tcl-core

[TCLCORE] Next bi-weekly meeting 19th May 2025 at 12:00 UTC

[Steve L. <st...@di...>]

On behalf of Harald (who is unavailable) I’d like to invite anyone interested to the bi-weekly Tcl/TK telco on Monday May 19th 2025 at 12:00 UTC via https://meet.jit.si/TclMonthlyMeetup

The bi-weekly meetings are designed to keep Tcl/Tk development moving forwards towards regular releases, allowing discussion and clarification of any issues. Agenda items for this meeting will include:

• the releases planned for this month - 9.0.2 and 9.1a0 (the first release of Tcl 9.1 features) as per TIP #713 https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/713.md
• TIPs being finalised and voted upon
• documentation

plus anything else attendees might want to raise.

Thanks to all

-- Steve

Re: [TCLCORE] Next bi-weekly meeting 19th May 2025 at 12:00 UTC

[Steve L. <st...@di...>]

Here’s some notes from the meeting

Discussion TIP 718 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/718.md)

• the issue is not all applications on Windows are able to move to utf-8
• this is generally recognised by those who care about encoding on Windows
• there was discussion on the relationship between TIP 718 and TIP 716 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/716.md)
• do we delay Tcl 9.0.2 or delay TIPs 716/718
• it was recognised that breakage now is better than breakage later
• DGP leans towards delay so we can better understand the problem before making changes
• we don't want to go down a bad path
• options are 716 vs 718 vs status quo
• Ashok will email TCLCORE outlining the situation

Discussion re TIP 720 Updated Bytecode Opcodes (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/720.md)

• people familiar with BCE (ByteCode Engine) are comfortable
• Rolf raised concern about tclcompiler  and tbcload
• we need to find the "official" repository for these
• these need to be brought up to date with 9.0 then 9.1 + 720
• DGP flagged there may be opportunities for sponsored work given there are commercial organisations relying on these components

Documentation

• there is still strong desire to keep the documentation program moving forward, including markdown, nroff and html
• SteveL will shake the trees

APN mentioned the new internal list representation proposal is ready for testing as per his May 15th email to TCLCORE. BrianG will review.

DGP mentioned converting mpexpr to Tcl9 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/mpexpr/timeline).

RMax asked about getting a review of his new socket implementation [https://chiselapp.com/user/rmax/repository/sock/]

• he is especially interested in comments or suggestions on how to translate between symbolic names and their values. Schelte suggested that he may be able to use constant variables (tip #677). One possible limitation is that you can't have an array of constant variables.
• as a result of previous debates/pushback about UDP the implementation is not based on the channel abstraction but instead data is passed as a binary stringg
• while currently an extension, it is easily adaptable for the core at some future point. RMax is looking for help/guidance in adding a channel wrapper from some channel expert. Jan volunteered and Andreas (not present) is likely the most knowledgeable.

See you all on June 2 for the next meeting

-- Steve
On 19 May 2025 at 9:27 AM +0800, Steve Landers <st...@di...>, wrote:
> On behalf of Harald (who is unavailable) I’d like to invite anyone interested to the bi-weekly Tcl/TK telco on Monday May 19th 2025 at 12:00 UTC via https://meet.jit.si/TclMonthlyMeetup
>
> The bi-weekly meetings are designed to keep Tcl/Tk development moving forwards towards regular releases, allowing discussion and clarification of any issues. Agenda items for this meeting will include:
>
> • the releases planned for this month - 9.0.2 and 9.1a0 (the first release of Tcl 9.1 features) as per TIP #713 https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/713.md
> • TIPs being finalised and voted upon
> • documentation
>
> plus anything else attendees might want to raise.
>
> Thanks to all
>
> -- Steve
> _______________________________________________
> Tcl-Core mailing list
> Tcl...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tcl-core

Re: [TCLCORE] Next bi-weekly meeting 19th May 2025 at 12:00 UTC

[Brian G. <bri...@ea...>]

See comments below.

