Thread: [Webwork-devel] WW/JavaOne get together

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For those of us that missed the get together, would it be possible for
someone to post some highlights?

-Matt

Matt Baldree wrote:

> For those of us that missed the get together, would it be possible for
> someone to post some highlights?

Well, it was a pretty modest gettogether (me, Kjetil, Maurice + 3 from=20
OpenSymphony, oh and Cedric from BEA). You were sorely missed Matt!

Mostly we just chatted, but we did talk about some about what to do=20
next. Supporting Flash as client was pretty high on the list, and from=20
what I can tell it should be trivial to do. I'm gonna get some=20
HelloWorld examples from Macromedia and convert them to use WW.

We also talked some about what would be the best way to go for WW in=20
terms of greater exposure. On the one hand OpenSymphony does make sense=20
(as already discussed), but on the other hand joining JBoss (which I'll=20
probably join up with again, now that I quit from TSS) would give us a=20
much more even footing with Struts. Because believe it or not, the=20
primary question I got last week was "So, who does this relate to=20
Struts?". Argh...

So, that was pretty much it. Good beer good chat good place. :-)

/Rickard

--=20
Rickard =D6berg

I think OS has done a good job and working with them would be good, but
throwing in a new opportunity such as JBoss adds a new twist. For instance,
Jetty is a separate project that is embedded in JBoss so why not WW? I
believe JBoss could use a good web tier framework, and I think its coat
tails have grown since it won best app server from JavaWorld. In addition, I
know Jakarta solicited them to come aboard but Marc set them straight. So,
my vote is JBoss. I think WW has the greatest potential to grow under
JBoss's umbrella.

My $0.02

-Matt

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rickard" <ri...@mi...>
To: "Matt Baldree" <ma...@sm...>
Cc: "Webwork-Developer" <web...@li...>
Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Webwork-devel] WW/JavaOne get together

Matt Baldree wrote:

> For those of us that missed the get together, would it be possible for
> someone to post some highlights?

Well, it was a pretty modest gettogether (me, Kjetil, Maurice + 3 from
OpenSymphony, oh and Cedric from BEA). You were sorely missed Matt!

Mostly we just chatted, but we did talk about some about what to do
next. Supporting Flash as client was pretty high on the list, and from
what I can tell it should be trivial to do. I'm gonna get some
HelloWorld examples from Macromedia and convert them to use WW.

We also talked some about what would be the best way to go for WW in
terms of greater exposure. On the one hand OpenSymphony does make sense
(as already discussed), but on the other hand joining JBoss (which I'll
probably join up with again, now that I quit from TSS) would give us a
much more even footing with Struts. Because believe it or not, the
primary question I got last week was "So, who does this relate to
Struts?". Argh...

So, that was pretty much it. Good beer good chat good place. :-)

/Rickard

--
Rickard Öberg

_______________________________________________
Webwork-devel mailing list
Web...@li...
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/webwork-devel

I was on a plane when this thread started - just got back to Sydney after J=
1
today.

(For those of you who don't know me - I'm the 'OS guy' that was at the
WebWork meeting ;))

Personally (I'll try to remove my OS bias here) I would be sad to see WW
rolled into the JBoss project. Both JBoss and WW are excellent products, bu=
t
I feel it would add a tremendous amount of bias (perceived or otherwise) to
WW to be part of a single server vendor. JBoss is a single server vendor -
don't mistake it.=20

OS has always prided itself on being 'server agnostic' and we have a number
of guys who try very hard to make sure our components run on many different
servers as possible (for example - see the SiteMesh test suite which
currently automatically tests SiteMesh on ~ 10 different app servers!)

I'm not saying that putting WW under the JBoss umbrella would necessarily
'bias' things, but that it would certainly taint the independence that
currently WW has (as would joining Jakarta but I'll keep that flame war for
another day ;))

If joining JBoss is all about attention, I'm sure this can still be gained
by providing a sample app with JBoss that uses WW (such as PetSoar -
http://www.theserverside.com/home/thread.jsp?thread_id=3D12753), linking from
the JBoss site to the project page etc.

I'd vote against a merger with JBoss.

My $0.02.

