From: Tom P. <to...@ts...> - 2001-01-21 22:04:18
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I had written, >> This problem seems to be with movement updates only; text updates (chat) >> seem good enough with delays of a second or less. Miguel replied, >UDP would speed things up. Has there been any discussion on implementing a UDP stream for server to client Perception messages? For example, the C2S_ASK_Perception would go through the established TCP connection, but S2C_Perception messages would only be sent back to the client via UDP. Instead of sending messages in batches or sending some sort of summary perception message (which make it look like mobiles/NPCs are teleporting), the server could send out a steady stream of Perception messages as they happen. If the server gets heavily loaded it could send n% of the Perception messages. (For example, only every other low priority Perception message could be sent.) This would mitigate any teleportation effects on the client. The client would send C2S_ASK_Perception messages (via the TCP connection) less frequently -- possibly only if the client thinks it has not received enough (or any) Perception messages to make the current client screen accurate enough. (What is accurate enough? That would have to be dealt with by experimentation.) With UDP updates, Perception messages could truly be asynchronous, and probably much more scalable. To implement this would be straightforward for the server, but the client would probably need an additional thread to listen for the UDP messages. (My appologies if this ground has already been covered.) Tom |
From: MIGUEL A. B. L. <x51...@fe...> - 2001-01-22 11:43:04
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> Miguel replied, > >UDP would speed things up. > > Has there been any discussion on implementing a UDP stream for server to > client Perception messages? For example, the C2S_ASK_Perception would go > through the established TCP connection, but S2C_Perception messages would > only be sent back to the client via UDP. Instead of sending messages in > batches or sending some sort of summary perception message (which make it > look like mobiles/NPCs are teleporting), the server could send out a steady > stream of Perception messages as they happen. If the server gets heavily > loaded it could send n% of the Perception messages. (For example, only > every > other low priority Perception message could be sent.) This would mitigate > any teleportation effects on the client. Yes, but also will increase bandwidth usage. One of our objetives is to make the server light, small CPU usage and small bandwidth usage. I think that the solution to the problem is PREDICTION and reducing the lapsus between PERCEPTION messages. So between PERCEPTIONS message the movement is predited. > The client would send C2S_ASK_Perception messages (via the TCP connection) > less frequently -- possibly only if the client thinks it has not received > enough (or any) Perception messages to make the current client screen > accurate enough. (What is accurate enough? That would have to be dealt with > by experimentation.) > With UDP updates, Perception messages could truly be asynchronous, and > probably much more scalable. To implement this would be straightforward for > the server, but the client would probably need an additional thread to > listen for the UDP messages. There is no problem with threads. :) QUESTION: This make me remember another question: Should client be threadless ? This would make mac port almost inmediate. At the cost of doing Network polling, Input polling and so... Bioware lastest game uses a threadless client. |
From: masahiro m. <el...@aa...> - 2001-01-22 12:34:21
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At 0:43 PM +0100 01.1.22, MIGUEL ANGEL BLANCH LARDIN wrote: >QUESTION: This make me remember another question: > >Should client be threadless ? >This would make mac port almost inmediate. >At the cost of doing Network polling, Input polling and so... > >Bioware lastest game uses a threadless client. Sorry but I'm totally clueless .... what I've done WORKED so far, but I know it's BAD. If threadless support is easy and worth trying ( i.e., makes your life and other's easy, too ), then please do... otherwise, I guess we should stick to whatever we've done...( and pray for more Mac people to find out Arianne..;)) Regards, -- masahiro minami el...@aa... PowerMac G3/233 MacOS 9.1 MacOS X Public Beta LinuxPPC exception handling : www2.age.ne.jp/~except |
From: MIGUEL A. B. L. <x51...@fe...> - 2001-01-22 16:57:27
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Mensaje citado por: masahiro minami <el...@aa...>: > At 0:43 PM +0100 01.1.22, MIGUEL ANGEL BLANCH LARDIN wrote: > >QUESTION: This make me remember another question: > > > >Should client be threadless ? > >This would make mac port almost inmediate. > >At the cost of doing Network polling, Input polling and so... > > > >Bioware lastest game uses a threadless client. > > Sorry but I'm totally clueless .... what I've done WORKED so far, > but I know it's BAD. No, I won't say bad, but as result of the new design a few things has to be changed on the client, also I am going to start adding the STL things. ( BTW Server is being recode in the whole, I am going to add also STL there, but threadless support isn't going to be avaliable ). So I wonder if it would be good to be threadless only, anyway as actual client I can do it to support both modes. > If threadless support is easy and worth trying ( i.e., makes your life > and other's easy, too ), then please do... otherwise, I guess > we should stick to whatever we've done...( and pray for more Mac people > to find out Arianne..;)) Yes, Threadless is easy to do. ( Just manuall call to the thread functions ). Well, when the game is really playable ( that is, when RP is done )I expect to see a real increase in users of the game. Actually, there is no BeOS users ( neither complaints ) nor MacOS users ( neither complaints ). But I think that we should keep development for these platforms no matter the number of users. |
From: otherwise <oth...@wo...> - 2001-01-23 17:40:25
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>Well, when the game is really playable ( that is, when RP is done )I >expect to see a real increase in users of the game. Actually, there is >no BeOS users ( neither complaints ) nor MacOS users ( neither >complaints ). >But I think that we should keep development for these platforms no >matter the number of users. There is at least one who spent hours to make it run but without any result. I keep trying anyway. |
From: MIGUEL A. B. L. <x51...@fe...> - 2001-01-24 10:05:38
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Mensaje citado por: otherwise <oth...@wo...>: > >Well, when the game is really playable ( that is, when RP is done )I > >expect to see a real increase in users of the game. Actually, there is > >no BeOS users ( neither complaints ) nor MacOS users ( neither > >complaints ). > >But I think that we should keep development for these platforms no > >matter the number of users. > There is at least one who spent hours to make it run but without any > result. > I keep trying anyway. Olivier, I understand you situation. For me to test Arianne on a new BeOS can take over 2~3 hours and later find the problem ( if I have it ). I can't spend now so many time on this. Also there haven't been any feedback from any BeOS user. And it has been downloaded several times on Bebits. I will try to look for it, but it has to wait for at least 16,Feb |
From: otherwise <oth...@wo...> - 2001-01-26 15:40:40
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>Olivier, I understand you situation. >For me to test Arianne on a new BeOS can take over 2~3 hours and later >find the problem ( if I have it ). I can't spend now so many time on >this. > >Also there haven't been any feedback from any BeOS user. And it has >been downloaded several times on Bebits. >I will try to look for it, but it has to wait for at least 16,Feb No problem. I prefer you working on the project or what you have to do in our job or life than loosing time in trying to help me to try arianne. I have the Windows version running. (enven if I hadn't it I wouldn't matter). Personnaly, I spent some times in trying to make Arianne running on BeOS and I think I know why your version runs and not mine (and maybe why others BeOS users runs too). But to help me to find out the resolution, could you just tell me if you have a volume or a folder called usr/ with folders usr/bin/ local mounted under Beos; it would be rather cool if u could answer. Otherwise I may have a person who is working on the problem (not sure). Bye, |
From: MIGUEL A. B. L. <x51...@fe...> - 2001-01-26 16:23:04
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No, I just installed the BeOS from be, and the installed the devtools. I will remove my BeOS and reinstall it again to try to find the problem, but as it is a time consumming task ( and I now need days of 36 hours :) ) I will delay it for at least ends of Feb. Anyway you don't need to compile it, just source and binary for BeOS should be enough. The /usr links that you see are related to the configure thing, that is not useful on BeOS. |