On May 19, 2025, at 17:08, Steve Landers <st...@di...> wrote:

Here’s some notes from the meeting

Discussion TIP 718 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/718.md)

  *   the issue is not all applications on Windows are able to move to utf-8
  *   this is generally recognised by those who care about encoding on Windows
  *   there was discussion on the relationship between TIP 718 and TIP 716 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/716.md)
  *   do we delay Tcl 9.0.2 or delay TIPs 716/718
  *   it was recognised that breakage now is better than breakage later
  *   DGP leans towards delay so we can better understand the problem before making changes
  *   we don't want to go down a bad path
  *   options are 716 vs 718 vs status quo
  *   Ashok will email TCLCORE outlining the situation

Discussion re TIP 720 Updated Bytecode Opcodes (https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/720.md)

  *   people familiar with BCE (ByteCode Engine) are comfortable
  *   Rolf raised concern about tclcompiler  and tbcload
  *   we need to find the "official" repository for these
  *   these need to be brought up to date with 9.0 then 9.1 + 720
  *   DGP flagged there may be opportunities for sponsored work given there are commercial organisations relying on these components

Documentation

  *   there is still strong desire to keep the documentation program moving forward, including markdown, nroff and html
  *   SteveL will shake the trees

APN mentioned the new internal list representation proposal is ready for testing as per his May 15th email to TCLCORE. BrianG will review.

Hi Ashok,

I browsed through the implementation and it seems pretty much as I expected. It looks good to me, from a high level. I didn't comb through it looking for flaws.

Ship It!

-Brian


DGP mentioned converting mpexpr to Tcl9 (https://core.tcl-lang.org/mpexpr/timeline).

RMax asked about getting a review of his new socket implementation [https://chiselapp.com/user/rmax/repository/sock/]

  *   he is especially interested in comments or suggestions on how to translate between symbolic names and their values. Schelte suggested that he may be able to use constant variables (tip #677). One possible limitation is that you can't have an array of constant variables.
  *   as a result of previous debates/pushback about UDP the implementation is not based on the channel abstraction but instead data is passed as a binary stringg
  *   while currently an extension, it is easily adaptable for the core at some future point. RMax is looking for help/guidance in adding a channel wrapper from some channel expert. Jan volunteered and Andreas (not present) is likely the most knowledgeable.

See you all on June 2 for the next meeting

-- Steve
On 19 May 2025 at 9:27 AM +0800, Steve Landers <st...@di...>, wrote:
On behalf of Harald (who is unavailable) I’d like to invite anyone interested to the bi-weekly Tcl/TK telco on Monday May 19th 2025 at 12:00 UTC via https://meet.jit.si/TclMonthlyMeetup

The bi-weekly meetings are designed to keep Tcl/Tk development moving forwards towards regular releases, allowing discussion and clarification of any issues. Agenda items for this meeting will include:

  *   the releases planned for this month - 9.0.2 and 9.1a0 (the first release of Tcl 9.1 features) as per TIP #713 https://core.tcl-lang.org/tips/doc/trunk/tip/713.md
  *   TIPs being finalised and voted upon
  *   documentation

plus anything else attendees might want to raise.

Thanks to all

-- Steve
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Re: [TCLCORE] Next bi-weekly meeting 19th May 2025 at 12:00 UTC

[<apn...@ya...>]

Brian,

 

Thanks for taking a look. I will commit after a few days in case anyone else takes a look and has objections.

 

Was originally targeting core-9-0-branch since no public API’s have changed but as Jan expressed reservations yesterday in terms of risk committing to a released minor version, will target 9.1a0 instead.

 

/Ashok

 

From: Brian Griffin <bri...@ea...> 



APN mentioned the new internal list representation proposal is ready for testing as per his May 15th email to TCLCORE. BrianG will review.

 

Hi Ashok,

 

I browsed through the implementation and it seems pretty much as I expected. It looks good to me, from a high level. I didn't comb through it looking for flaws.

 

Ship It!

 

-Brian