-mike

PS Anyone who believes 'best XXX' from any Java magazine is a fool ;) The
voting in those elections is more rigged than a Presidential election that
comes down to a recount in a state in which your brother is governor ;)

On 2/4/02 11:04 AM, "Matt Baldree" (ma...@sm...) penned the words:

> I think OS has done a good job and working with them would be good, but
> throwing in a new opportunity such as JBoss adds a new twist. For instanc=
e,
> Jetty is a separate project that is embedded in JBoss so why not WW? I
> believe JBoss could use a good web tier framework, and I think its coat
> tails have grown since it won best app server from JavaWorld. In addition=
, I
> know Jakarta solicited them to come aboard but Marc set them straight. So=
,
> my vote is JBoss. I think WW has the greatest potential to grow under
> JBoss's umbrella.
>=20
> My $0.02
>=20
> -Matt
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rickard" <ri...@mi...>
> To: "Matt Baldree" <ma...@sm...>
> Cc: "Webwork-Developer" <web...@li...>
> Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 3:05 AM
> Subject: Re: [Webwork-devel] WW/JavaOne get together
>=20
>=20
> Matt Baldree wrote:
>=20
>> For those of us that missed the get together, would it be possible for
>> someone to post some highlights?
>=20
> Well, it was a pretty modest gettogether (me, Kjetil, Maurice + 3 from
> OpenSymphony, oh and Cedric from BEA). You were sorely missed Matt!
>=20
> Mostly we just chatted, but we did talk about some about what to do
> next. Supporting Flash as client was pretty high on the list, and from
> what I can tell it should be trivial to do. I'm gonna get some
> HelloWorld examples from Macromedia and convert them to use WW.
>=20
> We also talked some about what would be the best way to go for WW in
> terms of greater exposure. On the one hand OpenSymphony does make sense
> (as already discussed), but on the other hand joining JBoss (which I'll
> probably join up with again, now that I quit from TSS) would give us a
> much more even footing with Struts. Because believe it or not, the
> primary question I got last week was "So, who does this relate to
> Struts?". Argh...
>=20
> So, that was pretty much it. Good beer good chat good place. :-)
>=20
> /Rickard
>=20
> --
> Rickard =D6berg
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Webwork-devel mailing list
> Web...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/webwork-devel
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Webwork-devel mailing list
> Web...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/webwork-devel

Mike Cannon-Brookes wrote:

> Personally (I'll try to remove my OS bias here) I would be sad to see W=
W
> rolled into the JBoss project. Both JBoss and WW are excellent products=
, but
> I feel it would add a tremendous amount of bias (perceived or otherwise=
) to
> WW to be part of a single server vendor. JBoss is a single server vendo=
r -
> don't mistake it.=20

As is Jakarta, in a sense. If you look at what they actually deliver it=20
is kind of similar to JBoss: a J2EE engine (web instead of EJB though),=20
a mgmt framework (Avalon instead of JBossMX). Struts seem to be doing=20
fine anyway.

> OS has always prided itself on being 'server agnostic' and we have a nu=
mber
> of guys who try very hard to make sure our components run on many diffe=
rent
> servers as possible (for example - see the SiteMesh test suite which
> currently automatically tests SiteMesh on ~ 10 different app servers!)

Which is good, and even after WW joins JBoss I will think that is good.=20
And NOONE has said differently. We can write it in capital letters in=20
docs to make sure noone misses it. "WORKS WITH X Y Z. REALLY".

> I'm not saying that putting WW under the JBoss umbrella would necessari=
ly
> 'bias' things, but that it would certainly taint the independence that
> currently WW has (as would joining Jakarta but I'll keep that flame war=
 for
> another day ;))

What's the difference between "bias things" and "taint the=20
independence"? Semantics...

> If joining JBoss is all about attention, I'm sure this can still be gai=
ned
> by providing a sample app with JBoss that uses WW (such as PetSoar -
> http://www.theserverside.com/home/thread.jsp?thread_id=3D12753), linkin=
g from
> the JBoss site to the project page etc.

Well, that would work, although I'd personally prefer to do that portal=20
thingy since it'd be actually useful. Although I guess something like=20
PetSoar could be a useful place to put common app tools in (i.e. stuff=20
that are common to many projects).

> PS Anyone who believes 'best XXX' from any Java magazine is a fool ;) T=
he
> voting in those elections is more rigged than a Presidential election t=
hat
> comes down to a recount in a state in which your brother is governor ;)

So you're saying the committee was bribed? ;-) Can I quote you on that?

/Rickard

--=20
Rickard =D6berg