Re: [Embedlets-developer] Re: Visual Age....

[Brill P. <bri...@ro...>]

Hey James... when I reply to you, I get the list address in the To: field...
how did you manage that?

I'm wondering if I can get Outlook Express to do that ;)

- Brill Pappin
  Rogue Robotics
  www.roguerobotics.com


----- Original Message -----
From: "James Caska" <ca...@vi...>
To: <emb...@li...>
Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 11:28 PM
Subject: RE: [Embedlets-developer] Re: Visual Age....


> >Umm... what do you use by the way?
>
> I sleep with the enemy - J++ with Visual Interdev. Seriously I love being
> able to integrate Java with VB/C++ app's via COM. Microsoft's J++
technology
> is actually pretty darn impressive - in fact it was the nuturing ground
for
> their entire .NET platform IMO.
>
> JC
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: emb...@li...
> > [mailto:emb...@li...]On Behalf Of
> > Brill Pappin
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 3:02 PM
> > To: emb...@li...
> > Subject: Re: [Embedlets-developer] Re: Visual Age....
> >
> >
> >
> > > > First time I tried this I was sold. I haven't found another IDE that
> > comes
> > > > even close. I think having something like this around would greatly
> > > > enhance acceptance of embedlets.
> > >
> > > You ever had to maintain the underlying code that is generated by such
> > tools.
> > > It's ugly and typically unmaintainable.....but in the real world you
> > always have
> > > to dig into the code (every reasonably complex project I have ever
seen
> > > has).....so the costs soon outweight the benefits.
> >
> > That was one of my main problems with it as well, the code it
> > generated was
> > all over the place, and it was difficult get into the code once VAJ had
> > created it. Frankly, I loved it when I first tried it... and it did have
> > some "cool" features, but in the end I found I had to switch
> > back. One thing
> > I did like though, was how it managed *every*  class and
> > interface... and it
> > forced you to view and think of the classes in an "OO way", which is why
I
> > still think it has value and I use it for teaching when I have to do
that
> > sort of work. Nothing forces a student to really *get it* than
> > working in an
> > environment that makes you think and work in OO and in java in
particular.
> >
> > > > The demo is 'old' as IBM is moving to eclipse and support for
> > Visual Age
> > > > will stop in the (near) future.
> > >
> > > And so why are you recommending VAJ when it is already obsolete?
Guess
> > > the GUI builder just wasn't that useful in the real world after all.
;-)
> >
> > Eclipse is the "new" VAJ. I am happy to say that I am far more impressed
> > with Eclipse... not only have the removed a lot of the garbage, but your
> > source tree/project structure is intact (you can even change its
location,
> > though not easily), you so can plug it into an existing
> > project... even use
> > CVS.
> >
> > It's good enough that I might even use it (VAJ fans can even make it
look
> > like VAJ)... only trouble is that its editor is not great (the text
entry
> > part is not "smart enough") and its missing a lot of the tools and UI
> > enhancements that JEdit plugins provide. Its also designed for Java
> > specifically, where JEdit allows me to work with anything (can
> > you tell I'm
> > a JEdit fan?). It also seems to have a very slightly funky
> > environment that
> > causes normal ant builds to fail (you can execute Ant targets in
> > Eclipse) so
> > you have to be careful how you set up Ant.
> >
> > I was also a little concerned about its strong tie to IBM (being an IBM
> > product)... not that I mind that much, but it was a little
> > disappointing and
> > it worried me a little that IBM could start charging for it or do
> > just about
> > anything else to it, at any time.
> >
> > Anyway. You use what you use, I'll use JEdit, and other folks can use
> > Eclipse. Umm... what do you use by the way?
> >
> > - Brill Pappin
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >
>
>
>
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