Hi,
In thread Stefan Ott posed some questions on how to improve the menu structure
of Freeplane. I answered with a proposal for a process to help him. In this
thread I propose to continue this discussion.
In the following I would like to invite you in helping to think over the menu
structure of FP. I will follow the process steps indicated in my previous
post. I will follow a process way of thinking, and ask you not to jump to the
end result. Also, no decisions are final until the last step, the extreme
being the decision that nothing will change if the end result is not evaluated
as better than the current situation.
First process step
Goal: strip all functions from the main menu bar which concern a selected
node, node component (text, details, attributes, note), edge or connector.
On page http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Harmonizing_FP-
menu#Process_step_1 two mindmaps are shown. The first
contains the starting point, the items of the main menu bar of FP 1.2.3_03.
With green OK-icons is shown which menu items are top level functions which
have effect on the mindmap as a whole and not on specific subobjects. With
numbered icons is shown which items concern subobject: 1 means node level, 2
means edge level and 3 means node text level. If two icons are shown, there
are two possibilities. A question mark icon symbolizes an item for which a
decision still has to be made. The second mindmap contains the main menu
stripped from items relating to subobjects (numbered icons).It also contains
the items related to the Node level (1), edge level (2). and Node text level
(3).
Before proceding to the next step, I would like to ask if you would put the
icons in the same way ?
Thanks,
Jokro
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Nice idea ! I'm ready to contribute because I think it's really important to
re-order FP's menus specialy now because last versions adds a lot of new
features.
Some / questions remarks :
How to report agreement or no agreement on the proposed maps ? => do we need to change the map localy and then upload it somewhere (in the wiki) ?
I think it's important to add "separators" in the menus (and also in the map) and to define submenus order.
If this work is okay, maybe we could also review : contextual menu and the preferences screen.
Regards,
Nam
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Hi Nam,
thanks for your support. On the wiki I am also publishing the (possible)
principles we might apply. You are most welcome to contribute.
@ posting maps: Good point. Point of attention: not everybody may have or want
edit-access to the wiki. For those that have, changed maps could be uploaded
and published at the discussion page in reversed order (newer on top) with
date, name and type of change . If a decision stage is reached, the decisive
map should be published on the major page. I am willing to moderate this. For
people contributing to the forum only, or small changes to the map, I am
willing to moderate the proposed changes in the forum to the map update. Or do
you have a better idea ? The procedure we agree om I will add to the wiki
page.
@ separators: please be more explixt, give an example.
@ review of contextual menu: this is a logical step of the process I have in
mind.
Regards,
Jokro
.
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Before continuing this thread I would like your opinion on the idea of
reorganizing the menu structure. Even if you do not want to contribute
yourself, tell if you think it should be done. Especially I would like to know
if the team of programmers support the idea, for otherwise it the effort will
be in vain. Once again, check http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php
/Harmonizing_FP-menu for what I have in mind.
Regards,
Jokro
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Unfortunately I'm quite busy at work, so it took a while to post my answer.
But nevertheless I'm still interested in this topic.
However I don't think that we should strip functions from the main menu but
rather reorder the items in a logical way and identify missing items e.g.
collect all node specific actions in a "Nodes" top menu.
I like to have an overview of the available actions a program can perform and
the main menu gives you this overview .
BR
Stefan
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Hi to All,
sincerely I don't understand the new menu structure that you propose. I think
that a reconstructed image can help me, and maybe others, to better understand
the issue.
I think that actually menu structure is fine and an habitual user find hot key
more useful.
Regards
Gioita
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I uploaded a map on the wiki : it's my suggestion to change the File Menu
(based on the existing one). This is a test to check how the process you
suggest can work ... but my suggestions are real ones ;-).
Nam.
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@Stephan,
I agree that we should reorder items. The number of items has grown, and is
growing in such a way that flat menu's are not sufficcient any more. This
means we have to decide about some hierarchical structure. This is not easy to
do as, depending how different people use FP, they will propose different
number of hierarcical levels and orderings, wanting the most used items higher
in the hierarchy. This is why I proposed to arrive at a comon decision.step by
step. The end result is exactly what you describe: a reordering, but based on
principles we are deciding during the process. So taking out "double"items in
the first process step does not mean the will be put back later on, but at a
different location.
@Gioata,
I did not yet propse a new menu structure. In process step 1 did a preliminary
analysis showing for each menu item, to which object (main mind map, node,
component of a node like text field) each item belongs. This could make
reordering easier in a following step.
@Nam,
I have problems downloading your map if you precede it with File. I changed File in Media and now, if I click, I can automatically download. This is simething I will add to the procedure.
I now understand what you mean with separators. A good idea indeed !
