Re: [Webwork-devel] WW/JavaOne get together

[Victor S. <vsa...@ho...>]

>My comparison with Jetty is not based on a web
>container but the fact that it is a standalone project
>that has hooked up with JBoss. JBoss has expanded to
>provide additional offerings such as JBoss.Net which
>uses Apache Axis another separate project. I believe
>that WW could be independent but work closely with
>JBoss to deliver some unique things. Obviously, this is
>at a conceptual level but there is possibility. Maybe,
>Rickard could enlighten us on some possibilities.
>

Cupholder holds Cup
Cars transport people
Airplanes transport people
Computer monitors are used to display data.

All of these are facts of different items and their 
relationship/dependencies. There's fact relation I forgot to mention:

JbossGPA is microkernel which can be be used to "contain" other containers 
and provide a series of services. Among these services, jBoss aims to 
provide a suitable platform to deploy J2EE applications (a specification). 
This is the reason for the EJB container (EJB Spec), the Web Container 
(Servlets/JSP spec), jBossMQ (JMS Spec), Security (JAAS Spec), RARDeployer 
and friends (JCA Spec)... Additionallity to this, JBoss, having a generic 
services architecture, also allows you to plug in whatever feature you 
desire in an easy way. Those are services, and JBoss is a tool.

The reason the JBoss group integrated Jetty in the core was that they 
desperately needed a Web container and Catalina's prupose is in life is not 
compatible with JBoss'... Jetty on the other hand, is a perfect match, being 
small and programatically configurable.

I just see nothing that could be added to WebWork relating to JBoss, since 
as a tool it is used to make applications, and is therefore not part of the 
environment.

Microsoft with all their money, could not ever make Microsoft Bob fly...

>Has Jetty lost user base because they are working with
>JBoss? I don't think so. I think either directions for
>WW is a win, but I disagree with your analysis.
>

Comparing Apples to Oranges again... Jetty has nothing to loose as it's a 
servlet container which is usually embedded in other applications. It's in 
their core purpose to be integrated to anything, as that, specifically is 
its purpose. Jetty has ALL to win.

We just should not ride in a marketing bus without a reason since it's 
pointless. There are far better ways of marketing than to be out of focus! 
:) I bet you love those nice "Buy me now" banner ads popping up when you're 
reading a news article in JDJ or JavaWorld!, and the item has nothing to do 
with what you're reading, or interesting to reading audience.

I'll give you a couple of reasons Struts is a winner:

-- Part of Apache, instant marketing.
-- Exposure by Apache, Sun, and everyone that makes tools (they make money 
out of this you know)
-- Articles written
-- GOOD MARKETING

I'll also give some reasons too for JBoss being successful:

-- Good technology.
-- Viable alternative to commercial software.
-- JBoss group makes money by selling documentation, consulting, and giving 
concerences.
-- GOOD MARKETING

Now the reason for Struts being more successful than WW:

-- They have marketing

Orion for example, is superior to Weblogic, but have poor docs, and 
extremely lame marketing, nonetheless the product is better.... but BEA 
markets their product, Ironflare hmmmm....

My point is... Instead of trying to catch someone else's wave... let's work 
towards creating a wave....

/V

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