visualpython-users

[Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[Bruce S. <ba...@an...>]

I'd like to propose a small Linux VPython community project. I find it 
frustrating that what look to me like the same Linux questions and problems 
keep recurring. Ari Heitner has been trying to provide some compiled 
packages, but it's clear that these often are not usable, depending on the 
Linux flavor, so there should be a high-quality document explaining how to 
do a source compile and install.

I propose that someone knowledgeable draft and post FULLY detailed, 
comprehensive instructions for how to compile and install on various common 
flavors of Linux. Other knowledgeable Linux users would critique and debate 
the document. When everyone had thrashed out agreement, we would post this 
prominently on the VPython site. The document needs in particular to state 
clearly and in detail all the dependencies, and all the places where one 
has to go to get the various pieces. And if we get that far, maybe we could 
even get all the pieces together in one place!

Feel free also to tell me that my proposal makes no sense. Since I'm not a 
Linux user, I may well have misunderstood everything. But watching from the 
sidelines it sure sounds like utter chaos that one is sent to lots of 
different repositories to find obscure files and keep trying to compile and 
find other dependencies and ask some more questions and update the compiler 
itself to the latest version and then.....

Bruce Sherwood

Re: [Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[heafnerj <hea...@vn...>]

On Wed, 11 Apr 2001, Bruce Sherwood wrote:

> I'd like to propose a small Linux VPython community project. I find it 
> frustrating that what look to me like the same Linux questions and problems 
> keep recurring. Ari Heitner has been trying to provide some compiled 
> packages, but it's clear that these often are not usable, depending on the 
> Linux flavor, so there should be a high-quality document explaining how to 
> do a source compile and install.
> 
Excellent idea. From what I read on the VPython website, the problem was
with a library supplied with Red Hat Linux 6.2. From version 6.2 to 7, the
problem was apparently fixed with an updated library.

Personally, I much prefer precompiled rpm's rather than compiling my own
packages.

> I propose that someone knowledgeable draft and post FULLY detailed, 
> comprehensive instructions for how to compile and install on various common 
> flavors of Linux. Other knowledgeable Linux users would critique and debate 
> the document. When everyone had thrashed out agreement, we would post this 
> prominently on the VPython site. The document needs in particular to state 
> clearly and in detail all the dependencies, and all the places where one 
> has to go to get the various pieces. And if we get that far, maybe we could 
> even get all the pieces together in one place!
> 
In my own experience, the necessary dependencies were on the supplementary
CD-ROM that came with my distribution. Well, all but one anyway. The
various Linux distributions all maintain repositories for bleeding edge
versions of libraries and programs (e.g. Mandrake's "cooker", Red Hat's
"rawhide"). These packages are usually supplied customized for a
particular distribution and are seldom compatible with other
distributions. To a certain extent, this is also true of source rpm's
because the various distributions sometimes store source files in
different places. This may quickly turn into a collection of HOW-TO's for
each of the various major Linux distributions.

> Feel free also to tell me that my proposal makes no sense. Since I'm not a 
> Linux user, I may well have misunderstood everything. But watching from the 
> sidelines it sure sounds like utter chaos that one is sent to lots of 
> different repositories to find obscure files and keep trying to compile and 
> find other dependencies and ask some more questions and update the compiler 
> itself to the latest version and then.....
> 
Well, it may not be as bad as it seems. There are a handful of well known
Linux repositories. One of the most often used is rpmfind.net, but I've
discovered tuxfinder.com is better for my purposes and has always
performed wonderfully for me. Most Linux users know about these, but the
newbies will probably not. I speak from experience since I've only been
using Linux for a year, and I've found these places usually by accident.
:-)

I have all of the pieces needed for installing VPython on my RH7 system,
but have not yet done so. After I get things installed and running, I will
doucment the dependencies and put together a HOW-TO for RH7. I've not yet
learned how to create rpm packages, but I need to learn anyway.

Now, back to doing my taxes. :-)

Joe Heafner

--
My Book <http://www.willbell.com/new/fundephcomp.htm>
My Home Page <http://users.vnet.net/heafnerj/>
CVAC Home Page <http://users.vnet.net/heafnerj/cvac.html>
PLEASE -- no Microsoft attachments! I will not read them!

