refentry and bibliography

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#148 refentry and bibliography

Status: closed-accepted

Owner: nobody

Labels: None

Priority: 5

Updated: 2004-05-03

Created: 2003-05-23

Creator: Sam Steingold

Private: No

many man pages, especially those for programs
that implement a certain known standard,
would contain a reference to a book or a standards
document in the "See Also" section.

bibliography is allowed in
appendix, article, book, chapter, glossary, part, preface,
sect1, sect2, sect3, sect4, sect5, section,

but not refsection!

I propose allowing bibliography in refsection and
refsect[12345].

See also
<http://article.gmane.org/gmane.text.docbook.misc/2812>

Discussion

Michael(tm) Smith - 2003-05-25

labels: 321157 -->

assigned_to: nwalsh --> nobody
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Michael(tm) Smith - 2003-05-25

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Note that this RFE is actually a duplicate of an existing
RFE, #435518 -

http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=21935&atid=384107&func=detail&aid=435518

It looks like that RFE was closed in over a year ago without
any change
being made to the DTD. The last part of the comment attached
to it says:

Norm suggests that BiblioList could be added, parallel to
GlossList,
which would allow authors to create a RefSect1 that
effectively
contains a bibliography.

Proposed: consensus is not forming. Post to DocBook list
and ask them.

But it doesn't look like any significant response ever came
back from
the list about it. The last mention of that RFE in the TC
records is in
the minutes for the November 2001 meeting.

Note that we also have an open RFE requesting that
Bibliography be allowed in Refentry. See RFE 686733
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=686733&group_id=21935&atid=384107
and see the meeting minutes from April 2003 -

http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/docbook/200304/msg00053.html

It looks like that one remains open pending feedback from
Dennis Evans.

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Sam Steingold - 2003-05-25

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1. Is there anything that _I_ could do to bring about
an implementation of this RFE?

2. how long will it take for this to be resolved?
the change appears to be next to trivial!

thanks!

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Michael(tm) Smith - 2003-05-27

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Hi Sam,

You wrote:

> 1. Is there anything that _I_ could do to bring about
> an implementation of this RFE?

Well, for starters, you could review the proposal at -

http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/docbook/200108/msg00081.html

And comment on which of the 4 options listed there you
think would work best.

Norm has suggested adding a new element, Bibliolist,
which would allow section-level bibliographies in the
same way the the existing Glosslist element allows
section-level glossaries.

What do you think of that idea?

Some examples of the content you are trying to mark up
would be helpful too.

> 2. how long will it take for this to be resolved?

If this change is made to the DTD, it probably won't
get done and released for several months

> the change appears to be next to trivial!

It may seem that way, but when the TC discussed it,
some serious concerns were raised about problems it
could cause in certain authoring/publishing
environments. Allowing it means that everybody will
need to implement support for it in their processing
apps; that's non-trivial.

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Sam Steingold - 2003-05-27

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I think that _both_ 1 _and_ 2 should be implemented.
glosslist is needed bacause people might
want to mention a book in the middle of the text.
Adding BG&I to the end of the content model of
RefEntry would make it more useful for the authors.

Think BibTeX: I have a file that defines some entities that
expand into biblioentries. I want to be able to add these
standard references to both reference manuals ("book") and
man pages ("refentry")...

I was half facetious when I wrote that it is easy to add
this to the DTD.
stylesheet implementors are, of course, the big stumbling block.
note that even now some dtd features are not implemented by the
stylesheets, so holding a necessary feature just because it
would
make some stylesheets even more incomplete does not seem like
a good idea.

thanks.

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Michael(tm) Smith - 2003-08-18

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I think this request may duplicate RFE 435518
(Allow bibliography in refsect1).

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Robert Stayton - 2004-05-03

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The TC added the bibliolist element in the November 2003
meeting, with no date yet for release in the DTD. The TC felt
bibliolist would satisfy this need.

<!ELEMENT bibliolist (blockinfo?,
(%formalobject.title.content;)?,
(biblioentry|bibliomixed)+)>

With common attributes.
To be allowed anywhere other sorts of lists are allowed.

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Robert Stayton - 2004-05-03

status: open --> closed-accepted
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