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From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-07-18 01:16:07
|
Hi Martin, > So every release MUST be a spinoff of your > commercial license then, even > if the code is the same (which is not, since the > license changes to GPL > if you make it public). Sorry, I don't get it. To clear the issue up, Luxor is basically like Mozilla. If there is a commercial spinoff (e.g. like Netscape), than the commercial spinoff is from the open-source code base (not the other way around). > if my above statement is not the case, you are > definitely in violation > of GPL..and you have to change that license to > something which allows > commercial spinoffs, if the base of your software is > GPL'ed.. > > At any time however you are allowed to change the > license for the > project, but if your "commercial" license says it is > GPL in the source, > you are definitely in violation of GPL. > > I am not talking about your copyright here.. If your > the author you own > the copyright. I am talking about licenses.. > > I am not a lawyer, but do a lot of open source > stuff, which will end up > a lot of times in in-depth discussion about > licenses. Sorry to be mean but you evidently don't know what are writting. To clear the issue up, I am the copyright holder of the Luxor kernel and, therefore, can license the *same* code base under multiple licenses at the same time. This is called "dual licensing", see Trolltech Qt or MySQL as real-world examples. After all your bitching, I expect to see all your code under the Apache or at least the LGPL license. Lead by example if you want credibility. Anyway, can't wait to see your GUI builder. Happy hacking. - Gerald |
From: Martin v. d. B. <ml...@mv...> - 2002-07-17 23:31:31
|
Btw.. This thread is not to shoot your effort or intention to do so.. I just want to know if it usefull to invest time in this or not.. I choose opensource for everything I do, so I can also contribute back, it's just a great way to get good quality software.. If I choose open source, I shouldn't end up in buying it (I would expect a great deal more off a commercial package..) Mvgr, Martin On Thu, 2002-07-18 at 01:04, Martin van den Bemt wrote: > On Wed, 2002-07-17 at 19:09, Gerald Bauer wrote: > > > I was wondering if you are ever intending to put the > > > source in cvs on sf? > > > > Eventually, but for now it's just overhead. > > > > > It's hard to build a community around luxor if > > > this is not available. > > > > I'm not sure how you come to this conclusion. Linux > > doesn't use CVS either. Are you using CVS for your > > projects? Are developers flocking in? > > CVS is just a means.. any other public version control will do ;) > I use cvs in all my projects, even prive projects which I am the only > programmer of. > > > > > > Also another question : I read a question about if > > > you want to switch to > > > LGPL to make it usable in commercial projects. > > > > There is no plan to switch to the LGPL. The GPL is > > the right choice. > > Don't mind the license, don't get me wrong.. > > > > > Just to clear some Micro$oft FUD up, the GPL is > > extremely business friendly. You can use Luxor for > > free (zero-cost) in your commercial projects as long > > as you follow the GPL rules > > I know.. But I don't think much people will use it if there isn't a repo > available, since they depend on a binary version of the release, since > if they adjust the sources, they have to gpl it (or incorporate any of > the sources in their project). So they have to be able to get some fixes > into cvs and be able to review the changes made by others.. > > > > > > You said "You can always > > > buy a commercial license". > > > > That's right. If you don't want to be bound by the > > GPL you can always buy a commercial license. > > > > The money will go in an endowment fund for the Luxor > > Foundation and will sponsor further development. > > > > > > > You are maintaing the real source, which is > > > "closed", so the "GPL'ed" > > > code is just a spin off. > > > > That's bullshit. The source I have on my hard disk > > and the source you can download is identical. > > So every release MUST be a spinoff of your commercial license then, even > if the code is the same (which is not, since the license changes to GPL > if you make it public). > > > > > > You are violating the GPL license you have chosen > > > > You must be kidding? How can infrige my own > > copyright? Can you can expand on the issue? Are you a > > lawyer? > > if my above statement is not the case, you are definitely in violation > of GPL..and