Re: [Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[Andrew M. <mo...@tb...>]

This would be a great help, I think.  Obviously, I have had some problems
getting going with the linux version.  

What was so great about the Windows version is you download two files
(assuming you didn't have python to begin with) which you double click in
the proper order to install.  Then, you use the provided short-cut to
start IDLE, open an included example program, and hit F5 to see if it
works.   That was painless.

For linux, I had to find all the dependencies first.  That wasn't so bad,
except the key dependency that I was missing in the end was labeled as a
RedHat7.0 rpm.  I am running Redhat 6.2, but it turned out the 7.0 rpm for
the libstdc++ worked on my system anyway.  After that, I got the vpython
rpm to install with no worries.

What also confused me was the whole IDLE issue.  When I write perl
programs or C programs or whatever, I usually use pico or vi.  The only
python programming I have done is "Hello World" type stuff, which I also
wrote using pico.  But, in Windows, it was more convenient to use the IDLE
that was included.  So, I thought that was something special about the
visual module that made the python program necessary to run even on a
linux system.  Now, I see I was foolish for thinking that.

I would help critique or edit a Howto or help page for the linux
installation.  Right now, I am still not familiar enough with it to
actually be able to create it myself.  Let me know what I can do to help.

Andrew

On Wed, 11 Apr 2001, Bruce Sherwood wrote:

> I'd like to propose a small Linux VPython community project. I find it 
> frustrating that what look to me like the same Linux questions and problems 
> keep recurring. Ari Heitner has been trying to provide some compiled 
> packages, but it's clear that these often are not usable, depending on the 
> Linux flavor, so there should be a high-quality document explaining how to 
> do a source compile and install.
> 
> I propose that someone knowledgeable draft and post FULLY detailed, 
> comprehensive instructions for how to compile and install on various common 
> flavors of Linux. Other knowledgeable Linux users would critique and debate 
> the document. When everyone had thrashed out agreement, we would post this 
> prominently on the VPython site. The document needs in particular to state 
> clearly and in detail all the dependencies, and all the places where one 
> has to go to get the various pieces. And if we get that far, maybe we could 
> even get all the pieces together in one place!
> 
> Feel free also to tell me that my proposal makes no sense. Since I'm not a 
> Linux user, I may well have misunderstood everything. But watching from the 
> sidelines it sure sounds like utter chaos that one is sent to lots of 
> different repositories to find obscure files and keep trying to compile and 
> find other dependencies and ask some more questions and update the compiler 
> itself to the latest version and then.....
> 
> Bruce Sherwood
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Visualpython-users mailing list
> Vis...@li...
> http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/visualpython-users
> 

Re: [Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[David A. <dm...@an...>]

When I download cvisualmodule.so.gz from the VPython Web site, gunzip 
complains that this is not a zip file ?

Re: [Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[Bruce S. <ba...@an...>]

This is very strange. The download on Windows (using Internet Explorer) 
automatically unzips the file, but doesn't remove the gz extension. So you 
end up with a working file, but the wrong extension.

I was unaware that IE would/could automatically unzip a .gz file during 
download? It doesn't do this with .zip files.

Bruce Sherwood

--On Monday, April 30, 2001 10:26 -0400 David Andersen <dm...@an...> 
wrote:

> When I download cvisualmodule.so.gz from the VPython Web site, gunzip
> complains that this is not a zip file ?

Re: [Visualpython-users] Linux users of VPython, unite!

[Ari H. <ahe...@an...>]

On Mon, Apr 30, 2001 at 11:59:35AM -0400, Bruce Sherwood wrote:
> This is very strange. The download on Windows (using Internet Explorer) 
> automatically unzips the file, but doesn't remove the gz extension. So you 
> end up with a working file, but the wrong extension.
> 
> I was unaware that IE would/could automatically unzip a .gz file during 
> download? It doesn't do this with .zip files.
> 
It's a general bug of stupid web browsers. Netscape does it too.

A long time ago someone said "why don't we gzip all html content? that will
make download a lot faster". This was an excellent idea and browsers
implemented support for it -- and they recognize the content by its gzip
header (in the data) rather than its extension, since for some reason they
expected the HTML files to still have a .html extension (even though they
were zipped).

No one actually ever zipped any html files.

And now all web browsers mangle .gz files on download, uncompressing them
without changing their extension to indicate their uncompressed type.


ari