Thread: [Simplygnustep-discuss] News
Status: Alpha
Brought to you by:
cehardin
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-15 05:11:50
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Changes in code: Lot's of updates! Downgraded from the linux-2.5.x series to 2.4.21 because of big time compilation problems. the kernel itself compiles fine but glibc chokes on the 2.5.X headers. We should have no problem going to 2.6 when it's ready. Lot's of odd problems. the new binutils-2.14 refuses to compile statically. so ni the static portion of the bild process we build binutils-2.13.2.1 and from then on do 2.14. Adam Fedor (main GNUstep developer) write me and mentioned that MacUser magazine is interested in a cd of some sorts. Not sure what the time line is but I'd like to push out a new live cd for the mags as quickly as possbile. Of course the ultimate goal is a install cd. Laterz, Chad |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-21 01:43:46
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The new linux-2.6.0-test1 is out! I'm gonna give it a shot. If glibc will compile with it then we are a "go" for using linux-2.6! I'll let you all know how it goes later on today. Chad |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-28 07:06:18
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Still building that 2.6 kernel distro set. Man, this takes foerever! Anyone want to donate a 2.8GHZ PIV CPU chip? That would speed this up a lot. Actually, I wish I could get a DUAL XEON or something but I just can't afford that right now. Anyhow... Here's the deal. I'm compiling the source to use the new linux 2.6 test kernel. I won't know if it actually works until the whole darn source is compiled. I'll let you all know how that works though! As far as the graphical boot, here's the plan: The kernel will have the vesa framebuffer built in, so all boot up displays will be 16bit color at 800x600? I don't think all the vid cards out there will handle the switch to X11, we'll find out though. We can always fall back to regular VGA16 if this is a problem. Here's my thinking of how this will work: When the kernel is done booting, init is called and init calls rcS, right? The first thing rcS does is switch all stdout and stderr out to /var/log/bootmessages (is there a more proper way?). Then, a FIFO is created in /tmp. Next, a program we will write will monitor the FIFO in /tmp. this program will know how to draw stuff to the framebuffer. The init scripts will replace the "echo"s with a shell command which puts stuff in the FIFO. Let's call the shell command "BootMessage.sh" When our program reads the FIFO, it puts it on the framebuffer. finally, a X11 display manager is run, and that's that. Now, what to do when the user shutsdown and the display manger dies? I guess our program will still be open and watching the FIFO, so we can just go right back to graphical until poweroff? Pretty simple I hope. Unlike other similar projects, this does not require a kernel path. Kernel bootup messages can be removed with the "messages" kernel parameter. So, while the kernel is initializing, the penguiin will be there until our program is started and stuff starts getting fed to it from the FIFO. Any comments, suggestions, volunteers? :-) Chad |
From: Frank D. E. Jr. <fd...@ya...> - 2003-07-28 10:41:19
|
Not all monitors can handle 800x600; unless you intend to make this a minimum system requirement, I would suggest using 640x480 instead for bootstrap purposes. --- ceh...@ma... wrote: > Still building that 2.6 kernel distro set. Man, this takes foerever! > > Anyone want to donate a 2.8GHZ PIV CPU chip? That would speed this > up > a lot. Actually, I wish I could get a DUAL XEON or something but I > just can't afford that right now. > > Anyhow... > > Here's the deal. > > I'm compiling the source to use the new linux 2.6 test kernel. I > won't > know if it actually works until the whole darn source is compiled. > I'll let you all know how that works though! > > As far as the graphical boot, here's the plan: > > The kernel will have the vesa framebuffer built in, so all boot up > displays will be 16bit color at 800x600? I don't think all the vid > cards out there will handle the switch to X11, we'll find out though. > > We can always fall back to regular VGA16 if this is a problem. > > Here's my thinking of how this will work: > > When the kernel is done booting, init is called and init calls rcS, > right? The first thing rcS does is switch all stdout and stderr out > to > /var/log/bootmessages (is there a more proper way?). > Then, a FIFO is created in /tmp. > Next, a program we will write will monitor the FIFO in /tmp. this > program will know how to draw stuff to the framebuffer. > The init scripts will replace the "echo"s with a shell command which > puts stuff in the FIFO. Let's call the shell command "BootMessage.sh" > When our program reads the FIFO, it puts it on the framebuffer. > finally, a X11 display manager is run, and that's that. > Now, what to do when the user shutsdown and the display manger dies? > I > guess our program will still be open and watching the FIFO, so we can > > just go right back to graphical until poweroff? > > > Pretty simple I hope. Unlike other similar projects, this does not > require a kernel path. Kernel bootup messages can be removed with > the > "messages" kernel parameter. So, while the kernel is initializing, > the > penguiin will be there until our program is started and stuff starts > getting fed to it from the FIFO. > > > Any comments, suggestions, volunteers? :-) > > Chad > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites > including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss ===== ======= Frank D. Engel, Jr. Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle decelerator to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to counterproductive atmospheric penetration. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-30 22:26:52