you have to change that license to something which allows > commercial spinoffs, if the base of your software is GPL'ed.. > > At any time however you are allowed to change the license for the > project, but if your "commercial" license says it is GPL in the source, > you are definitely in violation of GPL. > > I am not talking about your copyright here.. If your the author you own > the copyright. I am talking about licenses.. > > I am not a lawyer, but do a lot of open source stuff, which will end up > a lot of times in in-depth discussion about licenses. > > > > > > > - Without cvs nobody can and will help you out. The > > > "will not help you > > > out" means that is people would be really NUTS to > > > give you some fixes if > > > you are maintaining a commercial version and not > > > have a public source > > > repository > > > > I basicly follow MySQL's model, however, with a > > twist. I will keep track of contributions and once > > someone really ends up buying a commercial license, I > > will hand out cash/checks to contributors. > > To vague, sorry.. Nice promise though. > > > > > So this open-source project is different in that you > > will get paid for your contributions, though, not > > immediately. > > > > > It will allways stay a 1 man effort. > > > > Sorry, to break the news. It's already more than a > > one man show. > > I didn't know that.. (still only 1 member on sf though).. Just don't see > any developer discussion taking place on the mailinglists, so that makes > it easy to assume it's a one man effort (which is not bad, don't get me > wrong).. > > Mvgr, > Martin > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek > Welcome to geek heaven. > http://thinkgeek.com/sf > _______________________________________________ > luxor-xul-user mailing list > lux...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/luxor-xul-user > |
From: Martin v. d. B. <ml...@mv...> - 2002-07-17 23:05:00
|
On Wed, 2002-07-17 at 19:09, Gerald Bauer wrote: > > I was wondering if you are ever intending to put the > > source in cvs on sf? > > Eventually, but for now it's just overhead. > > > It's hard to build a community around luxor if > > this is not available. > > I'm not sure how you come to this conclusion. Linux > doesn't use CVS either. Are you using CVS for your > projects? Are developers flocking in? CVS is just a means.. any other public version control will do ;) I use cvs in all my projects, even prive projects which I am the only programmer of. > > > Also another question : I read a question about if > > you want to switch to > > LGPL to make it usable in commercial projects. > > There is no plan to switch to the LGPL. The GPL is > the right choice. Don't mind the license, don't get me wrong.. > > Just to clear some Micro$oft FUD up, the GPL is > extremely business friendly. You can use Luxor for > free (zero-cost) in your commercial projects as long > as you follow the GPL rules I know.. But I don't think much people will use it if there isn't a repo available, since they depend on a binary version of the release, since if they adjust the sources, they have to gpl it (or incorporate any of the sources in their project). So they have to be able to get some fixes into cvs and be able to review the changes made by others.. > > > You said "You can always > > buy a commercial license". > > That's right. If you don't want to be bound by the > GPL you can always buy a commercial license. > > The money will go in an endowment fund for the Luxor > Foundation and will sponsor further development. > > > You are maintaing the real source, which is > > "closed", so the "GPL'ed" > > code is just a spin off. > > That's bullshit. The source I have on my hard disk > and the source you can download is identical. So every release MUST be a spinoff of your commercial license then, even if the code is the same (which is not, since the license changes to GPL if you make it public). > > > You are violating the GPL license you have chosen > > You must be kidding? How can infrige my own > copyright? Can you can expand on the issue? Are you a > lawyer? if my above statement is not the case, you are definitely in violation of GPL..and you have to change that license to something which allows commercial spinoffs, if the base of your software is GPL'ed.. At any time however you are allowed to change the license for the project, but if your "commercial" license says it is GPL in the source, you are definitely in violation of GPL. I am not talking about your copyright here.. If your the author you own the copyright. I am talking about licenses.. I am not a lawyer, but