misc/Factor.tmbundle folder was removed in favor of the
   factor/factor.tmbundle repo.
 * The misc/vim folder was removed in favor of the factor/factor.vim repo.
 * The http vocabulary request tuple had a slot rename from post-data to
data.
 * The furnace.asides vocabulary had a slot rename from post-data to data,
and
   might require running ALTER TABLE asides RENAME COLUMN "post-data" TO
data;.
 * The html.streams vocabulary was renamed to io.streams.html
 * The pdf.streams vocabulary was renamed to io.streams.pdf

For more details, please see the full announcement at:

  https://re.factorcode.org/2025/12/factor-0-101-now-available.html

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Zoltán K. <zo...@pr...>]

Yeah, the issue occurs because libgtkglext1-dev is no longer included in recent Debian releases like Trixie.

You could use the temporary Bullseye repository to install libgtkglext1-dev, as I outlined in my previous email. This should allow the current build to run on Trixie.

Or you could wait for the new Factor backend, which replaces the GTK2 + GtkGLExt UI entirely and will resolve this issue without needing deprecated libraries.

On Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 at 7:00 PM, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk <fac...@li...> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Just to clarify. I can't run the current build under Trixie (see
> below). Looks like the new backend will sort it - good thing.
>
> > # ./factor
> > Cannot resolve C library function
> > Library: DLL" libgtkglext-x11-1.0.so"
> > Symbol: gtk_gl_init
> > DlError: none
> > See https://concatenative.org/wiki/view/Factor/Requirements
> >
> > (U) [ c-to-factor => ]
> > c-to-factor
> > (U) [ [ (get-catchstack) push ] dip call => (get-catchstack) pop* ]
> > (O) command-line-startup
> > (O) with-ui
> > (O) M\ gtk2-ui-backend (with-ui)
> > (U) [
> > OBJ-CURRENT-THREAD special-object error-thread set-global
> > current-continuation => error-continuation set-global
> > [ original-error set-global ] [ rethrow ] bi
> > ]
>
>
> On Wed, 8 Oct 2025 12:31:36 -0400
> John Benediktsson mr...@gm... wrote:
>
> > We’re pretty close to having a GTK3 or 4 backend which would solve
> > this nicely.
> >
> > PRs welcome!
> >
> > > On Oct 8, 2025, at 12:25 PM, Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
> > > fac...@li... wrote:
> > >
> > > No, it was not written by an LLM.
> > >
> > > If you disagree with the content, please address the substance
> > > directly rather than suggesting that my message was generated by an
> > > LLM.
> > >
> > > That said, you can verify this yourself here:
> > > https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=libgtkglext1-dev
> > >
> > > As you can see, bullseye (the release for which I provided a
> > > temporary workaround to obtain the package) is the last Debian
> > > version that includes it.
> > >
> > > And yes, you are absolutely correct, it is indeed a legitimate
> > > issue. I recommend that you, or Martin, submit a bug report on
> > > GitHub so that it can be properly tracked and addressed. :)
> > >
> > > Thank you.
> > >
> > > > On Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 at 5:33 PM, Jon Harper
> > > > jon...@gm... wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I think Martin just tried to use build.sh deps-apt and it doesn't
> > > > work on the latest Debian...? It does sound like a real problem.
> > > > https://github.com/factor/factor/blob/b06f7f0b25d7b8f7cc568379619fe673354dc271/build.sh#L776
> > > >
> > > > (Incidentally, it feels to me like the previous response could have
> > > > been written by an llm ? Not intending to be dismissing but the
> > > > response didn't seem very appropriate)
> > > >
> > > > Sorry I'm not bringing much to the table either, I just wanted to
> > > > say that Martin's question looks legitimate, maybe someone else
> > > > using Trixie can provide some more help ?
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at 4:15 PM Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
> > > > fac...@li... wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > `libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent
> > > > > Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around
> > > > > 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.
> > > > >
> > > > > First, check if it's still available in your repositories:
> > > > >
> > > > > `bash apt-cache search libgtkglext`
> > > > >
> > > > > If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from
> > > > > Debian Trixie. Your options are:
> > > > >
> > > > > Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)
> > > > >
> > > > > `bash # Add bullseye sources temporarily echo "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update sudo apt install libgtkglext1-dev sudo rm /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update`
> > > > >
> > > > > Option 2: Build from source
> > > > >
> > > > > `bash sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat git clone https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git cd gtkglext ./autogen.sh make sudo make install`
> > > > >
> > > > > Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org,
> > > > > which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider
> > > > > migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3),
> > > > > Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.
> > > > >
> > > > > ---
> > > > >
> > > > > https://zolk3ri.name
> > > > >
> > > > > -------- Original Message --------
> > > > >
> > > > > > On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk
> > > > > > fac...@li... wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Installing dependencies I get:
> > > > > > E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Also tried the latest build - no joy.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Regards,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Martin Nicholas.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout
> > > > > > 2025).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Factor-talk mailing list
> > > > > > Fac...@li...
> > > > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Factor-talk mailing list
> > > > > Fac...@li...
> > > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Factor-talk mailing list
> > > Fac...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Factor-talk mailing list
> > Fac...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>
>
>
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Martin Nicholas.
>
> E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Martin N. <fac...@mg...>]