|
I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to be completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, with a recommended of 1024x768. Chad On Monday, July 28, 2003, at 12:41 AM, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote: > Not all monitors can handle 800x600; unless you intend to make this a > minimum system requirement, I would suggest using 640x480 instead for > bootstrap purposes. > > --- ceh...@ma... wrote: >> Still building that 2.6 kernel distro set. Man, this takes foerever! >> >> Anyone want to donate a 2.8GHZ PIV CPU chip? That would speed this >> up >> a lot. Actually, I wish I could get a DUAL XEON or something but I >> just can't afford that right now. >> >> Anyhow... >> >> Here's the deal. >> >> I'm compiling the source to use the new linux 2.6 test kernel. I >> won't >> know if it actually works until the whole darn source is compiled. >> I'll let you all know how that works though! >> >> As far as the graphical boot, here's the plan: >> >> The kernel will have the vesa framebuffer built in, so all boot up >> displays will be 16bit color at 800x600? I don't think all the vid >> cards out there will handle the switch to X11, we'll find out though. >> >> We can always fall back to regular VGA16 if this is a problem. >> >> Here's my thinking of how this will work: >> >> When the kernel is done booting, init is called and init calls rcS, >> right? The first thing rcS does is switch all stdout and stderr out >> to >> /var/log/bootmessages (is there a more proper way?). >> Then, a FIFO is created in /tmp. >> Next, a program we will write will monitor the FIFO in /tmp. this >> program will know how to draw stuff to the framebuffer. >> The init scripts will replace the "echo"s with a shell command which >> puts stuff in the FIFO. Let's call the shell command "BootMessage.sh" >> When our program reads the FIFO, it puts it on the framebuffer. >> finally, a X11 display manager is run, and that's that. >> Now, what to do when the user shutsdown and the display manger dies? >> I >> guess our program will still be open and watching the FIFO, so we can >> >> just go right back to graphical until poweroff? >> >> >> Pretty simple I hope. Unlike other similar projects, this does not >> require a kernel path. Kernel bootup messages can be removed with >> the >> "messages" kernel parameter. So, while the kernel is initializing, >> the >> penguiin will be there until our program is started and stuff starts >> getting fed to it from the FIFO. >> >> >> Any comments, suggestions, volunteers? :-) >> >> Chad >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------- >> This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites >> including >> Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. >> Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. >> > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ > direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 >> _______________________________________________ >> Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list >> Sim...@li... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > > ===== > ======= > Frank D. Engel, Jr. > > Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle decelerator > to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to > counterproductive atmospheric penetration. > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ > direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss |
From: Peter-Henry M. <gn...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 06:23:27
|
Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything different looks quite unpleasant I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across systems for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If a system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too painfully old and slow to run SGstep. My P90 runs Linux+WindowMaker and it's barely adequate. I haven't bothered to dust down the 486-DX 66MHz in the garage! Pete. ceh...@ma... wrote: > I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to be > completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! > However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, with > a recommended of 1024x768. > > Chad > > > > On Monday, July 28, 2003, at 12:41 AM, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote: > >> Not all monitors can handle 800x600; unless you intend to make this a >> minimum system requirement, I would suggest using 640x480 instead for >> bootstrap purposes. >> >> --- ceh...