do a lot of open source stuff, which will end up a lot of times in in-depth discussion about licenses. > > > - Without cvs nobody can and will help you out. The > > "will not help you > > out" means that is people would be really NUTS to > > give you some fixes if > > you are maintaining a commercial version and not > > have a public source > > repository > > I basicly follow MySQL's model, however, with a > twist. I will keep track of contributions and once > someone really ends up buying a commercial license, I > will hand out cash/checks to contributors. To vague, sorry.. Nice promise though. > > So this open-source project is different in that you > will get paid for your contributions, though, not > immediately. > > > It will allways stay a 1 man effort. > > Sorry, to break the news. It's already more than a > one man show. I didn't know that.. (still only 1 member on sf though).. Just don't see any developer discussion taking place on the mailinglists, so that makes it easy to assume it's a one man effort (which is not bad, don't get me wrong).. Mvgr, Martin |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-07-17 17:09:12
|
> I was wondering if you are ever intending to put the > source in cvs on sf? Eventually, but for now it's just overhead. > It's hard to build a community around luxor if > this is not available. I'm not sure how you come to this conclusion. Linux doesn't use CVS either. Are you using CVS for your projects? Are developers flocking in? > Also another question : I read a question about if > you want to switch to > LGPL to make it usable in commercial projects. There is no plan to switch to the LGPL. The GPL is the right choice. Just to clear some Micro$oft FUD up, the GPL is extremely business friendly. You can use Luxor for free (zero-cost) in your commercial projects as long as you follow the GPL rules > You said "You can always > buy a commercial license". That's right. If you don't want to be bound by the GPL you can always buy a commercial license. The money will go in an endowment fund for the Luxor Foundation and will sponsor further development. > You are maintaing the real source, which is > "closed", so the "GPL'ed" > code is just a spin off. That's bullshit. The source I have on my hard disk and the source you can download is identical. > You are violating the GPL license you have chosen You must be kidding? How can infrige my own copyright? Can you can expand on the issue? Are you a lawyer? > - Without cvs nobody can and will help you out. The > "will not help you > out" means that is people would be really NUTS to > give you some fixes if > you are maintaining a commercial version and not > have a public source > repository I basicly follow MySQL's model, however, with a twist. I will keep track of contributions and once someone really ends up buying a commercial license, I will hand out cash/checks to contributors. So this open-source project is different in that you will get paid for your contributions, though, not immediately. > It will allways stay a 1 man effort. Sorry, to break the news. It's already more than a one man show. |
From: Martin v. d. B. <ml...@mv...> - 2002-07-17 13:24:16
|
Hi, I was wondering if you are ever intending to put the source in cvs on sf? It's hard to build a community around luxor if this is not available. Also another question : I read a question about if you want to switch to LGPL to make it usable in commercial projects. You said "You can always buy a commercial license". A couple of observations based on the current way you "expose" your project : - You are maintaing the real source, which is "closed", so the "GPL'ed" code is just a spin off. or - You are violating the GPL license you have chosen - Without cvs nobody can and will help you out. The "will not help you out" means that is people would be really NUTS to give you some fixes if you are maintaining a commercial version and not have a public source repository or - It will allways stay a 1 man effort, so no community. consequence : - The risk of using luxor will be to big, considering all choices made by the "project" so far. What to do to make it usable : - Change the license that allows you to have a commercial version - make code available in cvs, so people can see if there efforts end up in the open version. If you don't want to do above : Say on the website you are doing it alone and don't say that Luxor is Free and open source on your website. Life is simple : If you don't want a community, don't start a sf project. This mail may be a bit grumpy, but I invested already a day in luxor, just to find out that I cannot get involved the way it is setup right now (I don't mind contributing code and sending patches, but to what? your commercial effort ? your "closed" source solution?) and I will have to "buy" a commercial license because I (wanted) to use it in an commercial application. I really love to see you making money out of this effort, don't get me wrong, but don't clame to be open untill you are really are. Just having source in releases, doesn't make it open source, since nobody can or may do anything with it, because of the licensing and your setup.. Mvgr, Martin |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-07-14 04:25:32
