sql-ledger-users

[SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

   I'm working toward giving my accountant all the information she needs to
prepare our business tax returns. However, when I look at the trial
balance's account for interest and bank charges I find 4 entries of the same
amount from way back in 2003 until June of last year. I'm running version 2.8.20
if that matters.

   Also when I look at the details for one of these (haven't looked yet at
others), I find the four expenses are repeated and the check paying them
repeated 4 times.

   Any ideas what happened? I'll go back and fix them for 2008, but there's
no need to do anything earlier.

   Never saw this before.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Paul T. <pt...@wa...>]

It sounds like a recurring transaction to me.
Is it possible a transaction gets flagged as recurring somehow? Business
logic (and a perl script for that matter) could be easily fooled by a
trransaction occurring every year or quarter, so even if we do NOT flag it
manual strange things happen due to the script?

Unsettling idea in an acconting package however..

2009/2/10 Rich Shepard <rsh...@ap...>

>   I'm working toward giving my accountant all the information she needs to
> prepare our business tax returns. However, when I look at the trial
> balance's account for interest and bank charges I find 4 entries of the
> same
> amount from way back in 2003 until June of last year. I'm running version
> 2.8.20
> if that matters.
>
>   Also when I look at the details for one of these (haven't looked yet at
> others), I find the four expenses are repeated and the check paying them
> repeated 4 times.
>
>   Any ideas what happened? I'll go back and fix them for 2008, but there's
> no need to do anything earlier.
>
>   Never saw this before.
>
> Rich
>
> --
> Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
> Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
> <http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax:
> 503-667-8863
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with
> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and code
> to
> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power of
> local
> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR SDK
> and
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Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Paul Tammes wrote:

> It sounds like a recurring transaction to me. Is it possible a transaction
> gets flagged as recurring somehow? Business logic (and a perl script for
> that matter) could be easily fooled by a trransaction occurring every year
> or quarter, so even if we do NOT flag it manual strange things happen due
> to the script?

Paul,

   I don't know how it could be so flagged, but I'll take a look. Regardless,
I should not see the bank's monthly service charge show up 4 times on the
same date, nor have a list of purchases on a credit card repeated, with 4
payments of the same amount on the same day. I have a meeting this evening,
so it looks like tomorrow night will be a long session cleaning up theese
duplicates. And, I suppose I'll need to go through each account, too.

> Unsettling idea in an acconting package however..

   That's what bothers me, too.

Thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Michael H. <mh...@it...>]

Some benign causes we've seen:
	- they're not really duplicated.  (Problem was reported by somebody  
who didn't realize the GL shows a line item for every monetary  
element of the transaction.)
	- somebody got Back button happy in their browser and was just  
trying to correct an entry.


Thanks,

Michael



On Feb 10, 2009, at 6:15 AM, Rich Shepard wrote:

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Paul Tammes wrote:

> It sounds like a recurring transaction to me. Is it possible a  
> transaction
> gets flagged as recurring somehow? Business logic (and a perl  
> script for
> that matter) could be easily fooled by a trransaction occurring  
> every year
> or quarter, so even if we do NOT flag it manual strange things  
> happen due
> to the script?

Paul,

    I don't know how it could be so flagged, but I'll take a look.  
Regardless,
I should not see the bank's monthly service charge show up 4 times on  
the
same date, nor have a list of purchases on a credit card repeated,  
with 4
payments of the same amount on the same day. I have a meeting this  
evening,
so it looks like tomorrow night will be a long session cleaning up  
theese
duplicates. And, I suppose I'll need to go through each account, too.

> Unsettling idea in an acconting package however..

    That's what bothers me, too.

Thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity             
Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax:  
503-667-8863

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
------
Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R) 
AIR(TM)
software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and  
code to
build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power  
of local
resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
SDK and
Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
adobe-com
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Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> Some benign causes we've seen:
> 	- they're not really duplicated.  (Problem was reported by somebody
> who didn't realize the GL shows a line item for every monetary
> element of the transaction.)
> 	- somebody got Back button happy in their browser and was just
> trying to correct an entry.