@ma... wrote: >> >>> Still building that 2.6 kernel distro set. Man, this takes foerever! >>> >>> Anyone want to donate a 2.8GHZ PIV CPU chip? That would speed this >>> up >>> a lot. Actually, I wish I could get a DUAL XEON or something but I >>> just can't afford that right now. >>> >>> Anyhow... >>> >>> Here's the deal. >>> >>> I'm compiling the source to use the new linux 2.6 test kernel. I >>> won't >>> know if it actually works until the whole darn source is compiled. >>> I'll let you all know how that works though! >>> >>> As far as the graphical boot, here's the plan: >>> >>> The kernel will have the vesa framebuffer built in, so all boot up >>> displays will be 16bit color at 800x600? I don't think all the vid >>> cards out there will handle the switch to X11, we'll find out though. >>> >>> We can always fall back to regular VGA16 if this is a problem. >>> >>> Here's my thinking of how this will work: >>> >>> When the kernel is done booting, init is called and init calls rcS, >>> right? The first thing rcS does is switch all stdout and stderr out >>> to >>> /var/log/bootmessages (is there a more proper way?). >>> Then, a FIFO is created in /tmp. >>> Next, a program we will write will monitor the FIFO in /tmp. this >>> program will know how to draw stuff to the framebuffer. >>> The init scripts will replace the "echo"s with a shell command which >>> puts stuff in the FIFO. Let's call the shell command "BootMessage.sh" >>> When our program reads the FIFO, it puts it on the framebuffer. >>> finally, a X11 display manager is run, and that's that. >>> Now, what to do when the user shutsdown and the display manger dies? >>> I >>> guess our program will still be open and watching the FIFO, so we can >>> >>> just go right back to graphical until poweroff? >>> >>> >>> Pretty simple I hope. Unlike other similar projects, this does not >>> require a kernel path. Kernel bootup messages can be removed with >>> the >>> "messages" kernel parameter. So, while the kernel is initializing, >>> the >>> penguiin will be there until our program is started and stuff starts >>> getting fed to it from the FIFO. >>> >>> >>> Any comments, suggestions, volunteers? :-) >>> >>> Chad >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------- >>> This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites >>> including >>> Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. >>> Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. >>> >> http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ >> direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list >>> Sim...@li... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss >> >> >> >> ===== >> ======= >> Frank D. Engel, Jr. >> >> Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle >> decelerator to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to >> counterproductive atmospheric penetration. >> >> __________________________________ >> Do you Yahoo!? >> Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software >> http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------- >> This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including >> Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. >> Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. >> http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ >> direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 >> _______________________________________________ >> Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list >> Sim...@li... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > |
From: <d....@in...> - 2003-07-31 06:30:53
|
This depends on whether you only want to target desktop users. I can imagine people wanting to 'simply' :-) install GNUstep on servers with old superceded tiny monitors to run DO servers or GSWeb. Cheers, David > Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything different > looks quite unpleasant > > I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across systems > for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old > Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If a > system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too > painfully old and slow to run SGstep. My P90 runs Linux+WindowMaker and > it's barely adequate. I haven't bothered to dust down the 486-DX 66MHz > in the garage! > > Pete. > > ceh...@ma... wrote: >> I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to be >> completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! >> However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, >> with a recommended of 1024x768. >> >> Chad |
From: Peter-Henry M. <gn...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 06:59:30
|
Hi David, My impression is (forgive me if I'm wrong Chad) that SGstep *is* targeting the desktop. Maybe a flavour of "headless" SGstep is required for servers where a text console is all that is needed for bootstrapping, but logging on and running remote X11 sessions is supported. That would be great for my P90 :-) Bung in a CD, turn on, walk away. But I believe that there are other distributions that can do exactly that, so maybe that "market" is already catered for. I like the idea of using SGstep to turn a PC into a Mac clone. I think there's a big "market" opportunity for it. I don't remember seeing any other project like it. Chad, would you agree (in a simplistic way) that the aim of SGstep is to clone a Mac? Pete. d....@in... wrote: > This depends on whether you only want to target desktop users. I can > imagine people wanting to 'simply' :-) install GNUstep on servers with old > superceded tiny monitors to run DO servers or GSWeb. > > Cheers, > David > > > >>Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything different >>looks quite unpleasant >> >>I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across systems >>for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old >>Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If a >>system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too >>painfully old and slow to run SGstep. My P90 runs Linux+WindowMaker and >>it's barely adequate. I haven't bothered to dust down the 486-DX 66MHz >>in the garage! >> >>Pete. >> >>ceh...@ma... wrote: >> >>>I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to be >>> completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! >>> However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, >>>with a recommended of 1024x768. >>> >>>Chad >> > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 08:16:27
