Two problems in the new 1581-drive emulation found
C64/Amiga emulator with shader and runAhead
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#78 Two problems in the new 1581-drive emulation found
Hello. First of all, Denise is a really good C64-emulator and i use it alot, for several months now. I was very happy, when i read in the nightly-history, that 1581-emulation is included now. Today, i tried around with this new feature. Works already pretty good overall, but so far, I also noticed two problems, that I would like to describe here:
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When I try to load a file on a D81 using the VDT-Autostart, Denise freezes and I have to restart the emulator. There are no problems with D64 files and VDT in Denise, so it seems to have something to do with the newly integrated D81 format.
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In some games it makes sense, using the Autowarp not only for the first file, but also for reloading-processes, to shorten them. I noticed that this works very well with the vast majority of games in D64 format, but not so well in D81 files so far. I tested only about five games on D81 and already found some problems with this feature. I have attached a few test-files in D81 format for you, where this can be seen clearly. In both of these D81 files, this 'Turrican 2' and this 'World Class Leaderboard' version, only about half of the reloading processes are accelerated by the Autowarp, in the other half, the Autowarp does not turn on. You can get a good comparison, if you take a look at this attached D64 version of 'Leaderboard'. There are exactly the same files, on these two D64 files as on the D81 file (this D81 was created from the two D64 files, using the PC-tool 64Copy V4.46). But while on the D64 all reloading processes of 'W.C. Leaderboard' are accelerated by the Autowarp, on the D81 file of the game, it's only about half of them. So it must have something to do with the disk-format, since the loaders in this game remain the same.
Best regards,
TOM
Discussion
Anonymous
Let me add.
When testing the attached test files, I noticed that when I drag'n'drop a .d81 or .d64 disk on Denise, it changes the drive internally, but in the system tab of the configuration, the change in the drive model is not visible, but remains the same as before. A bit confusing.
Best regards,
John
Yes, i also recognized that, John. It's very good, that Denise changes the drive-model automatically, because then the different diskfiles can be used directly and not only, after the user has selected a new drive-model every time. But indeed, you are right, the system-configuration menue of Denise, then should also show the new drive-model, to which the emulator has switched now. Good point.
Regards,
TOM
Thanks for answering. VDT with 1581 works now and it indeed improves the Autowarp (for reloading processes) on d81-files , when "drive emulation on demand" is turned off, as you wrote. Then the Autowarp always turns on now, at least in all the d81-files, I have tried so far.
Nevertheless, in reloading processes of a game, the Autowarp don't work as good, as it does in d64-files so far. I found out, that it often turns off to late, when loading from a d81. In "Turrican 2" for example, the function "input check finish warp" helps here and then it works good. In "W.C. Leaderboard" this don't really help, because also there, the Autowarp often turns off to late.
But okay, it don't work bad, it only don't work as good, as it does with d64-files so far. But the 1581-emulation is still very new in Denise and maybe it can improve in the future, when the Autowarp can be better adapted, to the motor-behavior of the 1581, as has already happened with the 1541 and 1541-II longer time ago.
Best regards,
TOM
Forgot about the last point you mentioned. In my opinion (don't know what others think about it), it would be totally acceptable, if the menue would show something wrong in such cases, when using two different drive models at the same time in Denise, because I think, such a case would only occur very rarely. There are very few reasons anyway, to use more than one floppy in C64 emulation and then even rarer it will be, to use two different drive-models then. If the menue, in those special cases, then only shows one drive-model correctly, I think it would be completely acceptable. In any case, this is still better than the fact, that, when using one floppy (which will probably be the reality in 99% of use-cases), the correct drive model is never displayed in the menue.
Regards,
TOM
Regardless, as a satisfaction, there remains an option in Audio/Drives where the sound of the 3.5 inch drive can be set as "1581-amiga drive" and in this way it is possible to distinguish between the change of drives 1541 and 1581 after inserting a diskette.
Regards,
John
Displaying the currently used drive has some disadvantages:
Confusing view when using 2 different drives.
Users of the 1541, 1541C, 1570 lose their choices as D64 switches to the 1541-II.
This view is there to set the user's default drive. A D71/D81 that is replaced in from time to time should not permanently change the standard drive.
Yes, a view of the currently used drive would be helpful, but not at this point. Maybe an on screen message that informs about it.
"Drive 1581 has been activated in Device 8"
edit: to improve autoload please check if it works better for you if you disable "disk emulation on demand". I assume that is unfavourable for the motor behaviour of 1581.
As I said, the drive motor decides whether warp is on or off. If the software switches the motor very late, this is unfavorable for the warp. If a program is fully loaded, this does not mean that the motor is switched off directly.
Last edit: PiCiJi 2024-11-16
Okay, I understand the problem you described, with the default-drive of the user. An onscreen-message of the current drive-model could be better than nothing, but on the other side, such a message is not permanently visible, but only for some seconds. Therefore I am not sure, if this would make sense at all then. Then maybe you can leave it also, as it is now.
Yes, i already deactivated "disk emulation on demand" for some testing, as i had written in my last comment. This helped ensure, that the Autowarp then always started, for D81 files, during reloading processes. However, it could not prevent the Autowarp from often turning off too late. Maybe reason for this is, that 1581 drives already load faster than 1541/1541II disks and that the Autowarp is optimized for 1541 at the moment?
The same versions of games behave differently, regarding if a D64 or a D81 is used. So it's not the case that, for example 'W.C. Leaderboard', generally turns off the Autowarp too late (but there will probably be games like that too), because if the 'Leaderboard' files are on a D64, it works correctly with the Autowarp in this game. But if you then copy exactly the same files, from the two D64 to a D81, the Autowarp sometimes turns off too late in this game. In this example, the problem seems to be not the game itself, but the medium it is on, respectively the used drive-model. Maybe in the future, the Autowarp for reloading-processes in games, can be better adapted to the 1581?
the problem is that the 1581 drive motor is switched off very late.
Although the loading is finished, the drive motor continues to run for quite a while.
I've improved "disk emulation on demand" for 1581 in the current nightly.
Tried out the newest nightly and the AutoWarp in d81 files, works a bit better now, for realoding-processes. Not as good, as it works with d64 files generelly, but better than before, in the old nightly. Also find out, that JiffyDOS can have an influence too, on the AutoWarp behavior, especially when d81 files are used (and not that much on d64 files, at least that's what my tests showed today).
Last question about this topic. Have you changed the 'disk emulation on demand' function only for 1581 now, or have you changed it altogether now, for all drives? I ask, because this function worked nearly perfect for 1541 drives before, therefore I hope, nothing was changed on that and that it was only adapted now, when the user loads from a d81, respectively when a 1581 is used in Denise?
Regards,
TOM
Hy. I wanted to repeat my last question to this topic. Have you changed the 'disk emulation on demand' function only for 1581 now, or have you changed someting on it, that has influence on all the different drive models (1541/1541-II/1571/1581)? I guess, the new changes only active, if a 1581 is used, right?
Regards,
TOM
changes shouldn't affect 1541
That's good, thanks for the info.
I think, case closed then, for now. Maybe sometime in the future, the AutoWarp can be a bit better optimized, for the different technical behavior of the 1581, that it works as well there, as for the 1541/1541-II? But there's no rush, to do this right now, because overall d81 files are working good now and I'm glad, that d81 files are now usable in Denise.
Regards,
TOM