Hello,

Just to clarify. I can't run the current build under Trixie (see
below). Looks like the new backend will sort it - good thing.

> # ./factor
> Cannot resolve C library function
> Library: DLL" libgtkglext-x11-1.0.so"
> Symbol: gtk_gl_init
> DlError: none
> See https://concatenative.org/wiki/view/Factor/Requirements
> 
> (U) [ c-to-factor => ]
>     c-to-factor
> (U) [ [ (get-catchstack) push ] dip call => (get-catchstack) pop* ]
> (O) command-line-startup
> (O) with-ui
> (O) M\ gtk2-ui-backend (with-ui)
> (U) [
>         OBJ-CURRENT-THREAD special-object error-thread set-global
>         current-continuation => error-continuation set-global
>         [ original-error set-global ] [ rethrow ] bi
>     ]

On Wed, 8 Oct 2025 12:31:36 -0400
John Benediktsson <mr...@gm...> wrote:

> We’re pretty close to having a GTK3 or 4 backend which would solve
> this nicely. 
> 
> PRs welcome!
> 
> 
> > On Oct 8, 2025, at 12:25 PM, Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
> > <fac...@li...> wrote:
> > 
> > No, it was not written by an LLM.
> > 
> > If you disagree with the content, please address the substance
> > directly rather than suggesting that my message was generated by an
> > LLM.
> > 
> > That said, you can verify this yourself here:
> > https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=libgtkglext1-dev
> > 
> > As you can see, bullseye (the release for which I provided a
> > temporary workaround to obtain the package) is the last Debian
> > version that includes it.
> > 
> > And yes, you are absolutely correct, it is indeed a legitimate
> > issue. I recommend that you, or Martin, submit a bug report on
> > GitHub so that it can be properly tracked and addressed. :)
> > 
> > Thank you.
> >   
> >> On Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 at 5:33 PM, Jon Harper
> >> <jon...@gm...> wrote:
> >> 
> >> I think Martin just tried to use build.sh deps-apt and it doesn't
> >> work on the latest Debian...? It does sound like a real problem.
> >> https://github.com/factor/factor/blob/b06f7f0b25d7b8f7cc568379619fe673354dc271/build.sh#L776
> >> 
> >> (Incidentally, it feels to me like the previous response could have
> >> been written by an llm ? Not intending to be dismissing but the
> >> response didn't seem very appropriate)
> >> 
> >> Sorry I'm not bringing much to the table either, I just wanted to
> >> say that Martin's question looks legitimate, maybe someone else
> >> using Trixie can provide some more help ?
> >> 
> >> On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at 4:15 PM Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
> >> fac...@li... wrote:
> >>   
> >>> `libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent
> >>> Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around
> >>> 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.
> >>> 
> >>> First, check if it's still available in your repositories:
> >>> 
> >>> `bash apt-cache search libgtkglext`
> >>> 
> >>> If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from
> >>> Debian Trixie. Your options are:
> >>> 
> >>> Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)
> >>> 
> >>> `bash # Add bullseye sources temporarily echo "deb
> >>> http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee
> >>> /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update sudo apt
> >>> install libgtkglext1-dev sudo rm
> >>> /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update`
> >>> 
> >>> Option 2: Build from source
> >>> 
> >>> `bash sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev
> >>> libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat git clone
> >>> https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git cd gtkglext
> >>> ./autogen.sh make sudo make install`
> >>> 
> >>> Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org,
> >>> which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.
> >>> 
> >>> I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider
> >>> migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3),
> >>> Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.
> >>> 
> >>> ---
> >>> 
> >>> https://zolk3ri.name
> >>> 
> >>> -------- Original Message --------  
> >>>> On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk
> >>>> fac...@li... wrote:  
> >>>   
> >>>> Installing dependencies I get:
> >>>> E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
> >>>> 
> >>>> Also tried the latest build - no joy.
> >>>> 
> >>>> --
> >>>> Regards,
> >>>> 
> >>>> Martin Nicholas.
> >>>> 
> >>>> E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout
> >>>> 2025).
> >>>> 
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Factor-talk mailing list
> >>>> Fac...@li...
> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk  
> >>> 
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Factor-talk mailing list
> >>> Fac...@li...
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk  
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Factor-talk mailing list
> > Fac...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk  
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk



-- 
Regards,

Martin Nicholas.

E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

We’re pretty close to having a GTK3 or 4 backend which would solve this nicely. 

PRs welcome!


> On Oct 8, 2025, at 12:25 PM, Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk <fac...@li...> wrote:
> 
> No, it was not written by an LLM.
> 
> If you disagree with the content, please address the substance directly rather than suggesting that my message was generated by an LLM.
> 
> That said, you can verify this yourself here: https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=libgtkglext1-dev
> 
> As you can see, bullseye (the release for which I provided a temporary workaround to obtain the package) is the last Debian version that includes it.
> 
> And yes, you are absolutely correct, it is indeed a legitimate issue. I recommend that you, or Martin, submit a bug report on GitHub so that it can be properly tracked and addressed. :)
> 
> Thank you.
> 
>> On Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 at 5:33 PM, Jon Harper <jon...@gm...> wrote:
>> 
>> I think Martin just tried to use build.sh deps-apt and it doesn't work
>> on the latest Debian...? It does sound like a real problem.
>> https://github.com/factor/factor/blob/b06f7f0b25d7b8f7cc568379619fe673354dc271/build.sh#L776
>> 
>> (Incidentally, it feels to me like the previous response could have
>> been written by an llm ? Not intending to be dismissing but the
>> response didn't seem very appropriate)
>> 
>> Sorry I'm not bringing much to the table either, I just wanted to say
>> that Martin's question looks legitimate, maybe someone else using
>> Trixie can provide some more help ?
>> 
>> On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at 4:15 PM Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
>> fac...@li... wrote:
>> 
>>> `libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.
>>> 
>>> First, check if it's still available in your repositories:
>>> 
>>> `bash apt-cache search libgtkglext`
>>> 
>>> If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from Debian Trixie. Your options are:
>>> 
>>> Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)
>>> 
>>> `bash # Add bullseye sources temporarily echo "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update sudo apt install libgtkglext1-dev sudo rm /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update`
>>> 
>>> Option 2: Build from source
>>> 
>>> `bash sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat git clone https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git cd gtkglext ./autogen.sh make sudo make install`
>>> 
>>> Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org, which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.
>>> 
>>> I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3), Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.
>>> 
>>> ---
>>> 
>>> https://zolk3ri.name
>>> 
>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk fac...@li... wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Installing dependencies I get:
>>>> E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
>>>> 
>>>> Also tried the latest build - no joy.
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Martin Nicholas.
>>>> 
>>>> E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Factor-talk mailing list
>>>> Fac...@li...
>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Factor-talk mailing list
>>> Fac...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Zoltán K. <zo...@pr...>]

No, it was not written by an LLM.

If you disagree with the content, please address the substance directly rather than suggesting that my message was generated by an LLM.

That said, you can verify this yourself here: https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=libgtkglext1-dev

As you can see, bullseye (the release for which I provided a temporary workaround to obtain the package) is the last Debian version that includes it.

And yes, you are absolutely correct, it is indeed a legitimate issue. I recommend that you, or Martin, submit a bug report on GitHub so that it can be properly tracked and addressed. :)

Thank you.

On Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 at 5:33 PM, Jon Harper <jon...@gm...> wrote:

> I think Martin just tried to use build.sh deps-apt and it doesn't work
> on the latest Debian...? It does sound like a real problem.
> https://github.com/factor/factor/blob/b06f7f0b25d7b8f7cc568379619fe673354dc271/build.sh#L776
> 
> (Incidentally, it feels to me like the previous response could have
> been written by an llm ? Not intending to be dismissing but the
> response didn't seem very appropriate)
> 
> Sorry I'm not bringing much to the table either, I just wanted to say
> that Martin's question looks legitimate, maybe someone else using
> Trixie can provide some more help ?
> 
> On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at 4:15 PM Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
> fac...@li... wrote:
> 
> > `libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.
> > 
> > First, check if it's still available in your repositories:
> > 
> > `bash apt-cache search libgtkglext`
> > 
> > If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from Debian Trixie. Your options are:
> > 
> > Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)
> > 
> > `bash # Add bullseye sources temporarily echo "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update sudo apt install libgtkglext1-dev sudo rm /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list sudo apt update`
> > 
> > Option 2: Build from source
> > 
> > `bash sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat git clone https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git cd gtkglext ./autogen.sh make sudo make install`
> > 
> > Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org, which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.
> > 
> > I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3), Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.
> > 
> > ---
> > 
> > https://zolk3ri.name
> > 
> > -------- Original Message --------
> > On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk fac...@li... wrote:
> > 
> > > Installing dependencies I get:
> > > E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
> > > 
> > > Also tried the latest build - no joy.
> > > 
> > > --
> > > Regards,
> > > 
> > > Martin Nicholas.
> > > 
> > > E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Factor-talk mailing list
> > > Fac...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Factor-talk mailing list
> > Fac...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Jon H. <jon...@gm...>]

I think Martin just tried to use build.sh deps-apt and it doesn't work
on the latest Debian...? It does sound like a real problem.
https://github.com/factor/factor/blob/b06f7f0b25d7b8f7cc568379619fe673354dc271/build.sh#L776

(Incidentally, it feels to me like the previous response could have
been written by an llm ? Not intending to be dismissing but the
response didn't seem very appropriate)

Sorry I'm not bringing much to the table either, I just wanted to say
that Martin's question looks legitimate, maybe someone else using
Trixie can provide some more help ?

On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at 4:15 PM Zoltán Kéri via Factor-talk
<fac...@li...> wrote:
>
> `libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.
>
> First, check if it's still available in your repositories:
>
> ```bash
> apt-cache search libgtkglext
> ```
>
> If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from Debian Trixie. Your options are:
>
> **Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)**
>
> ```bash
> # Add bullseye sources temporarily
> echo "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list
> sudo apt update
> sudo apt install libgtkglext1-dev
> sudo rm /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list
> sudo apt update
> ```
>
> **Option 2: Build from source**
>
> ```bash
> sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat
> git clone https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git
> cd gtkglext
> ./autogen.sh
> make
> sudo make install
> ```
>
> Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org, which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.
>
> I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3), Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.
>
> ---
>
> https://zolk3ri.name
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk <fac...@li...> wrote:
>
> >  Installing dependencies I get:
> >  E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
> >
> >  Also tried the latest build - no joy.
> >
> >  --
> >  Regards,
> >
> >  Martin Nicholas.
> >
> >  E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).
> >
> >
> >  _______________________________________________
> >  Factor-talk mailing list
> >  Fac...@li...
> >  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Factor-talk mailing list
> Fac...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk

Re: [Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Zoltán K. <zo...@pr...>]

`libgtkglext1-dev` is deprecated and has been removed from recent Debian releases. GtkGLExt hasn't been maintained since around 2012 and doesn't support GTK+ 3 or later.

First, check if it's still available in your repositories:

```bash
apt-cache search libgtkglext
```

If you actually need `libgtkglext1-dev`, it's likely gone from Debian Trixie. Your options are:

**Option 1: Try Debian Bullseye (oldstable)**

```bash
# Add bullseye sources temporarily
echo "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list
sudo apt update
sudo apt install libgtkglext1-dev
sudo rm /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bullseye.list
sudo apt update
```

**Option 2: Build from source**

```bash
sudo apt install libgtk2.0-dev libglu1-mesa-dev libgl1-mesa-dev pangox-compat
git clone https://gitlab.gnome.org/Archive/gtkglext.git
cd gtkglext
./autogen.sh
make
sudo make install
```

Note: I'm currently unable to access https://gitlab.gnome.org, which might be an issue on my end. You may need to find a mirror.