|
On Wednesday, July 30, 2003, at 08:59 PM, Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > Hi David, > > My impression is (forgive me if I'm wrong Chad) that SGstep *is* > targeting the desktop. Most definitely! > > Maybe a flavour of "headless" SGstep is required for servers where a > text console is all that is needed for bootstrapping, but logging on > and running remote X11 sessions is supported. That would be great for > my P90 :-) Bung in a CD, turn on, walk away. But I believe that there > are other distributions that can do exactly that, so maybe that > "market" is already catered for. Yes, that market is already full. Plus, do we really want to deal with the headache of creating a server OS? That's one of things that you can't mess around with due to security and such. > > I like the idea of using SGstep to turn a PC into a Mac clone. I think > there's a big "market" opportunity for it. I don't remember seeing any > other project like it. LinuxStep, but they have not been active for quite a while now. > > Chad, would you agree (in a simplistic way) that the aim of SGstep is > to clone a Mac? Yes, that is why I chose the name Prometheus. check out the definition: Greek Mythology. A Titan who stole fire from Olympus and gave it to humankind, for which Zeus chained him to a rock and sent an eagle to eat his liver, which grew back daily. If we are too successful, you can bet Apple will indeed eat our liver! :-) Chad > > Pete. > > d....@in... wrote: >> This depends on whether you only want to target desktop users. I can >> imagine people wanting to 'simply' :-) install GNUstep on servers >> with old >> superceded tiny monitors to run DO servers or GSWeb. >> Cheers, >> David >>> Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything >>> different >>> looks quite unpleasant >>> >>> I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across >>> systems >>> for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old >>> Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If >>> a >>> system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too >>> painfully old and slow to run SGstep. My P90 runs Linux+WindowMaker >>> and >>> it's barely adequate. I haven't bothered to dust down the 486-DX >>> 66MHz >>> in the garage! >>> >>> Pete. >>> >>> ceh...@ma... wrote: >>> >>>> I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to >>>> be >>>> completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! >>>> However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, >>>> with a recommended of 1024x768. >>>> >>>> Chad >>> >> ------------------------------------------------------- >> This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including >> Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. >> Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. >> http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ >> direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 >> _______________________________________________ >> Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list >> Sim...@li... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > > |
From: Frank D. E. Jr. <fd...@ya...> - 2003-08-02 01:00:22
|
> the headache of creating a server OS? That's one of things that you > > can't mess around with due to security and such. Oh, really? Just look at how many companies are using M$-based server OSes, then reconsider this statement ;-) ===== ======= Frank D. Engel, Jr. Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle decelerator to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to counterproductive atmospheric penetration. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 07:42:17
|
The target is mainly desktop users. There will be some server stuff too. If people are looking for a simple server they are not likely to choose this distro! Also, while there will be some server stuff, it will geared to the desktop user. For example Apache will be set up to simply server personal pages, NFs mounts will be for simple file sharing, things like that. There may also be an SQL server for handling things like an iTunes and iPhoto equivalent. But this is definitely not a distro aimed at simply being a server. Chad On Wednesday, July 30, 2003, at 08:29 PM, d....@in... wrote: > This depends on whether you only want to target desktop users. I can > imagine people wanting to 'simply' :-) install GNUstep on servers with > old > superceded tiny monitors to run DO servers or GSWeb. > > Cheers, > David > > >> Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything different >> looks quite unpleasant >> >> I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across >> systems >> for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old >> Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If a >> system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too >> painfully old and slow to run SGstep. My P90 runs Linux+WindowMaker >> and >> it's barely adequate. I haven't bothered to dust down the 486-DX 66MHz >> in the garage! >> >> Pete. >> >> ceh...@ma... wrote: >>> I know, but anyone who tries to run GNUstep in 640x480 is going to be >>> completely disappointed. Actually, probable the same with 800x600! >>> However, Let's make the minimum resolution for the system 800x600, >>> with a recommended of 1024x768. >>> >>> Chad > > > |
From: smoerk <sm...@gm...> - 2003-07-31 10:36:42