I like your proposal.
I am still waiting if the programmers support - in principle - our action ?
Regards
Jokro
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The embedding of the mindmaps in a flash applet is making the mindmaps more
difficult to use. In the hyperlink above I combined a jpg picture with the
possibility to download the mindmap. Don't you find this more useable ?
Regards,
Jokro
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I find the flash-applet quite usable, although it lacks some features. I would
have used the java-applet but it failed loading as soon as there was more than
one map on the page.
The best and most comfortable way to discuss this topic would be a online
editable map but this could be goal for the future...
I uploaded a proposal to add two menus to the main menu bar. One for basic
node functions and the other for functions of node components. The menu items
in these two menus should be removed from the other menus in the main menu
bar.
Result:
menuitems are connected to the objectlevel (node or node component (such as text field, details field etc.) they belong to;
the other menu's of the main menu bar get more simple.
I prefer flat lists and interpret SEPARATOR as a visual separator like a line.
I agree with the points you raise, and added the following discussion points
to the text of the wiki:
To be discussed:
is Cloud a component of a node, or an object at the objectlevel of mindmap ? If it is a component, its functions should be added to Component. If not, I will duscuss its position later, when discussing the functions at the mindmap level.
is a Connector a component of a node, or an object at the objectlevel of mindmap ? If it is a component, its functions should be added to Component. If not, I will duscuss its position later, when discussing the functions at the mindmap level.
In principle all duplicate menuitems could be removed from other Top menus.However there may be some exceptions:
It seems intuitive to have the FormatPanel also in the View menu ;
The copy/paste menu items could be left ih the Top level Edit menu as well, because this is common in most applications ?
I would propose to remove the icon Top level menu but leave it as a side bar.
to support your efforts on creating a better menu structure I changed
implementation of menu builder (1.2.4_04).
Now almost all menu elements including the ones coming with plug-ins are
declared in file mindmapmodemenu.xml which can be found
core/org.freeplane.core/lib/freeplaneeditor.jar/xml or in source code in
directory freeplane/resources/xml .
You can create directory <freeplane-user-dir>/resources/xml and copy this file
there. Now you can change menu structure of your installation by editing your
local copy. All other resource files from freeplane jars can be substituted
the same way. Be careful: your local copies are not updated when you install
next freeplane versions, you should update or delete them manually. </freeplane-user-dir>
Regards, Dimitry
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is my first proposal for a changed menu structure.
I've introduced two new top level menus named "Nodes" and "Node features" and
removed the menu "Insert". I'd also like to remove the menu "Icons" and move
its content to "Node features -> Icons" but this can't be done just with the
xml file...
The menu "Nodes" keeps all actions to insert, delete and edit nodes (i.e. the
main part of the node).
The menu "Node features" keeps all actions that can be applied to a node (I
think that the term feature describes the nature of these actions good). The
actions are grouped in submenus. This way one could very easy explore the
features Freeplane offers.
Every node-action can be accessed in a top level menu and every node feature
can be accessed in a submenu of a top level menu.
Comments!?
Regards
Stefan
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don't you think we could combine your new "Nodes" menu with "Edit" menu?
in the next version 1.2.4_05 I introduced new xml attribute "menu_key". It is used as an absolute key to a menu structure element. All menu elements with this attribute may be moved even if some items are added to them dynamically. This way you can move the icons without changing the program code.
Regards, Dimitry
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I updated mindmapmodemenu.xml (you can download it with the old link from
21).Thanks to your changes I removed the top level icon menu and moved it to
"Node features -> Icons".
Regarding your point 1:
I'd like to keep the "Edit" menu because:
it's a very common menu. Nearly every application has one ;-)
we have some actions that are typical for an edit menu (Undo, Redo, Copy-Paste stuff, Find).
One would expect these items there.
These items do not fit to the "Nodes" menu as I defined it in 21.
(keeps all actions to insert, delete and edit nodes)
Regards
Stefan
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the script apiGenerator.groovy that is part of the distribution adds itself to
the end of the help menu. The configuration of this location is done by
setting the target menu (but not the position in it) in the script header.
This mechanism is available also to user scripts.
Do you see a need for improvement in this area? In which way should the
configuration/registration be extended so that at least the position within
the menu can be configured?
Volker
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Hi,
In thread Stefan Ott posed some questions on how to improve the menu structure
of Freeplane. I answered with a proposal for a process to help him. In this
thread I propose to continue this discussion.
In the following I would like to invite you in helping to think over the menu
structure of FP. I will follow the process steps indicated in my previous
post. I will follow a process way of thinking, and ask you not to jump to the
end result. Also, no decisions are final until the last step, the extreme
being the decision that nothing will change if the end result is not evaluated
as better than the current situation.