|
Hi Dave, > I was looking around Luxor's web pages and noticed > that it should be possible to port Luxor to .Net. > I was wondering if anyone had any ideas on > how to do this, as well as, the magnitude of the > effort required. First you should decide on the GUI toolkit, that is, Gtk# or Windows Forms. Once you picked a toolkit, you can start off creating a XUL engine in C# that parses XML documents and turns them in sizzling widgets. Pick your favorite XUL tags to start off (e.g. toolbar, menubar, box, button or whatever) and add more as you go along. Use the XUL tag reference or cheat sheet as a reference. Look at the XulManager, XulLoader and XulNode for inspiration. It shouldn't take more than a couple of days to have support for a bunch a tags. - Gerald |
From: Dave H. <lb...@ad...> - 2002-07-14 02:53:04
|
I was looking around Luxor's web pages and noticed that it should be possible to port Luxor to .Net. I was wondering if anyone had any ideas on how to do this, as well as, the magnitude of the effort required. As much detail as possible would be great. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Dave Holz |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-07-01 20:42:36
|
Hi, > a) How does one bind the data to the menu ? Can you > do it using Luxor. Data binding support is currently non-existant. However, what you can do is use XSL to create your XUL menu at runtime. See the transform example in the Ramses suite for details. > b) Is Luxor / XUL only for WEB related GUIs or can > you create stand > alone GUI > windows with it. Luxor is for standalone GUIs (that is, no connection back to a server on a different machine is needed). Luxor doesn't run inside a browser. Luxor has an optional built-in web server for loopback connections. |
From: Ravi B. <rav...@ya...> - 2002-07-01 17:59:36
|
Hello Luxor Users, I would like to do the following: a) The electonic component data is stored in XML data files. b) Create a menu using XUL to present the parameters for each component in a GUI window on the screen. c) Populate the menu with data from the data XML files. Be able to modify the data. d) Store the modified data back into the component XML files. Questions: a) How does one bind the data to the menu ? Can you do it using Luxor. b) Is Luxor / XUL only for WEB related GUIs or can you create stand alone GUI windows with it. Folks, I am catching up with the documentation. Thank you, Best Regards, ravi ( rav...@ya...) |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-06-25 16:26:22
|
Hi Tullio, > I need to bind my Swing with DataBase data using > TopLink or OracleBC4J. > How can I acheive this goal with Luxor ? Luxor doesn't currently support data binding. However, I will add it in the upcoming months and you also more than welcome to go ahead yourself. I will take Micropoly ASP.Net and ADO.Net as a starting point. Go ahead and use TopLink or OracleBC4J as Luxor won't replace them. Luxor will sport data binders that let you "plug-in" TopLink or OracleBC4J data models and bind them to widgets. - Gerald |
From: Bettinazzi T. <tbe...@ax...> - 2002-06-25 07:43:28
|
I need to bind my Swing with DataBase data using TopLink or OracleBC4J. How can I acheive this goal with Luxor ? TIA Tullio |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-06-18 01:08:43
|
Hi Dom, > I was wondering if we can use Luxor without using > Webstart. Yes, you can. > Is luxor can be used for standalone applications? Yes, Luxor is for standalone, offline apps. > Can we skip the WebServerManager's setup? Yes, the built-in WebServer is optional. You don't need to start it and can even remove the binary classes if you makes you feel better. > For instance, i just wanna use a XUL file and a java > File which will > describe a menu and their commands. > Is there any example among the ramses examples which > are not using the > WebServerManager ? Check out the in-progress batik SVG browser or notepad example. - Gerald |