|
Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything different > looks quite unpleasant > > I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across systems > for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an old > Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. If a > system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to be too > painfully old and slow to run SGstep. what about the old iBook? it only has 800x600 iirc. but this would be only relevant, if somebody will package sgstep for ppc. |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 11:07:24
|
Exactly, I ran OS X on an older iBook and it was useless. Many of the dialog boxes where larger than the screen itself. Couldn't even see the push buttons at the bottom of the dialog box! Chad On Thursday, July 31, 2003, at 12:36 AM, smoerk wrote: > Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > >> Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine :-) anything >> different looks quite unpleasant >> I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I haven't come across >> systems for quite a few years now that can't handle 1024x768. I've an >> old Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit in limited colours. >> If a system can't display at that resolution It's probably going to >> be too painfully old and slow to run SGstep. > > what about the old iBook? it only has 800x600 iirc. but this would be > only relevant, if somebody will package sgstep for ppc. > |
From: Justin C. <jcu...@ya...> - 2003-07-31 13:19:42
|
oops, forgot to send this to the list. oh yes, and if anyone is interested in trying out the installer(now at ver 0.5.0), let me know. It is fully working, and is prob. in need of a little UI clean up, but otherwise fine under the hood. It runs a script called /bin/installer which just prints out "Hello" to you on the commmand line, since I don't have the install scripts. just email me and I'll send it(it's around 10K I think). agreed. most systems can handle it. the only thing I can think of would be a moniter not being able to do it, but I doubt that to be the case. I know that all my testing boxes will have XGA usable. and Chad, older iBooks are useless w/ OSX. I don't think I would run it, even though I tend to be a real bastard when it comes to making a machine craw. that's just too painful ;-). as for use as a server, I don't think there is much of a market, and yea, Apple would eat our collective livers if a server version were to be made. It can be done, but I would only use it to replace my FreeBSD box myself. Oh yea, and while I can't donate a Pentium IV(the only one I have is at work, and that runs Win2k), I may be able to(once I settle into my dorm) run a few spare cycles on my new PC, which is an Athlon XP 2400+ w/ 512MB ddr ram. I'll have to run the disks via NFS, since I only have an 8GB disk for WinXPPro(my school sells XP for $3.00, since they have a volume deal.), due to me running out of funds to get a bigger disk, and I may have a 2GB disk to put hed rat or such on, but I think I can do it. I'll let you guys know. --- ceh...@ma... wrote: > Exactly, I ran OS X on an older iBook and it was > useless. Many of the > dialog boxes where larger than the screen itself. > Couldn't even see > the push buttons at the bottom of the dialog box! > > Chad > > > On Thursday, July 31, 2003, at 12:36 AM, smoerk > wrote: > > > Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > > > >> Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine > :-) anything > >> different looks quite unpleasant > >> I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I > haven't come across > >> systems for quite a few years now that can't > handle 1024x768. I've an > >> old Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit > in limited colours. > >> If a system can't display at that resolution It's > probably going to > >> be too painfully old and slow to run SGstep. > > > > what about the old iBook? it only has 800x600 > iirc. but this would be > > only relevant, if somebody will package sgstep for > ppc. > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built > ASP.NET sites including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are > available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual > Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-07-31 21:42:14
|
Awesome! Pass the sources over man! What I will do is put them in a Cvs module and give you access rights. Sorry man, in order for this to continue you simply got to learn CVS (unless you do now?) I will help you every step of the way as far as cvs goes. I will also be able to work on the installer.app while twiddling my thumbs waiting for SGSTEP to compile. Other's can help too, possibly increasing the speed of maturity for the app double-fold or more. Awesome going man! Chad On Thursday, July 31, 2003, at 03:19 AM, Justin Cutietta wrote: > oops, forgot to send this to the list. oh yes, and if > anyone is interested in trying out the installer(now > at ver 0.5.0), let me know. It is fully working, and > is prob. in need of a little UI clean up, but > otherwise fine under the hood. It runs a script called > /bin/installer which just prints out "Hello" to you on > the commmand line, since I don't have the install > scripts. just email me and I'll send it(it's around > 10K I think). > > agreed. most systems can handle it. the only thing I > can think of would be a moniter not being able to do > it, but I doubt that to be the case. I know that all > my testing boxes will have XGA usable. and Chad, older > iBooks are