First process step
Goal: strip all functions from the main menu bar which concern a selected
node, node component (text, details, attributes, note), edge or connector.
On page http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Harmonizing_FP-
menu#Process_step_1 two mindmaps are shown. The first
contains the starting point, the items of the main menu bar of FP 1.2.3_03.
With green OK-icons is shown which menu items are top level functions which
have effect on the mindmap as a whole and not on specific subobjects. With
numbered icons is shown which items concern subobject: 1 means node level, 2
means edge level and 3 means node text level. If two icons are shown, there
are two possibilities. A question mark icon symbolizes an item for which a
decision still has to be made. The second mindmap contains the main menu
stripped from items relating to subobjects (numbered icons).It also contains
the items related to the Node level (1), edge level (2). and Node text level
(3).
Before proceding to the next step, I would like to ask if you would put the
icons in the same way ?
Thanks,
Jokro
Nice idea ! I'm ready to contribute because I think it's really important to
re-order FP's menus specialy now because last versions adds a lot of new
features.
Some / questions remarks :
How to report agreement or no agreement on the proposed maps ? => do we need to change the map localy and then upload it somewhere (in the wiki) ?
I think it's important to add "separators" in the menus (and also in the map) and to define submenus order.
Regards,
Nam
Hi Nam,
thanks for your support. On the wiki I am also publishing the (possible)
principles we might apply. You are most welcome to contribute.
@ posting maps: Good point. Point of attention: not everybody may have or want
edit-access to the wiki. For those that have, changed maps could be uploaded
and published at the discussion page in reversed order (newer on top) with
date, name and type of change . If a decision stage is reached, the decisive
map should be published on the major page. I am willing to moderate this. For
people contributing to the forum only, or small changes to the map, I am
willing to moderate the proposed changes in the forum to the map update. Or do
you have a better idea ? The procedure we agree om I will add to the wiki
page.
@ separators: please be more explixt, give an example.
@ review of contextual menu: this is a logical step of the process I have in
mind.
Regards,
Jokro
.
Everybody,
Before continuing this thread I would like your opinion on the idea of
reorganizing the menu structure. Even if you do not want to contribute
yourself, tell if you think it should be done. Especially I would like to know
if the team of programmers support the idea, for otherwise it the effort will
be in vain. Once again, check http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php
/Harmonizing_FP-menu for what I have in mind.
Regards,
Jokro
Hello jokro and others.
Unfortunately I'm quite busy at work, so it took a while to post my answer.
But nevertheless I'm still interested in this topic.
However I don't think that we should strip functions from the main menu but
rather reorder the items in a logical way and identify missing items e.g.
collect all node specific actions in a "Nodes" top menu.
I like to have an overview of the available actions a program can perform and
the main menu gives you this overview .
BR
Stefan
Hi to All,
sincerely I don't understand the new menu structure that you propose. I think
that a reconstructed image can help me, and maybe others, to better understand
the issue.
I think that actually menu structure is fine and an habitual user find hot key
more useful.
Regards
Gioita
Hello Jokro,
I uploaded a map on the wiki : it's my suggestion to change the File Menu
(based on the existing one). This is a test to check how the process you
suggest can work ... but my suggestions are real ones ;-).
Nam.
@Stephan,
I agree that we should reorder items. The number of items has grown, and is
growing in such a way that flat menu's are not sufficcient any more. This
means we have to decide about some hierarchical structure. This is not easy to
do as, depending how different people use FP, they will propose different
number of hierarcical levels and orderings, wanting the most used items higher
in the hierarchy. This is why I proposed to arrive at a comon decision.step by
step. The end result is exactly what you describe: a reordering, but based on
principles we are deciding during the process. So taking out "double"items in
the first process step does not mean the will be put back later on, but at a
different location.
@Gioata,
I did not yet propse a new menu structure. In process step 1 did a preliminary
analysis showing for each menu item, to which object (main mind map, node,
component of a node like text field) each item belongs. This could make
reordering easier in a following step.
@Nam,
I am still waiting if the programmers support - in principle - our action ?
Regards
Jokro
@Jokro,
Thank's and I agree to get programmers agreement before spending time on menu
"refactoring".
Hello, I do support your attempts to create a better menu structure. After you
get it we shall use it.
Regards, Dimitry
Hello,
to make this discussion more easy I embedded the mentioned mindmaps as flash-
applet in the wiki.
Regards Stefan
Hi,
I added an object hierarchy showing which objects have context menus:
http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Harmonizing_FP-menu#Object_hi
erarchy_showing_menus_and_context_menus_in_Freeplane. Do you
think the map is correct and complete ? PS, I did not mean to include the menu
items at this stage, although I filled in one context menu as an example.