Michael,

   Since I'm the only one here and using the application, the latter is not
applicable.

   They actually are duplicated in two ways. I'm looking at my interest and
bank charge account and for each journal entry written there are two lines
for the interest and two for the principal (same amounts of interest and
pricipal in each), but only one (correct) total. Then, when I look at the
trial balance and select that account, each transaction is displayed four
times, with the balance increasing each time.

   Deleting one transaction deletes them all.

   So, I am slowly working my way through them, deleting and re-entering each
one. PITA, and something I've not seen before in the 6 years I've been
running SL.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Michael H. <mh...@it...>]

That's really odd.  I would be curious if the data on the back end  
was really duplicated or if it's a flakey query that's presenting  
them that way.  Have you looked at the actual records in the tables yet?


Thanks,

Michael

On Feb 10, 2009, at 10:05 AM, Rich Shepard wrote:

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> Some benign causes we've seen:
> 	- they're not really duplicated.  (Problem was reported by somebody
> who didn't realize the GL shows a line item for every monetary
> element of the transaction.)
> 	- somebody got Back button happy in their browser and was just
> trying to correct an entry.

Michael,

    Since I'm the only one here and using the application, the latter  
is not
applicable.

    They actually are duplicated in two ways. I'm looking at my  
interest and
bank charge account and for each journal entry written there are two  
lines
for the interest and two for the principal (same amounts of interest and
pricipal in each), but only one (correct) total. Then, when I look at  
the
trial balance and select that account, each transaction is displayed  
four
times, with the balance increasing each time.

    Deleting one transaction deletes them all.

    So, I am slowly working my way through them, deleting and re- 
entering each
one. PITA, and something I've not seen before in the 6 years I've been
running SL.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity             
Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax:  
503-667-8863

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
------
Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R) 
AIR(TM)
software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and  
code to
build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power  
of local
resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
SDK and
Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
adobe-com
_______________________________________________
sql-ledger-users mailing list
sql...@li...
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Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> That's really odd.  I would be curious if the data on the back end was
> really duplicated or if it's a flakey query that's presenting them that
> way.  Have you looked at the actual records in the tables yet?

Michael,

   No, I haven't. I need to get it straight so I can get corporate data to
our accountant quickly. Corporate taxes are due 15 March.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Michael H. <mh...@it...>]

Well, what I'm really wondering is if there's something funny on the  
back end, like maybe a duplicate entry for an actual account, where  
the bad/dupe/whatever record has always existed but previous versions  
of SL did a "select unique" and so you only ever saw single entries.   
Your reposting could be "cleaning" the entries but not necessarily  
curing the underlying problem.  If the cause can be tracked down then  
it could be fixed properly and not have the risk of it cropping back  
up.  Just my $1.50, (inflation, y'know :).


Thanks,

Michael


On Feb 10, 2009, at 1:20 PM, Rich Shepard wrote:

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> That's really odd.  I would be curious if the data on the back end was
> really duplicated or if it's a flakey query that's presenting them  
> that
> way.  Have you looked at the actual records in the tables yet?

Michael,

    No, I haven't. I need to get it straight so I can get corporate  
data to
our accountant quickly. Corporate taxes are due 15 March.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity             
Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax:  
503-667-8863

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
------
Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R) 
AIR(TM)
software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and  
code to
build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power  
of local
resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
SDK and
Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
adobe-com
_______________________________________________
sql-ledger-users mailing list
sql...@li...
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sql-ledger-users

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> Well, what I'm really wondering is if there's something funny on the back
> end, like maybe a duplicate entry for an actual account, where the
> bad/dupe/whatever record has always existed but previous versions of SL
> did a "select unique" and so you only ever saw single entries. Your
> reposting could be "cleaning" the entries but not necessarily curing the
> underlying problem.  If the cause can be tracked down then it could be
> fixed properly and not have the risk of it cropping back up.  Just my
> $1.50, (inflation, y'know :).