useless w/ OSX. I don't think I would run > it, even though I tend to be a real bastard when it > comes to making a machine craw. that's just too > painful ;-). > > as for use as a server, I don't think there is much of > a market, and yea, Apple would eat our collective > livers if a server version were to be made. It can be > done, but I would only use it to replace my FreeBSD > box myself. Oh yea, and while I can't donate a Pentium > IV(the only one I have is at work, and that runs > Win2k), I may be able to(once I settle into my dorm) > run a few spare cycles on my new PC, which is an > Athlon XP 2400+ w/ 512MB ddr ram. I'll have to run the > disks via NFS, since I only have an 8GB disk for > WinXPPro(my school sells XP for $3.00, since they have > a volume deal.), due to me running out of funds to get > a bigger disk, and I may have a 2GB disk to put hed > rat or such on, but I think I can do it. I'll let you > guys know. > > > --- ceh...@ma... wrote: >> Exactly, I ran OS X on an older iBook and it was >> useless. Many of the >> dialog boxes where larger than the screen itself. >> Couldn't even see >> the push buttons at the bottom of the dialog box! >> >> Chad >> >> >> On Thursday, July 31, 2003, at 12:36 AM, smoerk >> wrote: >> >>> Peter-Henry Mander wrote: >>> >>>> Having 1024x768 would suit my laptops just fine >> :-) anything >>>> different looks quite unpleasant >>>> I'm inclined to go with Chad on this one. I >> haven't come across >>>> systems for quite a few years now that can't >> handle 1024x768. I've an >>>> old Pentium 90MHz system that can do that, albeit >> in limited colours. >>>> If a system can't display at that resolution It's >> probably going to >>>> be too painfully old and slow to run SGstep. >>> >>> what about the old iBook? it only has 800x600 >> iirc. but this would be >>> only relevant, if somebody will package sgstep for >> ppc. >>> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------------------------------- >> This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built >> ASP.NET sites including >> Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are >> available now. >> Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual >> Studio .NET. >> > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ > direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 >> _______________________________________________ >> Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list >> Sim...@li... >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email sponsored by: Free pre-built ASP.NET sites including > Data Reports, E-commerce, Portals, and Forums are available now. > Download today and enter to win an XBOX or Visual Studio .NET. > http://aspnet.click-url.com/go/psa00100003ave/ > direct;at.aspnet_072303_01/01 > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss |
From: Peter-Henry M. <gn...@ma...> - 2003-06-17 06:34:09
|
Hi Chad, Welcome back, you seem to have been busy! May I conclude that the small CVS storm has passed, and that I can check out to try another compile? I had the unfortunate experience of damaging one of my machines when something went wrong with the last compilation (nothing I couldn't fix, just lost time), so I've prepared one specifically for SGstep compilation that I don't rely on, and I can merrily nuke and reinstall! Pete. ceh...@ma... wrote: > Changes in code: > Lot's of updates! I saw! |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-17 09:22:36
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On Monday, Jun 16, 2003, at 20:33 Pacific/Honolulu, Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > Hi Chad, > > Welcome back, you seem to have been busy! May I conclude that the > small CVS storm has passed, and that I can check out to try another > compile? Yes, I think if you nuke the old checkout, re checkout, and compile you should be able to build practically everything, including the packages. it still wont pop out a cdrom iso though, i gotta work on those portions. Since the kernel is completely modularized, the emulated bootfloppy needs shell scripts to probe for the ide device (or SCSI), find the cd-rom drve which has the boot-cd, load the proper filesystem module, mount it, and drive on. This portion will take some trial and error. My plan is to boot the cd with the emulated floppy. then manually trial and error ldmods to figure out the exact sequences needed, then turn that into a sh script. There is other stuff after that, such as configuring X11 automatically, as well as input devices, then launching the gnustep environment and (yah!) the installer. where we will undoubtedly screw some more stuff up. :-) > I had the unfortunate experience of damaging one of my machines when > something went wrong with the last compilation (nothing I couldn't > fix, just lost time), so I've prepared one specifically for SGstep > compilation that I don't rely on, and I can merrily nuke and > reinstall! Exactly! I do something similar, I just use vmware. What happened that screwed the machine? Later, Chad > > Pete. > > ceh...@ma... wrote: >> Changes in code: >> Lot's of updates! > > I saw! > > |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-17 09:24:05