I have no idea what you are doing, but if possible, consider migrating to modern alternatives like GtkGLArea (part of GTK+ 3), Epoxy, SDL2, or GLFW.

---

https://zolk3ri.name


-------- Original Message --------
On 2025-10-04 16:01, Martin Nicholas via Factor-talk <fac...@li...> wrote:

>  Installing dependencies I get:
>  E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev
>  
>  Also tried the latest build - no joy.
>  
>  --
>  Regards,
>  
>  Martin Nicholas.
>  
>  E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).
>  
>  
>  _______________________________________________
>  Factor-talk mailing list
>  Fac...@li...
>  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/factor-talk
>  

[Factor-talk] Running under Debian Trixie (stable)

[Martin N. <fac...@mg...>]

Installing dependencies I get:
E: Unable to locate package libgtkglext1-dev

Also tried the latest build - no joy.

-- 
Regards,

Martin Nicholas.

E-mail: rep...@mg... (Address will be valid throughout 2025).

Re: [Factor-talk] command-line.parser but with commands?

[toastal <to...@po...>]

> Argument parsing is a deep topic and few libraries fit all use cases.

I understand that. The my goal here is wanting to ‘bundle’ a collection
of tiny, related applications (like the aforementioned ``git`` &
``pijul`` examples) but avoiding the startup times / executable size of
dispatching to separate executables.

An alternative approach would be understanding how to best share code /
an image if needed to accomplish said task instead of shipping multiple
copies of very similar images.

> Argument parsing is a deep topic and few libraries fit all use cases.

Alternative 2 might be exposing more of the ``PRIVATE`` bits to
consumers since many of the pieces are there to assemble your own
system, but the exposed vocab kinda forces the consumer into
using the vocab in a singular way. Unsure.

> http://docopt.org

I did see this mentioned in the origin argument parsing weblog post. But
it does seem the project `would need to be resurrected if used
<https://github.com/docopt/docopt/issues/519>`_.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think I should just let these ideas marinate in my mind me a while as
there might a simpler solution — even if were some hack like throwing
$INSERT_LANGUAGE’s argument parser to do the dispatch. 

But speaking of the `Re: Factor <https://re.factorcode.org>`_ blog… it
is a great corpus of a decade of code examples & thought process — which
is often quite humorous / entertaining. It’s a good read & valuable
regardless of programming language background.

Re: [Factor-talk] command-line.parser but with commands?

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

> Regardless of whether going ``foo add`` or ``foo substract`` there is
> still value is top-level flags beyond ``--help`` — namely ``--version``.
> I wouldn’t expect to need to add ``--version`` flags to both ``add`` &
> ``subtract``, & while I could, downstream users would be confused that
> they need to use ``foo add --version`` or ``foo substract --version``,
> but not ``foo --version``. As a developer, I need to choose to opt into
> ``with-commands`` or ``with-options`` as either will fail if parsing
> came up blank. I can assume there is a try-catch mechanism that could be
> used to run ``with-options`` first for top-level, then try
> ``with-commands``, but that doesn’t seem like the intended UX but a
> hack.

Some good points.  I guess I would say:

It likely does needs to be extended to support top-level options.

The developer would typically know if they want sub-commands and opt-into the specific parser they want.

Argument parsing is a deep topic and few libraries fit all use cases.

I had hesitated to promote command-line.parser to basis/ as it feels a little clunky, which is partly due to inheriting the clunky-ness that python's ArgumentParser contained.

I've wanted a docopt style parser for Factor, for awhile.  See http://docopt.org/ for more info.   Contributions welcome!

If you come up with improvements, please let us know.

Thanks,
John.

Re: [Factor-talk] command-line.parser but with commands?

[toastal <to...@po...>]

> I think the command-line.parser vocab works as-is, but it's a little
> unwieldy and maybe more fragile than it should be.  Improvements and
> PRs welcome. 
>
> Let me know how that works (or not) for you.
>
> Thanks,
> John.