Stefan,
The embedding of the mindmaps in a flash applet is making the mindmaps more
difficult to use. In the hyperlink above I combined a jpg picture with the
possibility to download the mindmap. Don't you find this more useable ?
Regards,
Jokro
Hi.
I find the flash-applet quite usable, although it lacks some features. I would
have used the java-applet but it failed loading as soon as there was more than
one map on the page.
The best and most comfortable way to discuss this topic would be a online
editable map but this could be goal for the future...
I think it's a good idea to first get the status quo. I had a look at your map
and made some corrections/ additions. You can download it here:
http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/images/5/54/FP-object-
hierarchy_stefan.mm
Regards
Stefan
Hi Stefan,
Good addition. I moved edit styles menu to position submenu of Main menubar.
See http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Talk:Harmonizing_FP-menu#
2011-3-22_Jokro_FP_object_map.
Regards
Jokro
Hi,
I uploaded a proposal to add two menus to the main menu bar. One for basic
node functions and the other for functions of node components. The menu items
in these two menus should be removed from the other menus in the main menu
bar.
Result:
See: [http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Talk:Harmonizing_FP-menu
2011-3-28_Jokro_Node_.2B_Components_menu](http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wi
ki/index.php/Talk:Harmonizing_FP-
menu%232011-3-28_Jokro_Node_.2B_Components_menu)
What do you think ?
Regards,
Jokro
Hi Jokro.
I like your approach with the two new top level menus.
I had a quick look at your mind map and I have a few questions/ remarks:
I think this map is a good discussion base, but it needs some refinement.
Regards
Stefan
Hi Stefan,
I prefer flat lists and interpret SEPARATOR as a visual separator like a line.
I agree with the points you raise, and added the following discussion points
to the text of the wiki:
To be discussed:
http://freeplane.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Talk:Harmonizing_FP-
menu#2011-3-28_Jokro_Node_.2B_Components_menu
Regards,
Jokro
Hi Jokro,
I've uploaded a map with a proposal for the menu structure to the wiki.
Stefan
Hello,
to support your efforts on creating a better menu structure I changed
implementation of menu builder (1.2.4_04).
Now almost all menu elements including the ones coming with plug-ins are
declared in file mindmapmodemenu.xml which can be found
core/org.freeplane.core/lib/freeplaneeditor.jar/xml or in source code in
directory freeplane/resources/xml .
You can create directory <freeplane-user-dir>/resources/xml and copy this file
there. Now you can change menu structure of your installation by editing your
local copy. All other resource files from freeplane jars can be substituted
the same way. Be careful: your local copies are not updated when you install
next freeplane versions, you should update or delete them manually. </freeplane-user-dir>
Regards, Dimitry
@dimitry,
great, thanks.
Jokro
Hi Dimitry,
thanks a lot for your effort.
Here
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21049308/Freeplane_menu_proposal/resources/translatio
ns/Resources_en.properties
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21049308/Freeplane_menu_proposal/resources/xml/mindma
pmodemenu.xml
is my first proposal for a changed menu structure.
I've introduced two new top level menus named "Nodes" and "Node features" and
removed the menu "Insert". I'd also like to remove the menu "Icons" and move
its content to "Node features -> Icons" but this can't be done just with the
xml file...
The menu "Nodes" keeps all actions to insert, delete and edit nodes (i.e. the
main part of the node).
The menu "Node features" keeps all actions that can be applied to a node (I
think that the term feature describes the nature of these actions good). The
actions are grouped in submenus. This way one could very easy explore the
features Freeplane offers.
Every node-action can be accessed in a top level menu and every node feature
can be accessed in a submenu of a top level menu.
Comments!?
Regards
Stefan
Hi Stephan,
Regards, Dimitry
Hi Dimitry.
I updated mindmapmodemenu.xml (you can download it with the old link from
21).Thanks to your changes I removed the top level icon menu and moved it to
"Node features -> Icons".
Regarding your point 1:
I'd like to keep the "Edit" menu because:
One would expect these items there.
(keeps all actions to insert, delete and edit nodes)
Regards
Stefan
Hi,
the script apiGenerator.groovy that is part of the distribution adds itself to
the end of the help menu. The configuration of this location is done by
setting the target menu (but not the position in it) in the script header.
This mechanism is available also to user scripts.
Do you see a need for improvement in this area? In which way should the
configuration/registration be extended so that at least the position within
the menu can be configured?
Volker
@Stefan: I committed your proposal to the sources, the next version should use
it. Let us wait user comments.
Dimitry