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Little tip: i have a filter set up to divert all gnustep cvs email notifications to a separate folder in my email client, since there can be quite a few that get sent! Chad On Monday, Jun 16, 2003, at 20:33 Pacific/Honolulu, Peter-Henry Mander wrote: > Hi Chad, > > Welcome back, you seem to have been busy! May I conclude that the > small CVS storm has passed, and that I can check out to try another > compile? I had the unfortunate experience of damaging one of my > machines when something went wrong with the last compilation (nothing > I couldn't fix, just lost time), so I've prepared one specifically for > SGstep compilation that I don't rely on, and I can merrily nuke and > reinstall! > > Pete. > > ceh...@ma... wrote: >> Changes in code: >> Lot's of updates! > > I saw! > > |
From: Peter-Henry M. <gn...@ma...> - 2003-06-17 11:52:32
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ceh...@ma... wrote: > Little tip: i have a filter set up to divert all gnustep cvs email > notifications to a separate folder in my email client, since there can > be quite a few that get sent! > Quite! Done that a while back when I subscribed, and got snowed under. The nuked machine is normally used in a test rig and was simply recommissioned with a standard SuSE install over nfs. It failed to boot after failing in the chrooted phase of the build, and I don't really know what caused the problem. Sorry, I can't enlighten you more. I've done a complete fresh checkout, and will let you know when I've got some results. Pete. |
From: Justin C. <jcu...@ya...> - 2003-06-17 17:26:57
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Well, It will be nice to have a working disk. I have been kind of absent on the installer, mainly due to work. However, I have two bits of good news. One, We now have a NeXTStation to use as reference for things(thank God for re...@mi...), and also I have been working on a set of dedicated machines for testing, mostly Pentium-II's with various configuration options(I also have a dedicated build machine in the works, it is a 400Mhz cellery w/ 64Mb ram(send me more!*subliminal plug*) and prob a 4 gig disk. It will have to be temporary, since I may move the build to my server. maybe. I plan on improving the installer(Names anyone? I was thinking SGSInstall.app), mainly with a better usage of NSTask, as well as fixing up some of the UI. Also, What else should we have ready for a beta? I know chad sugested some kind of X11 config, maybe use the vesa only driver at first to make it easy, then add other configs, and such. Any other ideas? I hope to have some more time soon. Justin __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-18 00:28:03
|
On Tuesday, Jun 17, 2003, at 07:26 Pacific/Honolulu, Justin Cutietta wrote: > Well, It will be nice to have a working disk. I have > been kind of absent on the installer, mainly due to > work. However, I have two bits of good news. One, We > now have a NeXTStation to use as reference for > things(thank God for re...@mi...), got one too, but I have no room to set it up, it just sits in my closet :-( > and also I have > been working on a set of dedicated machines for > testing, mostly Pentium-II's with various > configuration options Cool, that will come in quite handy! > (I also have a dedicated build > machine in the works, it is a 400Mhz cellery w/ 64Mb > ram(send me more!*subliminal plug*) and prob a 4 gig > disk. 4GB should be more than enough for an install, but a build requires 15GB or so. > It will have to be temporary, since I may move > the build to my server. maybe. I plan on improving the > installer(Names anyone? I was thinking > SGSInstall.app), Why not simply call it Install.app? Since it is specific to our Os, you don't need to worry about naming conflicts. > mainly with a better usage of NSTask, > as well as fixing up some of the UI. Right on. > Also, What else > should we have ready for a beta? I know chad sugested > some kind of X11 config, maybe use the vesa only > driver at first to make it easy, then add other > configs, and such. Any other ideas? I hope to have > some more time soon. Using vesa would make things much easier. however, I have heard that some of the newer video cards do not support vesa anymore, not sure if that is really the case though. We can start out vesa only and then if people have problems, adjust. > > > Justin > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! > http://sbc.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: INetU > Attention Web Developers & Consultants: Become An INetU Hosting > Partner. > Refer Dedicated Servers. We Manage Them. You Get 10% Monthly > Commission! > INetU Dedicated Managed Hosting http://www.inetu.net/partner/index.php > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss |
From: Justin C. <jcu...@ya...> - 2003-06-18 13:14:17
|
--- ceh...@ma... wrote: > > On Tuesday, Jun 17, 2003, at 07:26 Pacific/Honolulu, > Justin Cutietta > wrote: > > > Well, It will be nice to have a working disk. I > have > > been kind of absent on the installer, mainly due > to > > work. However, I have two bits of good news. One, > We > > now have a NeXTStation to use as reference for > > things(thank God for re...@mi...), > got one too, but I have no room to set it up, it > just sits in my > closet :-( I got mine setup, and it's got NeXTStep 3.2 User on it, only 20MB ram :-( > > > and also I have > > been working on a set of dedicated machines for > > testing, mostly Pentium-II's with various > > configuration options > > Cool, that will come in quite handy! > > > (I also have a dedicated build > > machine in the works, it is a 400Mhz cellery w/ > 64Mb > > ram(send me more!