Re: [Boa Constr] [wxPython-users] Question on opinions...

[Chris S. <csp...@ci...>]

On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 11:09:22 +0100, "Werner F. Bruhin"
<wer...@fr...> wrote:
>Could you provide patches for any stuff which is of interest for others? 
>  Me and others can then test things and if they work in our setup ask 
>Riaan to apply it.

As I've indicated, I've monkey-patched BOA so much that I'm having
problems determining what can be safely applied to a base BOA install.
My WinDiff looks like a Christmas tree... :)

>Have a look at WingIDE free for open source projects otherwise it costs. 
>  I've looked at it a little while ago and still have the evaluation 
>copy on my machine - it is the nicest/best I have seen besides Boa and 
>would be high on my list if ever I switch away from Boa.

I have looked at it.  90% of my coding is on what will become a
commercial product (though someone might have to shoot me and grab my
hard drive to get it released...I'm relentlessly unhappy with my work,
making me spend time niggling over things).  That means I would be
honor bound to pay $179 for what is an impressive code editor.

Or I can use my $20 Textpad license.  And I'm cheap.  I've been using
Textpad since the days of Windows 95 and know its every grotty corner
and hidden feature.  It's a COMFORT thing, rather than a LOGIC thing,
I know.  But there you have it...

>> For debugging, I've never run across a debugger that is more flexible
>> than a print statement.
>Sometimes yes, but that means you already know where your bug is.

Oh, I've become proficient in narrowing down where bugs are using
"print".  In fact, it has gotten to the point that when I do Visual
Studio work (either VB.NET or C#), I am loathe to use the Visual
Studio debugger.

>Instead of print statements you should also look at the Python logging 
>module, that way your print/debug stuff can stay in the code instead of 
>having to add it/remove it etc.

I use the logging module for the work I'm doing.  In the beginning it
was invaluable.  Now it just generates gigabyte-sized debug files that
I delete every few days.  I really must go through my code and put
those logging statements on some sort of hierarchical scale.  Right
now I capture exceptions to a MUCH shorter log file, and that is my
main form of debug logging these days.

>Yes I am willing to invest even a bit more of my time then I already do 
>into Boa which is still nothing compared to what Riaan is doing.

IS Riaan doing anything?  Currently?  I can't tell from his lack of
CVS commits to sourceforge and his non-presence on this list.  To me
it feels like he's moved on in his life.  AND THAT IS HIS RIGHT.  I'm
not complaining about that choice, if it has been made.  But I think
he should communicate where he is with respect to the BOA codebase and
his involvement in it.  There's been no release in 3 years, and no CVS
commits for much of that.

>However it would have to be with Riaan's participation as I don't think 
>this will be feasible without having at least access to his know how.

I agree that it's one hell of a learning curve.  It's one we might
have to travel if Riaan is completely unavailable.  For me it's
either...we have to do this or it won't get done and I'll have to move
away from BOA for my next huge investment of coding time.  Which
probably means moving away from wxPython...since there isn't another
GUI builder that doesn't make me want to put my fist through the
screen.

RE plug-ins:  Until you mentioned it, I didn't even know Boa HAD the
ability to do plug-ins.  I subsequently looked for information on them
and found exactly one page on the internet...in German...that
describes how they are used....
http://www.xing.com/net/python-programmierung/details-programmschnipsel-22580/boa-constructor-plugins-1454660/

The documentation INSIDE Boa is nonexistent on the topic of how to do
custom controls in the context of a plug-in.

Even if I travel up that learning curve (which, from that Germanic
tutorial, is simpler than what I have been doing), there are things
like the properties for dialogs (wx.DIALOG_MODAL, etc) that need to be
applied to the existing code base.  Also, I'm not sure if I'm a big
fan of forcing people to install Boa...and then have to manually
download a plug-in pack and place it in the plug-ins directory.  I'm
much enamored of the "batteries included" approach.

It's only by the grace of god and Robin's commitment to keeping
wxPython as backward compatible as humanly possible that allows Boa to
even be used.  I don't know what is going to happen when Project
Phoenix is finished.

>Werner

Chris.