On second thought, while the help text is working as expected &
CONSTANT: COMMANDS *looks* about what I expected, the actual usage /
ergonomics are not what I expected. Maybe I am using it wrong… I did
hdo catch the post via Atom in my feed reader:
https://re.factorcode.org/2025/07/command-arguments.html

For one:

> There are other features we might want to add to this including
> per-command metadata with a brief description of the command, support
> for additional top-level options besides just the command, and perhaps
> a different way of handling the no command case rather than empty
> output.

Regardless of whether going ``foo add`` or ``foo substract`` there is
still value is top-level flags beyond ``--help`` — namely ``--version``.
I wouldn’t expect to need to add ``--version`` flags to both ``add`` &
``subtract``, & while I could, downstream users would be confused that
they need to use ``foo add --version`` or ``foo substract --version``,
but not ``foo --version``. As a developer, I need to choose to opt into
``with-commands`` or ``with-options`` as either will fail if parsing
came up blank. I can assume there is a try-catch mechanism that could be
used to run ``with-options`` first for top-level, then try
``with-commands``, but that doesn’t seem like the intended UX but a
hack.

The options type is ``{ T{ } }``,   but commands is ``H{ "" { T{ }
} }`` so they can’t intermingle (which is why I had mentioned
``commands`` as a possible option type in the original email rather than
a separate parsing style one must choose between).

Secondly:

I can’t just have a bare command like ``version`` that prints the
version (in lieu of no ``--version``). An option would be like

.. code:: factor

	SYMBOL: version
	
	MAIN: [
	   H{
	      {
	         "version"
	         {
	            T{ option
	               { name "--version" }
	               { type boolean }
	               { default t }
	               { variable version }
	            }
	         }
	      }
	      {
	   } [ version get . ] with-commands
	]

With like a phantom default boolean that could be checked, but it this
definitely feels like another hack. Leading to…

Thirdly:

Maybe the UX is off entirely as I would assume subcommands would lead to
their own branches like

.. code:: factor

	H{
	    {
	       "add"
	       [ ! call this quotation for “add” options
	       ]
	    }
	    {
	       "subtract"
	       [ ! call this quotation for ”substract” options
	       ]
	    }
	} TOP-LEVEL-OPTIONS with-commands-&-options

where the inner quotations might behave like ``with-options`` on their
respective options a bit like ``cond`` traversing/dispatching on the
hashmap rather than a flattening of say ``SYMBOL``s at the global level
& tons of if null checks to try to guess the user’s intent. 

With a UX more along these lines, I think the ``foo version`` (or
whatever bare command one could want) would have been covered since its
options could have been left empty rather than the phantom
``--version``. It also could avoid series of global checks as once in
the ``add`` branch, all other branches are definitely irrelevant &
shouldn’t be checked.

— toastal

Re: [Factor-talk] command-line.parser but with commands?

[toastal <to...@po...>]

> Perhaps this latest change helps you.
>
> https://github.com/factor/factor/commit/666a44bfc2b24b811bfde3a971e09a56ae7ad581

Oh, this looks like what I would expect from command-line.parser
library. Excellent, excellent work!

Re: [Factor-talk] command-line.parser but with commands?

[John B. <mr...@gm...>]

Perhaps this latest change helps you.

https://github.com/factor/factor/commit/666a44bfc2b24b811bfde3a971e09a56ae7ad581

If you define your commands list ("add", "subtract"):

https://paste.factorcode.org/paste?id=4743

You can see that it works more-or-less as you expect:

$ ./factor foo.factor

$ ./factor foo.factor --help
Usage:
    factor foo.factor [--help] [command]

Arguments:
    command    {add,subtract}

Options:
    --help    show this help and exit

$ ./factor foo.factor add --help
Usage:
    factor foo.factor add [--help] [a]

Arguments:
    a

Options:
    --help    show this help and exit

$ ./factor foo.factor multiply
ERROR: Invalid value 'multiply' for option 'command'

I think the command-line.parser vocab works as-is, but it's a little unwieldy and maybe more fragile than it should be.  Improvements and PRs welcome. 

Let me know how that works (or not) for you.

Thanks,
John.


> On Jul 7, 2025, at 12:08 PM, toastal <to...@po...> wrote:
> 
> It is pretty close, but the thing with command-line.parser, is that you
> can get --help (& in the future, command line completions, manpages,
> etc.) for free if following its API. That was the part that the big
> appeal over just coding my own over a switch statement.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> Fac...@li...
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