From: Clain, D. <dc...@lu...> - 2002-06-17 22:24:19
|
Hi,=20 I was wondering if we can use Luxor without using Webstart. Is luxor can be used for standalone applications? Can we skip the WebServerManager's setup? For instance, i just wanna use a XUL file and a java File which will describe a menu and their commands. Is there any example among the ramses examples which are not using the WebServerManager ? Thanks, Dom. |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-06-17 17:27:23
|
> Is there any container to load xul file in java > application like > JSVGCanvas for svg files?. The Xul engine loads all xul files in the startup directory tree in the chrome jar and keeps all top-level panels/canvases/compenents in a lookup table. Use XulMan.createJComponentFromBox to get a reference. For tips and tricks on how to "Ask Questions the Smart Way" check out Eric Raymond's article at http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html - Gerald |
From: Geetha <ge...@eq...> - 2002-06-17 05:43:04
|
Is there any container to load xul file in java application like JSVGCanvas for svg files?. >_______________________________________________________________ > >Don't miss the 2002 Sprint PCS Application Developer's Conference >August 25-28 in Las Vegas - >http://devcon.sprintpcs.com/adp/index.cfm?source=osdntextlink > >_______________________________________________ >luxor-xul-user mailing list >lux...@li... >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/luxor-xul-user |
From: Geetha <ge...@eq...> - 2002-06-17 05:41:31
|
At 03:21 PM 6/15/2002 -0700, Gerald Bauer wrote: It was possible for me to view the xul file in mozilla browser.but still i need to embed the xul with swing application. Link http://www.jxul.org is not working.please help me .if there is any alternative solution.i need a simple example with xul embed in swing. > > I am confused with hello.jnlp example.If i > > change in the toolbar.xul.the changes are not > > reflected in the Java web > > start of Hello.jnpl. > >The example apps use the chrome (aka XUL files) packed >up in jars, not the free-floating XUL files you >edited. Thanks.But i want to know the name of the jar file.Where you have packed all the xul files. > > What 's wrong? I want to view a simple xul file > > at least with a button? > >For a XUL "browser" use the box example and change >the chrome loader to use the file protocol >(e.g. file:///luxor/v1.0-b4/chrome/box). I found the location luxor-1.0-b4\ramses-1.0-b4\src\chrome\box\startup\article.xul where all the xul files are placed.but it is not inside the jar.so if i change it is not reflecting. > > Is it possible to add actions to the button?. > > Yes, it is. Note that actions are called commands in >XUL. > thanks. >_______________________________________________________________ > >Don't miss the 2002 Sprint PCS Application Developer's Conference >August 25-28 in Las Vegas - >http://devcon.sprintpcs.com/adp/index.cfm?source=osdntextlink > >_______________________________________________ >luxor-xul-user mailing list >lux...@li... >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/luxor-xul-user |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-06-15 22:21:51
|
> I am confused with hello.jnlp example.If i > change in the toolbar.xul.the changes are not > reflected in the Java web > start of Hello.jnpl. The example apps use the chrome (aka XUL files) packed up in jars, not the free-floating XUL files you edited. > What 's wrong? I want to view a simple xul file > at least with a button? For a XUL "browser" use the box example and change the chrome loader to use the file protocol (e.g. file:///luxor/v1.0-b4/chrome/box). > Is it possible to add actions to the button?. Yes, it is. Note that actions are called commands in XUL. |
From: Geetha <ge...@eq...> - 2002-06-15 10:10:27
|
I am newbie to xul.I just now runned the samples from Luxor.i am still confused.When i opened a xul in the browser it is displaying the tags as it is.how to view a xul file?.I am confused with hello.jnlp example.If i change in the toolbar.xul.the changes are not reflected in the Java web start of Hello.jnpl.What 'swrong going on.i want to view a simple xul file atleast with a button.one more question whether it is possible to add actions to the button?. |
From: Gerald B. <ge...@va...> - 2002-05-25 04:18:29
|
Hi, Just to let you know that the luxor-xul-user mailing list is set up and alive and kicking. Subscribe to ask questions, share knowledge, and discuss issues with fellow Luxor users and enthusiasts. - Gerald Bauer (Luxor Project Lead) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com |