*subliminal plug*) and prob a 4 > gig > > disk. > > 4GB should be more than enough for an install, but a > build requires > 15GB or so. Ok, I'm going to have to scrap up some diskspace for that. I have the disk, it may not be used afterall. > > It will have to be temporary, since I may move > > the build to my server. maybe. I plan on improving > the > > installer(Names anyone? I was thinking > > SGSInstall.app), > > Why not simply call it Install.app? Since it is > specific to our Os, > you don't need to worry about naming conflicts. Well, I was thinking that Install.app would be for installing packages after everything is all setup(ala NeXT). I know that OSX has one program, with many bundles for it(*cringes at the thought of learning bundles* j/k). Also, should the installer be divided into a commandline tool that does the real work(a script or otherwise) and a GUI Frontend that helps Harry Homeowner to set things up? It would make the code much cleaner if we did it that way. > > mainly with a better usage of NSTask, > > as well as fixing up some of the UI. > > Right on. > > > Also, What else > > should we have ready for a beta? I know chad > sugested > > some kind of X11 config, maybe use the vesa only > > driver at first to make it easy, then add other > > configs, and such. Any other ideas? I hope to have > > some more time soon. > > Using vesa would make things much easier. however, > I have heard that > some of the newer video cards do not support vesa > anymore, not sure if > that is really the case though. We can start out > vesa only and then if > people have problems, adjust. > agreed. I know that some systems(like my SiS620 chipset) don't even have proper drivers yet and can only use VESA (the 620 is funky and vesa works better with it). I haven't started a build either, btw. That is going to be in about a week or so. Still need to get a machine up. Justin __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com |
From: Frank D. E. Jr. <fd...@ya...> - 2003-06-18 17:58:12
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> Well, I was thinking that Install.app would be for > installing packages after everything is all setup(ala > NeXT). I know that OSX has one program, with many > bundles for it(*cringes at the thought of learning Or, make Install.app flexible enough to do both, without the need for this. > bundles* j/k). Also, should the installer be divided > into a commandline tool that does the real work(a > script or otherwise) and a GUI Frontend that helps > Harry Homeowner to set things up? It would make the > code much cleaner if we did it that way. Another idea is to put the 'real work' code into a shared library (or framework, bundle, whatever) and have the GUI front-end linked against that. This is even cleaner than using command-line tools in the background. (of course, you could still use existing command-line tools for fdisk/mkfs/ckfs/etc. if desired). ===== ======= Frank D. Engel, Jr. Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle decelerator to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to counterproductive atmospheric penetration. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-20 21:13:19
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On Wednesday, Jun 18, 2003, at 07:58 Pacific/Honolulu, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote: >> Well, I was thinking that Install.app would be for >> installing packages after everything is all setup(ala >> NeXT). I know that OSX has one program, with many >> bundles for it(*cringes at the thought of learning > > Or, make Install.app flexible enough to do both, without the need for > this. Let's just keep it simple. All install.app really needs to do for now is call on the scripts I am creating to do the work. Later on we can make a separate app for installing/removing/upgrading packages and the like. > >> bundles* j/k). Also, should the installer be divided >> into a commandline tool that does the real work(a >> script or otherwise) and a GUI Frontend that helps >> Harry Homeowner to set things up? It would make the >> code much cleaner if we did it that way. > > Another idea is to put the 'real work' code into a shared library (or > framework, bundle, whatever) and have the GUI front-end linked against > that. This is even cleaner than using command-line tools in the > background. (of course, you could still use existing command-line > tools for fdisk/mkfs/ckfs/etc. if desired). Yes, but it is just way easier to use comman dline tools. Especially since the packages are really just tarred up bzziped2 files with files that exaplin dependencies, etc. If you tried to do this in a compiled language you'd just be making forks and execs all over the place anyhow to unbzip, untar, etc. > > > ===== > ======= > Frank D. Engel, Jr. > > Modify the equilibrium of the vertically-oriented particle decelerator > to result in the reestablishment of its resistance to > counterproductive atmospheric penetration. > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! > http://sbc.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.Net email is sponsored by: INetU > Attention Web Developers & Consultants: Become An INetU Hosting > Partner. > Refer Dedicated Servers. We Manage Them. You Get 10% Monthly > Commission! > INetU Dedicated Managed Hosting http://www.inetu.net/partner/index.php > _______________________________________________ > Simplygnustep-discuss mailing list > Sim...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/simplygnustep-discuss |
From: <ceh...@ma...> - 2003-06-18 00:02:08
|
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you are currently doing a build, stop it (CTRL-C) and the do a "cvs update -d" and then a "cvs update". I forgot to add the modutils for kernel 2.4.X. Before we were using module-init-tools, which is the replacement of modutils in a linux-2.5.X environment. chad |