Michael,

   You raise valid concerns. After I get things looking correct I'll rummage
around the tables using psql. Actually, what I want to do is set up scema
(scemae?), one for each year. I have to read the Douglas^2 book to see if I
can do this retroactively. I've 5 full years of data in the system.

Thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

> around the tables using psql. Actually, what I want to do is set up scema

   Make that schema/schemae. My cold must be worse than it feels.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Jerome J. A. <jer...@bo...>]

Hi Rich,

Did you manage to find the problem for this one?  I ran into a similar 
problem happening to a client running version 2.8.13.  This problem 
started to show in Dec 2008 where  a POS transaction is shown multiple 
times on different dates in GL.  They just noticed it recently that 
there are ghost entries.  The ghost entries just seem to be both a debit 
and a credit on the same account so overall, there is no effect but the 
question is why are they showing up on different dates when creating a 
GL report.  The correct data is the latest one.

jerome

http://www.techsier.com - Blog
http://www.boholweb.com - Bohol tourism website
http://www.auza.net - enabling e-services in Bohol



Rich Shepard wrote:

>On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Well, what I'm really wondering is if there's something funny on the back
>>end, like maybe a duplicate entry for an actual account, where the
>>bad/dupe/whatever record has always existed but previous versions of SL
>>did a "select unique" and so you only ever saw single entries. Your
>>reposting could be "cleaning" the entries but not necessarily curing the
>>underlying problem.  If the cause can be tracked down then it could be
>>fixed properly and not have the risk of it cropping back up.  Just my
>>$1.50, (inflation, y'know :).
>>    
>>
>
>Michael,
>
>   You raise valid concerns. After I get things looking correct I'll rummage
>around the tables using psql. Actually, what I want to do is set up scema
>(scemae?), one for each year. I have to read the Douglas^2 book to see if I
>can do this retroactively. I've 5 full years of data in the system.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Rich
>
>  
>

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Michael H. <mh...@it...>]

Are they near the new/old DST time change?  :)


On Mar 31, 2009, at 11:02 PM, Jerome J. Auza wrote:

Hi Rich,

Did you manage to find the problem for this one?  I ran into a similar
problem happening to a client running version 2.8.13.  This problem
started to show in Dec 2008 where  a POS transaction is shown multiple
times on different dates in GL.  They just noticed it recently that
there are ghost entries.  The ghost entries just seem to be both a debit
and a credit on the same account so overall, there is no effect but the
question is why are they showing up on different dates when creating a
GL report.  The correct data is the latest one.

jerome

http://www.techsier.com - Blog
http://www.boholweb.com - Bohol tourism website
http://www.auza.net - enabling e-services in Bohol



Rich Shepard wrote:

> On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:
>
>
>
>> Well, what I'm really wondering is if there's something funny on  
>> the back
>> end, like maybe a duplicate entry for an actual account, where the
>> bad/dupe/whatever record has always existed but previous versions  
>> of SL
>> did a "select unique" and so you only ever saw single entries. Your
>> reposting could be "cleaning" the entries but not necessarily  
>> curing the
>> underlying problem.  If the cause can be tracked down then it  
>> could be
>> fixed properly and not have the risk of it cropping back up.  Just my
>> $1.50, (inflation, y'know :).
>>
>>
>
> Michael,
>
>   You raise valid concerns. After I get things looking correct I'll  
> rummage
> around the tables using psql. Actually, what I want to do is set up  
> scema
> (scemae?), one for each year. I have to read the Douglas^2 book to  
> see if I
> can do this retroactively. I've 5 full years of data in the system.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Rich
>
>
>

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Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Tue, 31 Mar 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:

> Are they near the new/old DST time change?  :)

   Not in my case. The duplicates (in almost every account) go back to 2004
and end in mid-2008. This does not mean the issue started then (I suspect it
was very recent), but those are the transactions affected. PITA.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Jerome J. A. <jer...@bo...>]

No DST for our timezone and TZ is set to local time.

