From: James B. <jbr...@gm...> - 2010-01-26 13:06:15
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I have a new Seagate HDD model ST9500420AS (which was bought by me 4 month again). Since about beginning this January the output of the "smartctl" command inform me that "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0032 099 099 099 Old_age Always FAILING_NOW 1" Is it a serious problem? |
From: Marti R. <ma...@ju...> - 2010-01-26 16:58:31
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On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 2:58 PM, James Brown <jbr...@gm...> wrote: > I have a new Seagate HDD model ST9500420AS (which was bought by me 4 > month again). > Since about beginning this January the output of the "smartctl" command > inform me that "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0032 099 099 099 > Old_age Always FAILING_NOW 1" > Is it a serious problem? It's very hard to know because Seagate does not document their SMART attributes. However, the fact that they would set the threshold so high (100 is best, 99 already fails) indicates that it's a very important attribute. smartmontools 5.39 labels this attribute as "End-to-End_Error" -- however, this comes from Hewlett-Packard's documentation and only refers to HP's drives. The two HP drives that I have list this attribute as "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0033 100 100 003 Pre-fail Always - 0" Notice that this threshold is 3 instead of 99, and has type "Pre-fail" instead of "Old_age" -- so HP's description probably does not apply to Seagate drives. Only newer Seagate drives seem to have this attribute; all 9 of my drives that have this attribute have the same flags as your laptop's (old-age and threshold at 99). Although these are Seagate Barracuda drives. I haven't seen this attribute failing yet. This response probably wasn't terribly useful to you, but that's all I know about this attribute. You should certainly back up all your important data on this drive and see how it behaves in the future. Maybe even reclaim your warranty because the disk identifies itself as failing. Regards, Marti |
From: James B. <jbr...@gm...> - 2010-02-03 23:19:07
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Marti Raudsepp wrote: > On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 2:58 PM, James Brown <jbr...@gm...> wrote: > >> I have a new Seagate HDD model ST9500420AS (which was bought by me 4 >> month again). >> Since about beginning this January the output of the "smartctl" command >> inform me that "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0032 099 099 099 >> Old_age Always FAILING_NOW 1" >> Is it a serious problem? >> > > It's very hard to know because Seagate does not document their SMART > attributes. However, the fact that they would set the threshold so > high (100 is best, 99 already fails) indicates that it's a very > important attribute. > > smartmontools 5.39 labels this attribute as "End-to-End_Error" -- > however, this comes from Hewlett-Packard's documentation and only > refers to HP's drives. The two HP drives that I have list this > attribute as "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0033 100 100 003 > Pre-fail Always - 0" > > Notice that this threshold is 3 instead of 99, and has type "Pre-fail" > instead of "Old_age" -- so HP's description probably does not apply to > Seagate drives. > > Only newer Seagate drives seem to have this attribute; all 9 of my > drives that have this attribute have the same flags as your laptop's > (old-age and threshold at 99). Although these are Seagate Barracuda > drives. I haven't seen this attribute failing yet. > > This response probably wasn't terribly useful to you, but that's all I > know about this attribute. You should certainly back up all your > important data on this drive and see how it behaves in the future. > Maybe even reclaim your warranty because the disk identifies itself as > failing. > > Regards, > Marti > > Oh, I had registered myself on the Seagate site after many attemps and I gave access to their technical support. I submitted a report about that problem and now I have received their answer. Here is their answer:What gave you tthat SMART error? It seems to me the Linux diagnostic? Our SMART values are proprietary and do not conform to the industrie standard. That is why 3rd party tools cannot correctly read our drives. To check on the condition of the drive, download Seatools for DOS (it boots into Free BSD and works with Linux). Here is the download link: http://www.seagate.com/ww/v/index.jsp?locale=en-US&name=SeaTools&vgnextoid=720bd20cacdec010VgnVCM100000dd04090aRCRD Seatools for DOS is an ISO image file that is burnt to CD. You boot with that CD and run the long test that will examine every sector on that drive. If Seatools indicates the drive has a problem, you should exchange it (it will generate an error code)." What do you mean about it? " |
From: James B. <jbr...@gm...> - 2010-02-05 07:43:28