http://www.techsier.com - Blog
http://www.boholweb.com - Bohol tourism website
http://www.auza.net - enabling e-services in Bohol



Michael Hasse wrote:

>Are they near the new/old DST time change?  :)
>
>
>On Mar 31, 2009, at 11:02 PM, Jerome J. Auza wrote:
>
>Hi Rich,
>
>Did you manage to find the problem for this one?  I ran into a similar
>problem happening to a client running version 2.8.13.  This problem
>started to show in Dec 2008 where  a POS transaction is shown multiple
>times on different dates in GL.  They just noticed it recently that
>there are ghost entries.  The ghost entries just seem to be both a debit
>and a credit on the same account so overall, there is no effect but the
>question is why are they showing up on different dates when creating a
>GL report.  The correct data is the latest one.
>
>jerome
>
>http://www.techsier.com - Blog
>http://www.boholweb.com - Bohol tourism website
>http://www.auza.net - enabling e-services in Bohol
>
>
>
>Rich Shepard wrote:
>
>  
>
>>On Tue, 10 Feb 2009, Michael Hasse wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Well, what I'm really wondering is if there's something funny on  
>>>the back
>>>end, like maybe a duplicate entry for an actual account, where the
>>>bad/dupe/whatever record has always existed but previous versions  
>>>of SL
>>>did a "select unique" and so you only ever saw single entries. Your
>>>reposting could be "cleaning" the entries but not necessarily  
>>>curing the
>>>underlying problem.  If the cause can be tracked down then it  
>>>could be
>>>fixed properly and not have the risk of it cropping back up.  Just my
>>>$1.50, (inflation, y'know :).
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>Michael,
>>
>>  You raise valid concerns. After I get things looking correct I'll  
>>rummage
>>around the tables using psql. Actually, what I want to do is set up  
>>scema
>>(scemae?), one for each year. I have to read the Douglas^2 book to  
>>see if I
>>can do this retroactively. I've 5 full years of data in the system.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Rich
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>
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>sql-ledger-users mailing list
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>
>
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>_______________________________________________
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>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sql-ledger-users
>
>  
>

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jerome J. Auza wrote:

> Did you manage to find the problem for this one?

Jerome,

   No, I haven't found why it happened, and I'm still cleaning up the data.
I'm not happy about the situation but am making the best of it that I can.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Jerome J. A. <jer...@bo...>]

We can't duplicate how it appears.  It just happens on some transactions 
and only from POS transactions.

http://www.techsier.com - Blog
http://www.boholweb.com - Bohol tourism website
http://www.auza.net - enabling e-services in Bohol



Rich Shepard wrote:

>On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jerome J. Auza wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Did you manage to find the problem for this one?
>>    
>>
>
>Jerome,
>
>   No, I haven't found why it happened, and I'm still cleaning up the data.
>I'm not happy about the situation but am making the best of it that I can.
>
>Rich
>
>  
>

Re: [SL] Multiple Entries for Same Transaction

[Rich S. <rsh...@ap...>]

On Mon, 9 Feb 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

> When I look at the trial balance's account for interest and bank charges I
> find 4 entries of the same amount from way back in 2003 until June of last
> year. I'm running version 2.8.20 if that matters.

   Well, I upgraded to 2.8.23, but that's not important.

   As I clean up these multiple entries by deleting and recreating them I
find them added to Accounts Payable, even though there's a balancing payment
against the invoice. This doesn't make sense to me.

   Why does the A/P account show a history of invoices paid, even if the
balance is zero? Shouldn't both A/P and Current Liabilities be empty of
transactions is there are currently no unpaid invoices or the current
portion of a long-term liability?

   I need to understand this so I can get the software back in balance with
my bank statement and have it accurately reflect both what happened (which
will be in the various expense accounts so they don't need to be repeated in
the payables account, too) and where I am.

   While I'm not an accountant, I'm familiar enough with the bookkeeping and
have used business accounting software for about 2 decades now. I'd really
like to know what SL is doing.

Thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863