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James Brown wrote: > Dan Lukes wrote: > > > The test from their Live disk was passed without errors, but didn't give > me any informations about attributes of that HDD. > I suspect that the long test with their DOS-disk don't differ from such > in smartmontools but the last can give to the user all information about > S.M.A.R.T attributes. > The long test through the command "smartcontrol" my disk passed too, but > in the information about attributes that command gave me the above > information about "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0032 099 099 099 Old_age > Always FAILING_NOW 1". > I suspect that they maked their S.M.A.R.T as propietary only for > refusing warranty requires when failing any attribute of a disk. > > > I have sent to the SeaGate support my new question like the above, and they answered me the next: "our SMART values are encrypted and proprietary, that is why you get no information. If SeaTools passed the long test, the disk is fine. The Linux tool is a standardized test for hard drives, however, since our SMART values are encrypted and no 3rd party tool like yours has the key, they cannot read them out correctly." It is so terrible! If I have known it I never bought their HDD. I don't understand for why they established such policy? Only for refusing warranty asking of clients when the long test passes successfully or for inculcating into their HDD's any hardwired laying and vulnerabilities for secret services?! |
From: Dan L. <da...@ob...> - 2010-02-05 08:22:39
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On 02/05/10 08:43, James Brown: > "our SMART values are encrypted and proprietary > It is so terrible! If I have known it I never bought their HDD. Why you think their attributes have publicly known meaning ? The specification doesn't say it. It's your own wishes that aren't fulfilled. > I don't understand for why they established such policy? Non-disclosed interfaces to hardware, making it accessible with non-portable vendor's tools and drivers are common for years. Proprietary interfaces to several USB devices, 3D acceleration on graphics cards, network cards, printer's protocols ... Despite of it, many user's buy those products, because they fulfill they requirements. The Seagate may follow any policy they want. If you dislike the policy, buy products from other vendors. Dan |
From: Dan L. <da...@ob...> - 2010-02-04 00:04:18
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On 02/04/10 00:18, James Brown: > Oh, I had registered myself on the Seagate site after many attemps and I > gave access to their technical support. > I submitted a report about that problem and now I have received their > answer. > Here is their answer:What gave you tthat SMART error? It seems to me the > Linux diagnostic? Our SMART values are proprietary and do not conform to > the industrie standard. That is why 3rd party tools cannot correctly > read our drives. > > To check on the condition of the drive, download Seatools for DOS > What do you mean about it? It's perfectly OK to create any attribute with any meaning. It's sovereign vendor decision to publish or not to publish such internals. It's not important what I mean about it. I buy no Seagate drive for more than 15 years (they made cheap poor quality drives until they acquire Conner; I newer start to trust the Seagate products even after such acquisition) You need to make a decision by own. To buy, or not to buy. It is the question. ;-) Dan |
From: James B. <jbr...@gm...> - 2010-02-04 08:55:47
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Dan Lukes wrote: > On 02/04/10 00:18, James Brown: >> Oh, I had registered myself on the Seagate site after many attemps and I >> gave access to their technical support. >> I submitted a report about that problem and now I have received their >> answer. >> Here is their answer:What gave you tthat SMART error? It seems to me the >> Linux diagnostic? Our SMART values are proprietary and do not conform to >> the industrie standard. That is why 3rd party tools cannot correctly >> read our drives. >> >> To check on the condition of the drive, download Seatools for DOS > >> What do you mean about it? > > It's perfectly OK to create any attribute with any meaning. It's > sovereign vendor decision to publish or not to publish such internals. > > It's not important what I mean about it. I > > buy no Seagate drive for more than 15 years (they made cheap poor > quality drives until they acquire Conner; I newer start to trust the > Seagate products even after such acquisition) > > You need to make a decision by own. > > To buy, or not to buy. It is the question. > > ;-) > > Dan > The test from their Live disk was passed without errors, but didn't give me any informations about attributes of that HDD. I suspect that the long test with their DOS-disk don't differ from such in smartmontools but the last can give to the user all information about S.M.A.R.T attributes. The long test through the command "smartcontrol" my disk passed too, but in the information about attributes that command gave me the above information about "184 Unknown_Attribute 0x0032 099 099 099 Old_age Always FAILING_NOW 1". I suspect that they maked their S.M.A.R.T as propietary only for refusing warranty requires when failing any attribute of a disk. |